Poor man's Dick Jauron who lucked into the most physically gifted QB ever

[colin]

if mcd is let go after this season (say we miss the playoffs, which is sadly quite likely) -- how does he compare to marvin lewis?

 

better record with miles more talent.  lost games due to horrible blunders.  both ran teams with huge discipline problems, the difference is lewis drafted and signed problem child talents who would fly off the handle here and there.  mcd goes for "character" but we commit painful penalties at a huge rate.

 

in 2020 it could be argued that maybe we didn't have the talent to hang w the big dogs (not sure that's true, but i could buy it), since then we haven't been out talented, just out coached and out played.

 

this guy is a dud and i'd like to see who on this board still buys in

[Billsfan1972]

14 minutes ago, colin said:

if mcd is let go after this season (say we miss the playoffs, which is sadly quite likely) -- how does he compare to marvin lewis?

 

better record with miles more talent.  lost games due to horrible blunders.  both ran teams with huge discipline problems, the difference is lewis drafted and signed problem child talents who would fly off the handle here and there.  mcd goes for "character" but we commit painful penalties at a huge rate.

 

in 2020 it could be argued that maybe we didn't have the talent to hang w the big dogs (not sure that's true, but i could buy it), since then we haven't been out talented, just out coached and out played.

 

this guy is a dud and i'd like to see who on this board still buys in

McD has wasted Allen....   no comparison 

[Mark Vader]

On 11/27/2023 at 4:52 AM, Brian Higgins hair said:

….Maybe, just maybe when you consistently miss on early round players like Basham, Elam, Epenesa, and destroy the cap by signing aging vets like Miller, Tre and Poyer, this is what happens.

‘McDermott holds a lot of res, but Beane is no GM god.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

.

He's not John Butler either.

[C.Biscuit97]

20 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

McD has wasted Allen....   no comparison 

Again, this is where we go too far. We have had top 3 defenses for most of Allen’s career. This team has averaged 12 wins once Allen “developed.” Allen got the same OC his rookie year for 4 years which rarely happens. 
 

allen has made himself into a great player. But it’s BS to give McDermott/ the Bills any credit for that. 

21 hours ago, JerseyBills said:

He doesn't deserve credit for developing a raw asf QB?

 

Ppl just love to pick and choose to fit their narrative 

No. The guy who was neither 1st or 2nd team mountain west was always going to be a star. Clearly. 
 

and I’m fine with moving on from McDermott but as you said, it’s cesp not to give him any credit for helping Allen into the player he is.

[Straight Hucklebuck]

Beane also wears some of this.

 

His personnel philosophy has been keep as much of the 2020 team together as possible. 
 

So it’s keep Hyde, Poyer, promote Gabe to #2, extend Oliver, extend Tre White, Dawkins, extend Milano, keep Morse.

 

That approach leads to an expensive team with age.

 

Beane has taken what little money he has and has jammed in veterans to supplement the roster. 

 

Other approaches would have been trading down in the draft and acquiring more picks and using that savings to go more aggressive at top flight talent, moving off McDermott last year, etc. The Von Miller contract has been a killer. 

 

I just think this version of the team, maxed out talent wise in 2020/2021, combined with this Coach, and we’re just hitting the ceiling. 
 

It’s gotten harder and harder to get everyone back, and the basis that the 2020 AFCCG team was 90% of the way there may have been faulty.  
 

 

Edited November 28, 2023 by Straight Hucklebuck

[Niagara Dude]

On 11/26/2023 at 10:42 PM, Patrick Fitzryan said:

Let's be honest...that's what McDermott is.

 

All the coaches we've criticized never had the talent McDermott has.

 

Put Allen on the Mike Mularkey 2004 Bills - that team possibly wins the Super Bowl. Put Allen on any Jauron teams that went 7-9 every year with Losman/Edwards - those teams make the playoffs annually. Doug Marrone's 2014 Bills that went 9-7 with a lights-out defense and Kyle Orton - that team goes deep into the playoffs. Rex Ryan took Mark Freaking Sanchez to the AFC Championship twice. What does he do with Allen?

 

Why does this guy continue to get credit for turning the team around when it's clearly a case of him simply getting a HOF QB by chance? How many games does his defense have to blow? How many more stupid timeouts? How many more?

No question, he is not a very good good at all.  Neither Poyer or Hyde both late round picks who did nothing before coming to Buffalo would still be in the league without McDermott and his old school soft zone defence

 

 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

The Sabres still talk about development and learning, guys who “want to be here” and growing.

 

So when I hear us continue to harken back to 2017 and how McDermott changed the culture it’s past the expiration date. 
 

2020 showed us the value of getting another top flight WR in this offense. 
 

McDermott / Beane chose the balanced roster path and have devoted 55-60/45-40 resources to the defense to get after Pat Mahomes.

 

What if instead of DEs and Von Miller they made getting another #1 WR their first priority?

 

Especially when to this day we play PREVENT defense in key moments.

[DuckyBoys]

Jauron did more w less  Yeah it was a tough watch but he got the most from what he had 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

On 11/27/2023 at 8:55 AM, Shortchaz said:

I don’t have a completely fleshed out thought but it seems to me McDermott is: 

 

a rigid proceduralist; there’s only one right way to do things. Not creative or a trailblazer 
 

obsessed with being respected not with winning

 

a bit of a hard-on 

 

he’s limited and will live in the good to pretty good range but unlikely to sniff great. 
 

Insipid 

 

 

To me, he has always spoke like Doug Marrone.

 

He knows it all, has done it all, seen it all, knows what it looks like.

 

It’s that constipated/stern manner that grates on me. The ultra generic cliche responses to everything, the timeouts, the complimentary football, everything is top secret and he says nothing.

 

Where he is like Dick Jauron is that he knows his defensive system. He knows zone. And when it comes to these games he still has that same approach to play safe, keep plays in front of us. It just doesn’t work against these elite QBs because it’s death by 1000 paper cuts. 
 

 

 

 

[Billsfan1972]

1 hour ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Again, this is where we go too far. We have had top 3 defenses for most of Allen’s career. This team has averaged 12 wins once Allen “developed.” Allen got the same OC his rookie year for 4 years which rarely happens. 
 

allen has made himself into a great player. But it’s BS to give McDermott/ the Bills any credit for that. 

No. The guy who was neither 1st or 2nd team mountain west was always going to be a star. Clearly. 
 

and I’m fine with moving on from McDermott but as you said, it’s cesp not to give him any credit for helping Allen into the player he is.

McD took a perfectly decent offense (Rex) and first three years was 31st, 29th and 24th in the league.  He did the impossible and not have a 300 yard passing game his first three years.

 

 

Edited November 28, 2023 by Billsfan1972

[JohnNord]

On 11/26/2023 at 10:53 PM, Billever76 said:

I've been saying this for 3 years and have been suspended here twice for voicing my opinion on this bumbling moron of a coach....the biggest issue with the Bills is and always has been McDermott 

Who suspended you and why would they suspend you for criticizing the coach?  Seems to be within the rules

[Billsfan1972]

Allen is all the difference.  

Edited November 28, 2023 by Billsfan1972

[JohnNord]

1 hour ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

Beane also wears some of this.

 

His personnel philosophy has been keep as much of the 2020 team together as possible. 
 

So it’s keep Hyde, Poyer, promote Gabe to #2, extend Oliver, extend Tre White, Dawkins, extend Milano, keep Morse.

 

That approach leads to an expensive team with age.

 

Beane has taken what little money he has and has jammed in veterans to supplement the roster. 

 

Other approaches would have been trading down in the draft and acquiring more picks and using that savings to go more aggressive at top flight talent, moving off McDermott last year, etc. The Von Miller contract has been a killer. 

 

I just think this version of the team, maxed out talent wise in 2020/2021, combined with this Coach, and we’re just hitting the ceiling. 
 

It’s gotten harder and harder to get everyone back, and the basis that the 2020 AFCCG team was 90% of the way there may have been faulty.  
 

 

This is completely correct.  There was someone here to said that Beane was going to turn on McDermott to keep his job.  My response was that he can’t because he would also be incriminating his performance.  
 

As far as the moves you’ve mentioned, some worked out and some didn’t.   But you mentioned Von Miller… the reason they had to overpay for Von was because they repeatedly missed on the DE position both with veterans and high draft picks.  So they were forced to overpay for Von Miller.  The moves worked until he blew his ACL and now it will be an albatross to the cap.  
 

The other move that looks questionable was re-signing Knox and drafting Kincaid.  Kincaid looks like he will be great TE,  but Knox’s deal will hurt the team next year.

 

There seems to be a fallacy that the Bills roster is better than it actually is. 

[DrBob806]

7 minutes ago, JohnNord said:

This is completely correct.  There was someone here to said that Beane was going to turn on McDermott to keep his job.  My response was that he can’t because he would also be incriminating his performance.  
 

As far as the moves you’ve mentioned, some worked out and some didn’t.   But you mentioned Von Miller… the reason they had to overpay for Von was because they repeatedly missed on the DE position both with veterans and high draft picks.  So they were forced to overpay for Von Miller.  The moves worked until he blew his ACL and now it will be an albatross to the cap.  
 

The other move that looks questionable was re-signing Knox and drafting Kincaid.  Kincaid looks like he will be great TE,  but Knox’s deal will hurt the team next year.

 

There seems to be a fallacy that the Bills roster is better than it actually is. 

That's the thing in the salary cap era. The Bills aren't alone in chasing an aged vet, overpaying because they think they're close to the pinnacle.

 

Where the Bills erred I think, was basically standing pat while Miami & the NYJets snuck up on 'em in the division. Yeah, maybe Rodgers would have gotten killed later in the year by that woeful O-line, but they WENT for it like the Bills did with Von.

 

 

[Steve Billieve]

Gosh, just imagine what they could have acheived with Tyrod Taylor

[Bill from NYC]

On 11/27/2023 at 12:02 AM, PromoTheRobot said:

His GM masterfully pulled a "Draft Day" to get Josh Allen. The QB 90% of Bills fans called "the wrong Josh."😂  

True but we were forced into this position because McDermott did not want Mahomes. Instead he wanted a 1st round corner to play in a zone. 

 

My how quickly we forget.

 

PS: I sure as hell wasn't one of the "wrong Josh" folks.

Edited November 29, 2023 by Bill from NYC

[JakeFrommStateFarm]

Giving McD credit for this teams turnaround would be like giving credit to the rooster for the sun coming up

[Mr. WEO]

On 11/28/2023 at 2:15 PM, Mark80 said:

 

I mean, you just doubled down on my point, thanks.  Tyrod was horrible.  Horrible every where he has played.  Yet, somehow we made the playoffs with him and an "incredibly mediocre team."  Tyrod's horrendous, "I'm afraid to throw to anyone who isn't open by 5 yards mentality" lost that game for us vs the Jags more than anything.

 

 

It wasn't a good team that was gifted a playoff spot by a spoiler.  HE was taken down by the combo of Doug Marrone and Blake Bortles (87 yards passing). 

 

Since then , with a far superior roster, 4 bad playoff exits in a row, one AFCC game (lost).

[Billsfan1972]

On 11/28/2023 at 2:15 PM, Mark80 said:

 

I mean, you just doubled down on my point, thanks.  Tyrod was horrible.  Horrible every where he has played.  Yet, somehow we made the playoffs with him and an "incredibly mediocre team."  Tyrod's horrendous, "I'm afraid to throw to anyone who isn't open by 5 yards mentality" lost that game for us vs the Jags more than anything.

Actually he had very decent stats with Rex as HC, but that is conveniently forgotten here (as was the record) as he was hated and McD considered the saviour.

[mannc]

7 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

Actually he had very decent stats with Rex as HC, but that is conveniently forgotten here (as was the record) as he was hated and McD considered the saviour.

The team McDermott took over was coached to a .500 record by Wrex Ryan. After adding Tre White, Dawkins and Milano, McDermott squeezed 1 more win out of them…what a legend.

[Billsfan1972]

21 minutes ago, mannc said:

The team McDermott took over was coached to a .500 record by Wrex Ryan. After adding Tre White, Dawkins and Milano, McDermott squeezed 1 more win out of them…what a legend.

And that is the narrative that McD fans ignore. Drives me crazy.

 

I don’t have any ill will towards McD, but the legend that some people attribute to him i don’t understand.

 

I just know he started Peterman and then doubled down the next year naming him the starter.

Edited November 30, 2023 by Billsfan1972

[HardyBoy]

Losman was arguably in a similar sphere as Allen physically and mentally...he was ruined by poor coaching, but don't let that get in the way of your narrative.

 

The culture on those teams sucked, and they would have never developed Allen into what he is today.

[Billsfan1972]

9 minutes ago, HardyBoy said:

Losman was arguably in a similar sphere as Allen physically and mentally...he was ruined by poor coaching, but don't let that get in the way of your narrative.

 

The culture on those teams sucked, and they would have never developed Allen into what he is today.

I say they held Allen back the first two years and the first ten games this year.

 

I'll credit Daboll not McD.....  Thank you

 

[HardyBoy]

Just now, Billsfan1972 said:

I say they held Allen back the first two years and the first ten games this year.

 

I'll credit Daboll not McD.....  Thank you

 

 

Wow, you must have special powers of insight into knowing how things went down based on having no actual information...super powers

 

Anyway, that's off topic, my comment was on how Allen would have been ruined by those coaching staffs, in the same way they ruined JP Losman.

 

Losman would have been a top level qb if he played today, I'm sure of that.

[Billsfan1972]

47 minutes ago, HardyBoy said:

 

Wow, you must have special powers of insight into knowing how things went down based on having no actual information...super powers

 

Anyway, that's off topic, my comment was on how Allen would have been ruined by those coaching staffs, in the same way they ruined JP Losman.

 

Losman would have been a top level qb if he played today, I'm sure of that.

No better special powers then you.  If Losman was so good another team could have resurrected him.

 

No head coach goes one year, much less 48 games (first 3 years) withoit a 300 yard passing game.  McD accomplished this.  

 

So yes i think Allen could be further ahead.  Jmho

Edited November 30, 2023 by Billsfan1972

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

23 minutes ago, HardyBoy said:

Losman was arguably in a similar sphere as Allen physically and mentally...he was ruined by poor coaching, but don't let that get in the way of your narrative.

 

The culture on those teams sucked, and they would have never developed Allen into what he is today.

 

Eh... JP losman was a sack machine in college, and a sack machine in the pro's.  Kid didn't have it between the ears in the slightest.  Not to mention his arm was not nearly as strong as Allens.  

12 minutes ago, HardyBoy said:

 

Wow, you must have special powers of insight into knowing how things went down based on having no actual information...super powers

 

Anyway, that's off topic, my comment was on how Allen would have been ruined by those coaching staffs, in the same way they ruined JP Losman.

 

Losman would have been a top level qb if he played today, I'm sure of that.

 

I don't see it.  Holds the ball, takes sacks, not a rhythm passer, not particularly accurate.  

[HardyBoy]

31 minutes ago, Bleeding Bills Blue said:

 

Eh... JP losman was a sack machine in college, and a sack machine in the pro's.  Kid didn't have it between the ears in the slightest.  Not to mention his arm was not nearly as strong as Allens.  

 

I don't see it.  Holds the ball, takes sacks, not a rhythm passer, not particularly accurate.  

 

Respectfully you don't know what you're talking about, and I didn't either until I read this article a few years back...JP Losman should have been elite, coaching broke him:

 

https://theathletic.com/2537042/2021/04/23/ex-bills-qb-j-p-losman-didnt-let-his-disappointing-nfl-career-define-him-instead-he-found-his-calling-at-clemson/

 

 

"

To some, Losman’s story is that of a first-round disappointment. The Bills drafted him No. 22 in the 2004 NFL Draft after Eli Manning, Philip Rivers and Ben Roethlisberger were already off the board.

 

“J.P. had the arm talent to rank with those guys and maybe even a little better arm talent than some of them,” former Bills offensive coordinator Tom Clements said. “He was probably the most athletic of that group, too … I don’t know how others had him ranked, but we felt strongly he was within that group of players.”

 

Yet seemingly from the start, Losman’s career was defined by adversity. He broke his leg in his first NFL training camp when he collided with Troy Vincent. That limited him to three games as a rookie.

 

The next year, he was benched after five games, only for the coaching staff to turn back to him later in the year. By Year 3, he was on his second head coach. He had three offensive coordinators in five seasons. The 2006 season, Losman’s third, was the only chance he got to start 16 games. He threw 19 touchdowns and 14 interceptions and had the 11th-best quarterback rating in the league. But the Bills drafted Trent Edwards in the third round the following year. Losman’s early-season injury in 2007 led the Bills to bench him in favor of Edwards. By midseason, ESPN reported that players weren’t pleased that Losman, a team captain, was on the bench, and they thought owner Ralph Wilson Jr. wanted Losman benched so that he couldn’t hit his performance bonuses.

 

“J.P. never had a fair chance,” former Bills vice president of player personnel John Guy said. “I’ll never forget his first day of practice and they were blitzing him every which way. I remember saying, ‘This isn’t the way to break in a quarterback.’”

 

"

 

... 

 

Matt Hasselbeck thought he knew what to expect when the Seahawks brought Losman in for a workout in 2010. Then 35, Hasselbeck had seen plenty of former first-round picks in the second acts of their careers. Because he didn’t know Losman, he perceived him through bits and pieces of what he had read and heard online.

 

“It was like, ‘Oh, that’s the guy that is tremendously talented, has the best arm you’ve ever seen, can run, has all the tools, but what’s his attitude like?’” Hasselbeck recalled. “That kind of stuff. That was sort of the vibe you got about him.”

 

After the workout, John Schneider and Pete Carroll said Losman’s workout was one of the most impressive quarterback workouts they’d ever seen. Hasselbeck wondered what his intangibles were like. Everyone knew he had the talent. Almost immediately after Losman signed, Hasselbeck regretted ever questioning his attitude or intangibles.

 

“I don’t even know if I could put a finger on just how much value he brought to our team,” Hasselbeck said. “I was 35 years old and whatever year that was for me playing. I’m older than my position coach, and my position coach is a very good coach. But I’m feeling like, wow, I’m really learning some valuable things from this third-string guy who I initially thought based on what I read on the internet, ‘This guy doesn’t have any intangibles that he’s bringing to the table.’ I couldn’t have been more wrong. He was incredible.”

 

...

That wasn’t the only time Hasselbeck thought Losman would be a coach. He shared that opinion around the building and with friends in the league. The more he was around Losman, the more he realized whatever perception he had before the arrival in Seattle was way off base.

 

“I think he’s been misunderstood,” Hasselbeck said. “He might just be smarter than everybody else. Sometimes when you’re smarter than the other people in the room it doesn’t work. If you have better ideas than the person in charge, and I don’t know who coached him prior, but it can feel threatening or like insubordination.”

 

Edited November 30, 2023 by HardyBoy

[CincyBillsFan]

28 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

No better special powers then you.  If Losman was so good another team could have resurrected him.

 

No head coach goes one year, much less 48 games (first 3 years) withoit a 300 yard passing game.  McD accomplished this.  

 

So yes i think Allen could bebfurther ah3ad.  Jmho

Losman and Allen should not be named together as Allen is an exponentially better QB.

 

Say the Bills drafted Baker, Darnold or the Other Josh, today we would be speculating on who was going to replace the coach that replaced McD in 2020.

 

Meanwhile I suspect Allen on another team not named the Chargers would have a Super Bowl ring or two. Because the only other franchise in football that would have squandered Allen the way the Bills have so far wasted him would have been the Chargers.  Because defensive minded head coaches in the current NFL can't get O lines, offensive skill players and QB's right. The Bills success has been in spite of McD and because Allen is really that good.

 

 

[HardyBoy]

2 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

Losman and Allen should not be named together as Allen is an exponentially better QB.

 

Say the Bills drafted Baker, Darnold or the Other Josh, today we would be speculating on who was going to replace the coach that replaced McD in 2020.

 

Meanwhile I suspect Allen on another team not named the Chargers would have a Super Bowl ring or two. Because the only other franchise in football that would have squandered Allen the way the Bills have so far wasted him would have been the Chargers.  Because defensive minded head coaches in the current NFL can't get O lines, offensive skill players and QB's right. The Bills success has been in spite of McD and because Allen is really that good.

 

 

 

They developed Allen into the player he is today and Losman probably should be talked about in the same breath as Allen, and definitely as a cautionary tale.

[Billsfan1972]

2 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

Losman and Allen should not be named together as Allen is an exponentially better QB.

 

Say the Bills drafted Baker, Darnold or the Other Josh, today we would be speculating on who was going to replace the coach that replaced McD in 2020.

 

Meanwhile I suspect Allen on another team not named the Chargers would have a Super Bowl ring or two. Because the only other franchise in football that would have squandered Allen the way the Bills have so far wasted him would have been the Chargers.  Because defensive minded head coaches in the current NFL can't get O lines, offensive skill players and QB's right. The Bills success has been in spite of McD and because Allen is really that good.

 

 

Regardless and we agree here, what drives me nuts is how the D has failed almost every time late game & OT along with McD's boneheaded decisions and miscues.

[mannc]

2 minutes ago, HardyBoy said:

 

They developed Allen into the player he is today and Losman probably should be talked about in the same breath as Allen, and definitely as a cautionary tale.

Please tell us what Sean McDermott, the defensive back specialist, did to make Josh Allen what he is today…

[McBean]

5 minutes ago, HardyBoy said:

 

They developed Allen into the player he is today and Losman probably should be talked about in the same breath as Allen, and definitely as a cautionary tale.

[HardyBoy]

1 minute ago, McBean said:

 

Read the article I shared...Allen is also the smartest person in most rooms. Those former Bills coaching staffs would have destroyed him just like they did Losman.

[CincyBillsFan]

Just now, HardyBoy said:

 

They developed Allen into the player he is today and Losman probably should be talked about in the same breath as Allen, and definitely as a cautionary tale.

First and foremost Allen developed himself into the player he is today.  I know this goes against the "gone Hollywood" narrative but the guy has made his own way to the top of the QB world.  It was Allen who chose not to give up and enroll in a community college when no D1 ofers were on the table;  it was Allen who made the smart choice of going to Wyoming; It was Allen who then made the choice to work out with Palmer.

 

Next, DaBoll gets a lot of credit for Allen becoming the QB he is today. You know who else should get more credit then Bean/McD for developing Allen his first two years? The people of Buffalo & Bills Mafia.  The atmosphere in Buffalo was perfect for a guy like Allen.  And he Buffalo community enthusiastically embraced the young QB which had to help him through those first 2 tough years.

 

When I look back at 2018 & 2019 it's hard for me to see how the Bills did much to develop Allen.  He was basically thrown to the wolves by Bean/McD. Fortunately between Allen and DaBoll he was able to float and then swim. 

 

*  He wasn't named the starter as a rookie and didn't get a lot of 1st team reps in training camp & the preseason games. Allen saw Peterman, the worst QB to start games in NFL history, get the nod over him.  How many guys would have lost confidence seeing that happen?  Then Petermann predictably sucked and Allen is thrust into the starting job week 2.

 

*  Of course Bean/McD not expecting their rookie to play much in year 1 eviscerate the offense as part of a rebuild.  Do you remember who Allen was playing with his rookie season?

 

*  In 2019 Bean/McD took the bargain basement path with their new QB.  Morse was a solid if not risky signing but no one is going to call Brown & Beasley splash offensive signings.

 

*  It wasn't until 2020 when Bean/McD FINALLY made a big time move to support Allen on the offense by signing Diggs.  But that was it until 2023 when they used a 1st round draft pick to take Kincaid.  ONE splash offensive FA signing/draft pick over Allen's first 5 seasons. ONE!

 

The narrative that the Bills organization developed Allen is just not supported by the evidence.

 

 

19 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

Regardless and we agree here, what drives me nuts is how the D has failed almost every time late game & OT along with McD's boneheaded decisions and miscues.

I think it's safe to say that the defensive shortcomings seen over the last four playoff seasons are now being seen in the regular season.

 

[HardyBoy]

27 minutes ago, mannc said:

Please tell us what Sean McDermott, the defensive back specialist, did to make Josh Allen what he is today…

 

13 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

First and foremost Allen developed himself into the player he is today.  I know this goes against the "gone Hollywood" narrative but the guy has made his own way to the top of the QB world.  It was Allen who chose not to give up and enroll in a community college when no D1 ofers were on the table;  it was Allen who made the smart choice of going to Wyoming; It was Allen who then made the choice to work out with Palmer.

 

Next, DaBoll gets a lot of credit for Allen becoming the QB he is today. You know who else should get more credit then Bean/McD for developing Allen his first two years? The people of Buffalo & Bills Mafia.  The atmosphere in Buffalo was perfect for a guy like Allen.  And he Buffalo community enthusiastically embraced the young QB which had to help him through those first 2 tough years.

 

When I look back at 2018 & 2019 it's hard for me to see how the Bills did much to develop Allen.  He was basically thrown to the wolves by Bean/McD. Fortunately between Allen and DaBoll he was able to float and then swim. 

 

*  He wasn't named the starter as a rookie and didn't get a lot of 1st team reps in training camp & the preseason games. Allen saw Peterman, the worst QB to start games in NFL history, get the nod over him.  How many guys would have lost confidence seeing that happen?  Then Petermann predictably sucked and Allen is thrust into the starting job week 2.

 

*  Of course Bean/McD not expecting their rookie to play much in year 1 eviscerate the offense as part of a rebuild.  Do you remember who Allen was playing with his rookie season?

 

*  In 2019 Bean/McD took the bargain basement path with their new QB.  Morse was a solid if not risky signing but no one is going to call Brown & Beasley splash offensive signings.

 

*  It wasn't until 2020 when Bean/McD FINALLY made a big time move to support Allen on the offense by signing Diggs.  But that was it until 2023 when they used a 1st round draft pick to take Kincaid.  ONE splash offensive FA signing/draft pick over Allen's first 5 seasons. ONE!

 

The narrative that the Bills organization developed Allen is just not supported by the evidence.

 

 

I think it's safe to say that the defensive shortcomings seen over the last four playoff seasons are now being seen in the regular season.

 

 

You mean the head coach that coordinates all the practice plans, and sets the expectations on the types of offensive formations they will highlight in a practice and coordinating with the defensive staff to make sure they are giving him the right looks defensively to reinforce the information he is learning from film and other preparation off the field

 

You guys sound super ignorant on what a head coach does...freaking Dunning Kruger convention

 

And Beasley was a huge signing, even at the time... he was the best slot receiver in football and was clearly being improperly utilized in Dallas...Brown turned out to be exactly the player they were hoping he would be...both of those signings were amazing at the time and looking back on it

[mannc]

1 minute ago, HardyBoy said:

 

 

You mean the head coach that coordinates all the practice plans, and sets the expectations on the types of offensive formations they will highlight in a practice and coordinating with the defensive staff to make sure they are giving him the right looks defensively to reinforce the information he is learning from film and other preparation off the field

 

You guys sound super ignorant on what a head coach does...freaking Dunning Kruger convention

 

And Beasley was a huge signing, even at the time... he was the best slot receiver in football and was clearly being improperly utilized in Dallas...Brown turned out to be exactly the player they were hoping he would be...both of those signings were amazing at the time and looking back on it

So McDermott took time off from coaching up Josh Allen to sign Beasley and Smoke Brown?

[HardyBoy]

2 minutes ago, mannc said:

So McDermott took time off from coaching up Josh Allen to sign Beasley and Smoke Brown?

 

That was in response to what I quoted from CincyBillsFan, not your post

[foreboding]

On 11/27/2023 at 12:14 AM, gobills404 said:

Good lord almighty, NO they would not. We can criticize McDummy without pretending other bad coaches were good. 

Think this was a joke...

[somnus00]

McDermott makes more in a year than Jauron did in his whole tenure. So if anything, McD is a rich man's Jauron.

 

That said, not sure I agree, but I see the comparison.

[Billsfan1972]

2 hours ago, HardyBoy said:

 

 

You mean the head coach that coordinates all the practice plans, and sets the expectations on the types of offensive formations they will highlight in a practice and coordinating with the defensive staff to make sure they are giving him the right looks defensively to reinforce the information he is learning from film and other preparation off the field

 

You guys sound super ignorant on what a head coach does...freaking Dunning Kruger convention

 

And Beasley was a huge signing, even at the time... he was the best slot receiver in football and was clearly being improperly utilized in Dallas...Brown turned out to be exactly the player they were hoping he would be...both of those signings were amazing at the time and looking back on it

Then he has failed miserably based on all the mistakes he makes game day.

 

He annointed Peterman the starting qb Allen's rookie season.  If Peterwas just awful instead of unplayable how long would have Allen sat?

 

Btw I look at CJ Stroud and wonder just how much McD would have impeaded him if he was the coach.  

 

I say if Allen was brought along like him he'd be further ahead.

Edited November 30, 2023 by Billsfan1972