Stadium Construction Discussion (No PSL/Seat selection posts)

[Ga boy]

1 minute ago, Bob Jones said:

Looking at that photo/rendering, I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that new stadium's seats and aisles would be covered in snow just as bad as Highmark was the other day (after a similar high wind/Lake effect snow event).

Did you forget about the state of the art wind confusion technology😂

7 minutes ago, Ga boy said:

I believe there are 3-4 more snow cities that play in the elements.

I think Roger wanted snow games in Buffalo.  Must see tv.

[Matt_In_NH]

19 minutes ago, ddaryl said:

 

 

really all the extra support needed, you do know you can't just put a roof on, that roof needs major support built in...  I also haven't see a render that shows it 70% covered, maybe 30% covered

Does this look 70% covered to you ?

 

Cannot tell from the angle.  But also snow and rain dont just fall stright down.

[Einstein]

12 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

No. The roof will cover the entire upper deck. 

 

Maybe it will.

And then the wind will blow the snow right into those seats.

I saw a video of the workers clearing out snow from the stadium and the wind was blowing the snow from the lower and upper deck, right into the covered concourse walkways. 

[Matt_In_NH]

19 minutes ago, PayDaBill$ said:

Only going by a post above on the 70%.

 

Youre the mathematician, the entire stadium project is $1.7b and you told me a $1b to cover.

 

i call BS.

The other thing is the current stadium is spread out at a very slow incline, the new one will have much steeper seats and there will be less square footage to shovel even if it had no cover.

Edited January 16 by Matt_In_NH

[ddaryl]

Just now, Matt_In_NH said:

Cannot tell from the angle.  But also snow and rain dont just fall stright down.

 

 

the partial cover will help some, especially with the wind.

[Matt_In_NH]

On 1/14/2024 at 12:48 PM, peterpan said:

The State Government should have insisted on a dome.

If you had a state government with any brains there would be no stadium.  As a guy who moved from the region, I am glad there will be a new stadium but public dollars is a little sketchy IMO.   Your reasoning also lacks details how much it will cost and how much all these events (that are just pie in the sky ideas) would or could bring in.  Where is the market analysis that shows it would pay off?   Actually I bet they did consider that kind of thing.   Does OP want all these events or have a say in it?

[PayDaBill$]

51 minutes ago, ddaryl said:

Ok but if there was a R.O.I then what is stopping them.. 

if you are gonna make your money back then what is stopping them......  they can't afford the loss or chose not to lose money on this investment

All I can say is with a taxpayer contribution of $850 million, &  $650 million due from the state, and the remainder from Erie County I think Pegula who’s worth is about $7B could have sprung for a design build with a roof.

 

A stadium is not an investment, how much revenue is the taxpayer realizing from their investment?😉

 

Oh and for NYS and Erie County part - where’s the money actually coming from?

 

Edited January 16 by PayDaBill$

[SoCal Deek]

20 minutes ago, Einstein said:

 

Maybe it will.

And then the wind will blow the snow right into those seats.

I saw a video of the workers clearing out snow from the stadium and the wind was blowing the snow from the lower and upper deck, right into the covered concourse walkways. 

If the wind blows the snow, or rain, into the downwind part of the bowl that means the upwind side will be shielded. You only get snowdrifts on one side of your house. 

[Einstein]

7 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

If the wind blows the snow, or rain, into the downwind part of the bowl that means the upwind side will be shielded. You only get snowdrifts on one side of your house. 

 

I know the Tottenham stadium claims to be 100% covered (for seats - not the field) and they still get snow and rain on their seats. If we only have 60-70% covered, how much of our stadium is going to be hit with rain/snow when we account for swirling wind?

 

 

The snow seems to go up the first section of their seats.

Edited January 16 by Einstein

[Donuts and Doritos]

It's days like yesterday that make you sit back, look & realize...

 

Screw it! We don't need a roof.

 

Edited January 16 by Donuts and Doritos

[eball]

Just now, Einstein said:

 

I know the Tottenham stadium claims to be 100% covered (for seats - not the field) and they still get snow and rain on their seats. If we only have 60-70% covered, how much of our stadium is going to be hit with rain/snow when we account for swirling wind?

 

 

The wind will be confused.  Not to worry.

 

[Buffalo Super Fan]

13 minutes ago, ddaryl said:

That's an extra $ BIllion.

So the question I'm going to ask, and if you have the answer I expect solid details. Where is the R.O.I coming from ?  The amount of offseason use of the venue needed to justify an extra billion$ is not happening. You would need to be able to book a couple dozen offseason acts to have a chance at getting an R.O.I. 

Not many big name acts or shows want to come to Buffalo in the winter.. dome or not. So again you can do the math up, down, sideways... the bottom line is you're in the red. Add in the fact that the new stadium will be getting periodic maintenance after the 1st decade of use, so you can start adding in 100s of millions of upkeep.

Buffalo just doesn't have the ability to support a dome and break even. Its a losing proposition. Terry could pony up the $1 Billion but even he knows he ain't making that chunk back. The state knows they can't sell that to the taxpayers, they sold them on replacing the stadium, but even that pissed off lots of NYS residents. There was a less than zero chance they could sell taxpayers on an extra $billion.

So you are saying that the Buffalo Bills have 17 years left in Western New York after this season? Because taxpayers don’t want to pay but they are ok as one of many examples letting Madison Square Garden owners not pay taxes on MSG for 50 plus years? When are New York State residents like yourself going to get the taxes aren’t going down ever in New York State? The New York State political leaders sell taxpayers on lots of stuff they are spending the taxpayers money regardless so this whole new stadium situation with savings is a joke. Western New York is never changing in a positive economic growth with there cheap mentality we aren’t saving it’s going to eventually cost us more money down the road than if we did the stadium right to begin with.
 

The Buffalo Bills should have built a downtown stadium in the late 1990’s when Pittsburgh, Cleveland and Cincinnati were doing that instead cheap renovations. Now we are left with the another Orchard Park open air stadium with a canopy that has never been done or tested in a snow belt like Buffalo sorry Seattle, London and Miami aren’t Buffalo weather. Your asking us to believe in a 70 plus year old owner that lives in Florida and two lawyers turned politicians in the Governor and Erie County executive what could go wrong? History tends to repeat itself this Highmark Stadium 2 decision is going to be just like all the Highmark Stadium 1 renovations in the 1990’s costly in the long run to the taxpayers there will be no savings kicking the can down the road it cost way more than if we did it right now. Speaking as a Amherst and New York State resident and taxpayer we aren’t saving anything it’s a joke in my opinion. Go Bills! Let’s Go Buffalo 

[SoCal Deek]

Just now, Einstein said:

 

I know the Tottenham stadium claims to be 100% covered (for seats - not the field) and they still get snow and rain on their seats. If we only have 60-70% covered, how much of our stadium is going to be hit with rain/snow when we account for swirling wind?

 

Ugh! A roof neither CREATES nor DISAPPEARS snow or rain. There will be less of either inside the stadium by exact percentage that the roof covers when looking straight down on the bowl from an airplane. 

[ScotSHO]

25 minutes ago, Matt_In_NH said:

If you had a state government with any brains there would be no stadium.  As a guy who moved from the region, I am glad there will be a new stadium but public dollars is a little sketchy IMO.   Your reasoning also lacks details how much it will cost and how much all these events (that are just pie in the sky ideas) would or could bring in.  Where is the market analysis that shows it would pay off?   Actually I bet they did consider that kind of thing.   Does OP want all these events or have a say in it?

I'm sorry, you're 2 years late to the discussion. 

[Matt_In_NH]

1 minute ago, ScotSHO said:

I'm sorry, you're 2 years late to the discussion. 

How so?  I am not arguing against anything that is actually happening.  I am just offering an opinion.  I even used past tense.

[ddaryl]

58 minutes ago, PayDaBill$ said:

All I can say is with a taxpayer contribution of $850 million, &  $650 million due from the state, and the remainder from Erie County I think Pegula who’s worth is about $7B could have sprung for a design build with a roof.

 

A stadium is not an investment, how much revenue is the taxpayer realizing from their investment?😉

 

Oh and for NYS and Erie County part - where’s the money actually coming from?

 

 

 

NYS and Erie come from tax payers. There were plenty of pissed off taxpayers that didn't want any tax money going towards the stadium. 

 

Pegulas could but they are billionaires. Billionaires don't invest like that because there is no ROI. They put money towards the stadium, they were not going to add to their expenses here. 

 

Yes it would be lovely if all the rich folks spent their money buying us nice things, but we live in capitalism, if your not getting a return it's a piss poor investment decision. 

 

I've said my peace, it wasn't going to happen, and it's not going to happen

[Einstein]

51 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

Ugh! A roof neither CREATES nor DISAPPEARS snow or rain. There will be less of either inside the stadium by exact percentage that the roof covers when looking straight down on the bowl from an airplane. 

 

So if the roof covers 100% of the seats, shouldn’t there be no snow? 

On the seats I mean.

[SoCal Deek]

3 minutes ago, Einstein said:

 

So if the roof covers 100% of the seats, shouldn’t there be no snow? 

On the seats I mean.

Huh? Physics isn’t your strong suit. 

[PayDaBill$]

6 minutes ago, ddaryl said:

 

 

NYS and Erie come from tax payers. There were plenty of pissed off taxpayers that didn't want any tax money going towards the stadium. 

 

Pegulas could but they are billionaires. Billionaires don't invest like that because there is no ROI. They put money towards the stadium, they were not going to add to their expenses here. 

 

Yes it would be lovely if all the rich folks spent their money buying us nice things, but we live in capitalism, if your not getting a return it's a piss poor investment decision. 

 

I've said my peace, it wasn't going to happen, and it's not going to happen

There you go again with that silly word “investment”.

[Einstein]

5 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

Huh? Physics isn’t your strong suit. 

 

I'm not sure why you're being hostile. I was trying to learn from you. But ok then...

[SoCal Deek]

2 minutes ago, Einstein said:

 

I'm not sure why you're being hostile. I was trying to learn from you. But ok then...

I’m not being hostile. I’m trying to explain that just like a rain gauge collects rain the snow is going to fall on the roof, the seats, and the field in the exact proportions and percentages that each of those surfaces face the sky. None will be more and none will be less. So if the roof covers NONE of the stadium then everything will get snowed on. If the roof covers ALL of the stadium, then all of the stadium will be dry. And…if the roof covers FIFTY percent of the surface then fifty percent on the snow will be inside the ‘donut’. Make sense? 

[RangerDave]

My question is, will they have actual restrooms in the parking lots for tailgaters and people walking in from elsewhere, or will they still have the stupid porta-johns which are cold, lack sanitizer most of the time, run out of TP, and blow over in strong winds?

[Einstein]

3 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

And…if the roof covers FIFTY percent of the surface then fifty percent on the snow will be inside the ‘donut’. 

This part is what i'm curious about. Is it not not possible for the rain/snow to be driven by wind shear and escape the donut? At an angle.

 

Like this I mean: 

Meaning, it would hit upper deck, lower deck, etc. Due to wind driving it at an angle?

[SoCal Deek]

5 minutes ago, Einstein said:

This part is what i'm curious about. Is it not not possible for the rain/snow to be driven by wind shear and escape the donut? At an angle.

 

Like this I mean: 

Meaning, it would hit upper deck, lower deck, etc. Due to wind driving it at an angle?

Yes it is….but the OPPOSITE side is getting the exact same percentage blocked by the roof. 

[Ga boy]

What about the wind confusion screens?  I imagine the snow would stick to them, but maybe they’ll be heated.  Asking for a friend 😂

[SoCal Deek]

3 minutes ago, Ga boy said:

What about the wind confusion screens?  I imagine the snow would stick to them, but maybe they’ll be heated.  Asking for a friend 😂

If you want my honest opinion the entire wind confusion thing sounds like utter nonsense. I guess it could be that the exterior skin could be used to break up wind a little bit, but that surface would neither increase or decrease snow. 

[Einstein]

12 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

Yes it is….but the OPPOSITE side is getting the exact same percentage blocked by the roof. 

ok thanks.

[LabattBlue]

24 minutes ago, RangerDave said:

My question is, will they have actual restrooms in the parking lots for tailgaters and people walking in from elsewhere, or will they still have the stupid porta-johns which are cold, lack sanitizer most of the time, run out of TP, and blow over in strong winds?

I’ve been to around 10 different stadiums around the league and not one had actual bathrooms outside of the stadium, but on stadium property.  Porta-Johns, this is the way.  

[Ga boy]

3 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

If you want my honest opinion the entire wind confusion thing sounds like utter nonsense. I guess it could be that the exterior skin could be used to break up wind a little bit, but that surface would neither increase or decrease snow. 

I would hope it would reduce the winds from blowing in snow.  We may be pleasantly surprised, but, like you, I am skeptical 🤨 

[K-9]

35 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

I’m not being hostile. I’m trying to explain that just like a rain gauge collects rain the snow is going to fall on the roof, the seats, and the field in the exact proportions and percentages that each of those surfaces face the sky. None will be more and none will be less. So if the roof covers NONE of the stadium then everything will get snowed on. If the roof covers ALL of the stadium, then all of the stadium will be dry. And…if the roof covers FIFTY percent of the surface then fifty percent on the snow will be inside the ‘donut’. Make sense? 

[Heitz]

48 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

Yes it is….but the OPPOSITE side is getting the exact same percentage blocked by the roof. 

So look at the snow AND wind forecast before buying your game day tickets 🤣🙌  

[PromoTheRobot]

Make note for new stadium: Install slides for easy exiting.

 

 

Edited January 16 by PromoTheRobot

[SoCal Deek]

43 minutes ago, Heitz said:

So look at the snow AND wind forecast before buying your game day tickets 🤣🙌  

It’s no different than picking your seats based on the sun angle. Unlike baseball, not all football stadiums face the same direction. (Most people don’t know that virtually all baseball fields face northeast.) 

[Punching Bag]

I wonder where they are going to put all snow from construction site.

[nedboy7]

Am I reading correctly that the storms this week will also impact practices?  

[JoPoy88]

4 minutes ago, nedboy7 said:

Am I reading correctly that the storms this week will also impact practices?  

It appears so at least for today’s yes. And?

[rusty shackleford]

Damn, if only we had a domed sports venue downtown we wouldn’t ever have disruptions to a game…

[Logic]

Meanwhile, on Twitter...

Edited January 17 by Logic

[Mike in Horseheads]

3 hours ago, LabattBlue said:

Just stumbled across this. I am sure it has probably been posted in some thread, but this is the first I have seen it.  Look forward to following the progress(even though I am local and only 15 min drive away from checking it out). 
 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3LvIYNfq94&pp=ygUcYnVmZmFsbyBzdGFkaXVtIGNvbnN0cnVjdGlvbg%3D%3D

Thank you! I wondered why there wasn't a camera live , FFSthey had one one they built First Arena in Elmira in 2000

 

[The Wiz]

On 1/17/2024 at 2:44 PM, Logic said:

Meanwhile, on Twitter...