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AJ Klein: Tremaine Edmunds "a True Mike"


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I searched for this before posting, and was surprised not to find it her on the boards yet. Mods, if I missed something, please feel free to fold it into another thread.

 

https://www.newyorkupstate.com/buffalo-bills/2020/12/bills-matt-milano-almost-back-impact-on-aj-kleins-role-tremaine-edmunds-a-true-mlb.html

 

"Last week against the Los Angeles Chargers, Klein was the star, finishing with a game-high 14 tackles and 1.5 sacks. But Edmunds was arguably just as good. Pro Football Focus gave Klein a 91.0 grade in run defense and Edmunds just barely lower at a 90.7. In Edmunds last three games he’s received overall grades of 62.3, 63.6, and 74.2. The highest single-game grade he registered in his first 7 games was a 55.5.

 

"Klein played with 5x first team All Pro middle linebacker Luke Kuechly in Carolina and watched him play the position as well as anybody has done it this century. He said Edmunds is a smart player whose preparation and leadership make him stand out. He said Edmunds is a true “Mike” linebacker.

 

“ 'When you watch him on film not many guys that are his size can move and cover like he does,' Klein said. 'To be able to be that downhill, physical guy that he is, not only his skill set physically but his skillset mentally. How he approaches the game and how he understands the game, how he studies - he is a true ‘Mike’ linebacker and that’s where he belongs. You can see him, he’s sideline to sideline making plays all across the field. ... He really is something special to watch. It’s fun to be able to play with him.' ”

 

-------------

 

 

This should end the discussion. But it won't. There are plenty of people who think they're way smarter and know more about the Bills defense than guys who play on it or coach for it. We'll doubtless hear from them.

 

But let's hear none of the "Well, he had to say that," nonsense, because it's just not true. All he had to say was - and this is true of every player or coach - is the Crash Davis cliches. Yeah, you can't say bad things of a teammate. But it's totally fine to restrict yourself to the usual, "He gives 110% eight days a week and 25 hours a day," or "I want him beside me in an alley fight," or "He's a good good player. Works hard and it shows," or "I want him in my foxhole with me," or "I love going to war with that guy" or "True Buffalo Bills spirit. A tough guy who always brings it," the usual copy-and-paste sayings. Those are what you have to say. When you get very specific about things, you're going far beyond what you have to say and you're saying what you believe. Klein wasn't asked about whether Tremaine is a Mike. He simply said what he sees and knows.

Edited by Thurman#1
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I searched for this before posting, and was surprised not to find it her on the boards yet. Mods, if I missed something, please feel free to fold it into another thread.   https://www.newyor

So honest question to everyone saying he’s not physical enough-name some linebackers in the league that are “physical enough” - You can probably say Bobby Wagner, but go back and watch the Bills game,

There is a disconnect between what many fans want in a middle linebacker and what McD wants which contributes to the constant “Edmunds should be moved outside” comments every week. First and foremost

5 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

I searched for this before posting, and was surprised not to find it her on the boards yet. Mods, if I missed something, please feel free to fold it into another thread.

 

https://www.newyorkupstate.com/buffalo-bills/2020/12/bills-matt-milano-almost-back-impact-on-aj-kleins-role-tremaine-edmunds-a-true-mlb.html

 

"Last week against the Los Angeles Chargers, Klein was the star, finishing with a game-high 14 tackles and 1.5 sacks. But Edmunds was arguably just as good. Pro Football Focus gave Klein a 91.0 grade in run defense and Edmunds just barely lower at a 90.7. In Edmunds last three games he’s received overall grades of 62.3, 63.6, and 74.2. The highest single-game grade he registered in his first 7 games was a 55.5.

 

"Klein played with 5x first team All Pro middle linebacker Luke Kuechly in Carolina and watched him play the position as well as anybody has done it this century. He said Edmunds is a smart player whose preparation and leadership make him stand out. He said Edmunds is a true “Mike” linebacker.

 

“ 'When you watch him on film not many guys that are his size can move and cover like he does,' Klein said. 'To be able to be that downhill, physical guy that he is, not only his skill set physically but his skillset mentally. How he approaches the game and how he understands the game, how he studies - he is a true ‘Mike’ linebacker and that’s where he belongs. You can see him, he’s sideline to sideline making plays all across the field. ... He really is something special to watch. It’s fun to be able to play with him.' ”

 

-------------

 

 

This should end the discussion. But it won't. There are plenty of people who think they're way smarter and know more about the Bills defense than guys who play on it or coach for it. We'll doubtless hear from them.

 

But let's hear none of the "Well, he had to say that," nonsense, because it's just not true. All he had to say was - and this is true of every player or coach - is the Crash Davis cliches. Yeah, you can't say bad things of a teammate. But it's totally fine to restrict yourself to the usual, "He gives 110% eight days a week and 25 hours a day," or "I want him beside me in an alley fight," or "He's a good good player. Works hard and it shows," or "I want him in my foxhole with me," or "I love going to war with that guy" or "True Buffalo Bills spirit. A tough guy who always brings it," the usual copy-and-paste sayings. Those are what you have to say. When you get very specific about things, you're going far beyond what you have to say and you're saying what you believe. Klein wasn't asked about whether Tremaine is a Mike. He simply said what he sees and knows.

What’s funny is that some posters on here who can’t give up the idea that he shouldn’t be the Mike are also the same people who get upset when people won’t drop the “Josh Allen is inaccurate” argument 

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5 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

I searched for this before posting, and was surprised not to find it her on the boards yet. Mods, if I missed something, please feel free to fold it into another thread.

 

https://www.newyorkupstate.com/buffalo-bills/2020/12/bills-matt-milano-almost-back-impact-on-aj-kleins-role-tremaine-edmunds-a-true-mlb.html

 

"Last week against the Los Angeles Chargers, Klein was the star, finishing with a game-high 14 tackles and 1.5 sacks. But Edmunds was arguably just as good. Pro Football Focus gave Klein a 91.0 grade in run defense and Edmunds just barely lower at a 90.7. In Edmunds last three games he’s received overall grades of 62.3, 63.6, and 74.2. The highest single-game grade he registered in his first 7 games was a 55.5.

 

"Klein played with 5x first team All Pro middle linebacker Luke Kuechly in Carolina and watched him play the position as well as anybody has done it this century. He said Edmunds is a smart player whose preparation and leadership make him stand out. He said Edmunds is a true “Mike” linebacker.

 

“ 'When you watch him on film not many guys that are his size can move and cover like he does,' Klein said. 'To be able to be that downhill, physical guy that he is, not only his skill set physically but his skillset mentally. How he approaches the game and how he understands the game, how he studies - he is a true ‘Mike’ linebacker and that’s where he belongs. You can see him, he’s sideline to sideline making plays all across the field. ... He really is something special to watch. It’s fun to be able to play with him.' ”

 

-------------

 

 

This should end the discussion. But it won't. There are plenty of people who think they're way smarter and know more about the Bills defense than guys who play on it or coach for it. We'll doubtless hear from them.

 

But let's hear none of the "Well, he had to say that," nonsense, because it's just not true. All he had to say was - and this is true of every player or coach - is the Crash Davis cliches. Yeah, you can't say bad things of a teammate. But it's totally fine to restrict yourself to the usual, "He gives 110% eight days a week and 25 hours a day," or "I want him beside me in an alley fight," or "He's a good good player. Works hard and it shows," or "I want him in my foxhole with me," or "I love going to war with that guy" or "True Buffalo Bills spirit. A tough guy who always brings it," the usual copy-and-paste sayings. Those are what you have to say. When you get very specific about things, you're going far beyond what you have to say and you're saying what you believe. Klein wasn't asked about whether Tremaine is a Mike. He simply said what he sees and knows.

 

 

 It's not very specific, though.  All of this stuff (physical/great athlete, studies a lot, sideline to sideline, fun to watch) has been said of Edmunds last year (not so much this season).  It's not a deep dive by AJ--just a nice guy who is playing well trying to talk up his teammate... which is great for team unity (plus he no doubt has seen the criticisms of Edmunds out) there.  If Edmunds was really killing it out there this season, Klein (nor much anyone else) probably wouldn't have made such a comment---wouldn't have to. 

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4 hours ago, Sharky7337 said:

Of course his teammate is going to sing his praises. When I see them whiff on tackles for big plays, like his brother did in the Pittsburgh game this week, it says otherwise.

What does his brothers play have to do with anything beside showing us that you are grasping to find fault? 
 

Our Edmunds played hurt pretty much the entire first half of the season.  He played hurt because he had to.  Yes, he missed some tackles and yes he was less of a force.  Also look at the play of the DTs in front of him.  
 

When healthy he is a very fine player that is still developing.  At 22 years old he is  3 year veteran.  I see a lot of upside. 

Edited by Bob in STL
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There is a disconnect between what many fans want in a middle linebacker and what McD wants which contributes to the constant “Edmunds should be moved outside” comments every week. First and foremost McD wants his MLB to be captain of the defenses and get them lined up correctly and by all accounts Edmunds does a tremendous job at this. The next objective for McD is to clog those middle zone passing lanes and this is where Edmunds excels. You can’t quantify the number of passes that weren’t made because he was in the lane with his 8 foot wing span and QB’s dumped off or looked in another direction. It’s unfortunate he seems to have stone hands because if he just caught the balls that hit him in the chest we wouldn’t be having any conversations of him not being a “game changing LB”. McD doesn’t put a premium on his MLB shedding blocks and stopping the run. The MLB can’t be a disaster at it but McD is willing to give up rushing yards to prevent those middle zone passes. It would be nice if Edmunds could shed blocks a little better and fill the right gaps but he’s still VERY young and I think this is something that can be improved upon (like Allen’s inaccuracy) with time. Edmunds isn’t going anywhere. He’s going to man the middle for the next 10 years so people on here should try and get comfortable with it.

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24 minutes ago, Virgil said:

All of those things may be true,  but he’s not a playmaker nor game changer.  All of those comments would be fine if he weren’t a first round pick, that has certain expectations with it.  

People need to recognize that he was playing injured earlier this season. Not hurt — injured. It has a huge effect.

17 minutes ago, Green Lightning said:

His speed and size are amazing. But I wouldn't call him physical and he can't get off blocks consistently.  Let's see how he does these next few weeks. He's much better against passing teams. 

Again he was playing one-armed earlier this season.

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12 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

I searched for this before posting, and was surprised not to find it her on the boards yet. Mods, if I missed something, please feel free to fold it into another thread.

 

https://www.newyorkupstate.com/buffalo-bills/2020/12/bills-matt-milano-almost-back-impact-on-aj-kleins-role-tremaine-edmunds-a-true-mlb.html

 

"Last week against the Los Angeles Chargers, Klein was the star, finishing with a game-high 14 tackles and 1.5 sacks. But Edmunds was arguably just as good. Pro Football Focus gave Klein a 91.0 grade in run defense and Edmunds just barely lower at a 90.7. In Edmunds last three games he’s received overall grades of 62.3, 63.6, and 74.2. The highest single-game grade he registered in his first 7 games was a 55.5.

 

"Klein played with 5x first team All Pro middle linebacker Luke Kuechly in Carolina and watched him play the position as well as anybody has done it this century. He said Edmunds is a smart player whose preparation and leadership make him stand out. He said Edmunds is a true “Mike” linebacker.

 

“ 'When you watch him on film not many guys that are his size can move and cover like he does,' Klein said. 'To be able to be that downhill, physical guy that he is, not only his skill set physically but his skillset mentally. How he approaches the game and how he understands the game, how he studies - he is a true ‘Mike’ linebacker and that’s where he belongs. You can see him, he’s sideline to sideline making plays all across the field. ... He really is something special to watch. It’s fun to be able to play with him.' ”

 

-------------

 

 

This should end the discussion. But it won't. There are plenty of people who think they're way smarter and know more about the Bills defense than guys who play on it or coach for it. We'll doubtless hear from them.

 

But let's hear none of the "Well, he had to say that," nonsense, because it's just not true. All he had to say was - and this is true of every player or coach - is the Crash Davis cliches. Yeah, you can't say bad things of a teammate. But it's totally fine to restrict yourself to the usual, "He gives 110% eight days a week and 25 hours a day," or "I want him beside me in an alley fight," or "He's a good good player. Works hard and it shows," or "I want him in my foxhole with me," or "I love going to war with that guy" or "True Buffalo Bills spirit. A tough guy who always brings it," the usual copy-and-paste sayings. Those are what you have to say. When you get very specific about things, you're going far beyond what you have to say and you're saying what you believe. Klein wasn't asked about whether Tremaine is a Mike. He simply said what he sees and knows.

And Klein definitely knows greatness when he sees it... he did play with the GOAT after all!:wub:

Edited by Sherlock Holmes
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21 minutes ago, RunTheBall said:

There is a disconnect between what many fans want in a middle linebacker and what McD wants which contributes to the constant “Edmunds should be moved outside” comments every week. First and foremost McD wants his MLB to be captain of the defenses and get them lined up correctly and by all accounts Edmunds does a tremendous job at this. The next objective for McD is to clog those middle zone passing lanes and this is where Edmunds excels. You can’t quantify the number of passes that weren’t made because he was in the lane with his 8 foot wing span and QB’s dumped off or looked in another direction. It’s unfortunate he seems to have stone hands because if he just caught the balls that hit him in the chest we wouldn’t be having any conversations of him not being a “game changing LB”. McD doesn’t put a premium on his MLB shedding blocks and stopping the run. The MLB can’t be a disaster at it but McD is willing to give up rushing yards to prevent those middle zone passes. It would be nice if Edmunds could shed blocks a little better and fill the right gaps but he’s still VERY young and I think this is something that can be improved upon (like Allen’s inaccuracy) with time. Edmunds isn’t going anywhere. He’s going to man the middle for the next 10 years so people on here should try and get comfortable with it.

 

Something we forget...run stuffing middle LBs are probably gone forever...Edmunds' physical skill set is likely what virtually all teams are looking for

Edited by matter2003
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Apparently Edmunds' early season deficiencies were injury related.  I can see why the team didn't make that very public, but it would have been nice to know.  The same has been true of Milano, though I think we were generally more aware of his injury issues this season.  I also was not really aware of the fact that AJ Klein is primarily an middle linebacker.  Playing out of position probably accounts for a lot of his struggles.  If Leslie Frazier had done a better job of adjusting for that early, I might have thought more highly of Klein from the start.  What I've said still is true, I think.  Milano is more athletic and faster. Klein's strengths are rooted in football intelligence and experience, rather than athleticism.  Milano has both, so he can do more things from his outside linebacker spot. With everybody healthy, the defense should be that much more effective down the stretch.

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Thurm -

 

Thanks for posting this.  I so much want Edmunds to succeed.  

 

I have to say, however, that notwithstanding what Klein says, I still have my doubts, primarily because Edmunds hasn't shown the physicality that I think the Mike needs.   He needs be tougher to block and neutralize than he his, and he has to hit people with more authority than he does.  If you could be a mike without the physicality, Micah Hyde would be playing there.   The position demands a man bigger than a safety because the position demands physicality. 

 

I'm hoping he'll develop in that area, because if he does, he'll be a true star. 

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Good find, Thanks!

 

"Klein played with 5x first team All Pro middle linebacker Luke Kuechly in Carolina and watched him play the position as well as anybody has done it this century. He said Edmunds is a smart player whose preparation and leadership make him stand out. He said Edmunds is a true “Mike” linebacker.

 

“When you watch him on film not many guys that are his size can move and cover like he does,” Klein said. “To be able to be that downhill, physical guy that he is, not only his skill set physically but his skillset mentally. How he approaches the game and how he understands the game, how he studies - he is a true ‘Mike’ linebacker and that’s where he belongs. You can see him, he’s sideline to sideline making plays all across the field. ... He really is something special to watch. It’s fun to be able to play with him.”

 

We have our regulars who are persuaded that Beane, McDermott, and Frazier, despite their track record of strong defense especially last year, are pig-headed about Edmunds and perennially misuse him by keeping him at Mike. 

I don't feel I know enough to second-guess them.  I'd certainly buy that so far, Edmunds is no Luke Keuchly.

 

I find Klein's take on him interesting.

 

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So honest question to everyone saying he’s not physical enough-name some linebackers in the league that are “physical enough” - You can probably say Bobby Wagner, but go back and watch the Bills game, dude was getting thrown all over the field. This is an honest question though, and are you truly watching enough of all of the other teams linebackers to know if they are more physical? 
 

as someone said earlier, the big, thumping linebacker days are over-those guys from years ago wouldn’t have any success I. Today’s game. I think Edmunds problem isn’t not being physical enough, his problem comes from taking the wrong angles and picking the wrong holes

5 minutes ago, Penfield45 said:

Not sold on Edmunds at all so far

 

he still has a lot to prove imo. His reading of the game is subpar at the moment 

Shocking, you’re against a Bills player...are there players on the team that you actually like?

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