AJ Klein: Tremaine Edmunds "a True Mike"

[BADOLBILZ]

53 minutes ago, Magox said:

Tremaine has just about regained his pro bowl level play of last year.  The injury really affected play but he has healed and his physicality has taken it up a notch and he’s been all over the field.  

 

 

He's been playing better since the bye week....... but Edmunds was not voted to the pro bowl last year he was a late addition as a replacement for injured/surgery/still playing players........like Tyrod Taylor was in 2015.

 

Steelers rookie Devin Bush was voted as the pro bowl starter at ILB for the AFC.   Dont'a Hightower was the original #2.    

[Thurman#1]

7 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

He's been playing better since the bye week....... but Edmunds was not voted to the pro bowl last year he was a late addition as a replacement for injured/surgery/still playing players........like Tyrod Taylor was in 2015.

 

Steelers rookie Devin Bush was voted as the pro bowl starter at ILB for the AFC.   Dont'a Hightower was the original #2.    

 

 

That's correct. In other words, he was considered the 3rd best ILB in the AFC.

 

In his second year.

 

Tyrod, on the other hand was, what? A fifth or sixth replacement? The Pro Bowl QBs that year after many guys turned them down were Russell Wilson, Jameis Winston, Bridgewater, Derek Carr, Eli Manning and Tyrod.

Edited December 15, 2020 by Thurman#1

[Thurman#1]

14 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

It's not a matter of misperception.  Just because you are in the area of a catch does not make you the targeted defender so perception implies that it's not at all a statistical factor.

 

That is where his 123 passer rating allowed certainly reflects his lack of impact in coverage.

 

And who are the *average* MLB's and why is a MLB drafted in the middle of round one expected to have "average" players as comps?

 

There are a lot of name MLB's in the NFL.    Fred Warner, for instance,  has a 63 passer rating allowed.    A lot of the MLB's that most would consider better tacklers and much more physical in run defense than Edmunds are in the 70-100 range in passer rating allowed.    

 

The question isn't whether Edmunds is an average MLB.........he plays in a defense designed to showcase the MLB so he's going to get some stats............the question is whether his talent/potential are muted by playing a position he isn't particularly instinctive at.

 

 And yes,  I know that some will argue that he must be a top MLB because the defense has been good with him.........but they had a near top ranked defense with Preston Brown at MLB under Schwartz.   You don't need a stud MLB to be successful on defense.

 

Modern NFL defenses are only as strong as their ability to defend the pass..............so MLB is well down on the priority list of spending money and personnel chips on.    Good defense is mostly about coverage and pass rush.

 

Having a MLB who can do everything well is like having a catcher who can hit in baseball...........not critical but it's a big plus.    Edmunds hasn't really been that + player at MLB so far.   You can't pay him $15M per year to do what he's been doing..........which is ultimately why I think they(and he and his agent) need to see if he can become a player at a more important and expensive to fill edge position.   Make him a guy who can pressure the passer and set the edge and ALSO drop back in coverage or take a great TE out of the gameplan and he then has the potential to become a player of far greater impact.

 

 

You're right that you don't need a stud MLB to be successful in any defense.

 

However, McDermott has made it as plain as can be that with his defense you really do need a stud MLB, and that he has one right now, one who plays very well when healthy.

 

MLBs don't generally get drafted very high these days. Certainly your example Preston Brown didn't. Yet in McDermott Ds, they've gone very far out of their way to draft MLBs very high indeed, at #9 in Carolina and at #16 here. The Brown example does indeed prove that a Schwartz defense doesn't need a great player there. Equally clearly, though, a McDermott defense does.

 

Oh, and great point that you can't pay an MLB much. That's why they never gave Kuechly a big contract when McDermott was there. Oh, wait ...

 

And before the dumb argument comes back from somebody, no, I'm not saying Edmunds is a good as Kuechly. But he is good enough to be paid a lot, and he plays a position McDermott feels is very important to his scheme, which is why his history shows he is willing to spend a lot of draft capital and a lot of money there.

Edited December 15, 2020 by Thurman#1

[RichRiderBills]

Edmunds has really salvaged his season with his play. This kid was so young, his big problem was over pursuit and poor angles. Hes getting better.

[GunnerBill]

20 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

You're right that you don't need a stud MLB to be successful in any defense.

 

However, McDermott has made it as plain as can be that with his defense you really do need a stud MLB, and that he has one right now, one who plays very well when healthy.

 

MLBs don't generally get drafted very high these days. Certainly your example Preston Brown didn't. Yet in McDermott Ds, they've gone very far out of their way to draft MLBs very high indeed, at #9 in Carolina and at #16 here. The Brown example does indeed prove that a Schwartz defense doesn't need a great player there. Equally clearly, though, a McDermott defense does.

 

Oh, and great point that you can't pay an MLB much. That's why they never gave Kuechly a big contract when McDermott was there. Oh, wait ...

 

And before the dumb argument comes back from somebody, no, I'm not saying Edmunds is a good as Kuechly. But he is good enough to be paid a lot, and he plays a position McDermott feels is very important to his scheme, which is why his history shows he is willing to spend a lot of draft capital and a lot of money there.

 

You are correct. McDermott values the MLB position higher than a lot of other NFL Head Coaches or even than a lot of other defensive coordinators. Similarly on offense the centre position. I did a breakdown when the regime first arrived of how the Panthers were built given that they were both coming from that system where there had been a relativel level of continuity and success. One of my conclusions was "do not be surprised if they invest in Center and Middle Linebacker at a level beyond the ordinary in the modern NFL." First they extended Eric Wood, then they moved up in the draft to take Edmunds and then they made Mitch Morse the highest paid center in the league. Doug Whaley told us he believed in pass rusher, #1 corner, left tackle and Quarterback plus an additional "playmaker" on each side as his cornerstone pieces. While McDermott and Beane have never articulated their pecking order quite so clearly when you follow the moves they have made it becomes apparent. They want the leadership positions. Quarterback, the center who calls the protections and the MLB who calls the defense. They are three of their cornerstone spots.

 

When they have to pay Josh that gives them some tough choices on the outside because they have also paid their left tackle and their corner..... in Carolina beyond Steve Smith (and by the time Beane and McDermott were in senior roles his big money days were over) and the first round miss on Kelvin Benjamin they tended to invest 2nd level resources in terms of draft capital and contract $$s on receivers. There will be a choice on Diggs where I think his current contract sets up in such a way that they might be able to retain him by upping the guarantees (which beyond next year are almost none) in exchange for a reasonable cap number but looking beyond Stef and into the middle years of Josh's 2nd contract it will be interesting to see if they ween themselves off high priced pass catchers.

[Magox]

8 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

He's been playing better since the bye week....... but Edmunds was not voted to the pro bowl last year he was a late addition as a replacement for injured/surgery/still playing players........like Tyrod Taylor was in 2015.

 

Steelers rookie Devin Bush was voted as the pro bowl starter at ILB for the AFC.   Dont'a Hightower was the original #2.    

 

I didn't say he was a pro bowler just that he played at a pro bowl level.  I don't believe him to be an ALL PRO, his instincts aren't there at this stage but he has a lot of other intangibles that make him a fringe pro bowl level player MB.    His crazy athleticism and size sometimes masks how he affects games as he covers lots of ground.   He has definitely been a lot more physical the past few weeks and has made some really nice important stops.   Earlier in the year he had the injury issue and he was getting fooled too often.   He has cleaned a lot of that up and his shoulder now looks fine.   He is definitely regaining form again with more physicality from him than I have seen in the past.

[colin]

the last 3 games he has balled out pretty hard.

 

he's not perfect, and obviously he makes some mistakes, but in a 4-2 he's asked to be all over the place and does a bunch of things well (lately) but not much great.

 

i really think the bills entire season is gonna come down to how we play KC in the playoffs.  if edmunds can sniff out the run and cause some problems vs their all world TE, he's worth his weight in gold.

[Buffalo Junction]

3 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

You are correct. McDermott values the MLB position higher than a lot of other NFL Head Coaches or even than a lot of other defensive coordinators. Similarly on offense the centre position. I did a breakdown when the regime first arrived of how the Panthers were built given that they were both coming from that system where there had been a relativel level of continuity and success. One of my conclusions was "do not be surprised if they invest in Center and Middle Linebacker at a level beyond the ordinary in the modern NFL." First they extended Eric Wood, then they moved up in the draft to take Edmunds and then they made Mitch Morse the highest paid center in the league. Doug Whaley told us he believed in pass rusher, #1 corner, left tackle and Quarterback plus an additional "playmaker" on each side as his cornerstone pieces. While McDermott and Beane have never articulated their pecking order quite so clearly when you follow the moves they have made it becomes apparent. They want the leadership positions. Quarterback, the center who calls the protections and the MLB who calls the defense. They are three of their cornerstone spots.

 

When they have to pay Josh that gives them some tough choices on the outside because they have also paid their left tackle and their corner..... in Carolina beyond Steve Smith (and by the time Beane and McDermott were in senior roles his big money days were over) and the first round miss on Kelvin Benjamin they tended to invest 2nd level resources in terms of draft capital and contract $$s on receivers. There will be a choice on Diggs where I think his current contract sets up in such a way that they might be able to retain him by upping the guarantees (which beyond next year are almost none) in exchange for a reasonable cap number but looking beyond Stef and into the middle years of Josh's 2nd contract it will be interesting to see if they ween themselves off high priced pass catchers.

I’d imagine that they will have one WR on a large contract and cycle through the rest with spot signings and draft picks. It’s going to depend on how well they draft and replace guys. If I had to bet.... They let Smoke go after his contract. There’s a substantial difference between Beane and Gettleman when it comes to playmakers so far with Beane going for passcatchers and Gettleman going for RBs. Of course this team is still evolving and it hasn’t been long enough to know if that’s due to Daboll’s offensive scheme or Beane’s preferences yet.  

[BADOLBILZ]

5 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

That's correct. In other words, he was considered the 3rd best ILB in the AFC.

 

In his second year.

 

Tyrod, on the other hand was, what? A fifth or sixth replacement? The Pro Bowl QBs that year after many guys turned them down were Russell Wilson, Jameis Winston, Bridgewater, Derek Carr, Eli Manning and Tyrod.

 

 

You don't know just how far down the list he was.

 

I know this........there is no way that Edmunds had a better year than Joe Schobert in 2019.    And you've probably never heard of Joe Schobert.    

 

You don't know if Edmunds was the 3rd alternate or the 8th anymore than you knew that about Tyrod.   

 

Just because you don't know the names of the guys who play inside in the NFL doesn't mean that there aren't a lot of more effective players than Edmunds..........it just means that it's a position overshadowed and considered less impactful than coverage and pass rush players.

 

@GunnerBillI'd be interested to see your inside linebacker rankings for the NFL for 2019 or 2020 seasons. 

[BADOLBILZ]

4 hours ago, Magox said:

 

I didn't say he was a pro bowler just that he played at a pro bowl level.  I don't believe him to be an ALL PRO, his instincts aren't there at this stage but he has a lot of other intangibles that make him a fringe pro bowl level player MB.    His crazy athleticism and size sometimes masks how he affects games as he covers lots of ground.   He has definitely been a lot more physical the past few weeks and has made some really nice important stops.   Earlier in the year he had the injury issue and he was getting fooled too often.   He has cleaned a lot of that up and his shoulder now looks fine.   He is definitely regaining form again with more physicality from him than I have seen in the past.

 

 

Well statistically he was clearly not at a pro blow level in the AFC last year.....and the bar was much lower in the AFC than NFC.

 

He was actually in a muddled performance group with a lot of solid players whose names the average NFL fan wouldn't even recognize.    

 

What he WAS was healthy and available in mid-January.

 

When you pick an ILB that early you expect All Pro type play........it's like selecting a RB that early.   

[Thurman#1]

On 12/16/2020 at 3:14 AM, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

You don't know just how far down the list he was.

 

I know this........there is no way that Edmunds had a better year than Joe Schobert in 2019.    And you've probably never heard of Joe Schobert.    

 

You don't know if Edmunds was the 3rd alternate or the 8th anymore than you knew that about Tyrod.   

 

Just because you don't know the names of the guys who play inside in the NFL doesn't mean that there aren't a lot of more effective players than Edmunds..........it just means that it's a position overshadowed and considered less impactful than coverage and pass rush players.

 

 

 

 

Edmunds

 

No, I do know that Edmunds was the 1st alternate, as does anyone willing to spend about a thousandth of a calorie typing the search into google. Just 'cause your ass is apparently too lazy to do so doesn't mean everyone is. 

 

"Edmunds was a first alternate in his second NFL season."

 

https://www.buffalobills.com/news/tremaine-edmunds-named-to-first-pro-bowl

 

"According toa league source, nine Bills were named as altrenates to the Pro Bowl. Tremaine Edmunds and Andre Roberts are first alternates, Mitch Morse is a second alternate, Josh Allen is a third alternate, ..."

 

https://www.wkbw.com/sports/buffalo-bills/bills-cb-tredavious-white-selected-to-his-first-pro-bowl

 

 

 

In case the technology is too much for you, you go to google.com and you type into the box, "Tre Edmunds pro bowl first alternate."

I personally got 980K results from that search. Your results should be similar.

 

Darius Leonard was the starter, Dont'a Hightower was the reserve, and Tremaine Edmunds was the first alternate.

 

 

 

Tyrod

 

As for Tyrod, his Pro Bowl was the all-time classic in terms of players fleeing in droves.

 

"The game was already a sham, but the diaspora at certain glamour positions make it even more so now. Five of the six quarterbacks originally picked are out, as are five of the six initial picks at outside linebacker. All three free safeties have been replaced as well, along with three cornerbacks and three wide receivers.

 

"So have fun with that, and enjoy this list (which we’ll update with the inevitable future replacements):

 

"2016 Pro Bowlers

 

"QUARTERBACKS (6)
"Tom Brady, New England (replaced by Jameis Winston, Tampa Bay)
"Cam Newton, Carolina (replaced by Tyrod Taylor, Buffalo)
"Carson Palmer, Arizona (replaced by Teddy Bridgewater, Minnesota)
"Aaron Rodgers, Green Bay (replaced by Derek Carr, Oakland)
"Ben Roethlisberger, Pittsburgh (replaced by Eli Manning, New York Giants)
"Russell Wilson, Seattle"

 

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/01/26/welcome-to-the-largely-replacement-pro-bowl/

 

Again, the title of that article is "Welcome to the (largely replacement) Pro Bowl."

 

 

 

Here's another one to fill out the picture that year:

 

"That has forced the league to push far down its list of alternates to fill some positions. Tampa Bay Buccaneers quarterback Jameis Winston, named Monday as a replacement, was the eighth player at his position to be either invited or announced in addition to the six quarterbacks voted in. The Cincinnati Bengals' Adam Jones, named Tuesday, was the seventh alternate at cornerback.

 

"The quarterback position has been especially hard hit. The Seattle Seahawks' Russell Wilson is the only player voted in who remains on the roster. Carolina Panthers quarterback Cam Newton is playing in Super Bowl 50, but the New England Patriots' Tom Brady, the Green Bay Packers' Aaron Rodgers, the Pittsburgh Steelers' Ben Roethlisberger and the Arizona Cardinals' Carson Palmer have all backed out.

 

"Bengals quarterback Andy Dalton, the first alternate, couldn't play because of a thumb injury that caused him to miss the playoffs. The San Diego Chargers' Philip Rivers declined an alternate invitation and the New Orleans Saints' Drew Brees is presumed to have done the same."

 

That left this collection of quarterbacks for the game: Wilson, the Oakland Raiders' Derek Carr, the New York Giants' Eli Manning, the Buffalo Bills' Tyrod Taylor, the Minnesota Vikings' Teddy Bridgewater and Winston."

 

https://www.espn.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/197015/2016-nfl-pro-bowl-most-declined-invitation-in-history

 

 

 

 

Again, the QBs in that game were Russell Wilson, Jameis Winston, Teddy Bridgewater, Derek Carr, Eli Manning and Tyrod.

Edited December 16, 2020 by Thurman#1

[Thurman#1]

On 12/15/2020 at 10:18 PM, GunnerBill said:

 

You are correct. McDermott values the MLB position higher than a lot of other NFL Head Coaches or even than a lot of other defensive coordinators. Similarly on offense the centre position. I did a breakdown when the regime first arrived of how the Panthers were built given that they were both coming from that system where there had been a relativel level of continuity and success. One of my conclusions was "do not be surprised if they invest in Center and Middle Linebacker at a level beyond the ordinary in the modern NFL." First they extended Eric Wood, then they moved up in the draft to take Edmunds and then they made Mitch Morse the highest paid center in the league. Doug Whaley told us he believed in pass rusher, #1 corner, left tackle and Quarterback plus an additional "playmaker" on each side as his cornerstone pieces. While McDermott and Beane have never articulated their pecking order quite so clearly when you follow the moves they have made it becomes apparent. They want the leadership positions. Quarterback, the center who calls the protections and the MLB who calls the defense. They are three of their cornerstone spots.

 

When they have to pay Josh that gives them some tough choices on the outside because they have also paid their left tackle and their corner..... in Carolina beyond Steve Smith (and by the time Beane and McDermott were in senior roles his big money days were over) and the first round miss on Kelvin Benjamin they tended to invest 2nd level resources in terms of draft capital and contract $$s on receivers. There will be a choice on Diggs where I think his current contract sets up in such a way that they might be able to retain him by upping the guarantees (which beyond next year are almost none) in exchange for a reasonable cap number but looking beyond Stef and into the middle years of Josh's 2nd contract it will be interesting to see if they ween themselves off high priced pass catchers.

 

 

Interesting, Bill.

 

Agreed that it will be fascinating to see how they appropriate resources as things get tighter. He might stress receiver more, thinking that Allen is more of a pure passer than Cam ever was. Maybe. Hard to say, though.

 

I hadn't remembered that Whaley had set out his values so clearly.

[GunnerBill]

On 12/15/2020 at 6:14 PM, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

You don't know just how far down the list he was.

 

I know this........there is no way that Edmunds had a better year than Joe Schobert in 2019.    And you've probably never heard of Joe Schobert.    

 

You don't know if Edmunds was the 3rd alternate or the 8th anymore than you knew that about Tyrod.   

 

Just because you don't know the names of the guys who play inside in the NFL doesn't mean that there aren't a lot of more effective players than Edmunds..........it just means that it's a position overshadowed and considered less impactful than coverage and pass rush players.

 

@GunnerBillI'd be interested to see your inside linebacker rankings for the NFL for 2019 or 2020 seasons. 

 

I'd have to have a think about a full ranking but just off the top of my head I agree with the point you made lower down that the AFC lacks the depth of talent at inside backer than the NFC does has. Wagner, Kendricks, David, Warner, Jones and Demario Davis (who has had some renaissance in New Orleans after looking done in Cleveland) are all names that just jump to the front of mind.

 

AFC after Darius Leonard I think it is really thin in terms of difference makers to their defense. When Edmunds is on I'd likely have him 2nd in the conference but that might still have him 8th or 9th across the league. The thing that holds him back from pushing higher remains consistency. I get he was hurt earlier in the season but I was so high on him coming into 2020 and his first 6 or 7 games frankly were just not good enough. Too many mental errors.

[GunnerBill]

 

9 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said:

Agreed that it will be fascinating to see how they appropriate resources as things get tighter. He might stress receiver more, thinking that Allen is more of a pure passer than Cam ever was. Maybe. Hard to say, though.

 

Certainly a fair hypothesis. Also the case of course that Beane and McDermott were the lieutenants not the generals in that situation but their early moves here definitely don't appear a radical departure from Panther Ball. They have placed a little less priority on running back than Carolina. Though two third rounders is not nothing - I will be very interested to see if they make any attempt to retain either of those guys beyond their rookie deals. At the moment not sure I see a case for that but then if you don't is it really a great use of two day 2 picks? 

[BADOLBILZ]

55 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I'd have to have a think about a full ranking but just off the top of my head I agree with the point you made lower down that the AFC lacks the depth of talent at inside backer than the NFC does has. Wagner, Kendricks, David, Warner, Jones and Demario Davis (who has had some renaissance in New Orleans after looking done in Cleveland) are all names that just jump to the front of mind.

 

AFC after Darius Leonard I think it is really thin in terms of difference makers to their defense. When Edmunds is on I'd likely have him 2nd in the conference but that might still have him 8th or 9th across the league. The thing that holds him back from pushing higher remains consistency. I get he was hurt earlier in the season but I was so high on him coming into 2020 and his first 6 or 7 games frankly were just not good enough. Too many mental errors.

 

 

I think the MAIN thing that holds Edmunds back is play making.     He lacks consistency sure, but he just doesn't make big plays.   For instance.......last year Devin Bush had 2 interceptions and 4 fumble recoveries for Pittsburgh.   That's 6 times he flipped the field for his team.  Turnover differential being arguably the most important stat in the game.........the fact that Edmunds has no nose for the ball playing off-ball greatly detracts from his game.

 

I'd really like to see your list.    You may have Hightower and Bush off this year because they are opted out/injured but the actual overall season that Edmunds himself has put together has been largely disappointing.   I think it would be a surprise to people to see where Edmunds stacks up in the NFL.    The perception is that he is a top 5 or 6 and he's not even close.   You didn't even mention Roquan Smith and he's leading the NFL in solo tackles and has 4 sacks.    Edmunds is closer to the middle of the top 32 ILB's than the top. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

3 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

I think the MAIN thing that holds Edmunds back is play making.     He lacks consistency sure, but he just doesn't make big plays.   For instance.......last year Devin Bush had 2 interceptions and 4 fumble recoveries for Pittsburgh.   That's 6 times he flipped the field for his team.  Turnover differential being arguably the most important stat in the game.........the fact that Edmunds has no nose for the ball playing off-ball greatly detracts from his game.

 

Seems to me I've seen Edmunds get his hands on the ball a handful of times this year.  I think he has a "nose for the ball', he just hasn't been able to close the deal.  I don't know if that's something that can be improved, my guess is "yes", but they've had different priorities of what to work on with him.

[BADOLBILZ]

1 hour ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

Edmunds

 

No, I do know that Edmunds was the 1st alternate, as does anyone willing to spend about a thousandth of a calorie typing the search into google. Just 'cause your ass is apparently too lazy to do so doesn't mean everyone is. 

 

"Edmunds was a first alternate in his second NFL season."

 

https://www.buffalobills.com/news/tremaine-edmunds-named-to-first-pro-bowl

 

"According toa league source, nine Bills were named as altrenates to the Pro Bowl. Tremaine Edmunds and Andre Roberts are first alternates, Mitch Morse is a second alternate, Josh Allen is a third alternate, ..."

 

https://www.wkbw.com/sports/buffalo-bills/bills-cb-tredavious-white-selected-to-his-first-pro-bowl

 

 

 

In case the technology is too much for you, you go to google.com and you type into the box, "Tre Edmunds pro bowl first alternate."

I personally got 980K results from that search. Your results should be similar.

 

Darius Leonard was the starter, Dont'a Hightower was the reserve, and Tremaine Edmunds was the first alternate.

 

 

 

Tyrod

 

As for Tyrod, his Pro Bowl was the all-time classic in terms of players fleeing in droves.

 

"The game was already a sham, but the diaspora at certain glamour positions make it even more so now. Five of the six quarterbacks originally picked are out, as are five of the six initial picks at outside linebacker. All three free safeties have been replaced as well, along with three cornerbacks and three wide receivers.

 

"So have fun with that, and enjoy this list (which we’ll update with the inevitable future replacements):

 

"2016 Pro Bowlers

 

"QUARTERBACKS (6)
"Tom Brady, New England (replaced by Jameis Winston, Tampa Bay)
"Cam Newton, Carolina (replaced by Tyrod Taylor, Buffalo)
"Carson Palmer, Arizona (replaced by Teddy Bridgewater, Minnesota)
"Aaron Rodgers, Green Bay (replaced by Derek Carr, Oakland)
"Ben Roethlisberger, Pittsburgh (replaced by Eli Manning, New York Giants)
"Russell Wilson, Seattle"

 

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/01/26/welcome-to-the-largely-replacement-pro-bowl/

 

Again, the title of that article is "Welcome to the (largely replacement) Pro Bowl."

 

 

 

Here's another one to fill out the picture that year:

 

"That has forced the league to push far down its list of alternates to fill some positions. Tampa Bay Buccaneers quarterback Jameis Winston, named Monday as a replacement, was the eighth player at his position to be either invited or announced in addition to the six quarterbacks voted in. The Cincinnati Bengals' Adam Jones, named Tuesday, was the seventh alternate at cornerback.

 

"The quarterback position has been especially hard hit. The Seattle Seahawks' Russell Wilson is the only player voted in who remains on the roster. Carolina Panthers quarterback Cam Newton is playing in Super Bowl 50, but the New England Patriots' Tom Brady, the Green Bay Packers' Aaron Rodgers, the Pittsburgh Steelers' Ben Roethlisberger and the Arizona Cardinals' Carson Palmer have all backed out.

 

"Bengals quarterback Andy Dalton, the first alternate, couldn't play because of a thumb injury that caused him to miss the playoffs. The San Diego Chargers' Philip Rivers declined an alternate invitation and the New Orleans Saints' Drew Brees is presumed to have done the same."

 

That left this collection of quarterbacks for the game: Wilson, the Oakland Raiders' Derek Carr, the New York Giants' Eli Manning, the Buffalo Bills' Tyrod Taylor, the Minnesota Vikings' Teddy Bridgewater and Winston."

 

https://www.espn.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/197015/2016-nfl-pro-bowl-most-declined-invitation-in-history

 

 

 

 

Again, the QBs in that game were Russell Wilson, Jameis Winston, Teddy Bridgewater, Derek Carr, Eli Manning and Tyrod.

 

 

2019 Edmunds........AFC's 3rd option at ILB.

2015 Tyrod...............AFC's 3rd option at QB.

 

I was wrong about Edmunds being a "first alternate" but your confusion/mistake was lumping the two leagues together for Tyrod Taylor and not Edmunds.

 

That game must have been a hybrid game with league's mixed.......because each league goes with 3 QB's..........Tyrod isn't even an alternate he's just on the original roster if it's AFC/NFC.

 

If we lump Edmunds into the pool of NFC LB's last season........in addition to the AFC.........he would haven't been invited in any form.     The NFC is stacked at ILB.

 

   

[GunnerBill]

12 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

I think the MAIN thing that holds Edmunds back is play making.     He lacks consistency sure, but he just doesn't make big plays.   For instance.......last year Devin Bush had 2 interceptions and 4 fumble recoveries for Pittsburgh.   That's 6 times he flipped the field for his team.  Turnover differential being arguably the most important stat in the game.........the fact that Edmunds has no nose for the ball playing off-ball greatly detracts from his game.

 

I'd really like to see your list.    You may have Hightower and Bush off this year because they are opted out/injured but the actual overall season that Edmunds himself has put together has been largely disappointing.   I think it would be a surprise to people to see where Edmunds stacks up in the NFL.    The perception is that he is a top 5 or 6 and he's not even close.   You didn't even mention Roquan Smith and he's leading the NFL in solo tackles and has 4 sacks.    Edmunds is closer to the middle of the top 32 ILB's than the top. 

 

Yep I forgot Bush (though I think he has similar struggles at times with consistency you are right in that he has has more splash plays). I think on Hightower he slightly lived on reputation last year. He was fine but I don't think he is the force of old. 

 

Smith probably has made more splash plays too but man, he makes an absolute ton of mental mistakes. I mean if we think Tremaine still has issues with play recognition and lane discipline in the run game "over pursuit" should be Roquan's middle name. I loved them both in that draft. Especially Roquan. But neither of them through 3 seasons has really established themselves as a truly elite inside backer in the way I expected and hoped. And while I take your point on splash plays it is mental mistakes and consistency that are the things holding them back for me.

[BADOLBILZ]

15 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Seems to me I've seen Edmunds get his hands on the ball a handful of times this year.  I think he has a "nose for the ball', he just hasn't been able to close the deal.  I don't know if that's something that can be improved, my guess is "yes", but they've had different priorities of what to work on with him.

 

 

I think 3 years is enough of a sample size.   

 

 

[PaoloBillsFanFromItaly]

Edmunds is not a true Mike.

He can be a perfect fit for our system, even if I am not a fan of him, but he's not a true Mike.