DefenseWins Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/06/30/bills-stadium-situation-is-a-big-big-nut-to-crack/ 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Deek Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 Seems pretty simple to me. Terry and Kim need to tell the City, the County and the State that they’re willing to privately fund a new, smaller, open air stadium in Orchard Park. Build it in the parking lot of New Era and then demolish the old one. If those governmental agencies want the facility available for more than Bills games the taxpayers can fund a roof and move the entire project downtown. I’m guessing that the stumbling block is not the Pegulas. 3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiotAct Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 “In the never ending quest for new and better NFL stadiums, the Bills recently have stepped from the on-deck circle to the batter’s box. But they may be fouling off pitches for a while.” Hopefully it’s a 30-pitch at-bat. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThurmasThoman Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 There might be some cities in America where the Bills could make more money than they do in Buffalo, but there are probably 10 owners in the league who know they could make more money in Buffalo than they do in their current city. Theyre never going anywhere. 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
US Egg Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 The revenues for the NFL continue to grow. Pushing Buffalo about a new stadium is senseless greed. There are franchises in bigger Metro areas barely generating more revenue than Buffalo and 4 bringing in less: https://www.statista.com/statistics/193553/revenue-of-national-football-league-teams-in-2010/ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 She better not bust that big nut on the taxpayers..... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BubbaT Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 44 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: [This is an automated response] As a courtesy to the other board members, please use more descriptive topic titles. A better title will help the community find information faster and make your topic more likely to be read. The topic starter can edit the topic title line to make it more appropriate. Thank you. Actually the vague titles make me more likely to click on them to see what the hell they are all about. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njbuff Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 You could a million ways with this thread title. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 54 minutes ago, JohnnyGold said: There might be some cities in America where the Bills could make more money than they do in Buffalo, but there are probably 10 owners in the league who know they could make more money in Buffalo than they do in their current city. Theyre never going anywhere. This could not be more wrong. 31 NFL owners would vote to move the Bills anywhere. San Antonio, Toronto, Mexico City, Norfolk, etc. No Pegula, no Buffalo Bills. Period. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nextmanup Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 (edited) If we simply wait long enough, the stadium will transition from "old and in need of replacement" to "historical and in need of preservation." Fenway, Wrigley, and Lambeau are not exactly cutting edge facilities either. But who would want to see any of those three replaced with the latest modern architecture? Leave the Cathedrals of Sport to the Dallases of the NFL. Soon people will want to see a game in Buffalo for its authentic, historic, and memorable game day experience. The experience in all of these new temples of football is going to be the same no matter where you are, and always a little dulled. Edited June 30, 2019 by Nextmanup 8 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brianmoorman4jesus Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 Can they just update the actual existing structure for safety reasons and stay where they are? Just make it so the thing isnt going to fall down. Does such technology exist? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 1 hour ago, SoCal Deek said: Seems pretty simple to me. Terry and Kim need to tell the City, the County and the State that they’re willing to privately fund a new, smaller, open air stadium in Orchard Park. Build it in the parking lot of New Era and then demolish the old one. If those governmental agencies want the facility available for more than Bills games the taxpayers can fund a roof and move the entire project downtown. I’m guessing that the stumbling block is not the Pegulas. ...with the rest of the league's "downtrodden owners" holding municipalities hostage for ***** funds, why should they privately fund a stadium?.....perhaps a portion? ....yes.....but if Guido Cuomo is going to doll out public funds, grab what you can because some other municipality will cash in....hell he can us his "Weed Tax".... our clown prince........... 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punching Bag Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 1 hour ago, DefenseWins said: https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/06/30/bills-stadium-situation-is-a-big-big-nut-to-crack/ Without the annoying ads https://pro32.ap.org/article/owner-fan-related-costs-factor-bills-stadium-decision Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddaryl Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 (edited) 30 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said: This could not be more wrong. 31 NFL owners would vote to move the Bills anywhere. San Antonio, Toronto, Mexico City, Norfolk, etc. No Pegula, no Buffalo Bills. Period. I disagree.. Where are you getting this info. Or are you dressing up opinion as fact because I don't believe this to be anywhere near reality.... Reality is Buffalo must generate more revenue..... However I seriously doubt 31 other owners would vote us out of Buffalo if it was purely up to just the owners. Especially when you see in regards to revenue we are within shot of being a top 15 revenue creating franchise. A solid playoff run and some winnning tradition alone closes that gap significantly. $415 million is the cutoff point for top 15. We are sitting at $364 in 2018. A new stadium AND A winning tradition moves us up significantly on the revenue scale. I don't think savy businessmen are really in that much of a hurry to Jettison Buffalo.. especially when Buffalo is building up quite nicely and is showing a brighter future in America Edited June 30, 2019 by ddaryl 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 8 minutes ago, ddaryl said: I disagree.. Where are you getting this info. Or are you dressing up opinion as fact because I don't believe this to be anywhere near reality.... Reality is Buffalo must generate more revenue..... However I seriously doubt 31 other owners would vote us out of Buffalo if it was purely up to just the owners The league is all for increasing revenue. Buffalo is seen as a revenue black hole. Tradition and a committed owner are the only reasons the NFL is still in Buffalo. Your kidding yourself if you think the Bills would be replaced if they ever left 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddaryl Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 (edited) Just now, PromoTheRobot said: The league is all for increasing revenue. Buffalo is seen as a revenue black hole. Tradition and a committed owner are the only reasons the NFL is still in Buffalo. Your kidding yourself if you think the Bills would be replaced if they ever left re read my edit I added more info. I feel we are pointing north in regard's to revenue generation.. This is without a new stadium, add a new stadium and winning tradition and we will close that gap in a real hurry IMO Edited June 30, 2019 by ddaryl 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 Just now, ddaryl said: re read my edit I added more info No question the city is trending up. But without any Fortune 500 companies based here, it's never going to have a revenue base that will satisfy the NFL. Terry and Kim are walking a tightrope between the league and the fan base. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSHMEAB Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 (edited) 50 minutes ago, ddaryl said: I disagree.. Where are you getting this info I believe the Bills were dead last in terms of team value. We're all Bills fans, but that is a pretty telling metric. As Promo pointed out, we should be grateful for Pegula. There's an excellent chance the team is not in Buffalo without his purchase. Edited June 30, 2019 by LSHMEAB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billykay Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 2 hours ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said: ...with the rest of the league's "downtrodden owners" holding municipalities hostage for ***** funds, why should they privately fund a stadium?.....perhaps a portion? ....yes.....but if Guido Cuomo is going to doll out public funds, grab what you can because some other municipality will cash in....hell he can us his "Weed Tax".... our clown prince........... "Guido", "clown prince" ??? Isn't obnoxious political banter supposed to be in a different section of TBD ? 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddaryl Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, PromoTheRobot said: No question the city is trending up. But without any Fortune 500 companies based here, it's never going to have a revenue base that will satisfy the NFL. Terry and Kim are walking a tightrope between the league and the fan base. well look at the revenue of all 32 teams we can easily return to the top half with a decade of winning football and / or a modest upgraded new stadium. So if its purely a revenue question we are not far out and can close this gap IMO. But no we are never going to compete with the largest metropolises over the next couple of decades, but neither are 15 or so other teams in the NFL... SO I just don't see any reason to feed the thought that the NFL will force the Bills out of Buffalo UNLESS!!!! (so here I go feeding the thought) UNLESS !!!!! Buffalonians pretty much refuse to build a new stadium and create more revenue. If that is the reality and Bills fans take a hard lined approach and refuse to allow a new stadium, and demand a much smaller investment be made into the old stadium, then yes I could see pressure coming from the NFL to move the team to a city who is willing to do so. Cash is king..... A Business is the business of being in Business and if one part of that business is under performing well then that's the part that gets moved. This would be do to the fact that the Bills are not doing everything to maximize their portion of revenues, and it will do exactly what you say, it will earn the ire of the other 31 teams In the end it is the DUTY of the Buffalo Bills to continue to create increasing revenue to the NFL. That's the nature of any Business, and for Bills fans to sit back and think that keeping the old Ralph rolling or trying short arm a stadium build then I do agree that the NFL should and probably will threaten to move the team. You are right Terry and Kim are actually do this smartly by walking the tightrope. Not rushing anything turning over every stone and keeping both parties interest in mind. I could see a nicely upgraded stadium in OP as the compromise... The question is does the NFL pony up a few $100 million to help out? Edited June 30, 2019 by ddaryl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 2 minutes ago, ddaryl said: well look at the revenue of all 32 teams we can easily return to the top half with a decade of winning football and / or a modest upgraded new stadium. So if its purely a revenue question we are not far out and can close this gap IMO. But no we are never going to compete with the largest metropolises over the next couple of decades, but neither are 15 or so other teams in the NFL... SO I just don't see any reason to feed the thought that the NFL will force the Bills out of Buffalo UNLESS!!!! (so here I go feeding the thought) UNLESS !!!!! Buffalonians pretty much refuse to build a new stadium and create more revenue. If that is the reality and Bills fans take a hard lined approach and refuse to allow a new stadium, and demand a much smaller investment be made into the old stadium, then yes I could see pressure coming from the NFL to move the team to a city who is willing to do so. Cash is king..... A Business is the business of being in Business and if one part of that business is under performing well then that's the part that gets moved. This would be do to the fact that the Bills are not doing everything to maximize their portion of revenues, and it will do exactly what you say, it will earn the ire of the other 31 teams In the end it is the DUTY of the Buffalo Bills to continue to create increasing revenue to the NFL. That's the nature of any Business, and for Bills fans to sit back and think that keeping the old Ralph rolling or trying short arm a stadium build then I do agree that the NFL should and probably will threaten to move the team. You are right Terry and Kim are actually do this smartly by walking the tightrope. Not rushing anything turning over every stone and keeping both parties interest in mind. I could see a nicely upgraded stadium in OP as the compromise... The question is does the NFL pony up a few $100 million to help out? They better, especially since we aren't getting a Super Bowl, like a lot of cities that build new stadiums. I absolutely would build new. No more half-measures to keep NewEra/RWS/Rich stadium afloat. The one structural advantage of building next to the current stadium is you can save a lot of money putting half the stadium in the ground. I would also go for a set roof. Not a retractable one. (Huge waste of money on something you'll use once or twice and will likely break anyway.) 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddaryl Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 1 hour ago, LSHMEAB said: I believe the Bills were dead last in terms of team value. We're all Bills fans, but that is a pretty telling metric. As Promo pointed out, we should be grateful for Pegula. There's an excellent chance the team is not in Buffalo without his purchase. We are towards the bottom but this is also after 17 ***** years of no winning.. Wining tradition alone will give us a give phat revenue bump, and a decent stadium should make our revenue generating picture much much rosier Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddaryl Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 (edited) 9 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said: (Huge waste of money on something you'll use once or twice and will likely break anyway.) LOL.. I think todays roofs are very well designed... Seriously how much technology is needed with a retractable roof. I know the 1st few retractable roofs came with issues We are an elements town until the team is eliminated from the playoffs then people don't show up cause its cold and snowy. If were winning and in the hunt then we show up in full force and put the fear into other teams fans with our insane embracing of crazy weather A roof might be a condition the NFL wants just to ensure those dec home games generate more revenue. It may also be something the state wants so attract more and larger acts when the stadium is not in use for football. The roof decision will probably fall in with revenue generation equation. Revenue will win if the ROI of the roof is positive in their eyes Edited June 30, 2019 by ddaryl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not at the table Karlos Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said: This could not be more wrong. 31 NFL owners would vote to move the Bills anywhere. San Antonio, Toronto, Mexico City, Norfolk, etc. No Pegula, no Buffalo Bills. Period. I’m gonna say this couldn’t be more wrong. There were a few people that were interested in keeping the bills in buffalo but backed off because the Pegulas made it known they were putting in a high bid (that came from someone with knowledge of the sale and is still involved with the team) NFL owners saw that the football market in Toronto was a complete joke and the people there would rather the team stayed in Buffalo. Yeah Bon Jovi and his team were rumored to want to move the team there but they didn’t have a legit shot at winning the bid. The Bills have an established fan base that regularly sells out, they spend on merchandise. Maybe not as much as say the cowboys but you can’t say we don’t support the team. Goodell is from area and doesn’t want to move the team but wants to light a fire under pegulas to build the stadium. They won’t force a team out of the area after the owner spent a billion plus on the team. That would just hurt sale prices down the line What is stopping the nfl from allowing buffalo to host a super bowl if a new stadium is built? We have enough hotel rooms and we fit all the requirements. Goodell said a few years back that the nfl would try to reward teams that built a new stadium with a super bowl as long as northern teams have a roof. If if the team starts winning their value will go up. Edited June 30, 2019 by Not at the table Karlos 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Joshin' Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 2 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said: This could not be more wrong. 31 NFL owners would vote to move the Bills anywhere. San Antonio, Toronto, Mexico City, Norfolk, etc. No Pegula, no Buffalo Bills. Period. I suspect the league would have no stomach for a fight to move the Bills and all the legal/PR hassles it would bring. I do believe they will assert max pressure to get a new stadium. I am in the minority but I do not see the need for a new stadium. This is not nostalgic but New Era meets the needs - a place to watch football in a great atmosphere. I do not need fast wi fi, bars and restaurants. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WotAGuy Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 There’s 32 teams. Not everyone can be in the top 15 in revenue. We’re in the top 30, and let’s be Talkin’ Proud about it, dammit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mc1320 Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 Arrowhead Stadium is just as old as New Era, so why isn’t the NFL banging on KC to build a new stadium? Pure shameless capitalism by a bunch of greedy old men. The Pegulas/state/county should invest $400-600 million to renovate the current stadium and tell the NFL to stuff it. After paying $1.4 billion too buy the team, there is no way the NFL can force the Bills to move regardless of the NFL by-laws. And if the Pegulas decided to move the Bills, they will have to sell/move the Sabres and their restaurants and hotels because no one in this town would patronize anything they owned going forward. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, PromoTheRobot said: This could not be more wrong. 31 NFL owners would vote to move the Bills anywhere. San Antonio, Toronto, Mexico City, Norfolk, etc. No Pegula, no Buffalo Bills. Period. oy.... 43 minutes ago, Mc1320 said: Arrowhead Stadium is just as old as New Era, so why isn’t the NFL banging on KC to build a new stadium? Pure shameless capitalism by a bunch of greedy old men. The Pegulas/state/county should invest $400-600 million to renovate the current stadium and tell the NFL to stuff it. After paying $1.4 billion too buy the team, there is no way the NFL can force the Bills to move regardless of the NFL by-laws. And if the Pegulas decided to move the Bills, they will have to sell/move the Sabres and their restaurants and hotels because no one in this town would patronize anything they owned going forward. The other owners can't force a move. They can nix one. Edited June 30, 2019 by Mr. WEO 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoPar_v2 Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 This is just Florio poking the bear a little bit more for clicks in the offseason. Nothing new of substance was said, or even implied, in this one. Low-effort I’d say, even by Florio standards. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted June 30, 2019 Share Posted June 30, 2019 4 hours ago, Not at the table Karlos said: I’m gonna say this couldn’t be more wrong. There were a few people that were interested in keeping the bills in buffalo but backed off because the Pegulas made it known they were putting in a high bid (that came from someone with knowledge of the sale and is still involved with the team) NFL owners saw that the football market in Toronto was a complete joke and the people there would rather the team stayed in Buffalo. Yeah Bon Jovi and his team were rumored to want to move the team there but they didn’t have a legit shot at winning the bid. The Bills have an established fan base that regularly sells out, they spend on merchandise. Maybe not as much as say the cowboys but you can’t say we don’t support the team. Goodell is from area and doesn’t want to move the team but wants to light a fire under pegulas to build the stadium. They won’t force a team out of the area after the owner spent a billion plus on the team. That would just hurt sale prices down the line What is stopping the nfl from allowing buffalo to host a super bowl if a new stadium is built? We have enough hotel rooms and we fit all the requirements. Goodell said a few years back that the nfl would try to reward teams that built a new stadium with a super bowl as long as northern teams have a roof. If if the team starts winning their value will go up. I'm sorry. Who are you referring to? Jon Bon Jovi? Donald Trump? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not at the table Karlos Posted July 1, 2019 Share Posted July 1, 2019 9 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said: I'm sorry. Who are you referring to? Jon Bon Jovi? Donald Trump? Yes I am referring to Bon Jovi and Donald Trump because they both backed off and didn’t bid on the Bills... / Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted July 1, 2019 Share Posted July 1, 2019 9 minutes ago, Not at the table Karlos said: Yes I am referring to Bon Jovi and Donald Trump because they both backed off and didn’t bid on the Bills... / Did you know that Bon Jovi's backer was the people at Rogers Communications? Do you really believe they were committed to keeping the Bills in Buffalo? As for the Donald, well... 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not at the table Karlos Posted July 1, 2019 Share Posted July 1, 2019 6 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said: Did you know that Bon Jovi's backer was the people at Rogers Communications? Do you really believe they were committed to keeping the Bills in Buffalo? As for the Donald, well... My reply was sarcasm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted July 1, 2019 Share Posted July 1, 2019 1 minute ago, Not at the table Karlos said: My reply was sarcasm. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DefenseWins Posted July 1, 2019 Author Share Posted July 1, 2019 As I recall, Bon Jovi never actually had 1.4 Billion that the Pegula's reportedly paid for the franchise. And as for Trump, latest news reports appear to indicate that he didn't have the funds either and may have committed "bank fraud" with regard to his application/bid... I think most of us would agree that the Bills will NEVER be able to command the PSL fees nor the kind of "suite sales" that major markets could. But with the coming of "legalized gambling" that is being talked about right now in addition to the fact that the Bills regularly sell out the stadium, the Bills franchise still brings in a rather tidy sum of money into Pegula's and the NFL's coffers. Obviously, there will most likely be someone out there with the funds to purchase the team IF it were ever put up for sale, But the Pegula's don't seem to be in any particular hurry to build a new stadium and certainly they are not losing money on the team. At some point a new stadium will be built. I don't believe that further remodeling of New Era would be an option. It will be interesting to see how this all pans out... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jrb1979 Posted July 1, 2019 Share Posted July 1, 2019 I have never seen a fanbase so upset by getting a new stadium. I would love to see one built like the one the Browns play in. From what I have seen of it, it looks really nice and probably has amenities like their baseball stadium. Almost all the Cleveland area craft brews have a booth. WNY needs to get over loving their game day brews of Blue and Genny. Two of the worst beers ever. A new domed stadium downtown is probably what's going to happen. Limit tailgating to Bills owned lots, aka no more Hammers lot, to generate more revenue and get people to spend more money in the stadium. I know a lot of you here don't want that but the team also wants to draw more family oriented people and limit the amount of drunks at games. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punching Bag Posted July 1, 2019 Share Posted July 1, 2019 19 hours ago, ddaryl said: We are an elements town until the team is eliminated from the playoffs then people don't show up cause its cold and snowy. If were winning and in the hunt then we show up in full force and put the fear into other teams fans with our insane embracing of crazy weather Not necessarily. Some playoff games were not even sold out during Kelly years. There are compromises between domes and open stadiums which help protect stands but nothing will solve roads issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted July 1, 2019 Share Posted July 1, 2019 3 minutes ago, Limeaid said: Not necessarily. Some playoff games were not even sold out during Kelly years. There are compromises between domes and open stadiums which help protect stands but nothing will solve roads issues. There were 80,000 tickets to sell back then and they may not have all been sold out but there 75,000 or more of us there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Joshin' Posted July 1, 2019 Share Posted July 1, 2019 5 hours ago, Jrb1979 said: I have never seen a fanbase so upset by getting a new stadium. I would love to see one built like the one the Browns play in. From what I have seen of it, it looks really nice and probably has amenities like their baseball stadium. Almost all the Cleveland area craft brews have a booth. WNY needs to get over loving their game day brews of Blue and Genny. Two of the worst beers ever. A new domed stadium downtown is probably what's going to happen. Limit tailgating to Bills owned lots, aka no more Hammers lot, to generate more revenue and get people to spend more money in the stadium. I know a lot of you here don't want that but the team also wants to draw more family oriented people and limit the amount of drunks at games. So you are basing a new stadium on needing different beer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted July 1, 2019 Share Posted July 1, 2019 On 6/30/2019 at 12:56 PM, Brianmoorman4jesus said: Can they just update the actual existing structure for safety reasons and stay where they are? Just make it so the thing isnt going to fall down. Does such technology exist? This isn’t really about safety, it’s about increasing revenue. In short, how do you gain pricing power in an old stadium with few amenities and too much capacity ? That is the nut that needs to be cracked. A climate controlled stadium with less seats would be ideal, but will cost a lot to build. The original design of Rich Stadium doesn’t leave much room for massive redesigns because it is a sunken field. A major renovation is expensive too, but can it give big enough results to add pricing power for tickets and boxes ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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