zevo Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 Just now, BullBuchanan said: Does it? Yup...I think it does Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackOrton Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 54 minutes ago, zevo said: Seems to work just fine for cam I’m not sure Cam has had a game where he completed only 8 passes. Ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zevo Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 Just now, BringBackOrton said: I’m not sure Cam has had a game where he completed only 8 passes. Ever. My point is running for a qb that big and athletic can also be a recipe for success.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BullBuchanan Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 Just now, zevo said: Yup...I think it does Well Cam has yet to have back to back winning seasons, and I don't think he's accomplished very much in this league for all of the talent that he has. I wouldn't want him on my team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zevo Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 Just now, BullBuchanan said: Well Cam has yet to have back to back winning seasons, and I don't think he's accomplished very much in this league for all of the talent that he has. I wouldn't want him on my team. He has an nfc championship and nfl mvp award.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BullBuchanan Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 1 minute ago, zevo said: My point is running for a qb that big and athletic can also be a recipe for success.... What success? Just now, zevo said: He has an nfc championship and nfl mvp award.... And he was also the reason his team lost the Super Bowl. He isn't good enough. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keepthefaith Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 47 minutes ago, jaybee said: He will be traded in three years and be a backup quarterback for a couple years and be out of the league by 2024. Probably sooner. He is an excellent athlete but a very bad quarterback. Right, because after a few starts on a team in transition his entire potential career can be judged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoPar_v2 Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 2 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said: What success? And he was also the reason his team lost the Super Bowl. He isn't good enough. Interesting. So you’d rather have Nick Foles than Cam Newton? By your hilarious standards Nick would be better after all. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 I would like to see Allen throw more, but I blame that on the playcalling more than on Allen. It seemed pretty windy today, too, so maybe not a great day for passing the football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt_In_NH Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 I had the same thought. The first 3rd down they had where he ran for the first down, he had a guy right after the snap to the right that would have been an easy conversion but he was not looking there. Bottom line is right now he is a one read guy, that has to change for him to make it. It's great that he is using his legs though which can give him some confidence and keep the offense moving at times. In the long run though your franchise QB has to be able to throw it more consistently that he does right now. So many bootlegs that generate a lot of time to pass and he often just hoofs it for 3-4 yards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longtimebillsfan Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 15 minutes ago, BringBackOrton said: Tyrod got traded, and then thrown on a scrap heap, so any parallels to Tyrod are bad. You missed the point entirely. But that is ok. I am a fan of Allen. Not everyone will be. That is what this board if for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keepthefaith Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 1 hour ago, Niagara Dude said: Great team win and Allen made some huge throws and ran for over 100yards, end of the day i do not want my franchise QB focused on running the football. For Allen to become a great franchise QB he needs to throw the ball and more plays to need to be called to throw the ball and not run. This is a passing league, and ground and pound is for losers the great teams pass for 300yards on weekly basis and we struggle to make it to 200 yards. Yes the receivers suck but we need to stay committed to becoming a pass first team. Even finishing this season focused on passing the ball and establishing ourselves as a pass first team will help signing potential free agent WR'S. Yes and the lack of a running game from the running backs is very troubling. The backs need to run more and more effectively and Allen needs to run less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misterbluesky Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 1 hour ago, Niagara Dude said: Great team win and Allen made some huge throws and ran for over 100yards, end of the day i do not want my franchise QB focused on running the football. For Allen to become a great franchise QB he needs to throw the ball and more plays to need to be called to throw the ball and not run. This is a passing league, and ground and pound is for losers the great teams pass for 300yards on weekly basis and we struggle to make it to 200 yards. Yes the receivers suck but we need to stay committed to becoming a pass first team. Even finishing this season focused on passing the ball and establishing ourselves as a pass first team will help signing potential free agent WR'S. He sure double guesses easy throws to the flat....Croom and Jones today,for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BullBuchanan Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 2 minutes ago, JoPar_v2 said: Interesting. So you’d rather have Nick Foles than Cam Newton? By your hilarious standards Nick would be better after all. I'm not sure they're that different in their ability to win football games. Foles had one great year and so did Cam. They both look terrible sometimes, and Cam has this way of absolutely blowing it against teams he should crush. I just don't think Newton is a very good QB. He'll come out one week and look like an MVP, and then he can't complete obvious reads and easy passes. He's inconsistent in the worst ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 2 minutes ago, keepthefaith said: Yes and the lack of a running game from the running backs is very troubling. The backs need to run more and more effectively and Allen needs to run less. I got very nervous on the run where Josh got bent over backwards THAT is how you blow out your knee 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billspro Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 1 hour ago, Niagara Dude said: Great team win and Allen made some huge throws and ran for over 100yards, end of the day i do not want my franchise QB focused on running the football. For Allen to become a great franchise QB he needs to throw the ball and more plays to need to be called to throw the ball and not run. This is a passing league, and ground and pound is for losers the great teams pass for 300yards on weekly basis and we struggle to make it to 200 yards. Yes the receivers suck but we need to stay committed to becoming a pass first team. Even finishing this season focused on passing the ball and establishing ourselves as a pass first team will help signing potential free agent WR'S. To be fair that is a very good defence to go against, especially not playing the last few weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mat68 Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 4 minutes ago, mattynh said: I had the same thought. The first 3rd down they had where he ran for the first down, he had a guy right after the snap to the right that would have been an easy conversion but he was not looking there. Bottom line is right now he is a one read guy, that has to change for him to make it. It's great that he is using his legs though which can give him some confidence and keep the offense moving at times. In the long run though your franchise QB has to be able to throw it more consistently that he does right now. So many bootlegs that generate a lot of time to pass and he often just hoofs it for 3-4 yards. Because he didn't throw it underneath right away does not indicate he is a one read qb. You dont know the passing concept and his coaching dictated by pressure or defensive alignment. Give me a break. Allen has faced by far the toughest defenses than any of the other rookies in his class. Also has the worst offensive supporting cast. He looks like a guy to build around. They won because of Josh Allen today not inspite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 Not sure why everybody is so defensive. Allen did some good things today but it’s OK to question a QB who completes 42% of his passes. This is his third game he’s completed less than 50% of his passes this season 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 1 hour ago, Degenerate Mike in HHDS said: Ummm he threw a lot of good pass's, Thompson dropped one and penalties killed a few, quit looking at the stats He only completed 4(?) passes after the first quarter. Even with gifting him drops and penalties you are looking at 6? 7? completions in 3 quarters. He will definitely have to step up but you take wins how you can get them with a young guy and he got it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bing Bong Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 That 40 some odd rush was my favorite play this game. A lot of other Quarterbacks might have taken a sack and the better ones would have marched up the field for those yards. Doesn't matter how you get em Josh sealed the game thurr. If he's 33 and we're griping about how reckless he was rookie year THEN THAT'S A GOOD PROBLEM TO HAVE given we have a 10 year franchise QB 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 5 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: I got very nervous on the run where Josh got bent over backwards THAT is how you blow out your knee And being third down about to go up 2 scores that late in the game.... whyyyyy would you run him at a stout defense by design?!? Gotta protect the guy there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 Just now, NoSaint said: And being third down about to go up 2 scores that late in the game.... whyyyyy would you run him at a stout defense by design?!? Gotta protect the guy there. Agreed...that looked like a set play from Daboll there.....would have liked to see him just sling that one from the pocket Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleeby Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 24 minutes ago, BringBackOrton said: I’m not sure Cam has had a game where he completed only 8 passes. Ever. Did you actually watch this game today? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackOrton Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 23 minutes ago, zevo said: My point is running for a qb that big and athletic can also be a recipe for success.... It sure can. I don't that recipe includes 8 completions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1st Ammendment NoMas Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 If my QB can make 45 yd runs, it's just as good as a 45yd pass in my book. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoPar_v2 Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 10 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said: I'm not sure they're that different in their ability to win football games. Foles had one great year and so did Cam. They both look terrible sometimes, and Cam has this way of absolutely blowing it against teams he should crush. I just don't think Newton is a very good QB. He'll come out one week and look like an MVP, and then he can't complete obvious reads and easy passes. He's inconsistent in the worst ways. Ok honestly I think I get what you’re trying to say now. Cam can be inconsistent; he’s had some recurring accuracy issues especially over the years. But you can’t deny the highs with Newton are very, very high. When he’s on he’s MVP caliber. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 Look beyond the stats. Allen had a very good game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsfanAZ Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 So people want NFL passing numbers instead of wins? I thought Allen made good throws and put the ball where he needed to. He had a couple that he missed but not many. If the middle of the field is open, he should run. If his WR's arent open, run and make something of it. Allen got the Bills the win. I am watching the Chargers game right now and their worst WR gets more separation and has better hands than anyone on the Bills. Rosen is playing and he threw an awful INT earlier. Right now he is 10 of 17 for 95 yards 1 TD 1 INT. They are down by 30 in the 4th and are just running the ball even on third down. They arent even letting him throw to get experience. 3 runs and punt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steptide Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 He took a step in the right direction today. Now I wanna see him take another step next week. I know people are excited, but our franchise qb completed 8 passes today. There's much work to be done Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 WINNING! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickelCity Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 17 minutes ago, mattynh said: I had the same thought. The first 3rd down they had where he ran for the first down, he had a guy right after the snap to the right that would have been an easy conversion but he was not looking there. Bottom line is right now he is a one read guy, that has to change for him to make it. It's great that he is using his legs though which can give him some confidence and keep the offense moving at times. In the long run though your franchise QB has to be able to throw it more consistently that he does right now. So many bootlegs that generate a lot of time to pass and he often just hoofs it for 3-4 yards. I was happy with Josh today and thought he played well, with a lot of great throws buried by the OLine/Refs and drops, but this is a reasonable critique. I may not totally agree but at least it's a reasonable take! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PittsforDave Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 (edited) Agreed. He’s going to get killed out there running and diving head first every other play. He needs to settle down and not panic so often. Just be cool Allen, don’t panic. Edited November 25, 2018 by PittsforDave 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackOrton Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 18 minutes ago, longtimebillsfan said: You missed the point entirely. But that is ok. I am a fan of Allen. Not everyone will be. That is what this board if for. Oh I got your point. I just found it funny that you demonstrated it by bringing up a guy whose career is over because he didn't throw for enough yards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bing Bong Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 1 hour ago, Niagara Dude said: This is a passing league, and ground and pound is for losers It's not always a passing team if you gash a team for a 40 yard game to clinch the game and win! Is winning for losers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt_In_NH Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 2 minutes ago, Mat68 said: Because he didn't throw it underneath right away does not indicate he is a one read qb. You dont know the passing concept and his coaching dictated by pressure or defensive alignment. Give me a break. Allen has faced by far the toughest defenses than any of the other rookies in his class. Also has the worst offensive supporting cast. He looks like a guy to build around. They won because of Josh Allen today not inspite. I do agree he was instrumental today, but they way he played today is not sustainable and wont work against better teams. The Jags are a great defense on paper only, they have been getting smoked for weeks. That was one example, there are plenty of others, he is a one ready QB right now. He could have diagnosed the pressure before the snap and watched for a couple things after the snap and easily read that and completed the pass. Instead he looked at his first read and then pulled it down. Like the better QB's do all the time. He will need to rely less on his running as time goes on. You want to put him in the HOF go for it but Im not, he barely completes 50% of his passes while most guys are mid 60's. Stop making excuses. He needs to improve a lot, I am hopeful he will. Today he completed 8 passes out of 19 and he rushed 13 times. He ran today on like 40% of his drop backs, that will not be a recipe to win a lot of games. 3 minutes ago, NickelCity said: I was happy with Josh today and thought he played well, with a lot of great throws buried by the OLine/Refs and drops, but this is a reasonable critique. I may not totally agree but at least it's a reasonable take! 8 for 19 passing with 13 runs. You are happy with that? I mean they won the game so I get "who cares about stats when you win". But for me, I just dont see that as something that will be successful in the long term if it continues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickelCity Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 13 minutes ago, Mango said: Not sure why everybody is so defensive. Allen did some good things today but it’s OK to question a QB who completes 42% of his passes. This is his third game he’s completed less than 50% of his passes this season I agree that it's fair to question those numbers, but boy was today's game one where the stats buried the lede. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleeby Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 2 minutes ago, PittsforDave said: Agreed. He’s going to get killed out there running and diving head first every other play. He needs to settle down and not panic so often. Just be cool Allen, don’t panic. He dove head first today? Are you certain about that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoPar_v2 Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 Just now, sleeby said: He dove head first today? Are you certain about that? Yes. At least once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mat68 Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 (edited) 5 minutes ago, mattynh said: I do agree he was instrumental today, but they way he played today is not sustainable and wont work against better teams. The Jags are a great defense on paper only, they have been getting smoked for weeks. That was one example, there are plenty of others, he is a one ready QB right now. He could have diagnosed the pressure before the snap and watched for a couple things after the snap and easily read that and completed the pass. Instead he looked at his first read and then pulled it down. Like the better QB's do all the time. He will need to rely less on his running as time goes on. You want to put him in the HOF go for it but Im not, he barely completes 50% of his passes while most guys are mid 60's. Stop making excuses. He needs to improve a lot, I am hopeful he will. Today he completed 8 passes out of 19 and he rushed 13 times. He ran today on like 40% of his drop backs, that will not be a recipe to win a lot of games. Never said HOF or any level of accolades for that matter. I just do not understand why more people are not impressed by Allen out athleting Jacksonvilles defense. He doesn't have a go to guy on 3rd down. He doesnt have a running game to fall back on. If this was a terrible defense than I understand. I do not recall an easy matchup yet for Allen. Edited November 25, 2018 by Mat68 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BullBuchanan Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 (edited) 8 minutes ago, JoPar_v2 said: Ok honestly I think I get what you’re trying to say now. Cam can be inconsistent; he’s had some recurring accuracy issues especially over the years. But you can’t deny the highs with Newton are very, very high. When he’s on he’s MVP caliber. Of course. When he's great, he looks all-time elite, but he doesn't go there enough to offset the times where looks terrible. DO you want a QB like that? I don't. It makes it impossible to create a plan to win games on a consistent basis, because you never know what you're going to get. I'd rather have a guy that doesn't fly as high, but has a higher floor. Cam has had extremely talented teams around him with HOF talent and they constantly under-perform. Edited November 25, 2018 by BullBuchanan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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