Peterman Works w/ Tom House, Adds Velocity

[Doc]

I'm glad he realized arm strength was an issue and tried to work on it.  Whether it produces results remains to be seen, but he's not getting cut anytime before final cutdowns, if even.

[racketmaster]

9 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

 

To be fair I haven’t been one to swing wildly high or low on him based on a few minutes of play here and there. I think he can be a fine backup probably. I don’t know how much his actual skill set will evolve though. 

This is reasonable. I’m certainly not advocating that he can be our franchise qb but I too think there is a chance he could be a quality and affordable backup. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, Da webster guy said:

You imply that you have a better sense for evaluating college qb's than most.     So rank your top 5 college qb's entering the draft this year.   I'm curious. 

 

Already done, go here:

 

I disagree with him on a couple of points, and keep in mind his draft grade is where he puts the guy overall on talent, not where he expects him to be drafted.

But it's based on a ton of work.  He had another post earlier where he explains exactly how he grades.

 

 

6 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

It would be cool if he somehow came back a much better QB and beat out McCarron for the backup role. That's what I'll be rooting for although the odds are very much against it.

 

I actually don't think it would be cool give we're paying McCarron to be an upgrade - but I'd be happy for Peterman.  I think he sounds like a good guy and I wish him the best.

[Real McClappy]

It amazes me how hard people are on a 5th rd pick. Just sit back, relax and just hope he proves people wrong. 

 

People act like we spent a 1st or 2nd rd on this guy and mortgaged the franchise on him being our franchise QB.

 

Just let him try to develop and support him. 

Edited April 18, 2018 by Real McCoy

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

2 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Who was that? 

Every Bills QB the last 20 years?

[Putin]

3 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

It would be cool if he somehow came back a much better QB and beat out McCarron for the backup role. That's what I'll be rooting for although the odds are very much against it.

What are the odds of top 4 QB’s in this draft all becoming franchise , or just good starting  QB’s  ? 

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

45 minutes ago, LittleJoeCartwright said:

I've always been good at sports/games involving accuracy and it does come naturally. I guess that's what they're talking about.

 

I hear ya.  Some folks got it, and some don't. 

 

But here's what puzzles me then: why give it the adjective "natural"?  Why isn't it just "accuracy"?  It seems as though they're trying to encode some other meaning, but I don't get it.

 

 

[Big Turk]

Adding velocity is far easier than most draft people want to admit...most QBs coming out of college can add at least 5 mph just from better mechanics and an NFL weight lifting regimen from their rookie year to their 2nd year(1st year if you go by NFL terms).  One of the reqsosn I dont put much stock in that

[racketmaster]

20 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

On to the 2018 draft to acquire a potential franchise QB. 

Bills will draft a potential franchise qb in about a week. Bills are smart enough to not bank on Mccaron or Peterman being the long term solution. We just disagree on whether Peterman can be a quality backup. What he showed in the preseason and in limited action (other than SD) was a poised qb that generally made quick and smart decisions. If he makes a few improvements to his game this season he could earn the right to be our backup and make Mccaron expendable in a year. 

Edited April 18, 2018 by racketmaster

[cd1]

1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:

 

He started 2.  I predicted his future before he started a single NFL game though...... in fact before he was drafted.  Everyone will know where to find me if I end up being wrong.  I won't be.  Peterman sucks.  

 

Not for nothin' but why hasn't the NFL discovered YOU yet?

 

You seem to possess  a talent that has yet to be displayed on any of the NFL scouting squads.

 

A real diamond in the rough I'd say. Color me VERY impressed.

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, racketmaster said:

Bills will draft a potential franchise qb in about a week. Bills are smart enough to not bank on Mccaron or Peterman being the long term solution. We just disagree on whether Peterman can be a quality backup. What he showed in the preseason and in limited action (other than SD) was a poised qb that generally made quick and smart decisions. If he make a few improvements to his game this season he could earn the right to be our backup and make Mccaron expendable in a year. 

 

He should have gone to SD instead of LA.  Depending on who the Bills draft, he might not make the 53 man roster. 

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

23 minutes ago, racketmaster said:

 

 

Here is what we know:

1. Peterman was expected to be a mid round draft pick last year and we got value getting him in the 5th.

My definition of mid round would certainly include the 5th round. You got you early rounds 1 and 2, mid rounds 3-5 and late rounds, 6-7. I guess you could say we got a little bit of value because we got him at the tail end of the mid round picks?

[Mojo44]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I don't think he was accurate in college. His college film is filled with horrible inaccuracy.  To me he is a classic case of getting the accuracy badge because he doesn't have a big arm.  It is the classic cliche used to describe QBs with less than ideal arm strength "smart and accurate."  My personal view on his college tape was the arm strength wasn't quite as bad as reported and the accuracy was nowhere near as good as reported.  He played in a gimmicky college offense and you had talking head draft media calling him "pro-ready".  I mean I know it is a thing on here at the moment to say nobody on this forum knows as much as guys who do this working for the networks but the draft media were way off base on Nathan Peterman.  His college tape was horrible from the perspective of a pro-evaluation.  All the "smart, accurate and pro-ready" stuff was just cliched rubbish from people who hadn't put the work in.  He was borderline undraftable.  The way he played in the league was absolutely zero surprise to me.  

60.1% completion percentage in college. Make what you will of it. 

[BadLandsMeanie]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

He isn't very accurate either.  He sucks.  2018 will be his last year in the NFL.  

Here is my trouble. Your smug and abrasive tone. 

 

Quite a few posts in this thread are like that. And you are so absolutely  sure. I don't believe that you alone have the power to be absolutely sure how a young QB will turn out 5 years from now.

I think you over state your case, over estimate your prowess and skill, and do it in a caustic kind of way in this thread here. I am not saying you will prove to be wrong, just that you are less believable by a lot, because of how you say things in this thread.

[jr1]

with the CBA, are players allowed to work with the team's QB coach during the offseason?

[Big Turk]

1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:

 

He started 2.  I predicted his future before he started a single NFL game though...... in fact before he was drafted.  Everyone will know where to find me if I end up being wrong.  I won't be.  Peterman sucks.  

With basically a 50% chance of being right it isnt really that hard

[HappyDays]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

He isn't very accurate either.

 

I thought he threw a pretty accurate ball last year, when he made good decisions. If his accuracy right now was his worst trait we'd be excited about his future. Arm strength and decision making were his downfall last year. He could improve both issues as unlikely as it might be.

 

And I still at least partly blame Dennison for the 5 INT disaster. A rookie QB making his first start on the road with less than a week's notice, it's the OC's job to prepare him and build a simple game plan and Dennison failed spectacularly.

Edited April 18, 2018 by HappyDays

[Hapless Bills Fan]

Just now, Putin said:

What are the odds of top 4 QB’s in this draft all becoming franchise , or just good starting  QB’s  ?

 

I can do that.  We'll doecoming a solid starting QB, I don't do "franchise" until someone explains to me exactly what that means.

Let's say hypothetically that 3 QB are drafted in the top 5 as people say (1, 3 and 5), and one is drafted in the 11-20 slot.

 

The odds of a QB drafted at #1 succeeding are 3/4 (might be 6/10 but we'll go with the higher number)

Top 5: 1/2

11-20: 3/10

 

That means the odds of them all succeeding are the product: 3/4 x 1/2 x 1/3 x 3/10 or 5.6%

2 minutes ago, jr1 said:

with the CBA, are players allowed to work with the team's QB coach during the offseason?

 

No, they are not, and IMHO it's a big handicap for young QB coming into the league and something the next CBA ought to address.

There's an article somewhere describing how McCarthy used to work with the QB and how it helped Aaron Rodgers.

[C.Biscuit97]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

He isn't very accurate either.  He sucks.  2018 will be his last year in the NFL.  

Strong take Gunner.  I won’t be as harsh but I struggle to see him upside.  He was the most “pro ready” qb in his class, still got picked in the 5th round, and had one of the worst games in nfl history.  Pro ready means you don’t have a lot of room for growth.  He will get his shot in camp but I would not be shocked if he got cut.

 

McDermott should send flowers to Andy Dalton everyday because it saved him from one of the worst coaching decisions in nfl history.  

[billsredneck1]

35 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

What a ridiculous take.  A knowledgeable poster gives a reasoned and honest assessment and you expect him to act like a cheerleader for every Bills' player.  He's been here a lot longer than you and if you don't like his assessment then maybe you should leave instead of suggesting that he does. 

i've been on the boards since 2004 and a fan for 45 years.  a reasoned and honest assessment does not include the phrase "he sucks" and "will not be in the league after 2018."

 

his reasoned and honest assessment is that of an nfl fan and nothing more than anyone else's opinion. also giving draft grades never correlates with where players are drafted.

[HappyDays]

13 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

I actually don't think it would be cool give we're paying McCarron to be an upgrade - but I'd be happy for Peterman.  I think he sounds like a good guy and I wish him the best.

 

Aside from the fact I like Peterman as a person and want him to succeed, it would also save cap space if he won the job in training camp.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

8 minutes ago, matter2003 said:

Adding velocity is far easier than most draft people want to admit...most QBs coming out of college can add at least 5 mph just from better mechanics and an NFL weight lifting regimen from their rookie year to their 2nd year(1st year if you go by NFL terms).  One of the reqsosn I dont put much stock in that

 

Is that really the case?

 

I am not a lifter.  I just know that adding strength doesn't necessarily translate into whatever you want to call it that produces velocity - power? 

Example, my kid used to throw shot put.  She worked hard on her technique, and she lifted weights all winter with the other throwers (mostly football players, which was interesting).  She got much stronger - could lift 2-3x the weight - and the coaches praised her improvement in technique.  But it somehow never translated into improved distance.

 

So I suspect there's something more to it.

 

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, billsredneck1 said:

i've been on the boards since 2004 and a fan for 45 years.  a reasoned and honest assessment does not include the phrase "he sucks" and "will not be in the league after 2018."

 

his reasoned and honest assessment is that of an nfl fan and nothing more than anyone else's opinion. also giving draft grades never correlates with where players are drafted.

 

So what! He's been here at TBD a lot longer than you have and if you don't like his opinion too bad! You have a lot of nerve suggesting he leave. 

[BadLandsMeanie]

3 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

So what! He's been here at TBD a lot longer than you have and if you don't like his opinion too bad! You have a lot of nerve suggesting he leave. 

He didn't.

[GunnerBill]

10 minutes ago, BadLandsMeanie said:

Here is my trouble. Your smug and abrasive tone. 

 

Quite a few posts in this thread are like that. And you are so absolutely  sure. I don't believe that you alone have the power to be absolutely sure how a young QB will turn out 5 years from now.

I think you over state your case, over estimate your prowess and skill, and do it in a caustic kind of way in this thread here. I am not saying you will prove to be wrong, just that you are less believable by a lot, because of how you say things in this thread.

 

4 minutes ago, billsredneck1 said:

i've been on the boards since 2004 and a fan for 45 years.  a reasoned and honest assessment does not include the phrase "he sucks" and "will not be in the league after 2018."

 

his reasoned and honest assessment is that of an nfl fan and nothing more than anyone else's opinion. also giving draft grades never correlates with where players are drafted.

 

So my first contribution to this thread was obviously very black and white.  But I explained my reasoning further down and I have explained my assessment of Nathan Peterman many times over on this board.  Before he was drafted, when he was drafted and since he was drafted.  You can say I come across smug if you like, that's your opinion.  But I absolutely stand by my assessment.

[26CornerBlitz]

53 minutes ago, billsredneck1 said:

we get it, you hate him. there is the browns board to go to if you can't find anything positive here.

 

2 minutes ago, BadLandsMeanie said:

He didn't.

 

That's exactly what he did. 

[Big Turk]

8 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Is that really the case?

 

I am not a lifter.  I just know that adding strength doesn't necessarily translate into whatever you want to call it that produces velocity - power? 

Example, my kid used to throw shot put.  She worked hard on her technique, and she lifted weights all winter with the other throwers (mostly football players, which was interesting).  She got much stronger - could lift 2-3x the weight - and the coaches praised her improvement in technique.  But it somehow never translated into improved distance.

 

So I suspect there's something more to it.

 

Well, strength in the areas you would think doesnt always translate 1:1...

 

Most of your strength regardless of what you are doing comes from your lower body and engaging your posterior chain properly and efficiently...

 

Its a combination of both. The most velocity will come from learning how to properly torque your hips and likely from doing hip flexor/posterior chain/lower body work. Watch Tom Brady...he has a very efficient motion where he basically twists his hips and is able to generate really good velocity on the ball.

 

He was one of the QBs with suspect velocity coming into the NFL

Edited April 18, 2018 by matter2003

[cd1]

4 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Is that really the case?

 

I am not a lifter.  I just know that adding strength doesn't necessarily translate into whatever you want to call it that produces velocity - power? 

Example, my kid used to throw shot put.  She worked hard on her technique, and she lifted weights all winter with the other throwers (mostly football players, which was interesting).  She got much stronger - could lift 2-3x the weight - and the coaches praised her improvement in technique.  But it somehow never translated into improved distance.

 

So I suspect there's something more to it.

 

TRUE!

 

Why can't people "learn" to run fast?  Why can't people learn to throw with "anticipation"?  Why can't people learn how to "speed read" a defense?

 

All we know is there are bridges that can't be crossed not matter the dedication or effort expended.

[aristocrat]

he doesn't need to add a ton of zip to his throw...just a bit might be able to get that edge he needs.  such a slim margin of error. 

[BadLandsMeanie]

Just now, GunnerBill said:

 

 

So my first contribution to this thread was obviously very black and white.  But I explained my reasoning further down and I have explained my assessment of Nathan Peterman many times over on this board.  Before he was drafted, when he was drafted and since he was drafted.  You can say I come across smug if you like, that's your opinion.  But I absolutely stand by my assessment.

I get that you stand by your assessment.

 

But it is an easy assessment. For example I could proclaim right after the draft, that I have run my analysis and I am sure that the Bills will not win the Superbowl this year.

I could then support that with a lengthy thread, in a know it all kind of tone, as if anyone at all on the planet aside from McDermott's mom, was forcefully saying the opposite thing.

 

And as true as that would probably be, people probably wouldn't want to hear that noise just after our draft . And really anyone who wanted to dispute me and see what happens, would be in a very weak position based on the odds.

 

Same as you here. You "boldly" predict the hugely more likely outcome. 5th round pick won't be a starter ever.

 

Who can take that bet? Your post is off topic in this thread. The thread is about his off-season work not if people think he will be a starter of backup. It seems more just like you are saying "I'm right. I'm right. I'm right."

 

Well I say you are wrong about one thing. Peterman will be in the NFL in 2019. I would like to place a bet on that with you. We can get someone to hold the wagers until opening day 2019  What do you say?

 

 

 

 

 

[cd1]

17 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Strong take Gunner.  I won’t be as harsh but I struggle to see him upside.  He was the most “pro ready” qb in his class, still got picked in the 5th round, and had one of the worst games in nfl history.  Pro ready means you don’t have a lot of room for growth.  He will get his shot in camp but I would not be shocked if he got cut.

 

McDermott should send flowers to Andy Dalton everyday because it saved him from one of the worst coaching decisions in nfl history.  

 

Ha Ha Ha - The worst in History?

 

WOW - the turnip truck can't be far down the road, Biscuit. You should be able to catch it if you try...

[BadLandsMeanie]

8 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

 

That's exactly what he did. 

Oh. Well you quoted a different post I didn't connect that was the same poster.

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

I see the troll accuser has been doing his daily trolling.

 

 

nothing wrong with the kid trying to improve. but it wont help his case any with those who just get off on hating on a bills player.

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, BadLandsMeanie said:

 

Well I say you are wrong about one thing. Peterman will be in the NFL in 2019. I would like to place a bet on that with you. We can get someone to hold the wagers until opening day 2019  What do you say?

 

 

If you are willing for the wager to be on an NFL 53 on opening day 2019 I am very happy to take your bet. $50?

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, Thurman#1 said:

And while I'm sure there's a lot of group-think in the media and everywhere, guys like Mayock and the other tape monsters were just as high on him as the folks who are more going on highlights and rumors.

 

IIRC, wasn't there a lot of hype on him after the Senior Bowl too?

 

1 hour ago, Thurman#1 said:

As for his college film being filled with inaccuracy, I'm not seeing it. Watched the 2016 Clemson and Miami games and saw two or three really bad decisions (all against Miami), and three or four throws that seemed to take forever to get there, causing problems, but overall good accuracy despite the Miami defense consistently pressuring him and making his windows small as well on many or most plays. 

 

OK, so shut the sound off and watch this.  I just went back and I looked at it and thought the INT and the almost INT right at the beginning of the tape were "bad decisions".  But then I watched again, and I wondered "is that what GunnerBill is seeing as he's just not accurate?" 

 

I dunno.  I don't have the data base to disagree with GunnerBill, but I didn't think he was that bad in college.  What I thought I saw was exactly what Zeirlien says: hero ball, the tendency to float balls at times, and the weak arm that made balls take a long time to arrive and would give NFL CBs a shot, but overall decent accuracy most of the time.

 

 

 

[Gugny]

I admire Peterman for the hard work and dedication he is putting toward his improvement.  Even if things don't work out in Buffalo, I wish him continued success in the NFL - even if it's solidifying a successful career as a backup.

[BadLandsMeanie]

1 minute ago, GunnerBill said:

 

If you are willing for the wager to be on an NFL 53 on opening day 2019 I am very happy to take your bet. $50?

$100

 

Who do we know who can hold the money?

[billsredneck1]

14 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

Aside from the fact I like Peterman as a person and want him to succeed, it would also save cap space if he won the job in training camp.

i hope they are ready to keep 3 qbs this year. i think if they take any qb not named rosen, there will be no reason at all to start a rookie this year.

 

i think a.j. has the ability to get us to the playoffs and ideally we have a qb competition next spring. i also like nate and see a lot of good qualities in him and think he will look greatly improved.

 

i  think he will push a.j. to be better, as i do not see a lot of difference in their game other than nate may have a sharper, quicker release, yet a.j. has the experience.  it's going to be interesting.

[GunnerBill]

2 minutes ago, BadLandsMeanie said:

$100

 

Who do we know who can hold the money?

 

I'm in.  

[MILFHUNTER#518]

Good, now that our QB situation is 100% settled we can trade back in this years draft and build a team around him.