RobH063 Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 Just an idea or theory or talking out my A** but I got to wondering. Dareus was not someone that was going to be here down the road but if the players had all bought in to we're winning this year and going to the playoffs and then 7 games into the season your 5-2 and contending for the division and then all of a sudden your run stuffing DT is traded away, did that send a signal to the players that McDermott and Beane might not be as committed to winning this year as the players thought they were and so now they've said to hell with it and have given up on the coach and GM? I don't think Dareus is the reason we were 5-2 by a long shot but players are pretty tight with one another and if the staff was preaching love and brotherhood and team and all that sugar coated stuff and the players bought into it and then they just trade a guy out of the blue, showing that they aren't loved and a brotherhood but really just a commodity does that sour the players? I know they traded for Benjamin at about the same time but if the thoughts were already in their heads, the trade for Benjamin may not have had much impact on the players view. It happens in the private sector. You pour your heart and soul into a job and then your boss craps on you and your co-workers, and then you get a fancy new car to drive, you know the boss can crap again so your attitude changes in a hurry. Did that happen with the Bills? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMF2006 Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 He probably supplied the smoke 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 I am sure it had an impact. Trade out a guy that was with you all offseason  bring in a guy from the team that the coach and Gm were at 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 Doubt it since Ricie Incognito commented that there was a disconnect between Darius and the coaches.  Kyle said it was best that Darius got a change of scenery.  It's business and the players know this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan130 Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 I don't think so personally. Â I think its a big reason why their run D sucks, because their run d is simply looking awful without him. Â But I don't think they are quitting because of that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 1 minute ago, RobH063 said: Just an idea or theory or talking out my A** but I got to wondering. Dareus was not someone that was going to be here down the road but if the players had all bought in to we're winning this year and going to the playoffs and then 7 games into the season your 5-2 and contending for the division and then all of a sudden your run stuffing DT is traded away, did that send a signal to the players that McDermott and Beane might not be as committed to winning this year as the players thought they were and so now they've said to hell with it and have given up on the coach and GM? I don't think Dareus is the reason we were 5-2 by a long shot but players are pretty tight with one another and if the staff was preaching love and brotherhood and team and all that sugar coated stuff and the players bought into it and then they just trade a guy out of the blue, showing that they aren't loved and a brotherhood but really just a commodity does that sour the players? I know they traded for Benjamin at about the same time but if the thoughts were already in their heads, the trade for Benjamin may not have had much impact on the players view. It happens in the private sector. You pour your heart and soul into a job and then your boss craps on you and your co-workers, and then you get a fancy new car to drive, you know the boss can crap again so your attitude changes in a hurry. Did that happen with the Bills?   I think they are quitting on D because they feel like they can't handle what they are being asked to do............and Dareus role in that defense was as the one big dude who nobody could push around..........and without the bully behind them it has had both a physical and psychological effect.  They got lucky that Lynch was benched for that Raiders game but I also think they didn't have time to dwell on their lack of jimmy's and joe's on the DL with Dareus having been dealt 48 hours before gameday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobH063 Posted November 13, 2017 Author Share Posted November 13, 2017 (edited) You guys are probably right but I just can't seem to wrap my head around such a change in effort and effectiveness. It's literally like flipping a switch. Edited November 13, 2017 by RobH063 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peace Frog Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 (edited) You're talking about one player that was in on what, 30 plays a game? My wife actually watched today's game with me for a change and at halftime she asked me, "Why do their players look bigger than ours, on offense and defense?"  From the mouth of babes... Edited November 13, 2017 by Peace Frog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommonCents Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 (edited) Anyone that is implying that the departure of Dareus is why the team went down hill is a used car salesman trying to patch up a bad take.  Even when the Bills were off to a good start the guys in the know said sit tight on McD and see how things play out once other coaches have an idea what the Bills are about.  Did losing Dareus hurt the depth at DT? Of course. Has the injured Poyer, Humber and loss of Gaines changed the effectiveness of the unit? Have opposing teams got a grasp for the weaknesses of this team and exploited them?  These last two games have felt like an avalanche. The only bright spot has been the punt coverage and let's just say they are getting plenty of practice out there.  The team exceeded expectations and now is playing as most of us expected....bad. The roster is pretty bad, trading away the talented malcontents isn't going to yield immediate results on the field.  McBeane's tenure will be decided on the weekend of the 2018 draft. Until then I'd like to see Peterman, I'm not sure he would win more games than TT this season but he would be more fun to watch.  Peterman is like visiting Montreal as an 18 year old. A wild time of exploration and enjoying the unknown even when it's sloppier than you could have ever expected.  Tyrod Taylor is the treadmill in your basement. You want to be excited to run on it, you try new music, you run with your eyes closed,  you wear pants or shorts, as soon as you get on it you realize it's still the same old suck! Edited November 13, 2017 by Commonsense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 Guess its better they have a guy who is "all-in" being blown 10 yards off the ball by one blocker rather than having Dareus eating up a double team at the LOS... Â SMFH 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsSbSoon Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 (edited) Now we have to find another dt and probably two and the endless cycle of trying to plug the same holes we create while others exist continues. Trying to win while rebuilding rarely works. We are caught in a hybrid with not that young of a roster with no qb still. It could actually get even worse next year when you think about it Edited November 13, 2017 by BillsSbSoon 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nedboy7 Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 Just because they got their ass kicked, doesn't mean they quit. I think this team has more pride than that. Regardless of what happened the past two weeks. Tyrod was unwatchable today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 We need a couple really good DT’s.  And paragraphs are your friend. Just sayin’. Make it easy to read.....or most won’t. (I didn’t.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmy10 Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 But wasn’t he gone before the Raider game? Maybe the others hadn’t noticed yet, so they didn’t quit until Thursday? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elite Poster Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 9 minutes ago, matter2003 said: Guess its better they have a guy who is "all-in" being blown 10 yards off the ball by one blocker rather than having Dareus eating up a double team at the LOS... Â SMFH Â This exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 2 minutes ago, jimmy10 said: But wasn’t he gone before the Raider game? Maybe the others hadn’t noticed yet, so they didn’t quit until Thursday?  When they faced a couple teams with decent running games what happened. Expect more of the same from SD and Raiders game would have been different if Lynch was playing i think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobH063 Posted November 13, 2017 Author Share Posted November 13, 2017 6 minutes ago, Augie said: We need a couple really good DT’s.  And paragraphs are your friend. Just sayin’. Make it easy to read.....or most won’t. (I didn’t.) You replied to something you didn't read... Interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmy10 Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 5 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:  When they faced a couple teams with decent running games what happened. Expect more of the same from SD and Raiders game would have been different if Lynch was playing i think  Thanks. It’s hard to keep track of when wins and other good things count and when they don’t. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 2 minutes ago, RobH063 said: You replied to something you didn't read... Interesting. I skimmed, make it readable. Expectations are not really high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 We are talking about rushing defense are we not? Â So doesnt Lynch being out kind of help a Bills rushing defense yes or no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LABILLBACKER Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 18 minutes ago, Augie said: We need a couple really good DT’s.  And paragraphs are your friend. Just sayin’. Make it easy to read.....or most won’t. (I didn’t.) We need 2 guys with the size of Dareus + the motivation. Kyle will definitely be retiring after this season. Thornton, Washington, Worthy are all terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rico Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 I could see the players on the team getting upset about a Fred Jackson or a Kyle Williams getting shipped out, but not a Dareus or a Sammy, no. I would be more upset with Dennison not setting them up for success, and along with that maybe TT when he has a brutal game like today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VADC Bills Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 52 minutes ago, RobH063 said: Just an idea or theory or talking out my A** but I got to wondering. Dareus was not someone that was going to be here down the road but if the players had all bought in to we're winning this year and going to the playoffs and then 7 games into the season your 5-2 and contending for the division and then all of a sudden your run stuffing DT is traded away, did that send a signal to the players that McDermott and Beane might not be as committed to winning this year as the players thought they were and so now they've said to hell with it and have given up on the coach and GM? I don't think Dareus is the reason we were 5-2 by a long shot but players are pretty tight with one another and if the staff was preaching love and brotherhood and team and all that sugar coated stuff and the players bought into it and then they just trade a guy out of the blue, showing that they aren't loved and a brotherhood but really just a commodity does that sour the players? I know they traded for Benjamin at about the same time but if the thoughts were already in their heads, the trade for Benjamin may not have had much impact on the players view. It happens in the private sector. You pour your heart and soul into a job and then your boss craps on you and your co-workers, and then you get a fancy new car to drive, you know the boss can crap again so your attitude changes in a hurry. Did that happen with the Bills? Â Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaviorPeterman Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 Yes but again Dareus isn't the reason the last two weeks happened. Â This was coming for a myriad of reasons and even if we kept Dareus we were still getting thumped and losing these games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo03 Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 56 minutes ago, RobH063 said: Just an idea or theory or talking out my A** but I got to wondering. Dareus was not someone that was going to be here down the road but if the players had all bought in to we're winning this year and going to the playoffs and then 7 games into the season your 5-2 and contending for the division and then all of a sudden your run stuffing DT is traded away, did that send a signal to the players that McDermott and Beane might not be as committed to winning this year as the players thought they were and so now they've said to hell with it and have given up on the coach and GM? I don't think Dareus is the reason we were 5-2 by a long shot but players are pretty tight with one another and if the staff was preaching love and brotherhood and team and all that sugar coated stuff and the players bought into it and then they just trade a guy out of the blue, showing that they aren't loved and a brotherhood but really just a commodity does that sour the players? I know they traded for Benjamin at about the same time but if the thoughts were already in their heads, the trade for Benjamin may not have had much impact on the players view. It happens in the private sector. You pour your heart and soul into a job and then your boss craps on you and your co-workers, and then you get a fancy new car to drive, you know the boss can crap again so your attitude changes in a hurry. Did that happen with the Bills? We traded Dareus right before the Raiders game. Didn't seem to affect them then Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 (edited) Different faces different leadership  Same Bills.  Three things you can count in life 1. Death 2. Taxes 3. Bills collapse Edited November 13, 2017 by MAJBobby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmy10 Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 1 minute ago, Buffalo03 said: We traded Dareus right before the Raiders game. Didn't seem to affect them then  Nope, doesn’t count. Because Marshawn Lynch, and reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kirkwoodus13 Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 The trade of Marcel made no sense. The bills didn't benefit financially. They are still on the hook for a tremendous amount of dead money. The fact the McDermet believed Thorton and Washington was even in Dareus league is disturbing. As a leader sometime you have to swallow your pride for the benefit of the group. Just look at the JAGS run defense the last two weeks compared to ours. In fact we will get a direct comparison when we play Charges next week. I am expecting Gordon to go for 150 plus. Our d-line is pure trash, can't stop the run and no pressure on the quarterback. What makes it worse was the lack of adjustment by the coaches. Can we send pressure on third and 13, instead of letting an all time great quarterback sit back there and pick us apart. The last two game look like the team was not prepare to play, and that's on coaching. Mcdermet and Beane made one trade too many. We might miss the playoffs for a 6th round pick. They got no cap relief from that deal worth noting. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Vader Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 No Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 3 minutes ago, jimmy10 said:  Nope, doesn’t count. Because Marshawn Lynch, and reasons. So you are telling me Lynch being out didnt hurt the Raiders run game?  Thats what your going with? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VADC Bills Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 I believe your thoughts have merit. It's the first thing that came to my mind. When management keeps trading your best players especially in the middle of a good run you begin to feel as though you are being sabotaged by your own leadership. The "why should I care if they don't" attitude sets in. Whether you liked Dareus or not he was the star of that line. They will not make the playoffs this year because they depended on defense to keep them in games and that has been dismantled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmy10 Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 Just now, MAJBobby said: So you are telling me Lynch being out didnt hurt the Raiders run game?  Thats what your going with?  Your going with a bunch of professionals quit because their friend got traded? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kirkwoodus13 Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 All you have to do is go look at Lynch in the Miami game. Those guys wanted no part of Ingram today. Do you think they wanted to tackle Lynch? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 5 minutes ago, jimmy10 said:  Your going with a bunch of professionals quit because their friend got traded?  Ahhh I got it that Dareus being traded helps the run defense as evident by the last couple weeks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hemma Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 41:23 Saints time of possession had a lot more to do with the tail dragging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kirkwoodus13 Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 Marcel had to fight for his starting job, but Humber as just given it back , even though Milano was playing out of his mind. Players see all this foolery, they don't care about next year, they want to win now. The only reason Tyrod has not been bench is because, that would be the final straw and expose two face management intentions. They want to win on there terms. Trading for a big slow receiver in the middle of the season for a quarterback that that takes time to develope chemistry makes no sense. FYI we had two very capable receivers. How about all the haters on this board that said WOODS was not nothing special. Today I saw Sammy caught a screen pass like in his college days for a touch down. Did the bills coaches ever had the play in for him. As a young coach Mcdermet has some good qualities, he need a dose of humility and the understanding that he has done nothing as ahead coach in this league. You win with talent . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
row_33 Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 1 hour ago, RobH063 said: You guys are probably right but I just can't seem to wrap my head around such a change in effort and effectiveness. It's literally like flipping a switch. Saints really wanted the game today and did their prep work and had a game plan,  i doubt half the NFL can do that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmy10 Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 6 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:  Ahhh I got it that Dareus being traded helps the run defense as evident by the last couple weeks  I’m not sure what you’re saying. I don’t think Dareus being gone makes us any better right now, I’m just saying I have a hard time believing everybody else quit over it.  1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mat68 Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 They traded for Benjamin shortly after. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kirkwoodus13 Posted November 13, 2017 Share Posted November 13, 2017 Can we please start Milano and bring in Alexander on obvious passing situations. On third down he is out there trying to cover instead of going to get the quarterback. I will take talent over effort any day 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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