Taylor Review

[tennesseeboy]

I didn't think TT was all that bad, but there were a few factors to consider:

 

First and foremost the offensive line was awful yesterday. Too many penalties and too little blocking. On the good side I don't think the line is as bad as they seemed on Sunday, given their improvement in pre-season and game one. They definitely lost focus and showed very little discipline. The offensive line coach should maybe slap them around like he did the teenage boys in Florida and get them lean, mean and disciplined.

 

Second he did throw for three touchdowns and run for one, and playing come from behind.

 

Third we should have run the ball more. The first drive was a work of art and keeping Brady on the bench would have been a smart game plan.

 

Fourth, maybe subliminally we are comparing him to Brady....I hate Brady....but he is one hell of a quarterback. I was talking with colleagues this morning and we posited the theory that he was a second string qb at Michigan and made a deal with the devil. I want to give that more thought...but it would explain a lot. No human is that good

 

Fifth, Ryan got outcoached this time. He's got to get back to the drawing board and back on track.

 

Conclusion...TT wasn't all that bad and we should expect him to get better.

[26CornerBlitz]

‏@TyDunne

Tyrod Taylor's ball was sailing high often in Sunday's loss leading to a couple costly picks... https://vine.co/v/ePJXMJLDvZH

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

Taylor was shaky at first and finished strong. Our offense put up 32. Offensive gameplan was garbage. Defense got us in a hole early. Penalties. O-line was crap.

That's all pretty fair. Bellicheat is very good at taking away things. He basically said you'll have to beat us with Tyrod over the top. We're taking everything else away.

Edited September 21, 2015 by over 20 years of fanhood

[Buffalo Barbarian]

do you have faith in this staff to develop any of them?

 

They made EJ and TT along with Alex Smith and Kaepernick look good so yes

[truth on hold]

 

They made EJ and TT along with Alex Smith and Kaepernick look good so yes

Different HC in San Francisco. With this HC the guy who won the preseason competition doesn't even dress for games

[D. L. Hot-Flamethrower]

I didn't think TT was all that bad, but there were a few factors to consider:

 

First and foremost the offensive line was awful yesterday. Too many penalties and too little blocking. On the good side I don't think the line is as bad as they seemed on Sunday, given their improvement in pre-season and game one. They definitely lost focus and showed very little discipline. The offensive line coach should maybe slap them around like he did the teenage boys in Florida and get them lean, mean and disciplined.

 

Second he did throw for three touchdowns and run for one, and playing come from behind.

 

Third we should have run the ball more. The first drive was a work of art and keeping Brady on the bench would have been a smart game plan.

 

Fourth, maybe subliminally we are comparing him to Brady....I hate Brady....but he is one hell of a quarterback. I was talking with colleagues this morning and we posited the theory that he was a second string qb at Michigan and made a deal with the devil. I want to give that more thought...but it would explain a lot. No human is that good

 

Fifth, Ryan got outcoached this time. He's got to get back to the drawing board and back on track.

 

Conclusion...TT wasn't all that bad and we should expect him to get better.

Know what's scary? He said before the game the plan had been ready for months!

[Wing Man]

It would be great if we had our actual OL coach in practices and on the field for us, but he had to be an undisciplined moron. I wonder where the young guys get their leadership from.

[GoBills!]

My big concern for TT yesterday was ball control after the snap and moving up in the pocket to see the play... he had a hard time seeing behind the line and controlling the ball after the snap..he didnt look over the top much or in the middle to TE or Slot...lots of dumps to shady and WR 4 yards out...

[1billsfan]

Different HC in San Francisco. With this HC the guy who won the preseason competition doesn't even dress for games

 

IMO this will eventually go down as a much bigger blunder for Rex than yesterday's game. They have "their" guy starting and now they are seeing very large red flags. I hope I'm wrong, but we are all beginning to see why Taylor isn't going to be the answer. There's a reason why having success as a small QB is an extremely rare thing in the NFL. You just can't have consistency with a "seat of your pants" style of passing game. I'd give him two more games to show something. Dude's in his fifth year so there's not a ton of slack given here with that big tall fellow EJ waiting in the wings.

[Maddog69]

This thread is a drastic overreaction.

Taylor struggled quite a bit in this game, as did many of his teammates and the coaching staff.

He still made a tremendous amount of plays and if Sammy Watkins is able to come down with that last catch, would've had a chance to drive down for the game tieing score. Taylor is still learning how to be an NFL starting QB. He completed over 70 percent of his passes and helped put up over 40 points.

This was a learning experience for him for sure. I'm interested to see his future development. People expecting a guy to show up and play like Brady in his prime right out of the gate is idiotic.

 

And to the guys saying this game shows EJ should be starting, that idiotic too. Some of you will remember, I'm one of EJ biggest fans and I would be thrilled if he were the starter right now but that's not because I think Tyrod did poorly yesterday. I'm happy we have two good young QBs. Now that Tyrod is starting, I want the Bills to stick with him and let him continue to gain experience and confidence.

[Nihilarian]

So we're back to blaming poor QB play on "play calling." Look, I get it, we want Taylor to be good. Yesterday, he wasn't. He wasn't even close to being good for the majority of the game.

 

The Bills got into a huge hole yesterday primarily because of three things: Horrible discipline on ST, a D that gave up play after play in the passing game and poor QB play. TT was indecisive and looked confused for much of the day. He held the ball to long. He was inaccurate on many of his passes.

 

But, he's young and I'd stick with him for the foreseeable future because everybody has clunkers, particularly against Belichick. Hopefully TT will learn from his mistakes but to defend his play yesterday is the definition of being a homer. One can think he played poorly and still think he can turn into a good QB. These things aren't mutually exclusive.

This! to the Bold print.

 

A lot of fans are forgetting that his last TD could have easily been intercepted had the defender not jumped to early.

 

Still, the entire team was bad in so many ways, and Taylor did manage to effectively mount a decent comeback at the end of the game.

 

TBH I'm far more disappointed in the coaching, game plan then I am in the QB.

Edited September 21, 2015 by Nihilarian

[BuffaloHokie13]

A lot of fans are forgetting that his last TD could have easily been intercepted had the defender not jumped to early.

 

Still, the entire team was bad in so many ways, and Taylor did manage to effectively mount a decent comeback at the end of the game.

 

TBH I'm far more disappointed in the coaching, game plan then I am in the QB.

If we're counting that as 'should have been intercepted' then Sammy should have caught that last ball that got tipped and picked. (FWIW I don't think either would have been easy catches)

[Kirby Jackson]

Yeah, like 1, maybe 2.

 

Hardly a "certain segment". One can criticize Taylor's poor play without having an agenda. No need to be so defensive. Taylor was poor yesterday. His play didn't improve until the Bills were down by three TDs.It's just the way it is. He needs to be better than he was yesterday if the Bills want to compete this year.

Read the post above this one

[Dibs]

Read the post above this one

You obviously missed the point. Sure, there are some here that are madly in love with EJ and that drives their particular narative....but there are many like myself who would like the opportunity to discuss the relative merits/weaknesses of our starting QB without posts like your earlier one inferring that we are all rabid irrational EJ lovers.

[D. L. Hot-Flamethrower]

Pareto Analysis is a simple technique for prioritizing problem-solving work so that the first piece of work you do resolved the greatest number of problems. It's based on thePareto Principle (also known as the 80/20 Rule) – the idea that 80 percent of problems may be caused by as few as 20 percent of causes.

 

 

A. Do some on here really believe that changing QBs or focusing on TT as the cause of 80% of the teams problems is the right course of action.

 

or

 

B. Have a different agenda other than being a bills fan, like being right in your own little mind.

 

 

IMO having a better game plan on both sides of the ball would help alot more!

 

The coach's know and deserve the lion's share of the criticism for the game.

Edited September 21, 2015 by The Thurmanator

[Hapless Bills Fan]

Tyrod only got hot because it was garbage time. The Pats got so comfortable and felt so non-threatened by Taylor that they allowed him to the opportunity to scare them at the end and he took advantage. It was still garbage time though.

 

So how exactly do you define "Garbage Time"?

 

If Taylor had completed a throw to Sammy instead of an INT and we'd scored, you'd be calling it a "brilliant comeback". That's My Point.

 

"Garbage time" is really not a useful concept because it's largely defined in hindsight.

Edited September 21, 2015 by Hopeful

[26CornerBlitz]

@MatthewFairburn

Per PFF, Tyrod Taylor was under pressure on 50 percent of dropbacks against the Patriots. Tom Brady was pressured 16.4 percent of the time.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

Pareto Analysis is a simple technique for prioritizing problem-solving work so that the first piece of work you do resolved the greatest number of problems. It's based on thePareto Principle (also known as the 80/20 Rule) – the idea that 80 percent of problems may be caused by as few as 20 percent of causes.

 

A. Do some on here really believe that changing QBs or focusing on TT as the cause of 80% of the teams problems is the right course of action.

or

B. Have a different agenda other than being a bills fan, like being right in your own little mind.

 

IMO having a better game plan on both sides of the ball would help alot more!

 

Ha! Nailed it. Tyrod Taylor didn't give up a new Bills record, 466 yds passing on our D. He did throw a bad INT to Clay that resulted in good field position at the Bills 30 (that's on him) and led to a TD putting the Pats up 21-7 after we gave up 2 passes for 21 yds, and 2 runs for 7.

It would be great if we had our actual OL coach in practices and on the field for us, but he had to be an undisciplined moron. I wonder where the young guys get their leadership from.

 

Now isn't this a zinger. Too true, too true!

@MatthewFairburn

Per PFF, Tyrod Taylor was under pressure on 50 percent of dropbacks against the Patriots. Tom Brady was pressured 16.4 percent of the time.

 

He wasn't under pressure. He just held onto the ball too long like a deer in the headlights for no good reason. I read that here.

Edited September 21, 2015 by Hopeful

[Kirby Jackson]

You obviously missed the point. Sure, there are some here that are madly in love with EJ and that drives their particular narative....but there are many like myself who would like the opportunity to discuss the relative merits/weaknesses of our starting QB without posts like your earlier one inferring that we are all rabid irrational EJ lovers.

I guess the point is what do we expect? Currently our starting QB has played 2 games in his career. He has led the offense on 8 TD drives in 2 games has a QBR of 57.5 (50 is average). The game plan that he was handed yesterday was appalling and they still managed 32 points. He completed 76.6% of his passes and had 2 balls tipped where diving picks were made.Are we shocked that a guy struggled against a Belicheck defense in his 2nd career start? Go look at what others have done against Belicheck in their first few starts. What is it that we should reasonably from him after 2 games? If you think that a guy completing over 75% of his passes that has led 8 TD drives in 2 weeks isn't playing well enough I don't know what to tell you. If I told you before the start of the year that the Bills offense was going to score 4 TDs a game what would you have anticipated the record being? The QB did not play particularly well yesterday but he was not the reason for the outcome.

[Dibs]

Pareto Analysis is a simple technique for prioritizing problem-solving work so that the first piece of work you do resolved the greatest number of problems. It's based on thePareto Principle (also known as the 80/20 Rule) the idea that 80 percent of problems may be caused by as few as 20 percent of causes.

 

 

A. Do some on here really believe that changing QBs or focusing on TT as the cause of 80% of the teams problems is the right course of action.

 

or

 

B. Have a different agenda other than being a bills fan, like being right in your own little mind.

 

 

IMO having a better game plan on both sides of the ball would help alot more!

 

The coach's know and deserve the lion's share of the criticism for the game.

If this thread was about the reasons why we lost the game you would have an excellent point. As it stands however, you are pretty much saying that we can only discuss the merits of those perceived 20% of things. Personally I would like the ability to discuss all aspects of my beloved Bills on the Bills forum.

I guess the point is what do we expect? Currently our starting QB has played 2 games in his career. He has led the offense on 8 TD drives in 2 games has a QBR of 57.5 (50 is average). The game plan that he was handed yesterday was appalling and they still managed 32 points. He completed 76.6% of his passes and had 2 balls tipped where diving picks were made.Are we shocked that a guy struggled against a Belicheck defense in his 2nd career start? Go look at what others have done against Belicheck in their first few starts. What is it that we should reasonably from him after 2 games? If you think that a guy completing over 75% of his passes that has led 8 TD drives in 2 weeks isn't playing well enough I don't know what to tell you. If I told you before the start of the year that the Bills offense was going to score 4 TDs a game what would you have anticipated the record being? The QB did not play particularly well yesterday but he was not the reason for the outcome.

Here you are discussing the situation...which is great. Unfortunately your earlier post was accusing all those who wanted to discuss TT's perceived flaws as being butthurt EJ fans (sic).

[bigK14094]

Watching him closely, he did have a few high throws......the picks after Clay and Watkins got hands on the ball were, I guess, to hot to handle....so he needs to throw with a little more finess. Having said that.....he didn't make a lot of bad throws.....EJ threw a lot more bad throws in his starts the prioir two years.....I am in no way ready to go back to EJ at this point. TT has been a more accurate passer than EJ by far. I am concerned however, that he looks like Rob Johnson in there...for those of you who remember....holding the ball to long ...8 sacks is indicative of trying to hard to make plays....throw it away!!! and avoid the sack. So, TT's completion percentage is abnormally high in the sense the sacks were negative plays while passing. Anyhow, I am all for rolling with TT......

[BillsFan-4-Ever]

 

Taylor did zip after the first drive until the Pats stopped playing for real in the fourth quarter. You and I both know that EJ Manuel will start again this year because Taylor is going to play his way back to the bench.

 

The NFL is not built for small QBs who need throwing windows to see. It's built for big and tall QBs to see and hit their targets on time. Unfortunately, the only Bills QB that size and who did that this preseason wasn't even dressed for the game.

say what? The Cheatriots stopped playing for real? They went for it on 4th and 1 with a 2 score lead. That is not playing for real? WOW

 

Unlike the last game of the season they never let the foot off of the gas.

[D. L. Hot-Flamethrower]

If this thread was about the reasons why we lost the game you would have an excellent point. As it stands however, you are pretty much saying that we can only discuss the merits of those perceived 20% of things. Personally I would like the ability to discuss all aspects of my beloved Bills on the Bills forum.

 

Here you are discussing the situation...which is great. Unfortunately your earlier post was accusing all those who wanted to discuss TT's perceived flaws as being butthurt EJ fans (sic).

No problem discuss away

[MarkAF43]

Just throwing this out there cause I've seen some people use the term garbage time or when the game was out of reach. For the Bills when you're losing like that it's not "garbage" time. It's the teams job to score points and that's what the offense did. It didn't matter if the pats**** continued to press or back off on defense it's TT and the offense's job to put up points and they did.

[BillsFan-4-Ever]

Lets see how TT snaps back from the 2 INT, multi sack and fumbling game. It is only hos second NFL start (unofficially as MC took the starting snap last week)

[billsfan89]

Taylor looked over-matched and severely limited till the last few drives when Roman opened up the offense and McCoy got going a bit as well. Overall I liked how he snapped back throwing that TD to Sammy. You can claim that the first two TD drives were pseudo garbage time against a soft defense that was up 37-13. But at 37-25 with about 4 minutes left the Pats* were for sure trying to stop the Bills and close that game out. Not only did the Bills drive up for a TD to make it a 5 point game but they did it with two plays and a quick strike. That drive gave the Bills a legit shot to win that game. Hell they actually had the ball with some time left (1:36 not a whole lot of time but enough time) and down 8 points. So overall there were some positives in that late push even if it ended in undramatic fashion.

[Kirby Jackson]

If this thread was about the reasons why we lost the game you would have an excellent point. As it stands however, you are pretty much saying that we can only discuss the merits of those perceived 20% of things. Personally I would like the ability to discuss all aspects of my beloved Bills on the Bills forum.

 

Here you are discussing the situation...which is great. Unfortunately your earlier post was accusing all those who wanted to discuss TT's perceived flaws as being butthurt EJ fans (sic).

Go back and read all of my posts on the topic. I believe that a lot of people want to pin it on Tyrod because he wasn't the guy that they wanted. However, I supported my thoughts with stats.

Lets see how TT snaps back from the 2 INT, multi sack and fumbling game. It is only hos second NFL start (unofficially as MC took the starting snap last week)

Good thoughts bf4e. There was some good and some bad. We will see what happens from here.

[Dibs]

Taylor looked over-matched and severely limited till the last few drives when Roman opened up the offense and McCoy got going a bit as well. Overall I liked how he snapped back throwing that TD to Sammy. You can claim that the first two TD drives were pseudo garbage time against a soft defense that was up 37-13. But at 37-25 with about 4 minutes left the Pats* were for sure trying to stop the Bills and close that game out. Not only did the Bills drive up for a TD to make it a 5 point game but they did it with two plays and a quick strike. That drive gave the Bills a legit shot to win that game. Hell they actually had the ball with some time left (1:36 not a whole lot of time but enough time) and down 8 points. So overall there were some positives in that late push even if it ended in undramatic fashion.

I don't think that Roman suddenly opened up the offense. I think perhaps it was TT who stepped up towards the end of the game and started throwing a couple of the type of passes that earlier in the game was unwilling to throw(instead opting to either check down or scramble). Above everything else he brings to the table, this concept gives me hope for his future as the Bills QB.

[thewildrabbit]

The QB wasn't the biggest problem from what I saw. Yea he did play poorly quite a bit yesterday, and did some good things too.

 

I'm far more concerned about the defense that looked so good most of last year, and allowing a new franchise record for passing with 466 yards from Brady. The Bills defense is currently ranked 30th in the NFL right now.

[TSOL]

The best way to negate the type of defense NE played yesterday would be some quick inside slants that burn the opposing D and force them to quit bringing everyone in various passing lanes through the middle. I know Tyrod has been billed as smart, that he can grasp Romans extensive playbook. But sometimes simpler is better. Mastering two or three very quick release inside passes, timing type plays could go a long way next time a team trys to defend us the way NE did. Or could go a long way next time we play NE.

 

We don't need 9 million plays in our playbook, they just need to master a few super effective plays that do not allow a defense to throw 8 guys on the line of scrimmage. Tyrod, and our offensive line were obviously confused early in the game partially by NE's pressure and partially by our own play calling. A fullback in the backfield would have been helpful to pick up some of those inside blitzes, a tight end to chip a block and release, and two receivers, to run fast short inside slants. Nothing fancy, just more back to basic offensive principles. I could see Taylor being successful with that type of offense.

[Dibs]

Go back and read all of my posts on the topic. I believe that a lot of people want to pin it on Tyrod because he wasn't the guy that they wanted. However, I supported my thoughts with stats.

....

 

I did that Kirby....and I figure you were a little hot under the collar with your initial comments.....but they happened.

 

You stated:

The most inevitable thread ever.......If a segment of the fanbase wasn't so butthurt that their guy didn't win the job we wouldn't have these conversations.....

 

I regret not starting a TT thread myself(which I did consider doing as there was no discussion thread on TT for several hours after the match). I chose not to start one because I didn't feel like being attacked by some of my fellow Bills fans directly after a bad loss.

 

My point is that these conversations certainly would happen regardless of whether the EJ fans are butthurt or not because there are many non-EJ lovers who have strong concerns over aspects of TT's game.

[Agent 91]

You cannot sustain offense like that on any consistent basis and there are no old running QB's in the NFL. He'll never last trying to make his living like that.

So whats the point. He is a running qb. Thats just telling someone else to ntplaybto their strengths. He is a runner. And yesterday he had a few chances to take off... a few times he was about to take off and then something held him back. He needs to diagnose the situations better and either get the ball out or scramble

[Hanoverbills]

Watching him closely, he did have a few high throws......the picks after Clay and Watkins got hands on the ball were, I guess, to hot to handle....so he needs to throw with a little more finess. Having said that.....he didn't make a lot of bad throws.....EJ threw a lot more bad throws in his starts the prioir two years.....I am in no way ready to go back to EJ at this point. TT has been a more accurate passer than EJ by far. I am concerned however, that he looks like Rob Johnson in there...for those of you who remember....holding the ball to long ...8 sacks is indicative of trying to hard to make plays....throw it away!!! and avoid the sack. So, TT's completion percentage is abnormally high in the sense the sacks were negative plays while passing. Anyhow, I am all for rolling with TT......

TT has been in the NFL five years. So because he is not a first round draft choice it is Ok for him to throw high.

Edited September 21, 2015 by Hanoverbills

[alluro]

Unfortunately - I think we saw the real Tyrod today. He was nothing at VaTech. Did nothing at Baltimore and did nothing today. I hope I am wrong- but I think Tyrod played over his head in limited action in pre season and against the Colts last week. He looked like a third string QB when it counted for mos of the game today. Maybe we can blame it on the coaching and game plan but if was bad today. Let's see what happens next week in Miami.

 

How can you say being named ACC player of the year over a guy named Russell Wilson (and EJ Manuel) "nothing"? Rushing for more yards in college than Mike Vick? Taylor was an exceptional collegiate player.

[Dorkington]

>70% completion percentage, ~9ypa, 103 Rating... I'm not ready to bench the kid yet. He struggled at times, but that happens... even HoFers have bad games, and Tyrod's game wasn't all that bad. Take those tip-INTs away, and we're looking at something different. Sometimes the ball bounces in our favor, sometimes not. On to Miami!

[FireChan]

#BringBackEJ #TheEJConspiracy #TheEJIdentity #TheEJUltimatum #TheEJSupremacy

[Lurker]

Ignore the homers Trolls!

While you can have your fun today, it's time to start moving on (to the ignore user list, if need be).

 

This team is neither as good as it showed in the Indy game nor as bad as it showed against the Pats. We'll have to wait bit longer to get a better read, starting with the Fins game this week...

[Kirby Jackson]

 

I did that Kirby....and I figure you were a little hot under the collar with your initial comments.....but they happened.

 

You stated:

 

I regret not starting a TT thread myself(which I did consider doing as there was no discussion thread on TT for several hours after the match). I chose not to start one because I didn't feel like being attacked by some of my fellow Bills fans directly after a bad loss.

 

My point is that these conversations certainly would happen regardless of whether the EJ fans are butthurt or not because there are many non-EJ lovers who have strong concerns over aspects of TT's game.

Fair enough, but look at the people with the most "concerns" in this thread and then go back a month. Read their thoughts from then and try to differentiate the 2. The people involved in this thread (in many cases) have been waiting a month to throw out the "I told you so." I simply responded by saying the guy is completing 75% of his passes, has led 8 scoring drives and has played above average (using QBR). He isn't the problem right now but a certain group wants him to be. The defense has been atrocious, scheme was pathetic and they committed a ton of penalties. 4 TDs a game should be enough for this team to compete for championships but instead they are .500.

[Rico]

 

IMO this will eventually go down as a much bigger blunder for Rex than yesterday's game. They have "their" guy starting and now they are seeing very large red flags. I hope I'm wrong, but we are all beginning to see why Taylor isn't going to be the answer. There's a reason why having success as a small QB is an extremely rare thing in the NFL. You just can't have consistency with a "seat of your pants" style of passing game. I'd give him two more games to show something. Dude's in his fifth year so there's not a ton of slack given here with that big tall fellow EJ waiting in the wings.

EJ would have to go thru Cassel first though. Looks more & more to be the case with each week he doesn't dress.

 

Rough game for TT going up against the fired-up World Champs in only his 2nd career start, but I'm impressed by the way he came back & didn't quit. A lot of people were loving playing the Pats at home in Week 2 because BB wouldn't have a lot of gamefilm to watch. Looking back now, I think we would've been better off playing them later after this O & TT had more time to come together. I do think they will look a whole lot better the next time we play them in NE.

[Dibs]

Fair enough, but look at the people with the most "concerns" in this thread and then go back a month. Read their thoughts from then and try to differentiate the 2. The people involved in this thread (in many cases) have been waiting a month to throw out the "I told you so." I simply responded by saying the guy is completing 75% of his passes, has led 8 scoring drives and has played above average (using QBR). He isn't the problem right now but a certain group wants him to be. The defense has been atrocious, scheme was pathetic and they committed a ton of penalties. 4 TDs a game should be enough for this team to compete for championships but instead they are .500.

Yeah, just please be careful not to tar everyone with the same brush.

 

My biggest concern with TT, and has been all through preseason, is that he hasn't shown that he is capable of pulling the trigger on downfield throws from the pocket....at least not at a regular enough rate. When the Pats were stifling our offense through most of the game(keying the run and underneath routes), this ability from TT was sorely needed.

 

I am hopeful that it is a confidence thing(and not a skill thing) and TT will quickly develop....but if he doesn't he will not make it as a longterm QB starter in the league IMO.