DJasper Probincrux III Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Some thoughts. There is plenty of surface parking within the same radius that people currently walk. The last lot at ecc is far and people already do that. Tailgating will look different but it will be fine. Access will be no better or worse than rws. Rws only has a couple main ways in and out. At some point youre on abbott southwestern big tree or milestrip already. The perry projects are gone regardless of what they choose. Iirc they are largely vacant already, the Ohio street site will require infrastructure that will run right through there. Plus if youre looking for private development you dont drop 750m right next to public housing. If only because its a massive piece of undevelopable property right in the middle of everything. A convention center will be folded into the project, if they choose cobblestone it could span south park ave and connect directly to the fnc, and thus harbor ctr as well. Philadelphia convention ctr does this to cut across the city witbout cutting off the grid like the current convention ctr does. I dont mean a walkway either, convention space spans several streets. They could then demo the current ctr and restore the grid to reopen that side of downtown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkAF43 Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 I'm not sure I follow the logic that the main reason to oppose a downtown stadium is the impact on tailgating. I'm a season ticket holder so I understand how it is at the Ralph now. But this can't be the main reason we wouldn't use a downtown stadium. The whole idea of a stadium downtown isn't just for the Buffalo Bills. It's for the continuing development of the city of Buffalo. It's for making the city a better place with more to do and see. As much as I love the Ralph for all that it is, I'm not at all opposed to a stadium in the proposed sites. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJasper Probincrux III Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Also, no matter what, Miami st needs to be renamed immediately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Interesting. The NFL insists that stadiums are built north and south, so sunlight doesn't effect the games, like getting in players eyes. The Cobblestone one, IIRC, looked to be east and west, that's why it would have to be a dome. http://www.omgfacts.com/lists/10369/NFL-Stadiums-have-to-be-built-North-to-South Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordong Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 There's plenty of space in the First Ward and Larkenville. Don't be so dramatic. We'll agree to disagree that the great thing about an opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLFan Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Throwing more money into Orchard Park is just good money after bad at this point. Not a realistic option. I'm not sure I follow the logic that the main reason to oppose a downtown stadium is the impact on tailgating. I'm a season ticket holder so I understand how it is at the Ralph now. But this can't be the main reason we wouldn't use a downtown stadium. The whole idea of a stadium downtown isn't just for the Buffalo Bills. It's for the continuing development of the city of Buffalo. It's for making the city a better place with more to do and see. As much as I love the Ralph for all that it is, I'm not at all opposed to a stadium in the proposed sites. Agreed. As great an environment for the fans that The Ralph has proved to be, locating the stadium there ranks as one of the two worst development decision of all time in Buffalo. The other being the Amherst location of the new ÜB campus. The same mistake can simply not be made again. That money needs to be invested in Buffalo, for the long term economic health of the region as a whole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hammered a Lot Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 Well I read the 141 page study. One very important issue not reported was the crime factor. My buddy Rick and I went to a Bills vs Colts game walked around a corner and saw a guy being robbed at gun point. Point being there was a study done concerning safety around stadiums. The neighborhood around the Ralph is rated second safest. Parking is cheap around the Ralph. Buffalo lots can charge upto $60 per car and with the lots controlled by a few what do you think you will pay to park? Orchard Park Chief of Police said since one way exit traffic started on Big Tree Road traffic clears out 40 minutes faster. I been downtown after FNC events (19,000) people) One hour stuck in the crawling traffic, 60,000 people ...... Gov Cuomo said during his election campaign no state money to be used for a new stadium, renovations money ???, in the end it's the Pegulas decision how much they want to spend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pimp 2 Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 New Orleans is not sterile. Thank you!!! Neither is St. Louis, Indy or Atlanta! Having a roof allows for year round use of the facility from an economic standpoint. Plus it may have a positive impact on potential free agents NOT thrilled about playing in adverse conditions that may affect their performance goals...some legit, some NOT but it is what it is! Cobblestone site is #1 IMO, it offers the easy access for those using the rail line, amtrax (adaptable) and tailgating (once parking structures are built + using existing available parking). Just imagine when Pegulaville & Canalside is truly up & running, that area would be rocking for when tourists come to town for any venue...small business owners can really capitalize & grow. Time for this region to step up, IMO. We've survived some of the most idiotic planning in the past (too many to list), the reason for our 2nd rate complex that we experience currently !!! Let's do the right thing !!! Go Bills & Let's Go Buff-alo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 Because you're limiting usage opportunties. For the most bang for the buck, you want to bring in revenue producers more than 8-10 times a year like the Ralph.Hmmm I wondering if there is anything else you can do with a stadium that has an outdoor field....I guess no combine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbb Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 Doesn't the Ralph run East-West? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 Hmmm I wondering if there is anything else you can do with a stadium that has an outdoor field.... I guess no combine. Knowing the Pegulas I could see them bidding for the NFL Combine. They already pried the NHL Combine away from Toronto with Harborcenter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRAWNDO Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 Another way to protect tailgating might be to use the Buffalo Belt Line, a RR Line which runs around the city. Satellite Parking Lots with attached stations could be used for tailgating and then fans could be transported via rail cars to the stadium. The lots could have to be enclosed with security patrols for safety purposes. http://buffalorising.com/2012/12/the-buffalo-belt-line/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haven Moses Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 I'm sure some smart investor will buy a lot and create a place for tailgating. Geez. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 (edited) I think the cobblestone site is best in that you will have a contiguous cluster/core of attractions(FNC, RWS, Canalside including Children's Museum and whatever else is planned for the old Aud site, HarborCenter, Courtyard by Marriott, Naval Park, Casino), which you can then build out from there as needed. I think this is a much better option than the Exchange or South Park options which puts RWS a greater distance from previous mentioned "core". Edited January 19, 2015 by LabattBlue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 Is there really any belief they'll eventually do anything other than the Cobblestone site? It makes too much sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 the Pegulas put out a statement that basically said "thanks but we got this"... making this study a waste of time and money Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 the Pegulas put out a statement that basically said "thanks but we got this"... making this study a waste of time and money LOL I got that too...Kim basically saying "we haven't had a chance to read the study" as a nice way of letting everyone know they aren't concerned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 LOL I got that too...Kim basically saying "we haven't had a chance to read the study" as a nice way of letting everyone know they aren't concerned. Don't underestimate the political clowns at the city, county and state level to either !@#$ this up, or at the very least bring it to a crawl until they get their chance to be in front of the cameras Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Optometric Insight Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 I personally would love to see something like what they've done in Pittsburgh, they have the some of the most beautiful stadiums with great lookouts there for their baseball and football teams, the atmosphere was electric before the Pirates game (the few times I've been downtown, it's been pretty dead and quiet, other than when it was the Taste of Buffalo) and I just liked how they have Heinz Field and PNC Park close to each other. Over all it was very aesthetically pleasing. I would prefer a stadium because they look better, especially in a city, but I doubt they build one, it's just way more practical to build a dome and there are lots of cool things you could do inside of it. But, in the end, just build something that isn't a gigantic eyesore for the city. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbb Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 PNC Park is heaven on earth. I wish we could emulate that somehow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Optometric Insight Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 PNC Park is heaven on earth. I wish we could emulate that somehow. isn't it? What makes PNC Park is the view so unless they jazz up the skyway or get some fancy new buildings for the Buffalo Skyline it'll be tough to come close. Too bad the falls is out, because that would have been a beauty of a stadium/view combo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike in Horseheads Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 isn't it? What makes PNC Park is the view so unless they jazz up the skyway or get some fancy new buildings for the Buffalo Skyline it'll be tough to come close. Too bad the falls is out, because that would have been a beauty of a stadium/view combo. I always find the thought there is land in NF, next to the falls to be ridiculous. There is a state park, it's going nowhere despite it self. Most often land mentioned was behind the Casino. The only pictures would still be the canned footage we see when the Bills play in OP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 It would be cool if they find a way to rip out that damn skyway when they start work on a new stadium. Pipe dream, I know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 (edited) http://www.bizjournals.com/buffalo/news/2014/12/08/pegulas-open-up-about-vision-for-one-buffalo.html?page=2 And here, snug between the arena and the ballpark …Here is where Benson stopped drawing, tapping his pen to a blank spot and looking up. "If the stadium is right here," said the confidant whom Terry Pegula dispatched to Buffalo to help execute his vision, not so much for the team as for the city, "then you can tie all of that together under the theory that as those assets are developed, other people will come invest. I would assume that is the parking areas to the east of the Harbor Center? Edited January 19, 2015 by May Day 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbb Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 isn't it? What makes PNC Park is the view so unless they jazz up the skyway or get some fancy new buildings for the Buffalo Skyline it'll be tough to come close. Too bad the falls is out, because that would have been a beauty of a stadium/view combo. It's one of my favorite places in the world. That view from the third base side as sun sets is the best! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 looks like the city already owns most of the land at the south park site. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rumblefish Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 Play the games in a parking lot, after all , that's what bullies do, don't they? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8-8 Forever? Posted January 19, 2015 Share Posted January 19, 2015 (edited) Watch and see it will end up like the Minnesota Vikings Dome. No tailgating, hugely expensive parking and long walks to get the stadium. that's the tradeoff for a downtown stadium.. do you want the stadium in the city or not? If the city, the whole tailgating on the grass thing goes away and you get real NFL prices.. gotta give something to get something. I say delay the stadium as long as possible. the ralph is totally unique Edited January 19, 2015 by 8and8Forever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbb Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 I agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiberius Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 I like the one down on Ohio street. That area could probably handle traffic and parking the best and have a nice background with the lake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
powerbroker Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 An open air stadium on the leeward side of Lake Erie? Design would need some big wind screens, RWS is four miles inland...I think it needs a lid on it. Of the 135 million dollar refresh on RWS the State and County put up 95 million of it. I don't know if they want to talk about putting a shovel in the ground for a new stadium at this point. I just hope a new stadium doesn't come with $2000.00 dollar PSL's and huge increases in ticket prices that keeps the average fan from being able to afford it. Enjoy The Ralph while you can, because a new stadium will come with a different game day experience and possibly the loss of the 12th man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hammered a Lot Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 that's the tradeoff for a downtown stadium.. do you want the stadium in the city or not? If the city, the whole tailgating on the grass thing goes away and you get real NFL prices.. gotta give something to get something. I say delay the stadium as long as possible. the ralph is totally unique My unbiased opinion is save a half billion dollars and retro the Ralph. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 Related topic. Thoughts? http://www.ubbullrun.com/2015/1/19/7834685/buffalo-bills-new-stadium-could-be-a-boon-for-university-at-buffalo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 (edited) Related topic. Thoughts? http://www.ubbullrun.com/2015/1/19/7834685/buffalo-bills-new-stadium-could-be-a-boon-for-university-at-buffalo There are a lot of things in there I disagree with and I think a lot of his/her numbers aren't well calculated... But as far as the UB stuff. You have to wonder what the future holds for that program. They would make a great Pitt-like tenant if they could get into a better conference. I do not think the American or Big10 would scoff at the WNY media market. I would also think this "One Buffalo" thing would love a higher profile NCAA Football program to have in the fold, especially if they play Penn State. The big question is will people support it and come out? Watch on TV? Its questionable. Certainly not with the existing stadium. That place makes football unwatchable. I like the MAC and cant stomach it. I also dont think the Bills having inaccessible pricing (if it happens to that degree) would trickle common fans to the Bulls. It would have to be a much bigger reason than just that, and Im not sure if Buffalo would support NCAA football... (I certainly would). The Leafs are really expensive... but you see the Marlies struggle with attendance as well as the OHL teams there (one just skipped town for North Bay). I wonder if they would do a dry run or 2 at a new facility. Like a neutral site game between Penn State and Syracuse or something of that sort to gauge how people would receive "real" NCAA football. Edited January 20, 2015 by May Day 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwight in philly Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 My unbiased opinion is save a half billion dollars and retro the Ralph. no argument there.. agree 100 per-cent.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heitz Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 Can we please get this locked in so I can quit my job, move back to Buffalo and open a little spot downtown for my "retirement"? Exciting times for Buffalo... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddaryl Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 (edited) My unbiased opinion is save a half billion dollars and retro the Ralph. that would be a complete waste of an opportunity to improve economic development in the city. There is close to zero economic development around the Ralph and that is after 40 years. Not moving the stadium to the city would just be a real bone headed decision. The economic development that will occur around the stadium will do more for the city and state then going cheap and keeping it in Orchard Park Edited January 20, 2015 by ddaryl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfanmiami(oh) Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 You are going to see a different tailgating experience. There will still be some traditional tailgating but it will be more bars and restaurants. It will be similar to a Cleveland. I fear the days of fires in garbage cans are coming to an end. This makes me sad. As an out of town season ticket holder I would potentially attend less games if that was the case. I don't want a hockey game atmosphere, I want tailgating. I want to bring my own beer and cook my own food an potentially stay over in my RV if I choose. I understand the NFL is changing and if that's going to be the price of keeping the Bills in town, so be it. I just hope the Pegulas come up with some kind of "best of both worlds" type scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted January 20, 2015 Share Posted January 20, 2015 This makes me sad. As an out of town season ticket holder I would potentially attend less games if that was the case. I don't want a hockey game atmosphere, I want tailgating. I want to bring my own beer and cook my own food an potentially stay over in my RV if I choose. I understand the NFL is changing and if that's going to be the price of keeping the Bills in town, so be it. I just hope the Pegulas come up with some kind of "best of both worlds" type scenario.I would think that the RV tradition will stay. I would be shocked though if the Bills didn't try to regulate the pregame alcohol intake and get a larger cut of that $. It seems to kill 2 birds with one stone and I would be really, really surprised if that isn't what they do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerme1 Posted January 21, 2015 Share Posted January 21, 2015 I have always been on the side of putting it in the Perry St Projects. I think that the South Park proposal is the winner of the four suggestions by far. You still get to knock those crappy buildings down. And of the four sites the most red dots labelled potential development are on that site :-) I believe if we're doing this and it will carry an economic impact, that site wins by a mile. Oh and it may be the only one downtown that could accommodate some tailgating and some rv lots if it's done right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts