NFL Week #9 - 11/6/2022 - The Bills at the (NJ) Jets - Post Game thread

[BillsFan130]

Just now, UKBillFan said:

The offense’s chances? The defense got the ball back and we promptly returned it to the Jets.

The offence sucked today, that’s besides the point.

 

“Got the ball back” was also after a 9 minute drive, so that ties in with what im saying 

[Boatdrinks]

1 minute ago, BillsFan130 said:

I hate the “they only gave up” argument.

 

Ok they let up 20 points.

 

three, 8 minute drives.

 

So of course that will limit the Jets scoring cause you’re content on letting them gash you with clock, but also you’re limiting the offences chances.

 

I would rather them play more aggressive and give up 24 points without those killer 7-8 minute drives against them

They did only give up 20 and Allen wasn’t good. That’s just enough to get you beat. I’d prefer to play more aggressive D vs QBs like Wilson because he isn’t very good. Pressure him and he’ll make mistakes. Lots of them. The passive D combined with Allen’s poor performance allowed the Jets to stick with a run game and not worry about time or keeping up. Bills should have gotten extremely aggressive on D in second half to generate big plays and takeaway opportunities . 

[UKBillFan]

Just now, BillsFan130 said:

The offence sucked today, that’s besides the point.

 

“Got the ball back” was also after a 9 minute drive, so that ties in with what im saying 

Therefore the offense needed to do the same. What was the score at the point? 17-10? Burn the clock, dink and dunk, keep the defense off the field and getting a proper break. I think the final drive by the Jets was because the defense was gassed. 
 

We were down Hyde, Milano, Poyer, White and, for much of the second half, Rousseau. The almost fully fit offense needed to help them out.

[Boatdrinks]

2 minutes ago, UKBillFan said:

The offense’s chances? The defense got the ball back and we promptly returned it to the Jets.

The Bills D got one takeaway , way below the Jets usual performance on Offense. 

[BillsFan130]

1 minute ago, Boatdrinks said:

They did only give up 20 and Allen wasn’t good. That’s just enough to get you beat. I’d prefer to play more aggressive D vs QBs like Wilson because he isn’t very good. Pressure him and he’ll make mistakes. Lots of them. The passive D combined with Allen’s poor performance allowed the Jets to stick with a run game and not worry about time or keeping up. Bills should have gotten extremely aggressive on D in second half to generate big plays and takeaway opportunities . 

Ya exactly.

 

Like if they have this game plan/outcome on defence against the chiefs, I’m thrilled with it.

 

But to run a bend but don’t break defence against Zack Wilson who is horrible under pressure is just inexcusable.

[UKBillFan]

Just now, Boatdrinks said:

The Bills D got one takeaway , way below the Jets usual performance on Offense. 

And conceded 20 points, seven of those where the offense - well, Josh - basically handed them field position on a plate.

[Bob in STL]

4 minutes ago, QLBillsFan said:

Interception by Edmunds? Should we have challenged? At one point the Jets TE has arms extended on his back while 49 has the ball, then grabs for possession. May have been too hard to overturn? Just such a big play. 

 

No way you challenge.  Not enough on film to overturn it.  The call on the field has priority and by rule, the offense wins in a simultaneous possession. 

  

[BillsFan130]

1 minute ago, UKBillFan said:

Therefore the offense needed to do the same. What was the score at the point? 17-10? Burn the clock, dink and dunk, keep the defense off the field and getting a proper break. I think the final drive by the Jets was because the defense was gassed. 
 

We were down Hyde, Milano, Poyer, White and, for much of the second half, Rousseau. The almost fully fit offense needed to help them out.

The offence let them down sir, we are in agreement there.

 

The bills shouldn’t be playing a time of possession game against the Jets though.. 

 

Thats what underdogs want, not 11 point favourites 

[henry jones]

5 minutes ago, Bob in STL said:

 

Giving up 20 on the road should have given us a win.   You could argue that the defense gave up 13 points and 7 points are directly related to the second Allen interception.   The offense does not sustain one single drive after their first 3 possessions.   The offense refuses to run, and lately they stopped throwing the much higher percentage short passes.  

 

Big plays happen when you can consistently make small plays, causing the opponents defense to cheat on what you are doing. 

 

The last two weeks Josh has checked down much less than he has in previous games.  They are throwing deep more, and they are not hitting the long ball enough to warrant that.  Take away his running game today and you have a guy with a 51.9 QBR.  

 

Final comment - if Josh is trying to make big plays, then he should target Diggs more.  Diggs was a forgotten man in the second half.  

Again…I never said Josh is blameless. He sucked as well as the game plan.  The defense hasn’t been helping.  Can’t score 50 every week

[UKBillFan]

1 minute ago, BillsFan130 said:

The offence let them down sir, we are in agreement there.

 

The bills shouldn’t be playing a time of possession game against the Jets though.. 

 

Thats what underdogs want, not 11 point favourites 

But that works both ways. If the offense dinked, dunked and burned the clock then we’re on control. It feels like we’ve abandoned that approach since the bye.

[henry jones]

6 minutes ago, CoudyBills said:

They gave up 20 to the chiefs

Yep.  Duh.  The Chiefs actually have a dynamic offense.  

[SoCal Deek]

8 minutes ago, henry jones said:

Can’t expect to score 50 every game.  The defense played admirably against a good KC offense.  Then put up back to back stinkers against terrible offensive teams.  Josh sucked today, but it’s not all on him

Sorry….but this was pretty much all in him. Today, anyway. 

[Royale with Cheese]

8 minutes ago, CoudyBills said:

They gave up 20 to the chiefs

Is 20 to the Chiefs not good?

[UKBillFan]

Just now, henry jones said:

Again…I never said Josh is blameless. He sucked as well as the game plan.  The defense hasn’t been helping.  Can’t score 50 every week

We didn’t need to score 50. Twenty one would have been enough.

 

 

[newcam2012]

1 minute ago, Boatdrinks said:

Can’t argue with it too much right now. It’s a problem because Allen looking human makes the Bills average to even slightly below at times. 

What sounds the alarm bells even more is the defense. They look to be very bad at stopping the run which was a clear strength early on. Also, teams are throwing the ball quickly and negating the Bills pass rush. The Bills defense is built to keep plays in front of them. The young secondary is getting exposed on short quick routes whether it's slants, screens, or quick outs. 

 

The Bills offense is out of sync. Thus far, Diggs is the only reliable offensive player on the team. The oline is just not that good. Thus far, teams are pressuring Allen and he's making mistakes. Frankly. Allen is making mistakes even when the pocket is clean. His vision and mechanics are way off now. Allen is the least of my worries. I think he will bounce back. However, the team needs to make adjustments on various levels and execute. 

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

The entire team absolutely sucked today but you punt that ball inside their 10, you absolutely do not let them score on that drive. Jesus Christ we should have had the ball back at midfield. Not only did we not, they ran the clock out and scored. That’s inexcusable. The offense was terrible but it was Zach Wilson. Get a ***** stop. 20 points to that offense isn’t good. Get up and make a stop with the game on the line 

[BillsFan130]

1 minute ago, UKBillFan said:

But that works both ways. If the offense dinked, dunked and burned the clock then we’re on control. It feels like we’ve abandoned that approach since the bye.

I guess we will agree to disagree.

 

When I’m the heavy favourite, I want as many possessions as possible and I want to challenge them into a shoot out, not a ground and pound time of possession game

 

 

[UKBillFan]

1 minute ago, Brianmoorman4jesus said:

The entire team absolutely sucked today but you punt that ball inside their 10, you absolutely do not let them score on that drive. Jesus Christ we should have had the ball back at midfield. Not only did we not, they ran the clock out and scored. That’s inexcusable. The offense was terrible but it was Zach Wilson. Get a ***** stop. 20 points to that offense isn’t good. Get up and make a stop with the game on the line 

13 in reality. Not sure I really blame the defense for the touch down after the second INT.

[henry jones]

4 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

Sorry….but this was pretty much all in him. Today, anyway. 

I mean, no, but ok

[UKBillFan]

Just now, BillsFan130 said:

I guess we will agree to disagree.

 

When I’m the heavy favourite, I want as many possessions as possible and I want to challenge them into a shoot out, not a ground and pound time of possession game

 

 

But if Josh is off, as he was, then adapt. The only way we were going to win was pound and ground; don’t be too proud or egotistical to take it.

[henry jones]

4 minutes ago, UKBillFan said:

We didn’t need to score 50. Twenty one would have been enough.

 

 

Good grief.  Can’t fix stupid

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

If our top 10 picked DT could make a game changing play when needed most.

 

Hate away. I'm right, and you all know it.

[SoCal Deek]

Just now, henry jones said:

I mean, no, but ok

It’s OK…it happens. I’m pretty sure Josh isn’t reading any of these posts. He was way below average today. 

[muppy]

1 hour ago, muppy said:

my confidence is not as high in any game without Poyer and Milano on defense. As far as Josh is concerned oh My .... *cringe* Knowing him he wont be kept out of a game unless its really bad. We shall see.

in retrospect I wonder what has caused #17 to misjudge the plays he has chosen to throw and had picked. Is he indeed not realizing the coverages or is it something more.  He wants to perform at a high level at least as much as we fans do. If Not More.

[UKBillFan]

Just now, henry jones said:

Good grief.  Can’t fix stupid

What a lovely intelligent reply.

 

Tell me, where has anyone said we should score 50 every game?

[Nihilarian]

10 minutes ago, JerseyBills said:

The D is fine 

We gave up 20 points on the road with 2 terrible to's

 

We gave up 17 last week 

 

Our offense scored 20 points in the last 6 Quarters

 

They're the issue and it's getting concerning 

 

👍

 

The season the NY Giants won the SB with Phil Simms at QB in 1986. They went up to Seattle and lost 12-17 with both teams 5-2 at that time....Simms sacked 7x and threw 4 INTs.

 

Stuff happens and it's why they say on "any given Sunday".

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  

[BillsFan130]

2 minutes ago, UKBillFan said:

But if Josh is off, as he was, then adapt. The only way we were going to win was pound and ground; don’t be too proud or egotistical to take it.

That’s a fair point on the offensive side.

 

I still don’t like the defensive game plan at all though in terms of being passive 

[GolfandBills]

8 minutes ago, Brianmoorman4jesus said:

The entire team absolutely sucked today but you punt that ball inside their 10, you absolutely do not let them score on that drive. Jesus Christ we should have had the ball back at midfield. Not only did we not, they ran the clock out and scored. That’s inexcusable. The offense was terrible but it was Zach Wilson. Get a ***** stop. 20 points to that offense isn’t good. Get up and make a stop with the game on the line 

Considering Allen gifted them 7 points with his interception inside the Jets 20 the defense didn’t lose that game.  

[newcam2012]

12 minutes ago, Ya Digg? said:

Do you honestly think teams going into games thinking they can’t win? Of course every team is “beatable.” No team is going into a game saying “well, let’s just kill these next 3 hours.” These are professional athletes, this isn’t high school or college-I’m honestly not sure this game did much either way as to how teams view the Bills. They just may have a better idea of what to do to try and beat them 

I think you are taking things out of context. Of course teams play to win and belief they can if they execute and the other team (if a lot better) plays poorly. I think that dominate teams have a psychological effects on less talented teams. I don't think you can under estimate the mindset of a player. It's often why good teams win close games and vice versa. Take today's game as an example. Couldn't you feel that the young Jets started to believe they could and would win? How confident were you that Allen would led the team to a game winning TD? 

 

In summary, the Bills psychological edge has been diminished greatly. Maybe I'm wrong but that's how I feel. 

[UKBillFan]

Just now, Nihilarian said:

👍

 

The season the NY Giants won the SB with Phil Simms at QB in 1986. They went up to Seattle and lost 12-17 with both teams 5-2 at that time....Simms sacked 7x and threw 4 INTs.

 

Stuff happens and it's why they say on "any given Sunday".

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

  

As said elsewhere, the Bucs faced the Saints at home and got turned over 38-3 in 2020. One game doesn’t make a season. The worrying thing is the trends on both sides of the ball carried over from the back end of the Packers game into this one. I have some sympathy for the defense considering who was missing; none for the offense.

2 minutes ago, BillsFan130 said:

That’s a fair point on the offensive side.

 

I still don’t like the defensive game plan at all though in terms of being passive 

On defense some of it was passivity but, like against the Packers, some of it was execution. How many tackles did we miss today?

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

1 minute ago, UKBillFan said:

As said elsewhere, the Bucs faced the Saints at home and got turned over 38-3 in 2020. One game doesn’t make a season. The worrying thing is the trends on both sides of the ball carried over from the back end of the Packers game into this one. I have some sympathy for the defense considering who was missing; none for the offense.

On defense some of it was passivity but, like against the Packers, some of it was execution. How many tackles did we miss today?

Dozens 

[BillsFan130]

1 minute ago, UKBillFan said:

As said elsewhere, the Bucs faced the Saints at home and got turned over 38-3 in 2020. One game doesn’t make a season. The worrying thing is the trends on both sides of the ball carried over from the back end of the Packers game into this one. I have some sympathy for the defense considering who was missing; none for the offense.

On defense some of it was passivity but, like against the Packers, some of it was execution. How many tackles did we miss today?

But when you’re in a nickel defence against heavy sets all game when you know the other team wants to run the ball ? Not a good look IMO

[UKBillFan]

Just now, BillsFan130 said:

But when you’re in a nickel defence against heavy sets all game when you know the other team wants to run the ball ? Not a good look IMO

The issue was we seemed to have no passing plan against Garrett Wilson. So if we pushed them to pass, they’d find it too easy to execute in the back field. I do think our plans would have been different had we not been missing Milano and Poyer.

[HOUSE]

10 minutes ago, UKBillFan said:

What a lovely intelligent reply.

 

Tell me, where has anyone said we should score 50 every game?

We should score 50 every game 

[Billz4ever]

19 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

I think you are taking things out of context. Of course teams play to win and belief they can if they execute and the other team (if a lot better) plays poorly. I think that dominate teams have a psychological effects on less talented teams. I don't think you can under estimate the mindset of a player. It's often why good teams win close games and vice versa. Take today's game as an example. Couldn't you feel that the young Jets started to believe they could and would win? How confident were you that Allen would led the team to a game winning TD? 

 

In summary, the Bills psychological edge has been diminished greatly. Maybe I'm wrong but that's how I feel. 

If the offense isn't scoring almost at will, it seems the whole team struggles because of it.  I had a feeling the 2nd half of last week was going to carry over to this week.  Lots of people here flamed me for ringing alarm bells that the GB game plan exposed Frazier's use of Nickel as our base D all the time.  The only responses I got were "we were winning by 17".  OK, and as I said last week, Frazier is too stubborn and rigid to make the adjustments he needs to based on what the offense is doing. Jets clearly were focused on running, but Frazier is more worried about preventing the deep ball.

 

Jets do a copy/paste of what GB was doing against our Nickel in the second half and Frazier wants to act like we are up the 17 pts we were last week. That is why he's not getting any phone calls for HC.

 

 

Edited November 7, 2022 by Billz4ever

[Simon]

Just now, Billz4ever said:

Lots of people here flamed me for ringing alarm bells that the GB game plan exposed Frazier's use of Nickel as our base D all the time

 

Yes, nobody in the NFL had noticed on film that the Bills run a base nickel until last week. 

[Billz4ever]

14 minutes ago, Simon said:

 

Yes, nobody in the NFL had noticed on film that the Bills run a base nickel until last week. 

What teams committed to the run and exposed it the way GB and the Jets did?

 

Other teams didn't because the Bills had big leads and had to throw.  GB was the first team that bothered, even though they were losing.

 

If the Bills offense isn't making it easy for their defense, the Nickel is going to struggle because teams do not have to abandon the run to try and close the gap on the scoreboard.

 

And can someone explain to me why you need to be running base Nickel against Zach Wilson anyway?  Another excuse I was given last week too was basically the "Aaron Rodgers factor". OK, Zach Wilson is about as far as you can get from Aaron Rodgers at this point.

Edited November 7, 2022 by Billz4ever

[IndyMark]

34 minutes ago, Ya Digg? said:

Please, enlighten me on what petty means then. You’re upset because god forbid he does something outside of football, as if people aren’t able to multitask or stay focused on the task at hand. What did Josh do today that made him look distracted? Give specific examples. I’m sure he was thinking about his Gillette commercials or his podcast in the middle of the third quarter….give me a break

 I am upset? Enlighten me on how you came to that conclusion.  You are projecting.

 

As for what petty means, geez look it up.  I should not have to do your work for you.

 

My goodness you look petty in this thread.  Give specific examples? Are you serious, did you watch the game? Josh threw interceptions that literally by any measure were bizarre....like right at the defender with no receiver close.  Sure, there will be reasons given, but his reads and throws were off. This is not to mention his really surprising lack of pocket awareness and forcing balls to receivers that he seemed to have developed out of.  His apparent audibles also did not seem to work or he did not audible into a play that seemed to have a chance.  All this, to me anyway, leads to him being distracted.  Which is not an usual place to be in life.  We all have been distracted in life with trying to do too many things at times.

 

You are free to disagree, as this is a message board.  

 

Finally, give you a break? I have.  A lot here.  Ponder that for a moment.

 

Take care. 

 

 

[Johnnyp566]

A garbage brand of football.. just like the half I referenced from last week. 

[Behindenemylines]

7 minutes ago, Simon said:

 

Yes, nobody in the NFL had noticed on film that the Bills run a base nickel until last week. 

From what I saw our base nickel was about 2 pennies short.