Diggs #'s way down - Is this an issue

[Royale with Cheese]

25 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

How stoopid are you?????  Really a serious question.  Is Adams not at the top again this year with a depleted receiving corp around him.  By your logic, his stats should be down 25% too (just like Diggs) because they are putting more emphasis and coverage on him....  Right?????  

 

I then said about the TD's (and no I did not check), are they not scoring in the red zone (he was injured last week) and Rodgers not targeting him down there, which would be an issue.  Oh & TD's receptions for the most part are random (ups & downs), but catches shouldn't be....

 

So Diggs needs to be around 120 or so catches every year then.  Amazing...amazing.

DeAndre Hopkins has 35 catches this year so far.  He's on pace for like an 80 catch season....He had 115 last year.  I wonder if there's a guy on the Cardinals message board that created a thread griping about Hopkins major decline?  Nope, there's no one that thinks like you.

[Stank_Nasty]

Bills have 3 guys on pace for at least 900+ through 16 games. And before Knox went down he was on pace for 800+... touches are getting distributed much more evenly this year. Its a GOOD thing. Diggs will still get his by the end of the season.

[Gugny]

37 minutes ago, teef said:

i've asked you more than once why you thought the offense has looked flat, and what you think should be done about it, and more than once you've ignored it.  why?  because you really don't want to have a discussion.  again, you bring up a point, you hear valid reasons, and just continue to hammer home complaints.  so...why do YOU feel that the offense if off to a slower start?  it bothers you, so what's up?  

 

 

 

They're the #1 scoring offense in the NFL after 8 weeks.  Maybe you should tell him that.

[T master]

To many mouths to feed Beasely's numbers are down too with the emergence of Knox then add Sanders there's where the extra targets have gone .

[Stank_Nasty]

1 minute ago, Gugny said:

 

They're the #1 scoring offense in the NFL after 8 weeks.  Maybe you should tell him that.

it definitely hasnt been as "shock and awe" as last year but how can somebody argue with 32 a game?

[Patrick Duffy]

4 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

They're the #1 scoring offense in the NFL after 8 weeks.  Maybe you should tell him that.

Or, if attention is in that big of  need purchasing a hooker for an hr makes all the difference in the world  🤑

Edited November 3, 2021 by Sheneneh Jenkins

[Gugny]

Just now, Stank_Nasty said:

it definitely hasnt been as "shock and awe" as last year but how can somebody argue with 32 a game?

 

Exactly, man.

 

And I will also opine that this is a marathon and not a sprint.  I'd be shocked if Diggs wasn't told (or didn't even need to be told) that this is the time to be unselfish.  Diggs will get his targets ... especially when it counts the most.

[teef]

7 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

They're the #1 scoring offense in the NFL after 8 weeks.  Maybe you should tell him that.

i don't think he cares.  it would slow down the thread.

[Patrick Duffy]

Just now, teef said:

i don't think he cares.  it would slow down the thread.

My sister asked about you other day....

[1ManRaid]

There's no reason for this thread to continue (not that there was one to start with), OP clearly just wants to argue with people.  I and others have repeatedly asked what his point is and he refuses to answer.

[teef]

1 hour ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said:

My sister asked about you other day....

go on...

[Billsfan1972]

14 minutes ago, 1ManRaid said:

There's no reason for this thread to continue (not that there was one to start with), OP clearly just wants to argue with people.  I and others have repeatedly asked what his point is and he refuses to answer.

Actually I have only it seems responded to two people who love to ignore the point.

 

I think the offense has been a little off and not what I saw last year (yes the eye test).  Diggs #'s are facts, down 25%.

 

I expect those to improve, but asked a question.  People make excuses and continue to come up with other reasons & seem bothered that I point out he has gone from 1st to 22nd in the league 40% into the season.

 

If this was basketball & Giannis' #'s were down from 28 ppg to 21 ppg and rebounds from 12 to 9 30+ games into the season (same playing time), there would be some questions.

 

 

[The Red King]

13 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

Actually I have only it seems responded to two people who love to ignore the point.

 

I think the offense has been a little off and not what I saw last year (yes the eye test).  Diggs #'s are facts, down 25%.

 

I expect those to improve, but asked a question.  People make excuses and continue to come up with other reasons & seem bothered that I point out he has gone from 1st to 22nd in the league 40% into the season.

 

If this was basketball & Giannis' #'s were down from 28 ppg to 21 ppg and rebounds from 12 to 9 30+ games into the season (same playing time), there would be some questions.

 

 

 

And ignoring the points made by others it seems.  Hell, I even reposted my original reply earlier.  Numbers are just numbers.  Gotta look into the why.  IMO these include better ball distribution and our wet kleenex O-line, neither of which are Diggs' fault.

[teef]

30 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

Actually I have only it seems responded to two people who love to ignore the point.

 

I think the offense has been a little off and not what I saw last year (yes the eye test).  Diggs #'s are facts, down 25%.

 

I expect those to improve, but asked a question.  People make excuses and continue to come up with other reasons & seem bothered that I point out he has gone from 1st to 22nd in the league 40% into the season.

 

If this was basketball & Giannis' #'s were down from 28 ppg to 21 ppg and rebounds from 12 to 9 30+ games into the season (same playing time), there would be some questions.

 

 

again...why do you think diggs, and the offense has off numbers this year?  is there any reasonable way to fix it at this time, or do you think it's worth to see how this plays out?

[Billsfan1972]

57 minutes ago, teef said:

again...why do you think diggs, and the offense has off numbers this year?  is there any reasonable way to fix it at this time, or do you think it's worth to see how this plays out?

Wow almost cogent.  I've said I expect things to improve and maybe it is the Oline.  Again too I think Allen has not been accurate on the long bombs (as not enough air).  Maybe too he isn't reading defenses as well, or Daboll's play calling not as good.  Could be a # of things.  

 

Last year Diggs was consistently targeted and open in the seam (or that is what I recall).  

 

Here's Allen's stats 7 gamess 2020 vs. 2021 (Completions/Passes).  Another poster & me showed the yards are identical through 7 games

 

163/248 65.7% 2020 vs. 178/272 65.4% 2021

 

Diggs through 7 games in 2020 48 catches 608 yards..... 

 

Outside a few games last year (Tenn, KC, first New England game, sure I forgot others) it seemed they moved the ball at will....  Against Miami in 2020 they did whatever they wanted and it seemed this year Miami played much better (heck not even 200 yards passing in the first game).

 

I'm a Diggs fan (he's a Bill) and see numbers & targets down.  A small concern.  

Edited November 3, 2021 by Billsfan1972

[bigduke6]

i could see this being a problem if,  the Bills werent winning.     if Diggs has a problem with his touches right now,  than thats a Diggs problem.   not saying he has a problem btw.    

 

keep in mind tho,  Diggs is gonna want a new contract,  and wins dont get u paid,  stats do.   hopefully none of the typical problems with lowered production occur for Diggs or the Bills.   cautiously optimistic.

[ToGoGo]

2 hours ago, The Red King said:

 

Numbers are just numbers.  Gotta look into the why. 

 

Smartest thing I've seen posted on this board in a while.

 

The biggest difference between people who are great at data analysis and people who just like to look smart, is that they are able to read between the lines of the data. THAT is the reason why FootballOutsiders and PFF are a bunch of frauds. It's a harsh word, but I can think of nothing better. 

 

Those outlets either refused to, or lacked the competence and ability to, watch tape and interviews and figure out WHY Josh Allen had a low completion rate. They just lumped him in with everybody else. Now that PFF and FO are begrudgingly giving Allen props while still throwing back-handed compliments shows that they will continue to make these blunders in the future with prospects. 

 

As for Diggs, we're just spreading the wealth while the defense is on higher alert covering him compared to last season. Two very important factors that would lower even Jerry Rice's stats. If the rest of our WR's were bad, we would be force-feeding Diggs leading to more INTs, drops, and incompletions. 

 

The biggest thing for me is that every time the balls comes Diggs way, he is just as elite as last season. The same caliber of player. He's just getting less targets. My only concern would be if he begins to pout, but his body language on the field and attitude during interviews shows that not only is he confident he will get his, but he is happier to see the team and offence become elite rather than the offense mediocre but his stats elite. Dude just wants to win and loves Allen. 

Edited November 3, 2021 by ToGoGo
Removed unnecessary comment at the end

[Patrick Duffy]

2 hours ago, teef said:

go on...

Well, she too hates Apple Bees so felt it was only right to mention that fact you both have in common. She asked what you do for a living and so I said, "from what I understand he's one of those perverted dentist that feels you up when you're under at times, other times to keep it interesting he will choke it and after you awaken he tells you he had to add a little extra numbing cream".....

 

She loved it and is very excited to make an appointment with you. She says you both have a lot in common lol. She gets the freaky, naughty, and nastiness honest because our mother was a ***** and father was a ***** chaser. So just an fyi kinda thing, you may want to make sure you eat your wheaties and make sure to get a heavy dose of protein before stepping into this situation.

 

Telling you as a friend....

 

 

Edited November 3, 2021 by Sheneneh Jenkins

[Hapless Bills Fan]

22 hours ago, Billsfan1972 said:

And they too focus on Adams, Kupp & others.....  There are 21 receivers ahead of Diggs.....  I'm sure he's happy about that.

 

His production is down 25%, another thing I'm sure warms his heart.

 

Have you looked at the year-to-year variance in Adams, Kupp, Woods, Hopkins etc R/G and Y/G?

What is it?

 

[Patrick Duffy]

1 hour ago, Billsfan1972 said:

Wow almost cogent.  I've said I expect things to improve and maybe it is the Oline.  Again too I think Allen has not been accurate on the long bombs (as not enough air).  Maybe too he isn't reading defenses as well, or Daboll's play calling not as good.  Could be a # of things.  

 

Last year Diggs was consistently targeted and open in the seam (or that is what I recall).  

 

Here's Allen's stats 7 gamess 2020 vs. 2021 (Completions/Passes).  Another poster & me showed the yards are identical through 7 games

 

163/248 65.7% 2020 vs. 178/272 65.4% 2021

 

Diggs through 7 games in 2020 48 catches 608 yards..... 

 

Outside a few games last year (Tenn, KC, first New England game, sure I forgot others) it seemed they moved the ball at will....  Against Miami in 2020 they did whatever they wanted and it seemed this year Miami played much better (heck not even 200 yards passing in the first game).

 

I'm a Diggs fan (he's a Bill) and see numbers & targets down.  A small concern.  

I'm sure somebody at some point or other likely has already said this, but I'm gona jus shoot anyway. With the year Diggs has last season and with how good he obviously is, do you not think Defenses are game planning for him whether it be double team or whatever to take him away as much as possible? Add in that Sanders has been taking advantage of that and playing awesome along with Knox killing it too.

 

I mean come on man, it's early still and if you happened to have missed the memo...this Bills WR core are a very unselfish unit as it has been said on multiple occasions. Diggs will get his for sure, I can't get why you believe it's some sort of issue with this lol

[Billsfan1972]

16 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Have you looked at the year-to-year variance in Adams, Kupp, Woods, Hopkins etc R/G and Y/G?

What is it?

 

And I've used Adams over & over.  Kupp now has Stafford and a huge uptick.  Woods is not an elite receiver (is he?).  Hopkins has been battling injuries at least 2-3 weeks.  The stats are there and have posted them.

2 minutes ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said:

I'm sure somebody at some point or other likely has already said this, but I'm gona jus shoot anyway. With the year Diggs has last season and with how good he obviously is, do you not think Defenses are game planning for him whether it be double team or whatever to take him away as much as possible? Add in that Sanders has been taking advantage of that and playing awesome along with Knox killing it too.

 

I mean come on man, it's early still and if you happened to have missed the memo...this Bills WR core are a very unselfish unit as it has been said on multiple occasions. Diggs will get his for sure, I can't get why you believe it's some sort of issue with this lol

And I've said as much, but his #'s are down significantly and hope that it is just short term.  I was throwing out a discussion point to see responses.  Not personal attacks.

 

Again do other teams not try & take Kupp or Adams out of games (or is it only Diggs that defenses game plan against). 

[Patrick Duffy]

15 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

And I've said as much, but his #'s are down significantly and hope that it is just short term.  I was throwing out a discussion point to see responses.  Not personal attacks.

 

Again do other teams not try & take Kupp or Adams out of games (or is it only Diggs that defenses game plan against).

like I said it's early and there will be games that a Defense will show different looks that Diggs will light it up. It's known he is unselfish and you should feel good about him drawing that attention so the other WR's can take advantage of that.

 

As to your 2nd bold.....obviously they do, all Defensive plans are different for each team. But whatever the case of course those 2 get doubled sometimes.

Edited November 3, 2021 by Sheneneh Jenkins

[Royale with Cheese]

39 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Have you looked at the year-to-year variance in Adams, Kupp, Woods, Hopkins etc R/G and Y/G?

What is it?

 

He’s only going to pick the stats he wants to use.

Guess what…touchdowns don’t count.

[Patrick Duffy]

18 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

He’s only going to pick the stats he wants to use.

Guess what…touchdowns don’t count.

I personally don't see why one would consider this an issue....it's nothing at all to be concerned about. I mean if anyone needs to feel concerned about something then I'd say the Oline is a good place to start.

 

Certainly not Diggs lol, my 2 cent

Edited November 3, 2021 by Sheneneh Jenkins

[Billsfan1972]

 

26 minutes ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said:

like I said it's early and there will be games that a Defense will show different looks that Diggs will light it up. It's known he is unselfish and you should feel good about him drawing that attention so the other WR's can take advantage of that.

 

As to your 2nd bold.....obviously they do, all Defensive plans are different for each team. But whatever the case of course those 2 get doubled sometimes.

 

And they seem to be doing okay......  I just point out that the top receivers get more attention regardless and sure Diggs did too last year, so seems like a spurious argument.

[Patrick Duffy]

3 hours ago, teef said:

go on...

 

45 minutes ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said:

I'm sure somebody at some point or other likely has already said this, but I'm gona jus shoot anyway. With the year Diggs has last season and with how good he obviously is, do you not think Defenses are game planning for him whether it be double team or whatever to take him away as much as possible? Add in that Sanders has been taking advantage of that and playing awesome along with Knox killing it too.

 

I mean come on man, it's early still and if you happened to have missed the memo...this Bills WR core are a very unselfish unit as it has been said on multiple occasions. Diggs will get his for sure, I can't get why you believe it's some sort of issue with this lol

Kinda interested to know how you feel about this and if you want to respond lol

[Royale with Cheese]

1 minute ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said:

I personally don't see why one would consider this an issue....it's nothing at all to be concerned about. I mean if anyone needs to feel concerned about something then I'd say the Oline is a good place to start.

 

Certainly not Diggs lol, my 2 cent

 

This is the OP.  He finds something that he feels is "concerning" and ignores every logical response, no matter how many and then keeps driving his point.

If Diggs continues his "25%" decline in production from just two raw stats....

He would be close to 100 catches and 1,200 yards.  Awful.

 

[Patrick Duffy]

10 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

 

 

And they seem to be doing okay......  I just point out that the top receivers get more attention regardless and sure Diggs did too last year, so seems like a spurious argument.

Well I guess that's fine if that's how you feel, however I feel it's not even remotely anything to be worried about. His numbers are fine, it's week 9 dude. If him being an unselfish player that wants the love to be spread around is concerning for you, then I'd have to think you may be one of those ppl that tend to get worried often about some things that you have no need to be worried over in the 1st place.

Edited November 3, 2021 by Sheneneh Jenkins

[Billsfan1972]

10 minutes ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said:

Well I guess that's fine if that's how you feel, however I feel it's not even remotely anything to be worried about. His numbers are fine, it's week 9 dude. If him being an unselfish player that wants the love to be spread around is concerning for you, then I'd have to think you may be one of those ppl that tend to get worried often about some things that you have no need to be worried over in the 1st place.

Again the OP was an observation.  Not overly worried, but the #'s are down. 

 

Obviously WR's #'s must be inflated as 100 receptions and 1,200 yards won't crack the top 20 this year.......🤣😜

[Patrick Duffy]

3 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

Again the OP was an observation.  Not overly worried, but the #'s are down. 

 

Obviously WR's #'s must be inflated as 100 receptions and 1,200 yards won't crack the top 20 this year.......🤣😜

Well maybe in one of the upcoming games he goes off in a couple or more of them. Then his numbers would be back on track then right? So again, point is it is lot of games to be played.

[Billsfan1972]

3 minutes ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said:

Well maybe in one of the upcoming games he goes off in a couple or more of them. Then his numbers would be back on track then right? So again, point is it is lot of games to be played.

Yes and trust me that's what I want to see, but the observation was that offence seems off and Diggs included.  Is that such a way out statement???? 

[Patrick Duffy]

1 minute ago, Billsfan1972 said:

Yes and trust me that's what I want to see, but the observation was that offence seems off and Diggs included.  Is that such a way out statement???? 

How do you get the offense seems off? They been scoring all over the place. They are one of the top Offenses in the league dude...They struggle against Fins in the 1st half with a banged up Oline.

 

Other than Steelers in week 1, where has the Offense been off??

[without a drought]

Now that the trade deadline has passed, I guess the Bills will have to look for his replacement after the season. Unless Josh is the problem, then they need to start building up some draft capital. 

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

9 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

@Hapless Bills Fan

I agree with you 

 

[frostbitmic]

Of course it's an issue ... for my fantasy team, other than that the Bills offense seems to be putting points on the board. Occasionally the offense sputters in the red zone, I'd suggest a few more looks to #14 down there, ya know, for the Bills benefit.

[What a Tuel]

I think it has something to do with this....

 

2020

9/13 27-17 W

9/20 31-28 W

9/27 35-32 W

10/4 30-23 W

10/13 42-16 L

10/19 26-17 L

10/25 18-10 W

 

2021

9/12 23-16 L

9/19 35-0 W

9/26 43-21 W

10/3 40-0 W

10/10 38-20 W

10/18 34-31 L

10/31 26-11 W

 

Point differential literally goes from:

174 Bills 178 Opponent

to

229 Bills 109 Opponent

 

Elite WR's make big plays when they are most needed. We needed Diggs to win games more last year.

[Nelius]

Diggs puts up one Diggsian 10 catch 180 yd performance in the next few weeks and this becomes a complete non-issue. I've been hearing this from fantasy talking heads too, as if Dawson Knox doesn't exist. Diggs is still on pace for over 1,150 yards and 7 TDs (16 games).

 

Boo hoo, only 1,150 yards from our #1 wide receiver. Boy how the times have changed.

[Royale with Cheese]

29 minutes ago, What a Tuel said:

I think it has something to do with this....

 

2020

9/13 27-17 W

9/20 31-28 W

9/27 35-32 W

10/4 30-23 W

10/13 42-16 L

10/19 26-17 L

10/25 18-10 W

 

2021

9/12 23-16 L

9/19 35-0 W

9/26 43-21 W

10/3 40-0 W

10/10 38-20 W

10/18 34-31 L

10/31 26-11 W

 

Point differential literally goes from:

174 Bills 178 Opponent

to

229 Bills 109 Opponent

 

Elite WR's make big plays when they are most needed. We needed Diggs to win games more last year.

Not only that, when you’re up by more than 3 scores late in the game, you’re not throwing all over the field.

Diggs targets and snaps are down.

We are consistently running new packages out there.  
 

Last year Diggs had 12 games where he averaged 90% or higher snap count.  This year he has just one.  In 7 games, 5 of them have been in the 70% area.  Last year, only two total.  

 

 

[Motorin']

9 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

This is the OP.  He finds something that he feels is "concerning" and ignores every logical response, no matter how many and then keeps driving his point.

If Diggs continues his "25%" decline in production from just two raw stats....

He would be close to 100 catches and 1,200 yards.  Awful.

 

 

Yeah, more "Concern Queen" behavior. 

 

[Scott7975]

11 hours ago, Billsfan1972 said:

Wow almost cogent.  I've said I expect things to improve and maybe it is the Oline.  Again too I think Allen has not been accurate on the long bombs (as not enough air).  Maybe too he isn't reading defenses as well, or Daboll's play calling not as good.  Could be a # of things.  

 

Last year Diggs was consistently targeted and open in the seam (or that is what I recall).  

 

Here's Allen's stats 7 gamess 2020 vs. 2021 (Completions/Passes).  Another poster & me showed the yards are identical through 7 games

 

163/248 65.7% 2020 vs. 178/272 65.4% 2021

 

Diggs through 7 games in 2020 48 catches 608 yards..... 

 

Outside a few games last year (Tenn, KC, first New England game, sure I forgot others) it seemed they moved the ball at will....  Against Miami in 2020 they did whatever they wanted and it seemed this year Miami played much better (heck not even 200 yards passing in the first game).

 

I'm a Diggs fan (he's a Bill) and see numbers & targets down.  A small concern.  

 

 

For the last time... Diggs numbers are down because Allen is spreading the ball to more targets.  Look at your own stats. More passes thrown.  Completion % pretty much the same.  Diggs numbers are down.  Want to know why?  Look and see whose numbers are up.  THERE IS ONLY ONE BALL TO GO AROUND.