Bojo doing Bojo things

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

After Mason Crosby missed like 4 kicks last week, I tried to go back and watch a few of the misses. On at least one that I was able to see, I am pretty sure Bojo’s hold was off (laces in or at least not totally out). 
 

LaFleur took aim at the entire “operation.”  Anyone else catch the holds on these kicks? 
 

https://www.nfl.com/news/packers-hc-matt-lafleur-on-crosby-s-missed-fgs-you-can-t-put-all-of-that-on-maso

 

Edit: there is also this—

 

 

 

Edited October 16, 2021 by Miyagi-Do Karate

[TBBills]

[Hapless Bills Fan]

12 minutes ago, Miyagi-Do Karate said:

After Mason Crosby missed like 4 kicks last week, I tried to go back and watch a few of the misses. On at least one that I was able to see, I am pretty sure Bojo’s hold was off (laces in or at least not totally out). 
 

LaFleur took aim at the entire “operation.”  Anyone else catch the holds on these kicks? 
 

https://www.nfl.com/news/packers-hc-matt-lafleur-on-crosby-s-missed-fgs-you-can-t-put-all-of-that-on-maso

 

Edit: there is also this—

 

 

 

 

Well since Bojo has a history here of messing up the hold with a very reliable LS, I'm gonna go Bojo doing Bojo things

[BearNorth]

Knowing McDermott's attention to detail, wondering if his place kick holding was why Bojo is now with his third team.  Sure's he not happy about the game-changing punt block against the Steelers, but Bojo's holding adventures aren't new.

[Patrick Duffy]

17 minutes ago, Miyagi-Do Karate said:

After Mason Crosby missed like 4 kicks last week, I tried to go back and watch a few of the misses. On at least one that I was able to see, I am pretty sure Bojo’s hold was off (laces in or at least not totally out). 
 

LaFleur took aim at the entire “operation.”  Anyone else catch the holds on these kicks? 
 

https://www.nfl.com/news/packers-hc-matt-lafleur-on-crosby-s-missed-fgs-you-can-t-put-all-of-that-on-maso

 

Edit: there is also this—

 

 

 

I didn't see it, but if was a bad snap you can't really put it all on him. However with that said, I do recall a few times with Bills he didn't laces out and snap was fine. Anyways, I guess it takes some getting used to having to get ball positioned so quickly like that even when it is a good snap. Lol, bad snap you just got to hope for the best

[Doc]

The kicker and long snapper are they same as last year.  It's Bojo.

[Patrick Duffy]

4 minutes ago, Doc said:

The kicker and long snapper are they same as last year.  It's Bojo.

Even with same snapper/kicker, once in a while bad or low snaps can still happen which obviously makes it more difficult for the holder. But as I mentioned I didn't see the actual play  and honestly don't hve much interest to see. I do agree he had trouble at times with it last  season though.

[DJB]

Bojo's weekly game results

 

1. Bomb a 65 yard punt 

2. Mess up the hold and K misses FG

3. Shank a 15 yard punt. 

 

Repeat process. 

[The Wiz]

Wasn't there video of Crosby chewing him out like crazy after his 3rd missed kick?

 

I know they even mentioned it on the broadcast.

[Peace Frog]

I miss the days of having the 2nd string QB be the holder on PATs and FGs.  Frank Reich used to do it for us.  It would make for the potential for a nice trick play with a QB throwing for a first down or TD on FG attempts.

[Patrick Duffy]

1 minute ago, Peace Frog said:

I miss the days of having the 2nd string QB be the holder on PATs and FGs.  Frank Reich used to do it for us.  It would make for the potential for a nice trick play with a QB throwing for a first down or TD on FG attempts.

Does every team use the Punter now? I can't think of any team that uses QB2 for that anymore. But don't know for sure, honestly something I haven't really paid much attention to

[letsgoteam]

Is he the worse holder in recent history?

 

Edit: worse holder in all of modern NFL

Edited October 17, 2021 by letsgoteam

[SirAndrew]

12 minutes ago, The Wiz said:

Wasn't there video of Crosby chewing him out like crazy after his 3rd missed kick?

 

I know they even mentioned it on the broadcast.

Yeah, I’m surprised there aren’t memes with Crosby’s facial expression following the 3rd miss. He gave Bojo the biggest stink eye I’ve ever seen on a football field. I caught that during the game, and was surprised it didn’t catch on. 

[Malazan]

19 minutes ago, Peace Frog said:

I miss the days of having the 2nd string QB be the holder on PATs and FGs.  Frank Reich used to do it for us.  It would make for the potential for a nice trick play with a QB throwing for a first down or TD on FG attempts.

 

14 minutes ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said:

Does every team use the Punter now? I can't think of any team that uses QB2 for that anymore. But don't know for sure, honestly something I haven't really paid much attention to

 

I asked about this back a little and a poster pointed me to Parcells explaining that it takes too much time to practice that the Backup QB does have with his own practice/meeting to prepare as the back and often running the scout team. So it seems that coaches have determined that's more important than the potential of a trick play since holding requires so much practice time. 

[Wnybricky]

We need a new punter too. I expect one in the draft

[Freddie's Dead]

58 minutes ago, DJB said:

Bojo's weekly game results

 

1. Bomb a 65 yard punt 

2. Mess up the hold and K misses FG

3. Shank a 15 yard punt. 

 

Repeat process. 

 

You forgot "Call a unilateral fake FG".  Bodork gonna Bodork.

Edited October 17, 2021 by Freddie's Dead

[Bobby Hooks]

Bass is showing now his early misses we’re definitely due to Bojo. That dude could’ve singlehandedly ruined the confidence of the Bills best kicker to come around in a very long time. 
 

 

[Patrick Duffy]

25 minutes ago, Malazan said:

 

 

I asked about this back a little and a poster pointed me to Parcells explaining that it takes too much time to practice that the Backup QB does have with his own practice/meeting to prepare as the back and often running the scout team. So it seems that coaches have determined that's more important than the potential of a trick play since holding requires so much practice time. 

Ok, well that's understandable. To your trick play comment, just wanted to point out that when opposing teams see the QB2 come out for holding duties instead of the usual punter, I imagine that would alert them to be ready for a trick play. So not sure it would be very successful. Unless for some reason opposing team wouldn't notice a different holder, but I doubt that would happen often, if at all.

Edited October 17, 2021 by Sheneneh Jenkins

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

1 hour ago, BearNorth said:

Knowing McDermott's attention to detail, wondering if his place kick holding was why Bojo is now with his third team.  Sure's he not happy about the game-changing punt block against the Steelers, but Bojo's holding adventures aren't new.

 

I've said that for awhile, think that had a lot to do with it.  As potent as Bills offense was/is missing a FG is probably more important than punting 5 to 10 yards less.

 

I do think next year they will draft a punter.

[Patrick Duffy]

10 minutes ago, Bobby Hooks said:

Bass is showing now his early misses we’re definitely due to Bojo. That dude could’ve singlehandedly ruined the confidence of the Bills best kicker to come around in a very long time. 
 

 

Well I wouldn't say all due to Bojo. I mean he was a rookie and rookie kickers can start out slow. But yeah the times it was a bad hold certainly didn't help.

[Rochesterfan]

1 minute ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

I've said that for awhile, think that had a lot to do with it.  As potent as Bills offense was/is missing a FG is probably more important than punting 5 to 10 yards less.

 

I do think next year they will draft a punter.

 

I think the change from BoJo was needed.  The new punter has a 3 year contract - I don’t think they will move on after this year.  
 

I would suspect they are happy with holds - it was stated before he is a significant upgrade at holder.

 

His punting has been inconsistent, but other than the missed blocked by the frontlines that caused a block - he has been fine.

 

I suspect we have our punter in place for the next couple of years and that will allow the punter, kicker, and LS to all be together for a minimum of 3 years.

 

 

[Rochesterfan]

4 minutes ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said:

Well I wouldn't say all due to Bojo. I mean he was a rookie and rookie kickers can start out slow. But yeah the times it was a bad hold certainly didn't help.

 

At minimum 4 of his 6 missed kicks last year the laces were not spun properly that we saw.  It was even talked about by I believe Jay Feely on a broadcast - where he said how unsettling it was when your foot hits the laces and creates a knuckle ball effect.
 

The 2nd and 3rd missed kick by Crosby - the laces were not spun fully out - both were on the left side and the ball stayed left.  After the one miss - Crosby was glaring at BoJo.  
 

I think BoJo struggles holding and it will cost you kicker multiple missed kicks on the year.  He is a bit slow and he is inconsistent with the placement and angle and worst of all - he struggles spinning the laces consistently.  
 

 

 

 

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

1 hour ago, The Wiz said:

Wasn't there video of Crosby chewing him out like crazy after his 3rd missed kick?

 

I know they even mentioned it on the broadcast.

Oh man— I missed that! 

[Sherlock Holmes]

1 hour ago, letsgoteam said:

Is he the worse holder in recent history?

 

Edit: worse holder in all of modern NFL

He's the Nathan Peterman of holding...heck even Peterman could probably hold better.

 

Also ***** Bojo, he cost me $100 on a 4 game parlay.🤮 Hold on, I better let my guy know we gotta switch whose lawn to pull a McLovin on...

Edited October 17, 2021 by Sherlock Holmes

[Mango]

I find this really frustrating for different reasons.

 

Bojo>Haack and it doesn’t seem close. Why can’t Bojo figure this out…or anybody else? I hate that we have sign a lesser punter because of holding for the place holder. Makes me really angry at Bojo and the coaching staff. Like this had to be either teachable and/or replaceable with anybody else on the roster. 

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

They are showing the GB/CIN

game on NFLN right now— am DVRing it now to take a closer look. 

[Patrick Duffy]

39 minutes ago, Rochesterfan said:

 

At minimum 4 of his 6 missed kicks last year the laces were not spun properly that we saw.  It was even talked about by I believe Jay Feely on a broadcast - where he said how unsettling it was when your foot hits the laces and creates a knuckle ball effect.
 

The 2nd and 3rd missed kick by Crosby - the laces were not spun fully out - both were on the left side and the ball stayed left.  After the one miss - Crosby was glaring at BoJo.  
 

I think BoJo struggles holding and it will cost you kicker multiple missed kicks on the year.  He is a bit slow and he is inconsistent with the placement and angle and worst of all - he struggles spinning the laces consistently.  
 

 

 

 

Oh I agree for sure. Although I don't remember exactly how many times Bojo didn't hold correctly, but I do recall seeing a few times it was a bad ball placement hold. However, I also remember Bass (early in the season) missed a couple that were good holds....which was expected with a rookie kicker.

 

All I'm saying is every single miss wasn't all on Bojo. Some were for sure, but not every single one.

Edited October 17, 2021 by Sheneneh Jenkins

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

49 minutes ago, Mango said:

I find this really frustrating for different reasons.

 

Bojo>Haack and it doesn’t seem close. Why can’t Bojo figure this out…or anybody else? I hate that we have sign a lesser punter because of holding for the place holder. Makes me really angry at Bojo and the coaching staff. Like this had to be either teachable and/or replaceable with anybody else on the roster. 

I have really never heard of anyone being a bad holder. You would think it is a skill that can be learned/honed. 

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

54 minutes ago, Rochesterfan said:

 

I think the change from BoJo was needed.  The new punter has a 3 year contract - I don’t think they will move on after this year.  
 

I would suspect they are happy with holds - it was stated before he is a significant upgrade at holder.

 

His punting has been inconsistent, but other than the missed blocked by the frontlines that caused a block - he has been fine.

 

I suspect we have our punter in place for the next couple of years and that will allow the punter, kicker, and LS to all be together for a minimum of 3 years.

 

 

 

So two years left after this year.  They moved on from their kicker Hauschka with one year remaining, so only difference is one more year left.  Agree they are happy with holding, but not to say they can't find a college punter who also held for 2 to 3 years and was very good at it.  And I do think holding was a big reason Bojo was let go.

 

Two years left on a punters contract isn't exactly going to break the bank like it would on a position player.  Many were thinking Star L will get let go after this season, admittedly based on recent play, may not happen.  But my point is that was much more money think it's around $5.1 mil.  Believe Haacks hit is $700k.  If fans were assuming the Bills were ready to take a $5 mil cap hit, can't believe they'd worry much about $700k.

 

If he starts punting a little better, he may be fine, but wouldn't shock me to see them draft a punter and see how he looks in camp, just like they did with Bass.

[Bobby Hooks]

43 minutes ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said:

Oh I agree for sure. Although I don't remember exactly how many times Bojo didn't hold correctly, but I do recall seeing a few times it was a bad ball placement hold. However, I also remember Bass (early in the season) missed a couple that were good holds....which was expected with a rookie kicker.

 

All I'm saying is every single miss wasn't all on Bojo. Some were for sure, but not every single one.

Yeah, I wasn’t saying every one was on Bojo, I could see how my original post may have made it seem that way but those early kicks are huge for a rookie kicker trying to get into his groove. Much like a young qb having his confidence rattled early on, it’s sometimes hard to overcome. I’m glad Bass was able to remain composed and overcome it but like you said rookie kickers typically have a rough go of it early on. It makes it that much worse when your placeholder is responsible for multiple missed kicks. 
 

If your confidence takes a hit because you miss a few kicks, so be it. But for your placeholder to be responsible for some is almost criminal. Doesn’t seem like something that should be happening to an nfl player. 

Edited October 17, 2021 by Bobby Hooks

[Rochesterfan]

19 minutes ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

So two years left after this year.  They moved on from their kicker Hauschka with one year remaining, so only difference is one more year left.  Agree they are happy with holding, but not to say they can't find a college punter who also held for 2 to 3 years and was very good at it.  And I do think holding was a big reason Bojo was let go.

 

Two years left on a punters contract isn't exactly going to break the bank like it would on a position player.  Many were thinking Star L will get let go after this season, admittedly based on recent play, may not happen.  But my point is that was much more money think it's around $5.1 mil.  Believe Haacks hit is $700k.  If fans were assuming the Bills were ready to take a $5 mil cap hit, can't believe they'd worry much about $700k.

 

If he starts punting a little better, he may be fine, but wouldn't shock me to see them draft a punter and see how he looks in camp, just like they did with Bass.

 

All is certainly true - the difference is expected positional spend.  
 

Most teams don’t want to spend more than 1 million to 1.15 million on a punter.  If you cut him - and sign even a draft pick - you are over budget.

 

Most people didn’t think they would cut Star this year because his cost combined with a replacement cost would’ve exceeded typical position spend.  Most people assumed this would be his last year as his dead hit is small enough when combined with a replacement to fit typical budget for that position.

 

They might sign a punter - you are correct, but I just think they are fine with his play and they are much less concerned than some fans.  I think they also really like the way the 3 specialists (punter, kicker, and LS) get along and work together.  I don’t think they will mess with that as it is important to this staff.

 

 

[Malazan]

2 hours ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said:

Ok, well that's understandable. To your trick play comment, just wanted to point out that when opposing teams see the QB2 come out for holding duties instead of the usual punter, I imagine that would alert them to be ready for a trick play. So not sure it would be very successful. Unless for some reason opposing team wouldn't notice a different holder, but I doubt that would happen often, if at all.

I mean, they'd hold it every time regardless of it being a trick play or not. 

[Patrick Duffy]

2 minutes ago, Malazan said:

I mean, they'd hold it every time regardless of it being a trick play or not. 

Ah ok. You meant the QB2 would only and always be the holder. Thought you meant the QB2 taking the Punters place as holder for a certain FG 

[Jay_Fixit]

2 hours ago, Bobby Hooks said:

Bass is showing now his early misses we’re definitely due to Bojo. That dude could’ve singlehandedly ruined the confidence of the Bills best kicker to come around in a very long time. 
 

 

I love how you use nicknames for players.

 

Bojo.

 

cuuuuute.

[Patrick Duffy]

3 minutes ago, Jay_Fixit said:

I love how you use nicknames for players.

 

Bojo.

 

cuuuuute.

I thought pretty much everyone calls him that myself....

[ticketssince61]

3 hours ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said:

Does every team use the Punter now? I can't think of any team that uses QB2 for that anymore. But don't know for sure, honestly something I haven't really paid much attention to

 

I think there was a post a few weeks ago which listed a whole explanation by Belichick on why back up QB's are not used anymore.

[Bobby Hooks]

21 minutes ago, Jay_Fixit said:

I love how you use nicknames for players.

 

Bojo.

 

cuuuuute.

You going to catch a game with me or what? 
 

 

[Patrick Duffy]

6 minutes ago, ticketssince61 said:

 

I think there was a post a few weeks ago which listed a whole explanation by Belichick on why back up QB's are not used anymore.

Yeah thanks. I was already informed up thread. But I'm saying though.....was that just Belichick saying why "he" doesn't use them anymore? Or was he talking about all teams don't use them?

 

Anyway, I guess I could look it up if I wanted, but in any event it's just not important enough for me to waste any time on it. Was just slightly curious lol

[Hapless Bills Fan]

4 hours ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said:

Does every team use the Punter now? I can't think of any team that uses QB2 for that anymore. But don't know for sure, honestly something I haven't really paid much attention to

 

Pretty much.  It enables the kicker, holder, and long snapper to be their own unit and do their own thing during practice, which is an operational advantage over needing to coordinate with the backup QB who is running the scout team and perhaps taking a few snaps with the 1's.

 

I think that's the primary reason most teams have changed

 

1 hour ago, Jay_Fixit said:

I love how you use nicknames for players.

Bojo.

cuuuuute.

 

Your....kink is OK?

 

Using nicknames for players is pretty common here and Bojo was almost universal, due to the difficulty some have with spelling Bojorquez.

 

If that sparks love in ya, better pace yourself...

[Patrick Duffy]

4 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

Your....kink is OK?

 

Using nicknames for players is pretty common here and Bojo was almost universal, due to the difficulty some have with spelling Bojorquez.

 

If that sparks love in ya, better pace yourself...

Yeah that's what I understood. I believe every single poster on this board that has ever posted anything at all in regards to him that it was/is Bojo. Has been since like day one lol.

 

Maybe he was just being sarcastic with that particular poster and went over our heads lol. Idk

8 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

Pretty much.  It enables the kicker, holder, and long snapper to be their own unit and do their own thing during practice, which is an operational advantage over needing to coordinate with the backup QB who is running the scout team and perhaps taking a few snaps with the 1's.

 

I think that's the primary reason most teams have changed

Yeah I get the reasoning and all. Hell, I don't even know when the last time a QB2 was actually the full time holder for the Kicker honestly. Want to say AVP was holder if not mistaken. Could easily be wrong.