Andy Benoit's 2018 Top Twelve Defensive Rookies; Tremaine Edmunds at 11; Cover 1 Breaks Down Edmunds in Week 14

[26CornerBlitz]

 

11. Tremaine Edmunds, LB, Bills (16th overall)
The NFL’s youngest player (he won’t turn 21 until May) struggled immensely in zone coverage early in the season, making play-action the favorite tactic of every Bills opponent. But to Edmunds’s credit, he has become more patient with his reads early in the down, which has allowed him to better employ his speed late in the down. With fellow starting linebacker Matt Milano having a surprisingly stellar season before fracturing his fibula on Sunday, Buffalo’s defense is set inside for the foreseeable future. Linebackers are crucial to this team, as head coach Sean McDermott has brought over many of the double-A-gap pressures and disguises that he ran with Luke Kuechly and Thomas Davis in Carolina.

 

12-12: Tremaine Edmunds on One Bills Live (9:27)

 

 

Edited December 20, 2018 by 26CornerBlitz

[Dadonkadonk]

So far trading up for Edmunds looks like a wasted pick. They could have found a LB in the second round and had another high draft pick for the OL.

Poor choice by Beane to trade up.

Edmunds the player however has been fine. If he continues to get better he can be the anchor the defense needs for the next 5-7 years. And still only be 27. Amazing.

[buffalobillswin]

Can you post the entire list? Can't open it at work

[K-9]

1 minute ago, Dadonkadonk said:

So far trading up for Edmunds looks like a wasted pick. They could have found a LB in the second round and had another high draft pick for the OL.

Poor choice by Beane to trade up.

Edmunds the player however has been fine. If he continues to get better he can be the anchor the defense needs for the next 5-7 years. And still only be 27. Amazing.

I’m confused by the seeming contradiction between your first two paragraphs and the last. 

[26CornerBlitz]

1 minute ago, buffalobillswin said:

Can you post the entire list? Can't open it at work

 

12. Minkah Fitzpatrick, DB, Dolphins (11th overall)

11. Tremaine Edmunds, LB, Bills (16th overall)

10. B.J. Hill, DT, Giants (69th overall)

9. Fred Warner, LB, 49ers (70th overall)

8. Rashaan Evans, LB, Titans (22nd overall)

7. Bradley Chubb, Edge, Broncos (5th overall)

6. Jaire Alexander, CB, Packers (18th overall)

5. Roquan Smith, LB, Bears (8th overall)

4. Darius Leonard, LB, Colts (36th overall)

3. Denzel Ward, CB, Browns (4th overall)

2. Leighton Vander Esch, LB, Cowboys (19th overall)

1. Derwin James, S, Chargers (17th overall)

[buffalobillswin]

3 minutes ago, K-9 said:

I’m confused by the seeming contradiction between your first two paragraphs and the last. 

I think it is similar to Luke Kuechly and Bobby Wagner. 

 

Kuechly is an amazing player and the Panthers should have no regrets picking him 9th overall but...Bobby Wagner in the 2nd round was a much better value.

 

Something similar may become true between Edmunds and LVE/Darrius Leonard

[Pete]

Not bad for a 20 year old kid.  We might of overpaid for Edwards.  Time will tell.  But imagine if we traded up for Derwin James?  He went one pick later, and is the prototype safety we are looking for

[RoyBatty is alive]

Edmunds, just like Allen is a physical freak, both were "projects" and grading them at this point doesn't make much sense.  Edmunds could be the ideal LB for the new pass happy NFL his with size &  incredibly long arms, he should be knocking down passes over the middle, pay attention Brady.

[JoshAllenHasBigHands]

9 minutes ago, buffalobillswin said:

I think it is similar to Luke Kuechly and Bobby Wagner. 

 

Kuechly is an amazing player and the Panthers should have no regrets picking him 9th overall but...Bobby Wagner in the 2nd round was a much better value.

 

Something similar may become true between Edmunds and LVE/Darrius Leonard

 

The "value" draft analysts are the worst analysts.  They really offer nothing of value (I mean that unironically).  The only way this approach makes sense is if the draft is pre-determined thing, where the players drafted end up being the exact amount of good their draft position dictates.  Since that is impossible, and because drafting is a crap shoot, "value" draft analysis becomes the worst sort of insight.  Especially since it doesn't consider positional need, other team's needs, and philosophical approach.  

[Not at the table Karlos]

31 minutes ago, Dadonkadonk said:

So far trading up for Edmunds looks like a wasted pick. They could have found a LB in the second round and had another high draft pick for the OL.

Poor choice by Beane to trade up.

Edmunds the player however has been fine. If he continues to get better he can be the anchor the defense needs for the next 5-7 years. And still only be 27. Amazing.

So is he fine or a wasted pick?

[billspro]

35 minutes ago, Dadonkadonk said:

So far trading up for Edmunds looks like a wasted pick. They could have found a LB in the second round and had another high draft pick for the OL.

Poor choice by Beane to trade up.

Edmunds the player however has been fine. If he continues to get better he can be the anchor the defense needs for the next 5-7 years. And still only be 27. Amazing.

He’s so young, the fact he can play in the league at his age is amazing. 3 years from now he will still be younger than some rookies.

[Kwai San]

49 minutes ago, RoyBatty is alive said:

Edmunds, just like Allen is a physical freak, both were "projects" and grading them at this point doesn't make much sense.  Edmunds could be the ideal LB for the new pass happy NFL his with size &  incredibly long arms, he should be knocking down passes over the middle, pay attention Brady.

Brady on borrowed time now.....seriously one hit away from retirement.....

 

Edmunds however!  WOW....sky is the limit.....he will rock it long after LVE is done playing....

[Bing Bong]

1 hour ago, K-9 said:

I’m confused by the seeming contradiction between your first two paragraphs and the last. 

I assume he's saying we could have acquired the same talent without trading up and getting someone else rounds 2 or staying pat for a LB.. feels after Edmunds and LVE LB would have been a reach where we were at if they were taken. I can't think of what linebackers at the spot we were in or after are looking better (and I can't get to this list either) but I assume Edmunds is behind LVE and I can't think of any other rookie LBs that have outperformed Edmunds.

 

But that's assuming Edmunds and LVE get taken before we'd have picked. I'd assume one of those guys would have been available anyway if we stayed pat. Wondering since it seems like the Cowboys were sold on LVE over Edmunds from the get go that we could have gotten Edmunds without trading up. Idk if any other teams had a burning desire for a LB between. It's splitting hairs, we traded up for the guy we wanted obviously and it was important enough not to wait for him to fall anymore.

Edited December 12, 2018 by PetermanThrew5Picks

[Baba Booey]

The rumor out there was San Diego wanted Edmunds thats why Buffalo jumped up just in front of them to grab him.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

1 hour ago, Dadonkadonk said:

So far trading up for Edmunds looks like a wasted pick.

 

Of course..... One guys opinion and arbitrary ranking 13 games into their rookie season pretty much sets everything in stone. 

[Chuck Wagon]

Is this the part where I grumble to no one in particular that we could have had DJ Moore or Calvin Ridley, plus Fred Warner instead of just Edmunds?

[Rufridr101]

He's the 6th rated middle linebacker in this class because lack of instincts. They should play him in Milano's spot and unleash his athletic ability. He is young and might develop better instincts but right now he's not there.

[Bob Chandler's Hands]

2 hours ago, Dadonkadonk said:

So far trading up for Edmunds looks like a wasted pick. They could have found a LB in the second round and had another high draft pick for the OL.

Poor choice by Beane to trade up.

Edmunds the player however has been fine. If he continues to get better he can be the anchor the defense needs for the next 5-7 years. And still only be 27. Amazing.

This post makes complete sense to me. The first paragraph is judging the trade Beane made to move up to get Edmunds. Assessment is not worth it. 
Whereas the 2nd paragraph is ignoring the question of how he was obtained and simply stating he's a good player. 

A similar argument could be:

Trading two number 1's for Sammy Watkins was a bad trade by the Bills

Sammy Watkins is a good player. 

[DtownB2]

1 hour ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

 

Of course..... One guys opinion and arbitrary ranking 13 games into their rookie season pretty much sets everything in stone. 

especially considering the dude is only 20.. only three of those players were 21 the rest 22 or 23.

[LeGOATski]

1 hour ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

 

Of course..... One guys opinion and arbitrary ranking 13 games into their rookie season pretty much sets everything in stone. 

Is this your first time on a fan message board?

 

That poster simply provided his opinion. A terrible, stupid opinion, but an opinion nonetheless.

[C.Biscuit97]

I’m really not worried about TE but they put a lot on him.  It’s rarely smart to trade up for a non qb.  He needs to become an elite type MLB to really justify it, which is harder than fans think.  But at the absolutely worse, he will be a really good OLB.

 

also, I still think the Browns should have drafted Chubb.  That would improve your secondary.  It’s early but that’s a really good defensive draft. 

[Big Turk]

2 hours ago, Dadonkadonk said:

So far trading up for Edmunds looks like a wasted pick. They could have found a LB in the second round and had another high draft pick for the OL.

Poor choice by Beane to trade up.

Edmunds the player however has been fine. If he continues to get better he can be the anchor the defense needs for the next 5-7 years. And still only be 27. Amazing.

 

And yet the veteran defensive players speak in almost awe of him and say he will be a future hall of famer when he is done...

 

And we are worried about his first season as a 20 year old...SMFH

Edited December 12, 2018 by matter2003

[John from Riverside]

3 hours ago, Dadonkadonk said:

So far trading up for Edmunds looks like a wasted pick. They could have found a LB in the second round and had another high draft pick for the OL.

Poor choice by Beane to trade up.

Edmunds the player however has been fine. If he continues to get better he can be the anchor the defense needs for the next 5-7 years. And still only be 27. Amazing.

???????

Its a wasted pick

 

but if you dont use the draft pick on him someone else will and they he will be THEIR 12th best player or whatever?

 

Im so confused

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

1 hour ago, LeGOATski said:

Is this your first time on a fan message board?

 

That poster simply provided his opinion. A terrible, stupid opinion, but an opinion nonetheless.

 

Is this your first time?

 

People often tend to react to poorly founded opinions by injecting perspective. Or at least it’s commonplace here.  

 

Welcome btw.  

[mjt328]

When judging a draft pick, I think it's fair to look at the player who was selected -- as well as any other players who could have been selected instead. 

It's also fair to criticize a GM for trading up, if it's eventually shown the move was not necessary.

 

However, it's not fair to judge any player so early into his career.

Whether good or bad.

 

Let's see how Tremaine Edmunds stacks up on this list 3-4 years down the road.

 

 

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

Does Andy ever give the Bills any credit?  

 

It seems every very time I see his name it’s not to compliment them. 

[LSHMEAB]

5 hours ago, billspro said:

He’s so young, the fact he can play in the league at his age is amazing. 3 years from now he will still be younger than some rookies.

Didn't we say the same thing about Watkins?

 

There's no guarantee that he'll improve any more than a 22 year old would be expected to improve.

 

I need to see more of a killer instinct from Edmunds. He seems like a nice kid and that's not a compliment for a MLB.

[26CornerBlitz]

12-12: Tremaine Edmunds on One Bills Live (9:27)

[MJS]

6 hours ago, Dadonkadonk said:

So far trading up for Edmunds looks like a wasted pick. They could have found a LB in the second round and had another high draft pick for the OL.

Poor choice by Beane to trade up.

Edmunds the player however has been fine. If he continues to get better he can be the anchor the defense needs for the next 5-7 years. And still only be 27. Amazing.

 

Thanks, captain hindsight.

6 hours ago, Pete said:

Not bad for a 20 year old kid.  We might of overpaid for Edwards.  Time will tell.  But imagine if we traded up for Derwin James?  He went one pick later, and is the prototype safety we are looking for

 

Why would we look for a safety? We have two good safeties. That would have been a dumb pick.

1 hour ago, mjt328 said:

When judging a draft pick, I think it's fair to look at the player who was selected -- as well as any other players who could have been selected instead. 

It's also fair to criticize a GM for trading up, if it's eventually shown the move was not necessary.

 

However, it's not fair to judge any player so early into his career.

Whether good or bad.

 

Let's see how Tremaine Edmunds stacks up on this list 3-4 years down the road.

 

Judging with hindsight is also unfair, though. I mean, every team epically failed to draft Tom Brady until he was taken in the 6th. You just never know how players will turn out.

[Pete]

5 minutes ago, MJS said:

 

Thanks, captain hindsight.

 

Why would we look for a safety? We have two good safeties. That would have been a dumb pick.

whats wrong with 3 great safetys?  Every team has 3 safety packages.  Derwin would be an upgrade over Raphael Bush.  Derwin is a hybrid lb/s pass rushing machine.  And the best defensive rookie in this class

[billspro]

28 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said:

Didn't we say the same thing about Watkins?

 

There's no guarantee that he'll improve any more than a 22 year old would be expected to improve.

 

I need to see more of a killer instinct from Edmunds. He seems like a nice kid and that's not a compliment for a MLB.

 

I don’t think Edmunds has even filled out yet. I would say for most athletes they hit their prime between 23-27. So I would expect him to develop a lot still. Similar to ever teenager that plays in the NHL.  

 

Watkins issue has more to do with his foot. He hasn’t been healthy in years and I don’t know if his foot will ever be the same. 

[26CornerBlitz]

2 minutes ago, billspro said:

 

I don’t think Edmunds has even filled out yet. I would say for most athletes they hit their prime between 23-27. So I would expect him to develop a lot still. Similar to ever teenager that plays in the NHL.  

 

Watkins issue has more to do with his foot. He hasn’t been healthy in years and I don’t know if his foot will ever be the same. 

 

He was actually healthy last season and it's not the same foot that he's having issues with this season. 

[C.Biscuit97]

35 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said:

Didn't we say the same thing about Watkins?

 

There's no guarantee that he'll improve any more than a 22 year old would be expected to improve.

 

I need to see more of a killer instinct from Edmunds. He seems like a nice kid and that's not a compliment for a MLB.

Watkins was one of the best college receivers I have ever seen.  In that one stretch with Tyrod, he was a top 10 receiver.  Since he came back from the first injury, it hasn’t been the same. 

 

And in today’s nfl, you don’t need to be a killer MLB (apparently Dick Butkus played on all really bad teams).  But I do think some fans underestimate how much natural instincts it takes to be a great MLB.  It’s why very average athletes like Zach Thomas can become really good players.  The ability to diagnosis a play quickly is a skill.  TE doesn’t have those instincts yet.

[Alphadawg7]

6 hours ago, Dadonkadonk said:

So far trading up for Edmunds looks like a wasted pick. They could have found a LB in the second round and had another high draft pick for the OL.

Poor choice by Beane to trade up.

Edmunds the player however has been fine. If he continues to get better he can be the anchor the defense needs for the next 5-7 years. And still only be 27. Amazing.

 

Huh?  Since when does part of a rookie season dictate a career arc?  There are reasons they chose Edmunds, and Edmunds was graded by mostly everyone higher than any of the LBs that went after him.  He is far from a "wasted" pick right now.  

 

I dont understand why fans act like the GM should have some crystal ball and know what remaining player on the board will have have the best career over every other remaining prospect.  Its never happened, will never happen, and is impossible.  

 

When I look at our draft, I see us grabbing 2 top 15 prospects withOUT giving up any future draft capital.  I see those 2 prospects showing the potential on Sundays.  I see rookie mistakes too...as they are rookies.  I also see Taron, Teller, and Phillips...3 more guys who look they can contribute to this team.  

 

We had a good draft.  Who cares if another guy after one of our guys had a faster start to their career.  LVE also plays on a vastly more talented team and gets more media attention because its the Cowboys.  We won't know how good Edmunds will be for another year or two.  I mean the kid cant even buy a legal beer yet.  

[26CornerBlitz]

 

[billspro]

6 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

He was actually healthy last season and it's not the same foot that he's having issues with this season. 

 

He’s not the same player that he was before the injury, not even close.

[C.Biscuit97]

2 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Huh?  Since when does part of a rookie season dictate a career arc?  There are reasons they chose Edmunds, and Edmunds was graded by mostly everyone higher than any of the LBs that went after him.  He is far from a "wasted" pick right now.  

 

I dont understand why fans act like the GM should have some crystal ball and know what remaining player on the board will have have the best career over every other remaining prospect.  Its never happened, will never happen, and is impossible.  

 

When I look at our draft, I see us grabbing 2 top 15 prospects withOUT giving up any future draft capital.  I see those 2 prospects showing the potential on Sundays.  I see rookie mistakes too...as they are rookies.  I also see Taron, Teller, and Phillips...3 more guys who look they can contribute to this team.  

 

We had a good draft.  Who cares if another guy after one of our guys had a faster start to their career.  LVE also plays on a vastly more talented team and gets more media attention because its the Cowboys.  We won't know how good Edmunds will be for another year or two.  I mean the kid cant even buy a legal beer yet.  

I overall agree with your post but isn’t the whole job of a GM to have more of a crystal ball than fans?!?

 

when you trade up for a non qb twice in twice drafts, which the previous GM used to criticize for, and possibly better players get chosen in the original draft spot, you should be open for criticism.  That said, I’m not worried about TE. 

2 minutes ago, billspro said:

 

He’s not the same player that he was before the injury, not even close.

I generally agree but he wasn’t playing well before he went out again.  But the lesson is never rush back earlier on a foot injury.  It is a sneaky kill of athlete’s careers.

[26CornerBlitz]

3 minutes ago, billspro said:

 

He’s not the same player that he was before the injury, not even close.

 

He's certianly not as productive as he was in those 1st two Bills' seasons. 

[LSHMEAB]

8 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Watkins was one of the best college receivers I have ever seen.  In that one stretch with Tyrod, he was a top 10 receiver.  Since he came back from the first injury, it hasn’t been the same. 

 

And in today’s nfl, you don’t need to be a killer MLB (apparently Dick Butkus played on all really bad teams).  But I do think some fans underestimate how much natural instincts it takes to be a great MLB.  It’s why very average athletes like Zach Thomas can become really good players.  The ability to diagnosis a play quickly is a skill.  TE doesn’t have those instincts yet.

I get what you're saying, but I tend to prefer front 7 players with a mean streak. I haven't seen that yet from TE. Maybe he needs to face some adversity to get "angry" out there. I'm actually a big Watkins fan so he probably wasn't the best example to use.

[Alphadawg7]

Just now, C.Biscuit97 said:

I overall agree with your post but isn’t the whole job of a GM to have more of a crystal ball than fans?!?

 

when you trade up for a non qb twice in twice drafts, which the previous GM used to criticize for, and possibly better players get chosen in the original draft spot, you should be open for criticism.  That said, I’m not worried about TE. 

 

I get what you are saying, and don't necessarily disagree with you.  But I have never agreed with the notion you only trade up for QB's.  You see a guy that you covet, especially one you believe can anchor your D for a long time, by all means go get him.  Also, systems and styles are different, just because one guy is working out in one system doesn't mean he is the ideal fit for the other system.  

 

So for me, McBeane have shown they can find talent in a draft with McD finding guys like Tre and Milano the year before, and then this year to maneuver around and land 2 first round picks without having to give up future draft capital.  Then also still grabbing guys like Taron, Teller and Phillips who show signs of being contributors or better around here.  

 

NOW...that being said, had Beane mortgaged the future to get Edmunds and traded away a lot of future draft capital, then I would get the heavier criticism now.  But I look at the overall draft, and right now I can say I feel both good and confident about it.  There is almost always going to be someone after that player that has a better career.  All that matters is that Edmunds becomes a good player for us, not what the other guys do after he was taken, who play in different schemes with different coaches and personnel around them.