EJ Manuel Consults Big Names on how to Lead

[Hapless Bills Fan]

Discuss, please:

 

Linky

 

1) a sign that news is freakin' slow this time of year and the papers are beating the bushes frantically to flush out articles?

 

2) a PR-savvy move by a young Bills QB desperate to be perceived as The Man

 

3) something every young NFL QB does, we just don't hear about it when the team is winning?

 

 

My take: on the one hand, I'm glad EJ is (at least by report) willing to accept mentoring and guidance. Far better this than a know-it-all Leaf or JaBustus.

 

On the gripping hand, I can't imagine Jim Kelly or Peyton Manning wandering the league with a lantern, looking for a better QB to show them how to be a leader.

Leadership in a fast-paced game is so complex, it's hard to define, we just know it when we see it.

[#34fan]

Little disappointed that you misspelled our starting QB's name, but I'll bite.

 

To lead effectively, EJ has to move the chains in all situations... He also NEEDS to make ALL the throws. Even the 50/50 ones through traffic.. He can't screw up. He's gotta be the answer and not the question mark.

 

Walk the walk EJ... There's no other way.

Edited May 2, 2014 by #34fan

[GunnerBill]

I don't believe you can learn leadership. What #34 says above to an extent is true, that playing well will gain him the respect of his teammates but leadership is about more than that. Joe Flacco is a Superbowl winning QB... he isn't a leader, the leaders on that team were all on the defense. Playing great and leading are not the same.

 

Ryan Fitzpartick was a good leader. He wasn't a good enough Quarterback.

[eball]

I think John Kryk had a deadline to meet. Fluff piece. Nothing wrong with it, but hardly newsworthy. We already knew EJ is a conscientious guy and hard worker who wants to get better. Only 6 days to go for some real news.

[Food_Pyramid_Wrong]

Execute.

 

Everything else will fall into place.

 

Bottom line is either you're good enough or you're not.

 

The organization can help this immensely by not asking too much from Manuel, much like in Seattle.

[Beerball]

Execute.

 

Everything else will fall into place.

 

Bottom line is either you're good enough or you're not.

 

The organization can help this immensely by not asking too much from Manuel, much like in Seattle.

I don't disagree, but, this hinges on a couple things.

 

Can our defense dominate games? (Schwartz gives me the heebee jeebees but I REALLY hope I'm wrong)

Can the offense do enough to stay in and win games? (need 1 o-line starter at minimum)

Can EJ stay healthy if not asked to do too much?

 

 

The coaching staff really dialed things back towards the end of last season. I think that they finally got an idea of what EJ was good at and what he struggled with. They did attempt to slow down the game a bit for him.

 

Hopefully he has progressed well this off season and the team has gotten better around him.

 

To hopeful's question...my first impression was that if you have to ask someone else how to be a leader than you aren't one. Given some thought though...how many CEO's have read at least one 'self help' book? I'd guess many have so good for EJ.

 

Finally...the view from outside of the huddle...I never saw EJ as lacking leadership, I saw him lacking execution based on mechanics and vision. If he questioned his leadership I wonder if there was some chirping in the locker room?

 

Little disappointed that you misspelled our starting QB's name, but I'll bite.

auto-correct is a B word

[Kellyto83TD]

I don't remember Jim Kelly seeking out anyone asking them how to lead. Or marino, or Elway, Montana and on and on and on. This kid is starting to worry me even more.He is seeking Russel Wilson? Who did Wilson seek?

 

See I have felt leaders are born, they are just natural at it. This kid seems to me is trying to manufacture the 'IT' factor. Most great QB's have an edge, cocky etc. EJ seems to passive and too nice. If he tries to fake what he doesn't have then his team mates will know.

 

I would just tell the kid quit talking to other people and be you. Stay on the field, and WIN. If you can WIN it will take care of most of the rest.

[Ronin]

Execute.

 

Everything else will fall into place.

 

Bottom line is either you're good enough or you're not.

 

The organization can help this immensely by not asking too much from Manuel, much like in Seattle.

 

What do you mean "not asking too much from Manuel, much like in Seattle?"

 

Wilson's done a ton there.

 

This is QB in the NFL, much is expected. The job ain't for weenies.

 

Leaders are what leaders do. Be eratic and inconsistent, with gross inaccuracy issues, poor decision making, and the inability to string 4, or at least 3, quarters of good solid football together, and good luck being a leader, at least an effective leader.

[BigBuff423]

Discuss, please:

 

Linky

 

1) a sign that news is freakin' slow this time of year and the papers are beating the bushes frantically to flush out articles?

 

2) a PR-savvy move by a young Bills QB desperate to be perceived as The Man

 

3) something every young NFL QB does, we just don't hear about it when the team is winning?

 

 

My take: on the one hand, I'm glad EJ is (at least by report) willing to accept mentoring and guidance. Far better this than a know-it-all Leaf or JaBustus.

 

On the gripping hand, I can't imagine Jim Kelly or Peyton Manning wandering the league with a lantern, looking for a better QB to show them how to be a leader.

Leadership in a fast-paced game is so complex, it's hard to define, we just know it when we see it.

 

To me, charisma is natural and bestowed at birth but leadership - to some extent - can be learned and it certainly can be refined. There are a great many books and seminars devoted to this very thing and some of the best leaders, take time to invest in their own development. Now, on field leadership occurs in winning and to that point I agree with the opinions posted so far, but to say that leadership can't be refined, honed, or enhanced based on an objective input and evaluation while providing some critical insight, in my mind is inaccurate. But, to each his own...and if I remember correctly, one of the things both Doug Whaley and his staff agreed with Mike Mayock on before last year's Draft when all the discussions were circling, was that EJ had a "presence" about him when he walked in a room. To me, that is natural, but some of the aspects of good leadership can be learned or developed.

[GunnerBill]

I don't remember Jim Kelly seeking out anyone asking them how to lead. Or marino, or Elway, Montana and on and on and on. This kid is starting to worry me even more.He is seeking Russel Wilson? Who did Wilson seek?

 

See I have felt leaders are born, they are just natural at it. This kid seems to me is trying to manufacture the 'IT' factor. Most great QB's have an edge, cocky etc. EJ seems to passive and too nice. If he tries to fake what he doesn't have then his team mates will know.

 

I would just tell the kid quit talking to other people and be you. Stay on the field, and WIN. If you can WIN it will take care of most of the rest.

 

I agree. I don't think "It" factor and leadership are completely the same thing mind you, but you can't manufacture leadership. It's there or it ain't.

 

But not being a leader doesn't stop you being a successful Quarterback... although I think it makes it more difficult.

[mrags]

People that say the Kelly's, Marinos, and Montana's of the world didn't ask how to be a leader are fools. I'm sure they all seeked some sort of help while starting out.

 

And for every Kelly, Marino and Montana there's an Eli, Payton, Marsha, Big Ben that did seek help. It seems like more and more now, players are seeking help from the veterans of the league. Payton always talks about how he helped you get QBs with certain things. And if the Marinos, Kelly's, and Montana's of the world didn't seek help, maybe it's because back then, you weren't expected to start right away and perform well enough for a playoff run within your first 2 years or hit the road.

 

Montana took some time

 

Kelly got a few years experience in the USFL first (similar to baseball or hockey's minor league systems)

 

Marino and Elway were arguably the best ever.

 

And to talk of 4 HOF QBs that all had to battle one another all the time didn't hurt them at the time. One can argue that the best age ever in QBing was in the late 80s to early 90s. That type of competition alone didn't hurt them.

 

 

In the end, I can't imagine any QB asking for hints and tips in every corner of his game can be a bad thing.

 

Freaking NFL screwing up the draft is pissing me off.

[Best Player Available]

I don't remember Jim Kelly seeking out anyone asking them how to lead. Or marino, or Elway, Montana and on and on and on. This kid is starting to worry me even more.He is seeking Russel Wilson? Who did Wilson seek?

 

See I have felt leaders are born, they are just natural at it. This kid seems to me is trying to manufacture the 'IT' factor. Most great QB's have an edge, cocky etc. EJ seems to passive and too nice. If he tries to fake what he doesn't have then his team mates will know.

 

I would just tell the kid quit talking to other people and be you. Stay on the field, and WIN. If you can WIN it will take care of most of the rest.

Articles like that fluff may drive his IPO price down. he should be careful, wall st. Hates weakness perceived or otherwise.

[MarkAF43]

I'm not sure I see where everyone is making a big deal out of leaders are born etc. Manuel is doing what he can to improve on his craft, and seek out ways to improve at his career. It's similiar to what most of us would do in our own jobs. He's striving to improve. Personally, I'd be more concerned if he wasn't doing any of these things in his free time.

[K-9]

Little disappointed that you misspelled our starting QB's name, but I'll bite.

 

To lead effectively, EJ has to move the chains in all situations... He also NEEDS to make ALL the throws. Even the 50/50 ones through traffic.. He can't screw up. He's gotta be the answer and not the question mark.

 

Walk the walk EJ... There's no other way.

 

He can't screw up? Brace yourself then, because he's gonna screw up plenty of times, sometimes at the most inopportune moment.

 

The most important aspect of a QB screwing up, is how he comes back from it. Like during a Monday night game vs. the Bengals when Kelly choked and threw 3 INTs in the first quarter, only to rebound and throw for 5 TDs to win the game. Or going to Pittsburgh or KC on a Monday night and getting embarrassed completely only to come back in the next games to rebound.

 

Get ready to pull your hair out over Manuel's seeming lack of ability.

 

But also get ready to marvel at the great plays he's gonna make as well.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[Dorkington]

I bet Mark Sanchez did it too, so EJ sucks.

[Campy]

It seems some of you didn't actually read the article.

 

It's pretty clear to me that EJ didn't go around literally asking people "How do I be a leader" but instead picked their brain for information and tips and the article mentions reading coverages and shifting protections specifically.

 

Those are abilities most QBs acquire only with experience. And once they do acquire them, they are in a position to be better leaders. So, what's the harm in that? Why is that a bad thing?

 

And as for you "Gee, I don't remember Kelly doing that" folks, just give me a freaking break. First off, how would you know? Were you such a big Gamblers fan back in the early 80s that you know with 100% certainty he never reached out to a more experienced QB for guidance? Secondly, does that mean every Bills QB has to be equal to or better than JK to be considered anything but a flop?

 

Some of you - and we all know who you are - are so quick to pounce on any Bills news and spin your negatively it's predictably boring. Your contrarianism does not make you look smart or the least bit enlightened. In fact, it has quite the opposite effect.

Edited May 2, 2014 by Campy

[LB3]

So based on a few of comments I've seen, some believe that seeking knowledge from those with experience is a weakness??

 

It's not like the article says he asked each QB "How can I be a leader?"

 

Here's the breakdown:

 

Russell Wilson - A friend of his. You know, the 2nd year QB who just won a Super Bowl. I'd be upset if he didn't talk with him.

 

Drew Brees - Met at the Super Bowl and he asked him some questions. What good could possibly come from a conversation with another Super Bowl winning QB who had questions about his ability to be an NFL QB coming out of college, struggled in his first couple seasons, but worked his ass off and became an elite QB? No similarities there.

 

RG3 - Another friend of his. One who also had a knee injury. Why not ask him about the rehab process.

 

Kaep - He worked out with him for a couple weeks because Kaep is a workout warrior. Is getting in shape a bad thing?

 

 

The draft can't get here soon enough.

Edited May 2, 2014 by KikoSeeBallKikoGetBall

[mattsox]

Little disappointed that you misspelled our starting QB's name, but I'll bite.

 

To lead effectively, EJ has to move the chains in all situations... He also NEEDS to make ALL the throws. Even the 50/50 ones through traffic.. He can't screw up. He's gotta be the answer and not the question mark.

 

Walk the walk EJ... There's no other way.

 

Exactly. He Has to Put This Team on HIS BACK AND CARRY IT! If that happens only good things for the Bills!!!

[Dorkington]

So based on a few of comments I've seen, some believe that seeking knowledge from those with experience is a weakness??

 

It's not like the article says he asked each QB "How can I be a leader?"

 

Here's the breakdown:

 

Russell Wilson - A friend of his. You know, the 2nd year QB who just won a Super Bowl. I'd be upset if he didn't talk with him.

 

Drew Brees - Met at the Super Bowl and he asked him some questions. What good could possibly come from a conversation with another Super Bowl winning QB who had questions about his ability to be an NFL QB coming out of college, struggled in his first couple seasons, but worked his ass off and became an elite QB? No similarities there.

 

RG3 - Another friend of his. One who also had a knee injury. Why not ask him about the rehab process.

 

Kaep - He worked out with him for a couple weeks because Kaep is a workout warrior. Is getting in shape a bad thing?

 

 

The draft can't get here soon enough.

 

EJ wasn't a HoF QB and legendary leader his first season. Bust. Time to move on. Draft Tebow.

[C.Biscuit97]

Discuss, please:

 

Linky

 

1) a sign that news is freakin' slow this time of year and the papers are beating the bushes frantically to flush out articles?

 

2) a PR-savvy move by a young Bills QB desperate to be perceived as The Man

 

3) something every young NFL QB does, we just don't hear about it when the team is winning?

 

 

My take: on the one hand, I'm glad EJ is (at least by report) willing to accept mentoring and guidance. Far better this than a know-it-all Leaf or JaBustus.

 

On the gripping hand, I can't imagine Jim Kelly or Peyton Manning wandering the league with a lantern, looking for a better QB to show them how to be a leader.

Leadership in a fast-paced game is so complex, it's hard to define, we just know it when we see it.

 

Peyton had his father, who was a #1 pick in the NFL. Jim Kelly was 2 years older when he was a rookie.

 

I bet Mark Sanchez did it too, so EJ sucks.

 

It's simple math.

 

EJ wasn't a HoF QB and legendary leader his first season. Bust. Time to move on. Draft Tebow.

 

Agreed 1000%

 

I'm not sure I see where everyone is making a big deal out of leaders are born etc. Manuel is doing what he can to improve on his craft, and seek out ways to improve at his career. It's similiar to what most of us would do in our own jobs. He's striving to improve. Personally, I'd be more concerned if he wasn't doing any of these things in his free time.

 

Yup. It's also hilarious that some folks want him replaced after one year. I'm sure they'd want the same loyalty in their jobs as well.

[Mr. WEO]

What....no Dale Carnegie? No Tony Robbins?

[Heitz]

I don't remember Jim Kelly seeking out anyone asking them how to lead. Or marino, or Elway, Montana and on and on and on. This kid is starting to worry me even more.He is seeking Russel Wilson? Who did Wilson seek?

 

See I have felt leaders are born, they are just natural at it. This kid seems to me is trying to manufacture the 'IT' factor. Most great QB's have an edge, cocky etc. EJ seems to passive and too nice. If he tries to fake what he doesn't have then his team mates will know.

 

I would just tell the kid quit talking to other people and be you. Stay on the field, and WIN. If you can WIN it will take care of most of the rest.

 

You never fail find something negative out of something positive...

 

I definitely remember reading articles on how Wilson asked other QBs for advice, if you search you'll see where he reached to Bradshaw for Super Bowl advice - clearly a sign of incompetence.

 

How a young player / employee / student even asking advice of others can be seen as a bad thing is beyond me!

 

And yes, all leaders are born, there's no point in education (as seen in the business world with the 12 billion leadership and management seminars available), or even giving people time to grow into a leadership role. If you haven't won the Super Bowl by age 8 you probably don't have it and never will...

[Brandon]

I'd be a lot more concerned if he were sitting on his butt all through the offseason. This may or may not help him, but I'm not going to criticize a guy for making an effort to improve.

[BigBuff423]

I'd be a lot more concerned if he were sitting on his butt all through the offseason. This may or may not help him, but I'm not going to criticize a guy for making an effort to improve.

 

Reasoned balance...on this board...HAS NO PLACE!!! OFFFFFFF with your head!!

[C.Biscuit97]

You never fail find something negative out of something positive...

 

I definitely remember reading articles on how Wilson asked other QBs for advice, if you search you'll see where he reached to Bradshaw for Super Bowl advice - clearly a sign of incompetence.

 

How a young player / employee / student even asking advice of others can be seen as a bad thing is beyond me!

 

And yes, all leaders are born, there's no point in education (as seen in the business world with the 12 billion leadership and management seminars available), or even giving people time to grow into a leadership role. If you haven't won the Super Bowl by age 8 you probably don't have it and never will...

 

Good post. Through my work and general life experience, I'm a much better leader than I was 10 years ago.

[yungmack]

To me, charisma is natural and bestowed at birth but leadership - to some extent - can be learned and it certainly can be refined. There are a great many books and seminars devoted to this very thing and some of the best leaders, take time to invest in their own development. Now, on field leadership occurs in winning and to that point I agree with the opinions posted so far, but to say that leadership can't be refined, honed, or enhanced based on an objective input and evaluation while providing some critical insight, in my mind is inaccurate. But, to each his own...and if I remember correctly, one of the things both Doug Whaley and his staff agreed with Mike Mayock on before last year's Draft when all the discussions were circling, was that EJ had a "presence" about him when he walked in a room. To me, that is natural, but some of the aspects of good leadership can be learned or developed.

This is on the money.

[CountryCletus]

If you gotta ask.... you ain't go IT!!!

[YoloinOhio]

Just because you are born with leadership skills doesn't mean you can't seek mentors and to improve. I am impressed with everything EJ has done to try to be the franchise QB of the Bills. No one knows whether it will translate to a playoff berth but I can't see how it could hurt, Questioning whether Manning and Wilson did this doesn't make sense to me. Manning was oft-criticized in his early years for not taking accountability. They are all human.

[DerekJ]

People that say the Kelly's, Marinos, and Montana's of the world didn't ask how to be a leader are fools. I'm sure they all seeked some sort of help while starting out.

 

And for every Kelly, Marino and Montana there's an Eli, Payton, Marsha, Big Ben that did seek help. It seems like more and more now, players are seeking help from the veterans of the league. Payton always talks about how he helped you get QBs with certain things. And if the Marinos, Kelly's, and Montana's of the world didn't seek help, maybe it's because back then, you weren't expected to start right away and perform well enough for a playoff run within your first 2 years or hit the road.

 

Montana took some time

 

Kelly got a few years experience in the USFL first (similar to baseball or hockey's minor league systems)

 

Marino and Elway were arguably the best ever.

 

And to talk of 4 HOF QBs that all had to battle one another all the time didn't hurt them at the time. One can argue that the best age ever in QBing was in the late 80s to early 90s. That type of competition alone didn't hurt them.

 

 

In the end, I can't imagine any QB asking for hints and tips in every corner of his game can be a bad thing.

 

Freaking NFL screwing up the draft is pissing me off.

 

You should never have had to post this. Anyone, no matter the profession, who refuses to seek counsel from those who came before is foolish. Seeking guidance is essential to self improvement. Come on, people. SMH

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

I don't know what will happen on the field this year, but I'm impressed so far with what has transpired off of it this offseason.But, hopefully it translates.

[Buffaloed in Pa]

Either you have it. Or you don`t. Nuff said.

[thebandit27]

Either you have it. Or you don`t. Nuff said.

 

What does this even mean? You're either a great QB right away or you're not? Or did you not read the article?

[Buffaloed in Pa]

How to lead little bandit,How to lead.

[Beerball]

How to lead little bandit,How to lead.

So, I should stop trying to better myself?

 

When did you stop?

[Buffaloed in Pa]

Was waiting for that. What took so long. I`m doing fine. I`m not making millions, to have it.

[thebandit27]

How to lead little bandit,How to lead.

 

Strongly disagree...pick up a John Maxwell book and so too will you disagree with that statement.

 

Athletes are born; leaders are developed.

[Beerball]

Was waiting for that. What took so long. I`m doing fine. I`m not making millions, to have it.

and you didn't answer the questions

 

I'll ask another two...should a young person walk into the adult world with full knowledge of how the industry he is joining works? Should that young person seek out experienced individuals to help him understand what can make him the best at his chosen craft?

[Buffaloed in Pa]

Im good as it gets at this age. You keep trying. If you think you need to.Answered!

[Beerball]

Im good as it gets at this age. You keep trying. If you think you need to.Answered!

How very narrow of you.

 

When did you achieve perfection?

[Kellyto83TD]

People that say the Kelly's, Marinos, and Montana's of the world didn't ask how to be a leader are fools. I'm sure they all seeked some sort of help while starting out.

 

And for every Kelly, Marino and Montana there's an Eli, Payton, Marsha, Big Ben that did seek help. It seems like more and more now, players are seeking help from the veterans of the league. Payton always talks about how he helped you get QBs with certain things. And if the Marinos, Kelly's, and Montana's of the world didn't seek help, maybe it's because back then, you weren't expected to start right away and perform well enough for a playoff run within your first 2 years or hit the road.

 

Montana took some time

 

Kelly got a few years experience in the USFL first (similar to baseball or hockey's minor league systems)

 

Marino and Elway were arguably the best ever.

 

And to talk of 4 HOF QBs that all had to battle one another all the time didn't hurt them at the time. One can argue that the best age ever in QBing was in the late 80s to early 90s. That type of competition alone didn't hurt them.

 

 

In the end, I can't imagine any QB asking for hints and tips in every corner of his game can be a bad thing.

 

Freaking NFL screwing up the draft is pissing me off.

But Mrags Kelly, Marino, Elway etal are exactly what we need EJ to be. With out that type of performance we can't get to let alone win a superbowl. Caepernick has it naturally and look where he has gotten SF, wilson too. Our guy is calling those young guys?

 

No offense but that scares the hell out of me. The #1 thing that bothers me about EJ was some article that came out last year where Marrone had to try and get him fired up. Something like he is too laid back. I am seriously wondering if we don't have a Todd Marinovich where he wanted to make it to the NFL Then when he did...

 

I like EJ, I liked the pick mostly, but this kid has yet to show me he can 1) Get pumped up about anything and get passionate, 2) stay healthy, 3) read defenses. #1 knock coming out was slow to read defenses and honestly guys we saw that all last year other than a couple big plays.

 

I do want to say this, Some fans say 'yeah but Capernick, Wilson, Rothlesberger etal are rare'. Well yeah, so was Jim Kelly but we had JK and that is the #1 Reason this team turned it around. We NEED a top end talent like those guys mentioned. I hope its EJ but I see a new owner telling Whaley to take a new QB next year.