Great article on Zay Jones

[hellofellowbillsfans]

Hi all, I've read some of Ty's work and this is fantastic. It's a great article about Zay Jones that's absolutely worth the read. So happy for him and so happy he's found his purpose and turned his life around!

 

https://www.golongtd.com/p/im-still-alive-the-zay-jones-story

[BADOLBILZ]

 

One thing that hasn't changed.........he's still "Drop-Zone" Jones.

 

Only receiver in the NFL to drop more passes than Gabe last year..........just did it on a lot more targets.

 

Remarkable that the Bills drafted the two worst ball droppers in the league in Zay and Gabe...........claimed McKenzie who was a near historic fumble factory in Denver and had a Gabe-esque drop rate last season........and drafted Knox who has been a work in progress wrt hands..........goes too show you that early in a teams development the finer points of the game can get overlooked.    

 

I expect Zay will wear out his welcome fairly quick in Jax if he doesn't fix the dropsies.   Expectations and windows of opportunity change the perspective.

 

 

[Dablitzkrieg]

1 minute ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

One thing that hasn't changed.........he's still "Drop-Zone" Jones.

 

Only receiver in the NFL to drop more passes than Gabe last year..........just did it on a lot more targets.

 

Remarkable that the Bills drafted the two worst ball droppers in the league in Zay and Gabe...........claimed McKenzie who was a near historic fumble factory in Denver and had a Gabe-esque drop rate last season........and drafted Knox who has been a work in progress wrt hands..........goes too show you that early in a teams development the finer points of the game can get overlooked.    

 

I expect Zay will wear out his welcome fairly quick in Jax if he doesn't fix the dropsies.   Expectations and windows of opportunity change the perspective.

 

 

I think you totally missed the point

[hellofellowbillsfans]

1 minute ago, Dablitzkrieg said:

I think you totally missed the point

LOL. that just seems like one angry Bills fan. 

 

I mean, these guys are also humans too

[boyst]

8 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

One thing that hasn't changed.........he's still "Drop-Zone" Jones.

 

Only receiver in the NFL to drop more passes than Gabe last year..........just did it on a lot more targets.

 

Remarkable that the Bills drafted the two worst ball droppers in the league in Zay and Gabe...........claimed McKenzie who was a near historic fumble factory in Denver and had a Gabe-esque drop rate last season........and drafted Knox who has been a work in progress wrt hands..........goes too show you that early in a teams development the finer points of the game can get overlooked.    

 

I expect Zay will wear out his welcome fairly quick in Jax if he doesn't fix the dropsies.   Expectations and windows of opportunity change the perspective.

 

 

100% truth. 

4 minutes ago, BillsFanInRaleigh said:

LOL. that just seems like one angry Bills fan. 

 

I mean, these guys are also humans too

We are on a football message board, not a hug, kiss and celebrate life message board.  In most cases these guys mean nothing more to us than the laundry they wear. That is unless you're wondering what Pooh Williams is up to these days, or Damien Conington, or Mark Pike, or Keith McKellar.

 

Zay Jones is by all accounts a good dude. He is good friends with my steps sons 2nd grade teacher. While we all should applaud growth, happiness, and personal development we are here to discuss the realities of football.

 

That reality is Jones has struggled with fundamentals of the game and it set our team back. This is not a personal statement - this is a professional statement. 

[Gugny]

3 minutes ago, boyst said:

100% truth. We are on a football message board, not a hug, kiss and celebrate life message board. 

That all goes out the window at the TBDAHOT. 

[SWATeam]

15 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Only receiver in the NFL to drop more passes than Gabe last year..........just did it on a lot more targets.

 

Cooper and Chase did as well.

[boyst]

Just now, Gugny said:

That all goes out the window at the TBDAHOT. 

i used vomit emogie because there was no love or eggplant emogie.

[hellofellowbillsfans]

11 minutes ago, boyst said:

100% truth. 

We are on a football message board, not a hug, kiss and celebrate life message board.  In most cases these guys mean nothing more to us than the laundry they wear. That is unless you're wondering what Pooh Williams is up to these days, or Damien Conington, or Mark Pike, or Keith McKellar.

 

Zay Jones is by all accounts a good dude. He is good friends with my steps sons 2nd grade teacher. While we all should applaud growth, happiness, and personal development we are here to discuss the realities of football.

 

That reality is Jones has struggled with fundamentals of the game and it set our team back. This is not a personal statement - this is a professional statement. 

I would not argue that it set our team back. The reality was Zay stepped into a role on a team that neither he - or the team - was ready for. That team was atrocious, talent wise. Zay was never a #1 and he never should have been.

 

I would instead argue that we do care about the players' personal lives, and we should. That is what separates Buffalo from these other commercially-driven franchises. It's in the core DNA of the city. Do you think anyone was thinking about Dawson Knox's rookie season drops last year when his brother died? Doubt it. That's what separates us as fans in Buffalo. 

 

While I do agree that it's fair to say that Zay was largely a bust in Buffalo, it's also fair to be happy for him finding success and stability when he didn't have either here.

Edited June 23, 2023 by BillsFanInRaleigh

[BADOLBILZ]

10 minutes ago, Dablitzkrieg said:

I think you totally missed the point

 

Not at all........it's good that he got over that night but I have plenty of friends that have gotten trashed one night in their lives and done things that could have resulted in their death if things had gone differently.     It's ultimately a human interest piece that cuts A LOT of corners.......like buying that he didn't know if he was intoxicated or with what.......or that the game losing drop in Carolina was an outrageous ask(ignoring the fact that the turf monster tackled him causing him to not be where he was supposed to be).   That's just some of it.   Lotta' excuses made to create a narrative of Jones as a victim of circumstance so that Dunne can prop him up for doing better.   He and his family were a weird, awkward presence when he was here in Buffalo.  That combined with his play made him a must move and a big draft bust for the regime.   Good for him that he is happier but his main issue on the football field remains even as he gets more run.   That's MY point.   

[Punching Bag]

11 minutes ago, boyst said:

That reality is Jones has struggled with fundamentals of the game and it set our team back. This is not a personal statement - this is a professional statement. 

 

Jones struggled because Coach McD hired his college WR coach as his NFL WR coach.  He had been a NFL WR coach several times before and in each case he returned to college because he was not able to elevate WRs game. He lasted one year with Bills.  I posted about this when he was signed from Eastern Carolina eliminating from staff a WR coach all of the WRs thought was doing a good job.   

[BADOLBILZ]

13 minutes ago, SWATeam said:

Cooper and Chase did as well.

 

Correct Zay lead all NFL wide receivers in drops and drop %.

 

Gabe was second in drop %.

 

So not 1-2 in total drops but in drop %.

[JohnNord]

48 minutes ago, BillsFanInRaleigh said:

Hi all, I've read some of Ty's work and this is fantastic. It's a great article about Zay Jones that's absolutely worth the read. So happy for him and so happy he's found his purpose and turned his life around!

 

https://www.golongtd.com/p/im-still-alive-the-zay-jones-story

It was a very good article and it makes you glad Zay his career and life around.

 

The only gripe about the article is that it never answered the question we all were asking - what kind of drugs was Zay Jones on?

 

He admitted to taking something but didn’t know what he was given.  He also refused the toxicology report to avoid potential trouble.   It was implied that fans were wrong to call him out for drug use - but they weren’t wrong - he was on something 

[hellofellowbillsfans]

5 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Not at all........it's good that he got over that night but I have plenty of friends that have gotten trashed one night in their lives and done things that could have resulted in their death if things had gone differently.     It's ultimately a human interest piece that cuts A LOT of corners.......like buying that he didn't know if he was intoxicated or with what.......or that the game losing drop in Carolina was an outrageous ask(ignoring the fact that the turf monster tackled him causing him to not be where he was supposed to be).   That's just some of it.   Lotta' excuses made to create a narrative of Jones as a victim of circumstance so that Dunne can prop him up for doing better.   He and his family were a weird, awkward presence when he was here in Buffalo.  That combined with his play made him a must move and a big draft bust for the regime.   Good for him that he is happier but his main issue on the football field remains even as he gets more run.   That's MY point.   

This is a bit of a lazy take IMO. Yes, his drop  % was high last year, on more targets, but in 2018 it was 2.9% on 100+ targets (with inaccurate Josh throwing to him). It was also low in 2020 and 2021 with LV. It's not like he's this +10% drop player every year. 

 

He had a bad drop year in 2017 and last year.

 

What's wrong with him not wanting to discuss a horrific night that almost killed him in an article that's going to get displayed to the world?

[Airseven]

I was shocked he hung around in the league. Good for him.

[PBF81]

Great post/link BFIR!!

 

Excellent read!

 

I hope that Jones flourishes in Jax with Lawrence.  

 

Thanks for posting!  

 

 

9 minutes ago, JohnNord said:

The only gripe about the article is that it never answered the question we all were asking - what kind of drugs was Zay Jones on?

 

Sounds as if he may not be sure either.  

 

Entirely understandable that he doesn't want to talk about it though.  

 

 

[BADOLBILZ]

4 minutes ago, BillsFanInRaleigh said:

This is a bit of a lazy take IMO. Yes, his drop  % was high last year, on more targets, but in 2018 it was 2.9% on 100+ targets (with inaccurate Josh throwing to him). It was also low in 2020 and 2021 with LV. It's not like he's this +10% drop player every year. 

 

He had a bad drop year in 2017 and last year.

 

What's wrong with him not wanting to discuss a horrific night that almost killed him in an article that's going to get displayed to the world?

 

First of all 10% isn't "a bad drop year".   It's as bad as it gets kinda' drop year and he was at 10% in both 2020 and 2022.........so both seasons post "fighting for Jesus" or whatever it was that he said when he was trashed that night.

 

And you're right they should have just left the "horrific night" out entirely.      "Inconsistency can't keep Zay Jones down" alone isn't particularly compelling though.

[mushypeaches]

At our local Bills Backers bar, early on we adopted saying "OK Zay!" whenever he made a play. 

They were few and far between, so the tone of our exclamation ended up being more surprised than excited. 

As if it was a reminder that he was actually still on the team and taking snaps.

 

I re-watch a lot of game on NFL Network from the 2017 and later era, and still chuckle and shout "OK Zay!" at the TV when he makes a catch.

Alcohol definitely helps my enthusiasm there...

[hellofellowbillsfans]

11 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

First of all 10% isn't "a bad drop year".   It's as bad as it gets kinda' drop year and he was at 10% in both 2020 and 2022.........so both seasons post "fighting for Jesus" or whatever it was that he said when he was trashed that night.

 

And you're right they should have just left the "horrific night" out entirely.      "Inconsistency can't keep Zay Jones down" alone isn't particularly compelling though.

10% drop in 2020 with 20 targets. Make sure you give the entire context of your data story lol. 

 

Sounds good man. It sounds like you may have been personally victimized by Zay and his newfound success and purpose. Glad you find some seemingly personal validation every time he drops a pass. May God bless you brother. 

[BullBuchanan]

1 hour ago, JohnNord said:

It was a very good article and it makes you glad Zay his career and life around.

 

The only gripe about the article is that it never answered the question we all were asking - what kind of drugs was Zay Jones on?

 

He admitted to taking something but didn’t know what he was given.  He also refused the toxicology report to avoid potential trouble.   It was implied that fans were wrong to call him out for drug use - but they weren’t wrong - he was on something 

Who is asking that and why does it matter in the least? The only people that care about that are tabloid readers. It's completely meaningless to everyone else, and frankly none of our business.

[JohnNord]

29 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said:

Who is asking that and why does it matter in the least? The only people that care about that are tabloid readers. It's completely meaningless to everyone else, and frankly none of our business.

The issue is him taking offense to the fact that people criticized him for being on drugs when…he clearly was on drugs.  

1 hour ago, PBF81 said:

Great post/link BFIR!!

 

Excellent read!

 

I hope that Jones flourishes in Jax with Lawrence.  

 

Thanks for posting!  

 

 

 

Sounds as if he may not be sure either.  

 

Entirely understandable that he doesn't want to talk about it though.  

 

 

Correct but he was on drugs like all of us could see.  It seems like Zay and/or Tyler presented the situation as though fans incorrectly cited drug use as a reason for his behavior 

[BullBuchanan]

1 minute ago, JohnNord said:

The issue is him taking offense to the fact that people criticized him for being on drugs when…he clearly was on drugs.  

Except it's not an issue at all. Not even a little bit.

[LABILLBACKER]

Our WR scouts need to figure it out.  

[Nephilim17]

Great article. It's not about dropping or catching a ball on a field, it's about picking yourself up from some dark, dark lows to live life with purpose and peace.

 

Much respect to Zay. And Carr and Waller.

[Don Otreply]

1 hour ago, Airseven said:

I was shocked he hung around in the league. Good for him.

No reason to be shocked, there are lots of mediocre and worse players, just look at most of the O & D line backups on every team, and that’s not mentioning STs players,  lots of hangers on in the league. But as you said, good on him to make a career for himself.

Edited June 23, 2023 by Don Otreply

[GoBills808]

Dunne can't write

[BADOLBILZ]

1 hour ago, BillsFanInRaleigh said:

10% drop in 2020 with 20 targets. Make sure you give the entire context of your data story lol. 

 

Sounds good man. It sounds like you may have been personally victimized by Zay and his newfound success and purpose. Glad you find some seemingly personal validation every time he drops a pass. May God bless you brother. 

 

 

Or it could just sound like I am telling it like it is about a Bills draft bust.   That bad choice on draft day still resonates with the organization even now because they passed on some much better receivers while also trading up to get him and since then they've had to go the veteran route (or 2 GS by UDFA Robert Foster) to fill every other starting WR role from then until Gabe got his shot(and disappointed) in 2022.   

 

Maybe being the worst ball dropping WR in the NFL is a great success story when you are an upstart, low expectations team who snuck into the wildcard round after being terrible for most of the first half of the season.   But if he repeats that with Jacksonville eyeing the #1 seed in their soft division this year........I suspect the story will be "we gotta' replace this guy if we want to advance any further".          

[The Jokeman]

32 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Or it could just sound like I am telling it like it is about a Bills draft bust.   That bad choice on draft day still resonates with the organization even now because they passed on some much better receivers while also trading up to get him and since then they've had to go the veteran route (or 2 GS by UDFA Robert Foster) to fill every other starting WR role from then until Gabe got his shot(and disappointed) in 2022.   

 

Maybe being the worst ball dropping WR in the NFL is a great success story when you are an upstart, low expectations team who snuck into the wildcard round after being terrible for most of the first half of the season.   But if he repeats that with Jacksonville eyeing the #1 seed in their soft division this year........I suspect the story will be "we gotta' replace this guy if we want to advance any further".          

They might already have his replacement on the roster when they got Calvin Ridley from the Falcons or he'll just push Zay down the depth chart. 

[JohnNord]

1 hour ago, BullBuchanan said:

Except it's not an issue at all. Not even a little bit.

It’s 100% an issue

[Buffalo716]

2 hours ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Our WR scouts need to figure it out.  

They don’t have a specific wide receiver scout …. Not how it works 

Edited June 23, 2023 by Buffalo716

[Rico]

1 hour ago, GoBills808 said:

Dunne can't write

Total hack.

[birdo67]

Incredible story filled with incredible incidents.

 

Least important of all, I can't believe that the OJ shirt was a complete coincidence - I just assumed that he knew we'd be drafting him, and I thought the shirt was hilarious.  I didn't even realize he was criticized for it.

Most important of all, his brother is a hero and saint for saving his life that night.

[BullBuchanan]

52 minutes ago, JohnNord said:

It’s 100% an issue

Not if you mind your own business. His past is his, not yours. You aren't entitled to know any of it.

Pray tell, how does this impact you in the slightest?

Edited June 23, 2023 by BullBuchanan

[Starr Almighty]

4 hours ago, boyst said:

i used vomit emogie because there was no love or eggplant emogie.

I let it slide because they only came out recently in 1998 but it's spelled emoji

[JohnNord]

9 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said:

Not if you mind your own business. His past is his, not yours. You aren't entitled to know any of it.

Pray tell, how does this impact you in the slightest?

Ugh because he’s a football player and we come here to discuss football.  Pray tell, how does any of this football talk in general impact YOU in the slightest?

 

Or pray tell, why use an old-timey word like “pray tell” to begin with? 
 

Not sure why this has touched a nerve with you.  All I said is, if he was filmed on drugs don’t get upset at people for talking about drug usage.

2 hours ago, GoBills808 said:

Dunne can't write

Not sure how you can read that article and come away with that conclusion.  Not the biggest fan of Dunne but he is one of the more talent writers covering the NFL

Edited June 23, 2023 by JohnNord

[BullBuchanan]

1 minute ago, JohnNord said:

Ugh because he’s a football player and we come here to discuss football.  Pray tell, how does any of this football talk in general impact YOU in the slightest?

 

Or pray tell, why use an old-timey word like “pray tell” to begin with? 
 

Not sure why this has touched a nerve with you.  All I said is, if he was filmed on drugs don’t get upset at people for talking about drug usage.

Not sure how you can read that article and come away with that conclusion.  Not the biggest fan of Dunne but he is one of the more talent writers covering the NFL

It tocuhed a nerve with me because you took the completely wrong message away form the article.

You said "The only gripe about the article is that it never answered the question we all were asking - what kind of drugs was Zay Jones on?"

We're very clearly NOT all asking that question, and if you're asking it, you don't need the answer.

And in case that wasn't clear enough, there is a chasm of distinction between having drugs in your system ona  given day and being a "crackhead" or "methhead" as was implied with Jones. People from all walks of life take recreational drugs, from the homeless to Billionaire CEOs. Labeling someone as an addict based on extremely limited information is an actual problem, unlike you demanding to know what drugs a stranger may or may not have ingested once upon a time.

[boyst]

12 minutes ago, Starr Almighty said:

I let it slide because they only came out recently in 1998 but it's spelled emoji

Get off my lawn. 

[mjt328]

5 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

Remarkable that the Bills drafted the two worst ball droppers in the league in Zay and Gabe...........claimed McKenzie who was a near historic fumble factory in Denver and had a Gabe-esque drop rate last season........and drafted Knox who has been a work in progress wrt hands..........goes too show you that early in a teams development the finer points of the game can get overlooked.    

 

Well, our 1st Round Pick this year dropped almost nothing in college.

 

So maybe Brandon Beane realized his hit percentage at this position wasn't good enough, and he decided to adjust scouting priorities.

 

[Malazan]

5 hours ago, Dablitzkrieg said:

I think you totally missed the point

 

Would you say he dropped the ball?

[GoBills808]

23 minutes ago, JohnNord said:

Not sure how you can read that article and come away with that conclusion.  Not the biggest fan of Dunne but he is one of the more talent writers covering the NFL

the degree to which he allows his voice to color the narrative is extremely lazy and to me indicative of inherent superficiality

 

i would call him solipsistic but that's probably giving him too much credit