OJ Howard expected to sign with Bengals (update: signs with Texans)

[ColoradoBills]

24 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

Then hopefully this is the case.  "Offset language" prevents a guy with guaranteed money from double-dipping on salary

 

Offsets are usually only done on rookie contracts.  Vet contracts I imagine would be rare.

If Beane signed Howard to an offset is sure would have been a wise move but somehow, I doubt it.

[eball]

I can sum up everything said about OJ Howard in Bills camp as follows:

 

- huge, physically imposing human

- slow, plodding route runner

- no explosion

 

Why do we care where he goes?  Beane swung and missed.  End of story.

 

[Wayne Arnold]

Howard absolutely fleeced the Bills. *tips cap*

[Beck Water]

3 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

 

Interesting.  The Bengals top TE is Hayden Hurst, who signed a 1 year, $3.5M contract with them.

 

I rather wanted the Bills to sign him, and they wound up signing Howard to a similar contract.  They have similar pedigrees - Howard drafted 1 year before Hurst, but lost a year to injury.  Both former first round picks.   But Howard actually has somewhat better production on a per-game basis than Hurst does!!!!

 

Behind Howard, the Bengals have Drew Sample and Mitch Wilcox, who I know nothing about (looked this up).   Anyone else?

Edited August 31, 2022 by Beck Water

[Beck Water]

7 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

Offsets are usually only done on rookie contracts.  Vet contracts I imagine would be rare.

If Beane signed Howard to an offset is sure would have been a wise move but somehow, I doubt it.

 

I defer to your superior knowledge of the fine print in NFL veteran contracts. 

 

 

[GunnerBill]

2 hours ago, loveorhatembillsfan4life said:

I guess the Bengals Offense must be overly simple to figure out..or according to some Bengals Fans the Te position group is their worst. Sounds like they have  some injury issues as well.

 

Howard seems to be making out ok financially throughout all this. 

 

 

 

Uzomah was their starter but left in FA. They have Hayden Hurst over from Atlanta, not sure what depth is behind him. 

[ColoradoBills]

2 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

I defer to your superior knowledge of the fine print in NFL veteran contracts. 

 

 

I claim no superior knowledge.  Google is my friend.  Google says it's almost exclusively used on rookie deals.

[GunnerBill]

While we are on the subject of the Bengals looks like my guy Cordell Volson who was a 4th round selection by them out of North Dakota State and featured in my pre-draft sleepers list (here) has won a starting job a guard.

[ddaryl]

45 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

 

 

 

He will get paid more due to per-game salary.  But, unless he had "no offset" language in his contract, anything he gets paid by the Bengals will reduce the amount he is paid by the Bills.

 

 

 

 

 

I do not think that is right.

If it is can you link me to that info. A fully guarenteed contract is just that. We gain nothing back no mater what.

Maybe I'm wrong but I have never heard of the situation you are descibing

[plenzmd1]

3 minutes ago, ddaryl said:

 

 

I do not think that is right.

If it is can you link me to that info. A fully guarenteed contract is just that. We gain nothing back no mater what.

Maybe I'm wrong but I have never heard of the situation you are descibing

Offset language is one of the few things that gets negotiated in rookie contracts. Simply states if we cut you and owe you $1m guaranteed , and another teams signs you for $750k, we then only owe you $250k, and that is all that is counted on our cap. As someone mentioned above, I have not seen that in vet FA deals, but maybe BBB used the allure of JA 17 and big production to get that included in the Howard deal. We shall see. 
 

any little bit of cap room helps the Bills this year. 

[Logic]

As someone who was really excited when Howard signed here, but then read all the camp reports and watched him in preseason...

Let him go be a blocking specialist who doesn't offer anything as a receiver somewhere else. 

Tommy Sweeney has much better taste in music any way. 😁

[HOUSE]

I am trying to be depressed but it's not working....

[Beck Water]

19 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

I claim no superior knowledge.  Google is my friend.  Google says it's almost exclusively used on rookie deals.

 

Huh, when I googled "how common is offset language in NFL contracts" the first hit says "Offset language is standard practice in most NFL contracts"

[Matt_In_NH]

2 hours ago, ddaryl said:

Nope he got paid to be in Bills training campand nothing can change that.

and he'll make more getting paid somewhere else

not true...offset language in the contract is being reported.  Bills can get a rebate

[Beck Water]

14 minutes ago, ddaryl said:

I do not think that is right.
If it is can you link me to that info. A fully guarenteed contract is just that. We gain nothing back no mater what.
Maybe I'm wrong but I have never heard of the situation you are descibing

 

https://www.yardbarker.com/nfl/articles/how_offset_language_in_nfl_contracts_works/s1_14819_34600049

 

The question being discussed here is whether it's common beyond rookie contracts.  I think it is used - I seem to vaguely recall some vet contracts where it was discussed that the Bills got something back on the cap when a guy they cut signed elsewhere.

[ColoradoBills]

3 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

Huh, when I googled "how common is offset language in NFL contracts" the first hit says "Offset language is standard practice in most NFL contracts"

 

The first hit is about Zach Wilson's rookie deal.  

2 minutes ago, Matt_In_NH said:

not true...offset language in the contract is being reported.  Bills can get a rebate

 

Beane may have had Howard sign offsets.  It's just not common with vets.

[Shake_My_Head]

6 minutes ago, Matt_In_NH said:

not true...offset language in the contract is being reported.  Bills can get a rebate

https://www.google.com/search?q=offset+language+in+the+contract&rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS838US838&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

 

"Offset language relates to what happens to a player's salary if he's cut during the first four years of his career, while he's still playing on his rookie deal."

 

As a FA, I belive that is off the table.

.

Edited August 31, 2022 by Shake_My_Head

[YoloinOhio]

He means Bills, not Bucs. Not sure if he’s privy to the contract or not

41 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

Interesting.  The Bengals top TE is Hayden Hurst, who signed a 1 year, $3.5M contract with them.

 

I rather wanted the Bills to sign him, and they wound up signing Howard to a similar contract.  They have similar pedigrees - Howard drafted 1 year before Hurst, but lost a year to injury.  Both former first round picks.   But Howard actually has somewhat better production on a per-game basis than Hurst does!!!!

 

Behind Howard, the Bengals have Drew Sample and Mitch Wilcox, who I know nothing about (looked this up).   Anyone else?

I think one or both are hurt too

Edited August 31, 2022 by YoloinOhio

[machine gun kelly]

2 hours ago, BlazinBill said:

Almost certain I heard on WGR yesterday that based off contract structure if he was picked up by another team we would get cap relief from his hit- may e I misheard?

I thought I heard the same.  One of

you guys should call Sal now

before the extra point show is over or tomorrow morning.  He’ll know definitively.

 

Personally I would’ve gone with Knox, Morris, and Howard.  Two athletes and a blocker.  He also has sure hands so he could’ve been a big albeit slow target in the end zone for Josh.

 

[Beck Water]

6 minutes ago, machine gun kelly said:

I thought I heard the same.  One of

you guys should call Sal now

before the extra point show is over or tomorrow morning.  He’ll know definitively.

 

Personally I would’ve gone with Knox, Morris, and Howard.  Two athletes and a blocker.  He also has sure hands so he could’ve been a big albeit slow target in the end zone for Josh.

 

 

TBH, I have not been impressed by what I've seen of Howard's blocking.  He doesn't have the power of Sweeney, and he seems to lack the fast feet to maintain his position and leverage against athletic LB and CB.

[YoloinOhio]

10 minutes ago, machine gun kelly said:

I thought I heard the same.  One of

you guys should call Sal now

before the extra point show is over or tomorrow morning.  He’ll know definitively.

 

Personally I would’ve gone with Knox, Morris, and Howard.  Two athletes and a blocker.  He also has sure hands so he could’ve been a big albeit slow target in the end zone for Josh.

 

They are talking about hockey!

[machine gun kelly]

2 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

TBH, I have not been impressed by what I've seen of Howard's blocking.  He doesn't have the power of Sweeney, and he seems to lack the fast feet to maintain his position and leverage against athletic LB and CB.

If we get any of that deadcap back, and I’m more confused than clarified after reading these posts.  I’ll wait and ask Sal tomorrow.

 

The pundits did commend Howard’s blocking, but who cares as he’s gone.  Spilt milk.

[ColoradoBills]

2 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

They are talking about hockey!

 

Tage Thompson signing?

[machine gun kelly]

7 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

They are talking about hockey!

If you mean the show, earlier the guys said they were going to have Hamilton on to talk about that extension.  They usually are more football talk, but they have to get some hockey in when big events occur.

 

im sure tomorrow someone will get through and Sal can clarify the rules.  He’s usually not wrong on these matters.  I wish they had Andrew Brandt on tomorrow as that dude is the best on the business of football.  I used to love his Wed. Morning spot on Ross Tucker’s morning show when he was on NFLR.

[YoloinOhio]

6 minutes ago, machine gun kelly said:

If you mean the show, earlier the guys said they were going to have Hamilton on to talk about that extension.  They usually are more football talk, but they have to get some hockey in when big events occur.

 

im sure tomorrow someone will get through and Sal can clarify the rules.  He’s usually not wrong on these matters.  I wish they had Andrew Brandt on tomorrow as that dude is the best on the business of football.  I used to love his Wed. Morning spot on Ross Tucker’s morning show when he was on NFLR.

I’m not bagging on it, at all. They do cross over to Sabres. Just didn’t think anyone would be able to get through with a Bills question.

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

4 hours ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said:

Waive the waiver!

👋🏼

 

 

The Bills may be waivering on their decision.

[John from Riverside]

Looks like Tarzan plays like Jane

[YoloinOhio]

Spotrac has spoken 

 

 

[Sierra Foothills]

21 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Uzomah was their starter but left in FA. They have Hayden Hurst over from Atlanta, not sure what depth is behind him. 

 

Drew Sample

Mitchell Wilcox

Devin Asiasi

 

20 hours ago, Logic said:

As someone who was really excited when Howard signed here, but then read all the camp reports and watched him in preseason...

Let him go be a blocking specialist who doesn't offer anything as a receiver somewhere else. 
 

 

He's also a big body who can wall off and post up defenders.

 

 

 

 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

 

[No_Matter_What]

40 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

Spotrac has spoken 

 

 

 

8 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

 

Wow I had no clue.

 

Guess I am a big fan of Howard from now on. Sign the beast!

Edited September 1, 2022 by No_Matter_What

[YoloinOhio]

 

[ColoradoBills]

3 hours ago, No_Matter_What said:

Wow I had no clue.

 

Guess I am a big fan of Howard from now on. Sign the beast!

 

Bills fans on the "Howard" watch.

[Punching Bag]

On 8/31/2022 at 8:07 AM, Commish said:

So, if he signs with the Bengals, does that affect the Bill's cap hit?

 

 

It depends if Jim Overdorf was involved.  If Bills get nothing you know he was.

[Rochesterfan]

30 minutes ago, Limeaid said:

 

It depends if Jim Overdorf was involved.  If Bills get nothing you know he was.

 

You mean one of the best and longest serving cap managers.

 

This is just plain dumb.

 

 

[unbillievable]

That offset also means that Howard has less motivation to sign with another team.

 

He'll be looking for the best situation only, since he'll essentially be making the same whether he plays or sits on the couch.

[Punching Bag]

14 minutes ago, Rochesterfan said:

You mean one of the best and longest serving cap managers.

 

This is just plain dumb.

 

 

He refused for years to put in any penalties for players breaking rules. Do some research.  It was mandatory for previous GMs to use him but Beane was given option to use or not.

 

He left out offsets from many contracts.

 

Reminds me on contract manager at work who did not include annual Per Diem raises for CONUS travel making employees absorb costs or what I did was stay further and further away since gas and miles were paid for.

[ColoradoBills]

7 minutes ago, unbillievable said:

That offset also means that Howard has less motivation to sign with another team.

 

He'll be looking for the best situation only, since he'll essentially be making the same whether he plays or sits on the couch.

 

If he sits on the couch, he will be forgotten.  As of now he needs to perform to prove he deserved a roster spot.

I can't be certain, but maybe his motivation or lack of it is why he was let go by his last 2 teams.

[unbillievable]

2 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

If he sits on the couch, he will be forgotten.  As of now he needs to perform to prove he deserved a roster spot.

I can't be certain, but maybe his motivation or lack of it is why he was let go by his last 2 teams.

Howard said that he had trouble learning the playbook, which is why he was going slow. Apparently had that trouble in TB, too.

I imagine teams may get scared off if the guy can't learn their system fast enough to be ready for the start of the season.

[Rochesterfan]

6 minutes ago, Limeaid said:

 

He refused for years to put in any penalties for players breaking rules. Do some research.  It was mandatory for previous GMs to use him but Beane was given option to use or not.

 

He left out offsets from many contracts.

 

Reminds me on contract manager at work who did not include annual Per Diem raises for CONUS travel making employees absorb costs or what I did was stay further and further away since gas and miles were paid for.

 

He did what the GM wanted.  For example he argued to put offsets in on Dareus and was told not to because they were afraid of him not signing.

 

And Beane has stated several times what an asset he is and how much he knows about the cap.

 

He also was forced to do cash to the cap and everyone blamed him, but in comes a different owner and bam - suddenly he can do all types of contracts.

 

He has a standard contract with all types of offsets built - pulling them out is typically the purview of the GM at the time.  
 

Beane was given many options including removing Jim and bringing in new people - nearly the entire FO was replaced, but he kept Overdorf and still uses 5+ years later.