My biggest issue with the demise of the Patriots dynasty when it comes to the media

[HOUSE]

A player like Tom Brady comes along once every 50 years. Its highly unlikely New England will ever have anything close.

 

I see a long drought in NE

[Orlando Tim]

People  not mentioneing the fact that they got caught cheating again last year is weird to me. Brady was not good down the stretch and the difference between championships and first round burn outs is often small coaching decisions that will often come from little bits of information. Belicheck is a brilliant defensive mind but a mediocre offensive mind and he wonany close games based on cheating.

[Da webster guy]

Brady looked pretty bad for them last season though, 60% completion, 24 td's, 8 picks and he missed a lot of wide open dudes, especially in the 2nd half of the season.  

Not saying he sucked, but he wasnt great by any means.

[Doc]

8 minutes ago, Da webster guy said:

Brady looked pretty bad for them last season though, 60% completion, 24 td's, 8 picks and he missed a lot of wide open dudes, especially in the 2nd half of the season.  

Not saying he sucked, but he wasnt great by any means.

 

Brady is in decline, but the talent around him was crap and still is in Cheaterland.  But they'd gladly take his production last year this year.  Can has been a complete and utter failure.

[RunTheBall]

BB the coach is probably in the running for GOAT. BB the GM sucks. Pats* problems run a lot deeper than just losing Brady, they have little in the ways of good young talent coming up. Yeah their D will probably be better next year because of the opt-outs coming back but a lot of those guys are in their 30s already and aren’t getting younger. I think the Pats are going to be in that middle-of-the-road limbo for a long time and I love it. Good enough to win 7-9 games because they do have great coaching but lack of good scouting and poor drafting will hold them back. 

[Doc]

Just now, RunTheBall said:

BB the coach is probably in the running for GOAT. BB the GM sucks. Pats* problems run a lot deeper than just losing Brady, they have little in the ways of good young talent coming up. Yeah their D will probably be better next year because of the opt-outs coming back but a lot of those guys are in their 30s already and aren’t getting younger. I think the Pats are going to be in that middle-of-the-road limbo for a long time and I love it. Good enough to win 7-9 games because they do have great coaching but lack of good scouting and poor drafting will hold them back. 

 

The winning percentage without Brady, and being lower than Rex Ryan's, is pretty damning.  And again, Brady was dumb luck on their part.  As I've been saying, I don't think he'll be coaching much longer.

[Da webster guy]

57 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

Brady is in decline, but the talent around him was crap and still is in Cheaterland.  But they'd gladly take his production last year this year.  Can has been a complete and utter failure.

Yeah and the only game he really lit it up was vs Seattle and they lost anyway at the last second.

 

That was before anyone realized Seattle defense is awful, and the Pats fans were acting like they had found their franchise qb for the next 10 years.  Uh....no

[Spiderweb]

On 12/22/2020 at 8:34 AM, streetkings01 said:

They downplay the loss of Tom Brady.  They talk about the Patriots as if Brady was never there.  Watching GMF now and they have Scott Pioli there......he thinks the players opting out is what held them back this season and feels that a good draft and getting those players back will help the Patriots make another Super Bowl run.  After watching the Pats this season it's clear that Brady the bigger part of their success.  Not once have I seen someone in the media admit that the loss of Brady was huge for the Pats instead they seem to have felt the Pats were going to continue the Patriot way regardless if #12 was there.  I'm thinking it'll take next year when they go 9-7 at best before it really starts to sink in.

What planet are you living on? There have been a plethora of Brady stories and Patriot stories that spoke directly to his loss for the Patriots. Quit making crap up..

[Royale with Cheese]

Do the Pats have the money to acquire like a Matt Ryan?  If they get a decent QB, they’ll be playoff contenders again.

[Don Otreply]

I for one have zero issue with the demise of the cheatriots on any level, not a fan never have been, I do in fact enjoy Tb being down played, ignored or even forgotten about, I hope he has a groin injury so severe that he has to retire today, in fact Fuh K Tom bill, Kraft, and every staffer that helped them cheat continuously for decades. I know I leaving something out, feel free to add on if you got something I forgot... 😁😂🤣😅👍

 

Oh, and happy Boxing Day to you all👍

[Doc]

52 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

Do the Pats have the money to acquire like a Matt Ryan?  If they get a decent QB, they’ll be playoff contenders again.

 

The Falcons can't trade or release him because it would be an almost $50M cap hit and they would have no replacement.  And even if he were available, I can't see them wanting him after that epic collapse in the SB.

[stinky finger]

On 12/22/2020 at 8:46 AM, Ethan in Portland said:

If White and Edmunds had opted out and Diggs was lost for the season, do you think the Bills would have won the division with two games to play?
 

Belichick’s record is mostly the product of Brady. I’ve posted that many times before. But to be fair, the Patriots were hurt as much as anyone by opt outs and injury. 

 

 

So true.

 

BUT to be fair......

 

If you're looking for sympathy you've come to the wrong place.

On 12/22/2020 at 9:20 AM, PromoTheRobot said:

 

Naw. That entire roster is trash. Pats got nothing to build on.

 

Yep.

 

And nobody competent to build it back.

[stinky finger]

On 12/22/2020 at 9:29 AM, JMF2006 said:

My biggest issue is all the cheating is never mentioned.

 

I hope they wallow in the mire for the next 20 years.

 

20? 

 

That's all?

On 12/22/2020 at 9:35 AM, Ramza86 said:

I mean...a full team and say...Stafford next season. Find some sort of talent at the WR position. 

 

They will be in the wildcard race next season.

 

I love it.

 

Their turn to play on the QB carousel. Good luck with that.

[stinky finger]

On 12/22/2020 at 9:44 AM, Ramza86 said:

 

Stafford. Never had a good coach, never had a good defense. 

 

He might not be the best, but he will be miles better than Cam.

 

I think any decent aging QB will put the Pats in a decent spot.

 

I actually like this plan. It will most assuredly keep them down in the standings in the AFC east 

On 12/22/2020 at 10:08 AM, Irish Dave said:

Whatever guys.  All I know is New England's cheat-filled dominance of the AFC East is now over.  It's like they were that guy in high school who pretended to be a nice guy to all the teachers but was really a bully and cheated on all his tests, has moved away. 

As for Marcia Brady - it's really pretty annoying that he's still being referred to (even here) as the GOAT after all of his cheating was exposed; The dude was an EXTREMELY LOW 6th round draft pick who somehow miraculously ascends to all these wins out of nowhere....it was BECAUSE OF the rigged system that they had in New England.  All the spying, throwing deflated balls, he wouldn't turn over his cell phone, he had an extra radio frequencey in his helmet throughout entire plays!!! 

 

Preach

 

And to be clear TB is NOT the GOAT.

 

He's the most accomplished. Do with that what you will. 

[Doc]

4 minutes ago, inaugural balls said:

I actually like this plan. It will most assuredly keep them down in the standings in the AFC east 

 

Even if the Lions were to take-on an almost-$25M cap hit by trading or releasing him, he'd still have no one to throw it to, as FA WRs and TEs wouldn't be clamoring to come to Cheaterland to play with him.

[stinky finger]

1 minute ago, Doc said:

 

Even if the Lions were to take-on an almost-$25M cap hit by trading or releasing him, he'd still have no one to throw it to, as FA WRs and TEs wouldn't be clamoring to come to Cheaterland to play with him.

 

Agree 

 

The Dak's, Matty's (Stafford or Ryan) are not the answer. As an Bills fan, the Pats tying up the money and resources it would take to procure one of these QBs

scares me not one iota. 

 

They are not the answer. That, and BB is not capable of drafting to fill the holes. 

[Freddie's Dead]

On 12/22/2020 at 11:57 PM, What a Tuel said:

 

36 wasn't really sustainable.

 

Turnovers:

2016 (SB) - 23

2017 (SB) - 18

2018 (SB) - 28

2019 (No SB) - 36

2020 (No Playoffs) - 20 (14 games)

 

To say 20 turnovers is why they couldn't make the playoff let alone the super bowl in 2020 is a bit misleading.

 

Now look at offensive turnovers (giveaways)

2016 (SB) - 11

2017 (SB) - 12

2018 (SB) - 18

2019 (No SB) - 15

2020 (No playoffs) - 19 (14 games)

 

Differential

2016 (SB) - +12

2017 (SB) - +6

2018 (SB) - +10

2019 (No SB) - +21

2020 (No playoffs) - +1 (14 games)

 

Stats adjusted for deflation?

[stinky finger]

On 12/24/2020 at 7:59 AM, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

It'd be $24.85M in dead cap, but again, they'd also avoid paying his $9.5M salary, a $500K bonus and a $10M roster bonus, a total of $20M saved. Financially very doable. That's why Spotrac has 2021 listed as a potential out for Stafford.

 

And you watch, if Stafford goes somewhere with a program that has a clue, he's going to unexplainably be better than he ever was when he was working in that dysfunctional Detroit environment. 

 

And if Stafford went to the Pats, he'd be going to a team that is going to have a sensational chance at picking up FAs to fill their many holes. The Pats optouts killed them this year but also put them in a much better situation for next year. They have the 4th most unused cap space this year ($25M), and they will roll it over into next year. In a year that looks like it will have very little money available for teams league-wide, the Pats will have plenty in a buyer's market. They'll be able to shore up receivers, TEs, and fill their holes about as well as anyone in the league.

 

I hear you, but the problem is BB has never been good at filling the holes. They've managed to sustain success because they've had the QB to cover up the warts. 

 

As mentioned, BB great coach not so much building a roster. Especially offensively. Stafford shouldn't scare anyone.  

[stuvian]

i think NE is tanking

[stinky finger]

On 12/24/2020 at 8:59 AM, Victory Formation said:

Garoppolo will end up in New England next year.. Either the 49ers let him go or Belichick sends them a mid round pick for him. I do think the Patriots will be considerably better.. Obviously the Bills should win the AFCE again but I don’t think the Patriots will just roll over..

 

Please, please, please may this happen. 

 

A ticket to mediocrity. 

[Doc]

3 minutes ago, inaugural balls said:

 

Please, please, please may this happen. 

 

A ticket to mediocrity. 

 

I don't see Jimmy G going back there.  I don't think he liked his time there, they have no weapons, and they won't pay him what he wants. 

[stinky finger]

On 12/24/2020 at 2:55 PM, ColoradoBills said:

 

Great post Doc.  Yes their D will be pretty good still next year.  The O is a complete mystery.

I'm going to wait to see what happens with the Pats* UFAs this offseason especially on the O.

Joe Thuney and David Andrews jump out to me.  Will they stay or move on?

 

The "Patriots* Way" may be in trouble if they cannot get a QB, WR, TE and keep their excellent G and C.

 

 

 

Good points.

 

The offense is a complete disaster. Those 2 OL you mention are gonna get paid - and I'm not sure the Pats have an appetite to match.

 

They are depleted across the board offensively. This is gonna take some doing to correct. And as always, finding the QB will prove to be a challenge.

 

They can have allllll the 6-9 win teams they want. Purgatory is a B word as we all know. They're gonna muddle in the middle for a bit, I suspect.  

 

 

On 12/24/2020 at 3:21 PM, Doc said:

 

Without Brady, Belicheat has a losing record.  But without Belicheat, Brady probably doesn't win more than a SB, if even.

 

I'm confidant going with - "if even"

[PromoTheRobot]

1 hour ago, inaugural balls said:

 

Yep.

 

And nobody competent to build it back.

 

And Bill has been hiring his sons for various roles. If you're a GM how much control would you have? Everything would have to been okayed by the Hoodie & family.

[stinky finger]

6 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

I don't see Jimmy G going back there.  I don't think he liked his time there, they have no weapons, and they won't pay him what he wants. 

 

This is fair. 

 

Jimmy was surrounded by top end talent in SF and a terrific system. Granted, he went a SB and lost to the mighty Chiefs, but he was the weak link on a loaded roster. 

 

It never felt like he had command.

[Doc]

3 minutes ago, inaugural balls said:

Good points.

 

The offense is a complete disaster. Those 2 OL you mention are gonna get paid - and I'm not sure the Pats have an appetite to match.

 

They are depleted across the board offensively. This is gonna take some doing to correct. And as always, finding the QB will prove to be a challenge.

 

They can have allllll the 6-9 win teams they want. Purgatory is a B word as we all know. They're gonna muddle in the middle for a bit, I suspect. 

 

It will be interesting to see what Thuney gets, and from whom.  He didn't even make the Pro Bowl after making 2nd team All-Pro last year.  I figured Scarnecchia's loss would be felt.

[ColoradoBills]

3 minutes ago, inaugural balls said:

 

Good points.

 

The offense is a complete disaster. Those 2 OL you mention are gonna get paid - and I'm not sure the Pats have an appetite to match.

 

They are depleted across the board offensively. This is gonna take some doing to correct. And as always, finding the QB will prove to be a challenge.

 

They can have allllll the 6-9 win teams they want. Purgatory is a B word as we all know. They're gonna muddle in the middle for a bit, I suspect.  

 

 

 

They don't have the draft capital to move up and get one of the top QBs so it looks like they got to go after one of the UFAs or look

for a trade.  The problem there is they are just one of many teams in the same position.

 

Side Note:  They will now be UFA buyers instead of sellers.  Those comp picks may become a thing of the past.

"That's a shame"!

[Doc]

Just now, inaugural balls said:

This is fair. 

 

Jimmy was surrounded by top end talent in SF and a terrific system. Granted, he went a SB and lost to the mighty Chiefs, but he was the weak link on a loaded roster. 

 

It never felt like he had command.

 

He lost the SB.  There were plays to be made to prevent squandering that 10 point leading in the 4th quarter and he failed to make them.

[stinky finger]

1 minute ago, PromoTheRobot said:

 

And Bill has been hiring his sons for various roles. If you're a GM how much control would you have? Everything would have to been okayed by the Hoodie & family.

 

Another good point.

 

Nepotism wins the day in Foxboro. I'd really like to know how long Kraft will support this. 

23 hours ago, Da webster guy said:

Brady looked pretty bad for them last season though, 60% completion, 24 td's, 8 picks and he missed a lot of wide open dudes, especially in the 2nd half of the season.  

Not saying he sucked, but he wasnt great by any means.

 

This - and his heart wasn't in it. He had one foot out the door before the season ended.

[stinky finger]

22 hours ago, Doc said:

 

The winning percentage without Brady, and being lower than Rex Ryan's, is pretty damning.  And again, Brady was dumb luck on their part.  As I've been saying, I don't think he'll be coaching much longer.

 

I actually think he's a stubborn, old mule. I think he may endure a few less than mediocre seasons to try to prove he can do it w/o TB. It's been so long since he's been confronted with the direction and success of his team that it will get the best of him. He will try the Kraft's patience. 

 

He will not leave the organization in a favorable manner. I think the Kraft's may very well intervene before they become seriously relevant again. 

[stinky finger]

3 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

Do the Pats have the money to acquire like a Matt Ryan?  If they get a decent QB, they’ll be playoff contenders again.

 

It would take a trade, right? Would they be willing to spend the money and resources it would take to acquire a 35 year old QB with so many other issues to tend too?

 

Ryan should not strike fear in a Bill's fan mind.

 

The Pats are on the dreaded carousel until proven otherwise, imo. 

28 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

I don't see Jimmy G going back there.  I don't think he liked his time there, they have no weapons, and they won't pay him what he wants. 

 

Honestly, I wonder what franchise makes a play - a serious commitment - to Jimmy G.

 

This will be interesting to see play out. He'll get a gig, I just wonder about the commitment.

[stinky finger]

21 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

It will be interesting to see what Thuney gets, and from whom.  He didn't even make the Pro Bowl after making 2nd team All-Pro last year.  I figured Scarnecchia's loss would be felt.

 

True

 

As we both know, the premium placed on OL, even less than blue chip types get their payday. Usually from the next suitor. That's why I don't think his future is in NE.

[Jrb1979]

My biggest issue is the obsession so many of you have with the Pats. 

[JMF2006]

3 hours ago, inaugural balls said:

 

20? 

 

That's all?

 

I love it.

 

Their turn to play on the QB carousel. Good luck with that.

 

I should be dead and buried by then  

[stinky finger]

1 hour ago, JMF2006 said:

 

I should be dead and buried by then  

 

You and me both, brother. 

Edited December 26, 2020 by inaugural balls

[ganesh]

On 12/26/2020 at 12:47 AM, Da webster guy said:

Yeah and the only game he really lit it up was vs Seattle and they lost anyway at the last second.

 

That was before anyone realized Seattle defense is awful, and the Pats fans were acting like they had found their franchise qb for the next 10 years.  Uh....no

they beat up on the Lions today

[BigDingus]

On 12/22/2020 at 7:35 AM, DeltaDigital said:

Cam Newton is horrific. That's the only reason they suck. Much like buffalo during the drought. NO QB = Perpetual 7-9. I hope they choke on it. 

 

It's even weirder how I've heard analysts talk about Belichick & the team not preparing well for this season, as if 1) Brady not being there was Belichick's choice, and 2) he's the one that traded away Jimmy G for a 2nd round pick to the Niners...

Belichick was like the only one in that office that knew they should be preparing for life after Brady, but Kraft & Co. weren't having any of it. Now Belichick is just stuck with the leftovers, probably just waiting until he can retire on a decent note.

[Livinginthepast]

I think a lot of people in here are too young to remember the Pats without Brady. There is this weird assumption that New England has always been a great franchise and their unparallelled success (in any sport at any time) is just part of normal reality. The fact is that we have been witness to a team that has had an absolutely freakish run of achievement, where every possible star has aligned (including the star of cheating), seems to have been missed. I can forgive Bills fans (they are the victims of 20 years of psychological trauma).  But there is no excuse however for the lack of perspective from a lot of NFL journalists. Why these guys (a lot who are 50 plus) seem mystified at the Pats demise is bizarre. The Pats success was never going to last forever, dynasties come and dynasties go and normally QBs have 10 good years and fall off a cliff.  Now that Brady is gone, a lot of these morons now cant figure out that it was literally all him? Belichick was just riding on his coattails the entire time.

Edited December 27, 2020 by Livinginthepast

[PetermansRedemption]

On 12/22/2020 at 9:17 AM, All_Pro_Bills said:

For being regarding as a grand chess master of football Belichick never had good plan in place to acquire Brady's successor through the draft of free agency.  The Cam Newton signing felt more like a desperation move rather than some part of a plan.  Cam played well but his productivity plummeted as the season progressed.  Brady left for Tampa where the team was accommodating his contract demands and the need to surround him with viable weapons at the skill positions.  Along with what looks like a lot more input into the offense than Belichick would ever agree to.  Not that Arians seems happy with this arrangement either but he's going with it.  At the end of the day the Patriots have the same problem this year the Bills had until Allen was drafted and developed.  No good option at QB.    

I actually think he had a perfect plan in place, Jimmy Garropolo. The problem is, he underestimated Brady’s willingness to continue playing well into his 40’s. In a perfect world (for the Patriots) Brady retired 2 years ago and Garropolo took over. I have no doubt they would have continued to be a perennial playoff team in that scenario. 

[Doc]

8 hours ago, BigDingus said:

It's even weirder how I've heard analysts talk about Belichick & the team not preparing well for this season, as if 1) Brady not being there was Belichick's choice, and 2) he's the one that traded away Jimmy G for a 2nd round pick to the Niners...

Belichick was like the only one in that office that knew they should be preparing for life after Brady, but Kraft & Co. weren't having any of it. Now Belichick is just stuck with the leftovers, probably just waiting until he can retire on a decent note.

 

I think most people know that it was Kraft who prevented them from trading Brady.  But Jimmy G doesn't appear to have what it takes to win a SB and more importantly, can't stay healthy.  They'd be in the same position.

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

The media knows what’s what MNF preview