Penfield45 Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 5 hours ago, Bangarang said: I know fans like him but Harrison Phillips is such a meh player to me. Id like to see oliver get more reps over him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Protocal69 Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 5 hours ago, ILBillsfan said: Quote The worst part of the Rams’ comeback, from a Bills perspective, had to be Allen’s temporary relapse into old habits that led to multiple negative plays. Perhaps it was complacency with a big lead, or Allen pressing to put the game out of reach because he saw the defense struggling. Whatever the case, Allen lost his poise and control of the offense. He was evading the pocket prematurely, occasionally throwing off his back foot and failing to “live to fight another day” on plays that called for either a dump-off pass or a throwaway. Though, fortunately for the Bills, it was only temporary. If he is referring to the interception in the cover one analysis Kroft is open and the defense player coming free off the tackle prevents this from being an even bigger play as it was open and to say it was a hero ball. Some of those throws off his back foot was due to the line being continually pushed back into him and funny how he gave praise to Ford for holing his own. Did not like this analysis but to each there own. 39:36 is a good review and show of the play in regards to the interception and as always these guys do a good job breaking it down some nice clips of Donald owning Ford in this but Josh gets the ball out quick enough 17:55 that swim move on Ford man taking advantage of the OL with his head down The thing with Josh is that once he leaves the pocket something clicks in his head to say no matter what I am not taking a sack. Sometimes I wish he would just live to see another day but I think that is what makes Allen special is that do give up mentality. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big C Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 No way Micah Hyde got a B+ he didn't have any INTs or PBUs! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 1 hour ago, GG said: Maybe the sages can explain this, but for the entire second half, Edmunds seemed totally confused by the Rams offense. I can understand missing tackles because of his injury, but to be completely in the wrong zip code when the play went his way was inexcusable. Here's one from Cover1. Do you see where it breaks down? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Penfield45 said: Id like to see oliver get more reps over him. You do realize they play different roles, right... 5 minutes ago, GoBills808 said: Here's one from Cover1. Do you see where it breaks down? Epenesa screwed the pooch on that play as well, but chalk that up to inexperience. I have no idea what Edmunds was doing... Edited October 1, 2020 by Lurker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 5 minutes ago, GoBills808 said: Here's one from Cover1. Do you see where it breaks down? Was this before or after Woods took the pitch for 18 yards to the right when entire Bills line went left? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 4 minutes ago, Lurker said: You do realize they play different roles, right... Epenesa screwed the pooch on that play as well, but chalk that up to inexperience. I have no idea what Edmunds was doing... Correct. Epenesa shows his inexperience and allows the TE to move him which kills Johnson's angle. Edmunds is playing Bgap, Milano Agap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 Just now, ScottLaw said: Why are people just focusing on the run defense? The defense(particularly Edmunds)was completely lost in all aspects of the game Sunday. If you have some examples that would be helpful, otherwise not Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 1 hour ago, Penfield45 said: Id like to see oliver get more reps over him. Pssssst. One plays 1 tech. The other plays 3 tech. They aren't substituting one for the other. 1 hour ago, Protocal69 said: The thing with Josh is that once he leaves the pocket something clicks in his head to say no matter what I am not taking a sack. Sometimes I wish he would just live to see another day but I think that is what makes Allen special is that do give up mentality. I don't mind Allen not wanting to take a sack Taking sacks is a bad deal, some consider it almost as bad as a turnover. But he needs to learn when to just throw it away and live for the next down. There's no point in risking injury wrassling 480 lbs of linebacker to the ground and stiff arming Donald, only to sail a ball out the back of the endzone in the face of a 4th defender. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 11 minutes ago, ScottLaw said: Get NFL game pass and rewatch the game.... dude was a hot mess in the 3rd and 4th. Getting blown off the ball, easily engaged and blocked, wrong gaps, terrible missed tackles, over pursing. . Check out Woods TD to make the game 28-17. Olay! We all saw it. He took a bad angle and missed the tackle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LABILLBACKER Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 9 hours ago, Bangarang said: I know fans like him but Harrison Phillips is such a meh player to me. We kept the wrong Phillips Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 10 hours ago, Bangarang said: I know fans like him but Harrison Phillips is such a meh player to me. He has been considerably worse than meh through 3 weeks. I am lower than Joe on Milano this week. Not that he didn't do better on the all22 than I immediately thought on tv angle but he still had some run fit mistakes as well. Other than that I agree with his grades. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJS Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 11 hours ago, Bangarang said: I know fans like him but Harrison Phillips is such a meh player to me. He's coming off two knee surgeries. He needs some time to get back into things. Let's check back later in the season and see where he is at. He was definately looking pretty good last year before his injury, in my opinion, and hasn't gotten back to that yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 3 minutes ago, MJS said: He's coming off two knee surgeries. He needs some time to get back into things. Let's check back later in the season and see where he is at. He was definately looking pretty good last year before his injury, in my opinion, and hasn't gotten back to that yet. The problem is whether the Bills have that time. If they decide they need to go grab an alternative space eater then to me Phillips is on the hot seat. As for the Edmunds chat - this was Tremaine's career in microcosm. He is a vital cog in pass defense because of what he takes away but he continues to have run game struggles. My concern on the run game work is that this season looks more through 2 games like his rookie year rather than year 2 where I think he did find a little bit more consistency in that area. The Raiders and Titans worry me less because they are a bit more "straight ahead" as running teams. There isn't quite as much misdirection as the Rams. But you better know when we play New England Belichick is gonna give Edmunds a dozen things to look at every play because he knows if you can get him out of his gap the Bills D can be susceptible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJS Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 1 minute ago, GunnerBill said: The problem is whether the Bills have that time. If they decide they need to go grab an alternative space eater then to me Phillips is on the hot seat. As for the Edmunds chat - this was Tremaine's career in microcosm. He is a vital cog in pass defense because of what he takes away but he continues to have run game struggles. My concern on the run game work is that this season looks more through 2 games like his rookie year rather than year 2 where I think he did find a little bit more consistency in that area. The Raiders and Titans worry me less because they are a bit more "straight ahead" as running teams. There isn't quite as much misdirection as the Rams. But you better know when we play New England Belichick is gonna give Edmunds a dozen things to look at every play because he knows if you can get him out of his gap the Bills D can be susceptible. I don't think it is even remotely likely that Phillips would get cut or traded this year. But stranger things have happened. Could his snaps be reduced? For sure. Edmunds went to the pro bowl last year. I think his trajectory as a player has been a fairly steady climb. He's still super young. He's banged up. I'm pretty sure he'll get things turned around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 1 minute ago, MJS said: I don't think it is even remotely likely that Phillips would get cut or traded this year. But stranger things have happened. Could his snaps be reduced? For sure. Edmunds went to the pro bowl last year. I think his trajectory as a player has been a fairly steady climb. He's still super young. He's banged up. I'm pretty sure he'll get things turned around. So if they decide they need a space eater who goes? They are not signing him and cutting another position. They already carry 9 DLinemen on the roster. They are not carrying 10. I think first most at risk is Darryl Johnson who is normally a core STer and played defense snaps week 1 and 2 but was sat down against the Rams. The problem with cutting him is of their five defensive ends only he and Epenesa offer any youth. Second most at risk even if fans don't want to hear it is Harrison Phillips. He is the only natural 1 tech on the roster. So when we look at the D tackles we have and start asking who has got the biggest responsibility to make more plays Phillips is the answer. I think he has two weeks to up his game. If the Raiders and Titans embarrass him like the Rams did I suspect he is out of a job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 3 hours ago, GunnerBill said: So if they decide they need a space eater who goes? They are not signing him and cutting another position. They already carry 9 DLinemen on the roster. They are not carrying 10. I think first most at risk is Darryl Johnson who is normally a core STer and played defense snaps week 1 and 2 but was sat down against the Rams. The problem with cutting him is of their five defensive ends only he and Epenesa offer any youth. Second most at risk even if fans don't want to hear it is Harrison Phillips. He is the only natural 1 tech on the roster. So when we look at the D tackles we have and start asking who has got the biggest responsibility to make more plays Phillips is the answer. I think he has two weeks to up his game. If the Raiders and Titans embarrass him like the Rams did I suspect he is out of a job. They’d put Harry on IR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 10 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said: They’d put Harry on IR. Was just going to post the same thing. They won’t give up on the kid coming back from an ACL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trogdor Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 10 hours ago, ScottLaw said: And a guy completely fooled play after play, wrong gap play after play. Edmunds has been getting a lot of free passes. He played really well last season in spurts but he’s just too inconsistent to be a great player. He should be playing OLB. There was potential at MLB, but he had similar struggles in college when they moved him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 I liked his review of Butler in the 1 technique against the run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2o Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 14 hours ago, TigerJ said: Harrison Phillips doesn't have the explosion to be effective pressuring the QB in pass defense. He's a bit undersized for 1 tech but with his wrestling background he's got a good understanding of leverage. He's also coming back from bilateral knee surgery. That can't make things easy. I still wouldn't want him to be my starting nose tackle. I think the knee injury is definitely still causing him an issue at this time, but I always thought he would be a 3-Tech or 5-Tech in the NFL. His last two years he was a disruptive force at Stanford. I saw him play multiple times and he stood out making plays in the backfield or getting to the QB. You had to account for him. In 2016 he had 10 tfl's and 7 sacks. In 2017 he 17 tfl's and 7.5 sacks. I believe part of his ineffectiveness up to this point of his career is being played out of position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 44 minutes ago, machine gun kelly said: I liked his review of Butler in the 1 technique against the run. Butler has been the best of our four DTs against the run so far IMO. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 (edited) 10 hours ago, ScottLaw said: Like I said he’s been very good in spurts and awful in others.... dude was flat out awful in the 2nd half Sunday. Terrible. Worst defensive player on the field terrible. He ... is ... injured. He was obviously favoring his shoulder later in the game. And yet he was not the worst on the field, nor terrible. Certainly not as good as he generally is, but as usual, using hyperbole just makes someone look unreasonable. Both your posts about him because of their exaggerated nature, just look kind of twisted. Edited October 1, 2020 by Thurman#1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 (edited) 10 hours ago, Lurker said: You do realize they play different roles, right... Epenesa screwed the pooch on that play as well, but chalk that up to inexperience. I have no idea what Edmunds was doing... Filling a gap that nobody else was filling. That's nice play design by McVay, and Taron Johnson running into Epenesa and falling down. Not a good look for that whole side, really, but absolutely can't be blamed only on Edmunds, though with the shoulder he couldn't get off the block well at all. McD keeps saying this is about run fits. From this film, he's dead right, though the play was designed to be confusing and to mess up run fits and was successful. Edited October 1, 2020 by Thurman#1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 (edited) 8 hours ago, LABILLBACKER said: We kept the wrong Phillips Refusing to overpay for the other one was the only smart decision. He was certainly not especially effective against the run. Edited October 1, 2020 by Thurman#1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 (edited) 10 hours ago, ScottLaw said: Get NFL game pass and rewatch the game.... dude was a hot mess in the 3rd and 4th. Getting blown off the ball, easily engaged and blocked, wrong gaps, terrible missed tackles, over pursing. . Check out Woods TD to make the game 28-17. Olay! Yeah, reaches out with his right hand and Woods kind of runs right through it. Which shoulder was injured again? Oh, yeah, the right one. Gosh, hard to figure what happened there. 5 minutes ago, ScottLaw said: Not hyperbole at all and the tape speaks for itself but I've said enough already... Yeah, you certainly have. Edited October 1, 2020 by Thurman#1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 21 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said: Filling a gap that nobody else was filling. That's nice play design by McVay, and Taron Johnson running into Epenesa and falling down. Not a good look for that whole side, really, but absolutely can't be blamed only on Edmunds, though with the shoulder he couldn't get off the block well at all. McD keeps saying this is about run fits. From this film, he's dead right, though the play was designed to be confusing and to mess up run fits and was successful. All that stuff messes up run fits, you also have the element of a very heavy PA/screen offense that puts the DBs and LBs on their heels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 48 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said: McD keeps saying this is about run fits. From this film, he's dead right, though the play was designed to be confusing and to mess up run fits and was successful. It wasn't just that play. McVay dusted off the '19 Bills film and specifically adjusted the 2nd half offense to attack Bills' D aggressiveness and its susceptibility to misdirection. Add very poor run support up the middle, and that's how you got 29 points in less than 1.5 quarters. Frazier got totally undressed in this one, and was saved by a maturing Josh. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan89 Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 9 hours ago, MJS said: I don't think it is even remotely likely that Phillips would get cut or traded this year. But stranger things have happened. Could his snaps be reduced? For sure. Edmunds went to the pro bowl last year. I think his trajectory as a player has been a fairly steady climb. He's still super young. He's banged up. I'm pretty sure he'll get things turned around. I think people are really hard on Edumonds overly so. He was a solid MLB the first half of last season and then the back half of the season turned it on to a near All-Pro level. He was lights out against the Jets and then got hurt. He played up and down against the Rams (I thought he had a good first half bad second half.) I am not ready to say this team need to draft a MLB next year just yet like some have been hyperbolically stating. 3 hours ago, Thurman#1 said: Refusing to overpay for the other one was the only smart decision. He was certainly not especially effective against the run. I don't know how so many people forget that Phillips was a pass rusher and not a run stuffer. When this team suffered a big lapse in run defense from weeks 7-11 last year teams were picking on Phillips freelancing ways. Now McD did adjust the scheme to work around Phillips (who was a good pass rusher) but it wasn't like Phillips was a big part of the run defense. I think people see the flashy plays and his size and think he was a bigger part of the team's success last year in the ground game than he was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 3 hours ago, GG said: It wasn't just that play. McVay dusted off the '19 Bills film and specifically adjusted the 2nd half offense to attack Bills' D aggressiveness and its susceptibility to misdirection. Add very poor run support up the middle, and that's how you got 29 points in less than 1.5 quarters. Frazier got totally undressed in this one, and was saved by a maturing Josh. This is absolutely correct. 10 hours ago, GunnerBill said: He has been considerably worse than meh through 3 weeks. I am lower than Joe on Milano this week. Not that he didn't do better on the all22 than I immediately thought on tv angle but he still had some run fit mistakes as well. Other than that I agree with his grades. Sometimes I notice Milano likes to shoot his gap instead of plug/plant which can be an issue, he's not on balance and relying on his athleticism to make a play against talented fundamentally sound offensive lines/schemes like Eagles last yr and Rams this year...not a great idea. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MILFHUNTER#518 Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 I cannot believe how high the grades were for the secondary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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