Good Night / Bad Night - Pre-Season Game 1

[SirAndrew]

Lots of good, and some not so great things we can take from that game. Allen continues to develop a better awareness with the mental aspect of the game. He has looked more in command each time he’s been on field since late last season. 

 

Zay is a guy I’m concerned about. It seems like popular opinion regarding Zay’s performance has swayed in his favor since his rookie year. He’s made great progress since that season, but I still don’t trust him. Zay has always been best suited for the slot position. Slot receivers need to be sure handed. Zay doesn’t possess big play ability to make up for errors such as the red zone drop where he heard footsteps in the secondary. Those are huge plays when the games get real. 

Edited August 9, 2019 by SirAndrew

[AllenLongBall]

1 minute ago, oldmanfan said:

The one inaccurate pass he threw was the low ball to Jones, and he said he wanted to bring it in lo w so the defender couldn't come over the top to knock it down.

 

Basing your disappointment on an N of 1 doesn't cut it. 

 

He underthrew brown, and overthrew the TE.  The Zay pass into the dirt and Zay drop are a wash.

[Big Turk]

7 minutes ago, AllenLongBall said:

I was disappointed in Allen's accuracy. I see no difference from last year. I even felt worse after I saw Kyler Murray throw the ball, he's damn accurate.

 

Allen's accuracy HAS to improve if this whole thing is going to work out.

You mean like the one he threw perfectly to Zay near the goalline that he dropped?

[skibum]

I feel like the preseason games don't mean as much as they should as far as roster decisions go. How many times have we seen a guy like Brandon Reilly pile up numbers in the second half of these games, only to get cut anyway? I feel like that's what's probably going to happen with McKenzie and Wade. Shining in the second half of a preseason game doesn't seem to get you anywhere, because if the coaching staff thought you were better, they would have played you earlier in the game. 

[Royale with Cheese]

1 minute ago, AllenLongBall said:

 

He underthrew brown, and overthrew the TE.  The Zay pass into the dirt and Zay drop are a wash.

 

Are you talking about the one where Sweeney was held?  

[Coach Tuesday]

Zay Jones might be the least efficient WR, and pound for pound possibly the worst player, in the entire league.  I am not exaggerating.

[SirAndrew]

Just now, matter2003 said:

Allen threw a perfect strike to Jones near the goal line that he dropped...gotta catch that ball.

Yeah, we’ve all seen that movie a few times before. Personally, I’ve seen enough from Zay. I really need to see something more the rest of the preseason. With that said, it’s highly likely this regime will part with Zay before his contract is up. He’s always felt like a liability on the field imo. 

[Chandler#81]

10 minutes ago, AllenLongBall said:

I was disappointed in Allen's accuracy. I see no difference from last year. I even felt worse after I saw Kyler Murray throw the ball, he's damn accurate.

 

Allen's accuracy HAS to improve if this whole thing is going to work out.

 

You had to quit school in 9th grade to help bring money in for the family, right??

[Ittakestime]

22 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

You're supposed to snap the ball at the QB’s numbers.

A 6”5 and 6”2 doesn’t make that much of a difference.  Unless you think Bodine has zero depth perception.  Or he’s dyslexic. 

“Well, Barkley is 3 inches shorter so I should snap it 3 feet higher”

 

Bodine doesn’t do anything better.  He went from starting the majority of the season last year to 3rd string this year.  He was demoted 2 levels because he’s terrible.

 

QBs also stand at different intervals behind the QB.

 

All I am saying is that Bodine has been playing almost exclusively with Allen for the last 40 weeks.  For there to me a snap issue when they was a change, is not unexpected.

 

Just wait till Morse gets back in and there are snapping issues.  100% there will be.  There was already issues in TC with Morse and Allen.

[eball]

Good recap Gunner...I think we saw a lot of the same things.  When I see a Buffalo News headline this morning that reads "Allen Unspectacular" and a D&C headline that reads "The Wrong QB Looked Great" I just sort of shake my head.  Did Allen light it up?  Of course not.  But if you remove the holding penalty and Zay catches that last pass Josh's stat line would read 8/12 with a TD.  I think he only threw one "bad" pass -- the 3rd down effort to Zay -- and the other three incompletions were a throwaway, an overthrow downfield, and a miscommunication.  He looked decisive and accurate with his checkdowns and short passing game.  I love the fact that Barkley looks solid as the #2.  Zay needs to start worrying if he can't hang onto the football.

 

I may disagree with you a bit regarding Singletary.  No, his YPC were not good, but he showed the quickness and shiftiness we were told about.  It looks like his hands are reliable as well.

 

All in all a pretty good start to the season by these Bills.

[GunnerBill]

3 minutes ago, skibum said:

I feel like the preseason games don't mean as much as they should as far as roster decisions go. How many times have we seen a guy like Brandon Reilly pile up numbers in the second half of these games, only to get cut anyway? I feel like that's what's probably going to happen with McKenzie and Wade. Shining in the second half of a preseason game doesn't seem to get you anywhere, because if the coaching staff thought you were better, they would have played you earlier in the game. 

 

I think you are right. I think that this coaching staff values practice much more than it values performance in a vanilla offense in pre-season. That being said McKenzie is legit in the competition for the final roster spot at WR. Wade I don't think is in competition for anything. He gets a practice squad expemption for the year as part of the pathway programme and I expect the Bills to give him the chance to stick for the year as a result but the likelihood is he does that, has a year on the PS and then is released next year in cut downs. 

[HappyDays]

23 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

This is a guys we signed as an UDFA out of LSU after the 2018 draft, had on our practice squad and have worked with, developed, coached up.... if he ends up making a serious contribution it says a LOT about our defensive coaching staff. And all of it good. 

 

I'd like to see what Wade can do after a year on the practice squad. He seems to have NFL traits, just zero experience playing the game.

 

I think this is the best all around coaching staff Buffalo has had in the last 20 years. I don't think there's a weak link.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

1 hour ago, Canadian Bills Fan said:

I thought Singletary had a great game and looked good

 

Yeah - some nice little plays - picked up a 3rd and 10 and generally carried buffalo down the field on the first TD drive.

[CuddyDark]

That 2 yard line pass to Zay was behind him. If it's out in front it's a touchdown.

[HappyDays]

16 minutes ago, SWATeam said:

Tremaine looked to be playing much faster. 

 

I focused on Edmunds a lot on my rewatch and I agree, he was flying all over the field. Compared to last year's preseason it was night and day. Oliver and Lotulelei were keeping him clean too. If he makes a big jump this year, along with the addition of Oliver and a deeper secondary, this defense is going to be ferocious.

[GunnerBill]

4 minutes ago, eball said:

 

I may disagree with you a bit regarding Singletary.  No, his YPC were not good, but he showed the quickness and shiftiness we were told about.  It looks like his hands are reliable as well.

 

He looked like a good 3rd down back. That is what I think he is at this stage. As I said it wasn't really a bad night for him... it was a bad night for those who think he is going to be the starter some time very soon. He isn't there yet as a three down back. 

[CuddyDark]

Worst player of the night was Ducasse. Just put him in the first cuts and be done with him.

[AllenLongBall]

11 minutes ago, matter2003 said:

You mean like the one he threw perfectly to Zay near the goalline that he dropped?

 

I think everyone thought Foster was going to replace Jones, but it looks like Foster has regressed.

Edited August 9, 2019 by AllenLongBall

[buffaloboyinATL]

1 hour ago, MAJBobby said:

 

 

Speaking of depth. I think for the first time in a long time there are going to be players that get cut from Bill and immediately find work in the NFL. And that is a testament to the depth this team is developing. There are still thin position groups but nothing like in years past. 

 

 

This was very noticeable, especially on Defense.  We will win most if not all of our pre-season games this year (which obviously means nothing) because our 2nd and 3rd string players will be a bit better than the scrubs other teams roll out there in the second half.  This has not been the case in previous seasons.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

1 minute ago, CuddyDark said:

That 2 yard line pass to Zay was behind him. If it's out in front it's a touchdown.

 

Disagree.  That was an incredibly catchable pass.  I don't know if he lost it in the sun, or feared the contact - but any wide receiver should be able to catch that pass. If anything leading him more might lead to a pick.

[HappyDays]

11 minutes ago, skibum said:

feel like that's what's probably going to happen with McKenzie and Wade.

 

Wade will be on the practice squad for sure. I'd like to see McKenzie mixed in with the 2nd offense next week. Maybe a few plays with the 1st offense too to see how it goes. He has his issues handling the ball, but unlike Zay Jones he at least brings something to the table that defenses have to worry about. 

[SirAndrew]

Just now, AllenLongBall said:

 

I think everyone thought Foster was going to replace Jones, but it looks like Foster has regressed.

Yeah,  I’ve found that to be the most discouraging development this preseason. Foster developed into a sure handed receiver with big play ability late last season. He looked like he could play on the outside as a real number two type receiver.  Zay is nowhere close to a guy I want as my number two. 

[CuddyDark]

1 minute ago, dneveu said:

 

Disagree.  That was an incredibly catchable pass.  I don't know if he lost it in the sun, or feared the contact - but any wide receiver should be able to catch that pass. If anything leading him more might lead to a pick.

Catchable, but behind him. You throw that in the hole between the DBs and lead the WR into the endzone.

[Royale with Cheese]

11 minutes ago, Ittakestime said:

 

QBs also stand at different intervals behind the QB.

 

All I am saying is that Bodine has been playing almost exclusively with Allen for the last 40 weeks.  For there to me a snap issue when they was a change, is not unexpected.

 

Just wait till Morse gets back in and there are snapping issues.  100% there will be.  There was already issues in TC with Morse and Allen.

 

No they don't...like no they don't at all.  Everyone lines up where they are supposed to line up.  Do you really think that if Allen stands 5 yards back but Barkley stands 7 yards back...nothing is adjusted???  They purposely are making things harder? 

 

I'm trying to think how your mind processes things because man you say some really bizarre stuff.

Right now, in your mind, you have concerns between Morse and Allen on snapping because of one training camp practice?  But then Bodine snaps it 3 feet over the head of Barkley in an actual game....no issues because as you say :

 

So every single time a new QB/Center combo, they are going to just have consistent snapping issues?

Why wasn't there snapping issues last year with 2 different starting centers and 3 different starting QB's?

 

How is it all of a sudden, we sign the a center to highest contract at his position, and that is going to bring snapping issues?

Edited August 9, 2019 by Royale with Cheese

[AllenLongBall]

6 minutes ago, CuddyDark said:

That 2 yard line pass to Zay was behind him. If it's out in front it's a touchdown.

 

I think that was the play where Tasker wanted to blame the sun and not Jones.  It was definitely not a perfect pass, but it did hit both hands.

[Gugny]

1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:

There we are, my reflections on pre-season game 1... I'll be back next week. Let's hear your thoughts!

 

 

Thanks, Gunner.  I always look forward to your assessments.  I appreciate the work you put into them.  Cheers!

[oldmanfan]

14 minutes ago, AllenLongBall said:

 

He underthrew brown, and overthrew the TE.  The Zay pass into the dirt and Zay drop are a wash.

 

15 minutes ago, AllenLongBall said:

 

He underthrew brown, and overthrew the TE.  The Zay pass into the dirt and Zay drop are a wash.

They are not a wash.  You can’t be critical of one throw and then ignore him hitting Jones right in the hands in between two defenders.  The only way that logic works is if you’re trying to pick out only negatives.  The TE throw has been discussed by others and I’ll have to look back to see what you’re talking about with Brown.

[skibum]

Also props to Lafayette Pitts, he had a couple of nice break-ups. Though maybe it's because he was being targeted...

 

And Perry had a good night, though I don't know if he looked like an NFL running back, exactly. 

 

Yeldon was pretty bad. 

[SCBills]

2 minutes ago, CuddyDark said:

Catchable, but behind him. You throw that in the hole between the DBs and lead the WR into the endzone.

 

Maybe Josh should just run down the field and hand the ball to Zay from now on.   

 

That was a good throw and any average WR catches that 9.5/10 times. 

[AllenLongBall]

Just now, oldmanfan said:

 

They are not a wash.  You can’t be critical of one throw and then ignore him hitting Jones right in the hands in between two defenders.  The only way that logic works is if you’re trying to pick out only negatives.  The TE throw has been discussed by others and I’ll have to look back to see what you’re talking about with Brown.

 

Hit both hands yes, but the pass was behind.  Don't know if you saw the Cards game after the Bills game at all, but watching Murray throw with anticipation, leading receivers etc, that's accuracy....  A poorly thrown ball can hit a receiver on both hands, but if the receiver has to react/contort to catch, it reduces the odds of completion.  Having said that, Jones being the receiver is the biggest problem on that play

[HappyDays]

8 minutes ago, CuddyDark said:

That 2 yard line pass to Zay was behind him. If it's out in front it's a touchdown.

 

You know what, Allen should have just walked to Zay Jones and slowly handed the ball to him. Then he should have picked him up and carried him into the endzone. Would that have been perfect enough for you?

[Coach Tuesday]

11 minutes ago, CuddyDark said:

That 2 yard line pass to Zay was behind him. If it's out in front it's a touchdown.

THE EARTH IS FLAT

[thebandit27]

Generally agree Gunner.

 

I was very happy with the QB play. I'm willing to accept some miscommunication early on, provided that it looks like it's been ironed out rather quickly...seems that that's what we saw.

 

You and I both had Ed Oliver as our #1 player in the draft, and it was obvious on a snap-to-snap basis why. He's "That Guy". Opposing OCs will devote time to game planning against him. You can already see the trickle down effect on the rest of the unit, as guys like Edmunds and Shaq are free to make plays.

 

My other good night guys:

Feliciano

Star

Corey Thompson

 

Other bad night guys:

Sweeney

Jaquan Johnson

 

[mjt328]

I may be in the minority, but maybe we should give Zay Jones a break on that drop.

 

Nobody wants to get hurt in preseason, on a meaningless play that won't count.

The defender was about to take his head off.  You really can't blame him for bracing himself and losing focus.

 

Don't get me wrong.  I believe this is Zay's last chance to prove himself as a starter on the Bills.  The talent around him is getting much better.  If the drop problems continue into this season,  I don't see him getting much playing time going forward.  

 

 

 

 

[thebandit27]

5 minutes ago, CuddyDark said:

Catchable, but behind him. You throw that in the hole between the DBs and lead the WR into the endzone.

 

That pass hit him in the hands, in stride. A mediocre NFL WR catches it 9/10 times.

[eball]

11 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

He looked like a good 3rd down back. That is what I think he is at this stage. As I said it wasn't really a bad night for him... it was a bad night for those who think he is going to be the starter some time very soon. He isn't there yet as a three down back. 

 

I'm surprised you didn't give Yeldon a "bad" night grade.  That fumble was a killer, and Singletary showing skills as a 3rd down back didn't help him either.

[GunnerBill]

Just now, eball said:

 

I'm surprised you didn't give Yeldon a "bad" night grade.  That fumble was a killer, and Singletary showing skills as a 3rd down back didn't help him either.

 

Meh. I never have given Yeldon much hope of making the team. He is an irrelevance to me. 

[eball]

Just now, thebandit27 said:

 

That pass hit him in the hands, in stride. A mediocre NFL WR catches it 9/10 times.

 

Exactly.  I can't believe the nitpicking over the placement of that throw.  Does anyone watch throws Brady/Brees make?  They're not all perfect, folks.  Your receivers need to make plays when the football hits them in the hands.

[DCOrange]

8 minutes ago, CuddyDark said:

Catchable, but behind him. You throw that in the hole between the DBs and lead the WR into the endzone.

I mean, sure he could have led him a little more than that, but it pretty much hit him dead on. He didn't have to reach back for it or anything. Ignoring the incoming tackler that might have been able to knock it loose, this is a very easy catch.

Edited August 9, 2019 by DCOrange

[Royale with Cheese]

7 minutes ago, CuddyDark said:

Catchable, but behind him. You throw that in the hole between the DBs and lead the WR into the endzone.

 

It was not behind him.  He hit him exactly where it's supposed to go.  He had the momentum going towards the endzone and he stopped it himself when he dropped it.

If he throws it "more in the hole" as you say...that safety crushes him.  He's already lowering that shoulder.