Inigo Montoya Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 When the season was over last year we all knew that upgrading the O-line was the single most important thing on Beane's to-do list. It looks like he felt the same way. With the addition of no less than seven new O-lineman, I think we may have upgraded the teams biggest weakness into one of its major strengths in just one off season. I think the last truly dominant O-line in the NFL was the 2016 Cowboys. They were maulers and helped rookie Zeke Elliott to over 1,600 yards rushing and helped rookie Dak Prescott look like an All Pro, franchise QB. There's a link below for a great article that really digs into the incredible stats for that Dallas 2016 O-line. http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000784248/article/offensive-line-of-the-year-dallas-cowboys-lived-up-to-the-hype I remember watching the Dallas offense tear it up that season and wondering why more teams don't invest in their O-lines like Dallas did? Why the Bills never seemed to make that common sense investment? I know O-linemen are not flashy or sexy like skill position players, but everyone knows that the offense lives and dies by two things, QB play, and O-line performance, and the QB play is dictated in large part by how well the O-line plays. I think a lot of GMs feel the need to keep the fans happy (and hopefully keep their jobs) by making splashy skill position signings and don't invest in the O-line. Does the average fan get stoked about an offensive guard signing? It looks like Beane gets it though. Enter Cody Ford. It might have seemed that we were set at O-line after a free agency where we brought in six O-linemen, but I think Beane is determined to place not just a solid O-line in front of Allen, but a dominant O-line, a line like Prescott had in 2016. That's why they turned in an envelop with Cody Ford's name on it with the 38th pick. A right tackle instead of a flashy WR or TE. With any luck, Ford is the Bill's starting RT for the next ten years. By all accounts Cody Ford plays nasty and this line has been in dire need of a little bit of nasty since Incognito left. I think that when all the dust settles, we will have gone from the 31st ranked O-line in the league last year to a top 5 line this year. I think every part of our offense will flourish this year because of it. Beane gets it, find your franchise quarterback and then build the trenches, everything else will follow. 5 3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoPar_v2 Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 Only starting holdover from last year is Dawkins (maybe?) Even The coach was replaced. Yeah it’s gonna be wild. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Brown Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 It's going to take them a while to mesh and even if they do they're pry not top 5. They have the potential to be in that 6 to 10 range though. Mitch Morse is the only elite player on the line. Dawkins, Spain, and Ford have the potential to be. I'm hoping Nsekhe (I butchered the name but I don't care) orLong step up to be that fifth guy. I've wanted Dawkins to move to guard since he's gotten here and I'm hoping the opening day roster is Nsekhe/Dawkins/Morse/Spain/Ford if all goes well. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inigo Montoya Posted April 27, 2019 Author Share Posted April 27, 2019 (edited) 27 minutes ago, JoPar_v2 said: Only starting holdover from last year is Dawkins (maybe?) Even The coach was replaced. Yeah it’s gonna be wild. I think Dawkins ends up being the odd man out. He was the best of a bad lot last year and I think he gets beat out and ends up being the reserve swing tackle. Nsekhe / Spain / Morse / Long / Ford Just my guess. The Battle of the O-Line is going to be incredible this year and improved O-Line play should really push the defense to be better as well going against them in practice all week. Edited April 27, 2019 by Inigo Montoya Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Boy Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 (edited) I harken way back to ‘88 when the O line was a concern that proved to be a strength. I get the distinct impression J Allen will have the repeated opportunity, by mid year, to just hang out behind this line, with ridiculous amounts of time, waiting for players to come open. Also excited to watch our run game reappear. Edited April 27, 2019 by Buffalo Boy 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobDVA Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 36 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said: I think Dawkins ends up being the odd man out. He was the best of a bad lot last year and I think he gets beat out and ends up being the reserve swing tackle. Nsekhe / Spain / Morse / Long / Ford Just my guess. The Battle of the O-Line is going to be incredible this year and improved O-Line play should really push the defense to be better as well going against them in practice all week. I think Dawkins knows he dropped off last year and has become determined to right what was wrong. If he does, then we truly will have a top five line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincec Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 (edited) 16 hours ago, Inigo Montoya said: I think Dawkins ends up being the odd man out. He was the best of a bad lot last year and I think he gets beat out and ends up being the reserve swing tackle. Nsekhe / Spain / Morse / Long / Ford Just my guess. The Battle of the O-Line is going to be incredible this year and improved O-Line play should really push the defense to be better as well going against them in practice all week. They're going to give Dawkins every opportunity to keep the job. I don't think Nsekhe beats him out. OL is an area where cohesion is very important so I would expect a period of adjustment, trial and error before a group of 5 emerges and begins to gel. So the first half of the season will be interesting. Then we can see what they've put together at OL. Edited April 28, 2019 by vincec Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CEN-CAL17 Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 Dawkins Spain Morse Ford Nsekhe Those are probably the top 5. Ford goes to RT 2020 season 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobbRiddick Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 2 hours ago, Inigo Montoya said: When the season was over last year we all knew that upgrading the O-line was the single most important thing on Beane's to-do list. It looks like he felt the same way. With the addition of no less than seven new O-lineman, I think we may have upgraded the teams biggest weakness into one of its major strengths in just one off season. I think the last truly dominant O-line in the NFL was the 2016 Cowboys. They were maulers and helped rookie Zeke Elliott to over 1,600 yards rushing and helped rookie Dak Prescott look like an All Pro, franchise QB. There's a link below for a great article that really digs into the incredible stats for that Dallas 2016 O-line. http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000784248/article/offensive-line-of-the-year-dallas-cowboys-lived-up-to-the-hype I remember watching the Dallas offense tear it up that season and wondering why more teams don't invest in their O-lines like Dallas did? Why the Bills never seemed to make that common sense investment? I know O-linemen are not flashy or sexy like skill position players, but everyone knows that the offense lives and dies by two things, QB play, and O-line performance, and the QB play is dictated in large part by how well the O-line plays. I think a lot of GMs feel the need to keep the fans happy (and hopefully keep their jobs) by making splashy skill position signings and don't invest in the O-line. Does the average fan get stoked about an offensive guard signing? It looks like Beane gets it though. Enter Cody Ford. It might have seemed that we were set at O-line after a free agency where we brought in six O-linemen, but I think Beane is determined to place not just a solid O-line in front of Allen, but a dominant O-line, a line like Prescott had in 2016. That's why they turned in an envelop with Cody Ford's name on it with the 38th pick. A right tackle instead of a flashy WR or TE. With any luck, Ford is the Bill's starting RT for the next ten years. By all accounts Cody Ford plays nasty and this line has been in dire need of a little bit of nasty since Incognito left. I think that when all the dust settles, we will have gone from the 31st ranked O-line in the league last year to a top 5 line this year. I think every part of our offense will flourish this year because of it. Beane gets it, find your franchise quarterback and then build the trenches, everything else will follow. I agree, and if they are then I don't think 10 or 11 wins is a crazy as some people think. As I just said in another thread, a great O-line just improves everything. Even the defense will benefit as they're not having to spend as long on the field, and if we get more leads they get to be more aggressive as teams are playing catchup, meaning more turnovers. Can't wait for camp to see these guys begin to work together. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProcessAccepted Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 1 hour ago, BobDVA said: I think Dawkins knows he dropped off last year and has become determined to right what was wrong. If he does, then we truly will have a top five line. It's hard to completely hold last year against him. He was part of a unit that had all sorts of problems. You OL is only as strong as the weakest link and was there ever a lot of weak links. Like a lot of posters have said, it's going to take time for this group to gel and know how to work with each other. #17's ability to run around will mask things a bit stat wise. But it's way too early to be talking top 5, that's like Rex declaring us winning the offseason every year he was here ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IgotBILLStopay Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 Ford has fronted mobile QBs well. He is a technician - and is great at frustrating the lineman he is engaged with because he just doesn’t give ground. While a Jawaan Taylor can turn nasty and pancake block linemen as a Tackle he is not versatile like Ford who you can move around anywhere on the line. Ford is just solid inside or outside. His versatility gives the Bills so many options - if Long and Spain work out he goes outside. If Nsekhe and Dawkins work out well he can move inside. The key to Ford’s game is that it is predicated upon beating the opposing lineman to the spot through sheer athleticism. And then just holding his ground. He is not super strong. That is why game tape is more important than BP reps. I have not seen a tackle pull as well as he does. Oliver and then Ford - the athletic side on either side of the line just underwent a quantum leap. Nicely done Beane. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 34 minutes ago, 1ZAYDAY1 said: Dawkins Spain Morse Ford Nsekhe Those are probably the top 5. Ford goes to RT 2020 season Thats my expectation. If Dawkins struggles a bit you miiiiight see him kick inside and nsekhe slide over with ford at rt this year but I’m expecting your configuration with teller, long and waddle off the bench. Should be middle of the pack instead of a weakness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockinon Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 Expectations are high. I just hope they gel quickly. A lot of new pieces here...... could take a while. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmyNoodles Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 54 minutes ago, 1ZAYDAY1 said: Dawkins Spain Morse Ford Nsekhe Those are probably the top 5. Ford goes to RT 2020 season I think this is the right combo, which looks pretty good. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WideRightRevenge Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 2 hours ago, BobDVA said: I think Dawkins knows he dropped off last year and has become determined to right what was wrong. If he does, then we truly will have a top five line. Agree on Dawkins .. bottom line ... he had no challenges or leadership from his fellow OL teammates in 2018 .... it's a totally different situation in 2019 .. the message has been sent .. step up or get sent to the bench ... I predict he responds and hopefully Morse will be a good mentor to push him forward Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptnCoke11 Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 In no scenario do i see Long starting anywhere on the line. He’ll be back up to all interior spots. Dawkins spot is shaky at best right now. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hebert19 Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 2 hours ago, BobDVA said: I think Dawkins knows he dropped off last year and has become determined to right what was wrong. If he does, then we truly will have a top five line. Look who was playing beside Dawkins. He will rebound. Having said that they may eye a trade too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GimmeSomeProcess Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 I am beyond ecstatic the focus we put in the o line. This was bar none the most important thing we needed to do for Josh Allen. Now next year we can add more weapons 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lightning21 Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 I believe now its up to the coaches. The pats coaches would make this a top 5 unit. They've done a few oline overhauls in one offseason that panned out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peace Frog Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 I see it as Nsekhe / Spain / Morse / Dawkins / Ford Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris heff Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 (edited) When the Bills drafted Ford, my reaction was they must feel better about Dawkins than I thought. Ford’s upside seems to be RT. Are they really thinking a 33 year old Nsekhe is a LT? Mark Gaughan’s conclusion is exactly that. What do you guys think? https://buffalonews.com/2019/04/26/cody-ford-buffalo-bills-right-tackle-nfl-draft-offensive-line-new-starters-analysis/ Edited April 27, 2019 by chris heff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rc2catch Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 They’re thinking all out battle, cream rises to the top and best man wins across the line. Morse is the only 100% given for his position. The beauty of it all is most if not all the free agents can play multiple spots. Going to be a difficult cut down this year as some pretty good players won’t make this team 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatdrought Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 I’m happy knowing that Morse is the anchor, and everything else falls into place. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njbuff Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 Boettger could be the surprise of it all. The staff seems to really like him. Teller might not make the team. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 Same conversation here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris heff Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 In Dawkins defense he did go from playing with Incognito and Wood to a revolving door, a rookie and two guys that aren’t starting centers. I hope Dawkins rebounds. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickrage Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 9 minutes ago, chris heff said: In Dawkins defense he did go from playing with Incognito and Wood to a revolving door, a rookie and two guys that aren’t starting centers. I hope Dawkins rebounds. Exactly this. Incognito was a huge loss for Dawkins. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptnCoke11 Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 (edited) 21 minutes ago, chris heff said: In Dawkins defense he did go from playing with Incognito and Wood to a revolving door, a rookie and two guys that aren’t starting centers. I hope Dawkins rebounds. Good LTs shouldn’t need a crutch. He was awful. Edited April 27, 2019 by CaptnCoke11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollars 2 donuts Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 (edited) Guys, seriously, as was mentioned during a phone conversation with Bagel from this board earlier today...how fun is preseason going to be? we honestly could be looking at olinemen playing into the third and fourth quarter in front of Barkley that may end up starting for this team. Our fourth quarter preseason line might end being made up entirely of multi-year nfl starters. i know it is just preseason, but may I please claim 3-1 right now? Edited April 27, 2019 by dollars 2 donuts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dayman Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 5 minutes ago, dollars 2 donuts said: Guys, seriously, as was mentioned during a phone conversation with Bagel from this board earlier today...how fun is preseason going to be? we honestly could be looking at olinemen playing into the third and fourth quarter in front of Barkley that may end up starting for this team. i know it is just preseason, but may I please claim 3-1 right now? With the Oline situation we probably will play well in the second half of the first 2 games. Experienced guys blocking nobodies and our fancy new RB feasting. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollars 2 donuts Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 Just now, dayman said: With the Oline situation we probably will play well in the second half of the first 2 games. Experienced guys blocking nobodies and our fancy new RB feasting. DAYMAN, I NEED AUGUST HERE RIGHT NOW! ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil The Thrill Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 2 hours ago, chris heff said: When the Bills drafted Ford, my reaction was they must feel better about Dawkins than I thought. Ford’s upside seems to be RT. Are they really thinking a 33 year old Nsekhe is a LT? Mark Gaughan’s conclusion is exactly that. What do you guys think? https://buffalonews.com/2019/04/26/cody-ford-buffalo-bills-right-tackle-nfl-draft-offensive-line-new-starters-analysis/ Good article but if Dawkins doesn’t win a tackle spot, I think he gets moved to guard. Part of what they value is flexibility. I can see Dion sitting while he has the ability and knowledge to play guard 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IgotBILLStopay Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 Dawkins was fine playing with Wood and Incognito. I expect him to bounce back now that he has Morse and Ford next to him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BullBuchanan Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 Dawkins/Spain/Morse/Ford/Nsekhe 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boater Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 I agree with OP's original sense; though I add a slower timeline. From my fan experience, it seems that offensive line players take time to gel together. If you do a change out on offensive line.. it will take sometime for the new guy to synch up and get used to each other. When you change multiple positions in one training camp (seems likely here) the problem is amplified. I hope fans are patient when the starting unit may not be up to speed the first four of five games this year. I expect a Top-5 offensive line in 2020. We'll see glimpses of it in late 2019. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warcodered Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 They've still got some major work to do though. They've got to get their starters and backup/depth sorted out and then they've got them to coalesce together. New O line coach is gonna have to earn his pay this year. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddaryl Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 Practicing against our DL should help speed up the learning process 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincec Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 15 hours ago, 1ZAYDAY1 said: Dawkins Spain Morse Ford Nsekhe Those are probably the top 5. Ford goes to RT 2020 season Exactly my thinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasterStrategist Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 Always exciting with new pieces to work with and a new coach. Hopefully the new coach can quickly identify the "best 5" and get the continuity started. Not the same at all, but somewhat similar to what Indy did with their o-line last year. That certainly worked out very well for them. My guess: Dawkins Teller Morse Spain Ford Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Putin Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 15 hours ago, 1ZAYDAY1 said: Dawkins Spain Morse Ford Nsekhe Those are probably the top 5. Ford goes to RT 2020 season I think this is pretty much how it will go !!! im not sure if it’s a top 5 or 25 but it sure is ALOT better then what we had last year , and we should also feel good about the depth we now have ? Go Bills !!!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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