Do NOT start Allen at Baltimore

[zow2]

Josh is obviously the future, but hopefully this staff has the smarts to not put the kid in there for game #1.   He and the offense were overwhelmed by Cincinnati's starting D-line just 5 days ago.  He's not ready to go into a hostile environment and read a pro defense, have good communication in/out of the huddle, audible and execute at a high level.   It's just not gonna happen in this game.

Baltimore is back after a disappointing 2017.  They will have a very good team this year.  Their D is going to be playing with their hair on fire opening day.  I think they'd still beat the Bills even if they started Lamar Jackson (which they won't).   Do I think Nate Peterman will do well if he gets the start?  I doubt it but I'd rather see him in there for this particular game than Allen.   I think Nate has a year under his belt to notice pre-snap reads better than JA and to handle the difficult communication that will be required in a loud road stadium.   

 

If Peterman surprises people and plays well, then it's a nice bonus for everyone and the coaching staff will have a good situation on their hands.  If he lays a big egg (like many will expect him to do)...then it's very justified and easy for McDermott to name Josh Allen the starter for the home opener vs. LA.     I'd much rather see Allen get his first start in a friendly environment than on the road where he will literally have almost no chance to succeed.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

3 minutes ago, zow2 said:

Josh is obviously the future, but hopefully this staff has the smarts to not put the kid in there for game #1.   He and the offense were overwhelmed by Cincinnati's starting D-line just 5 days ago.  He's not ready to go into a hostile environment and read a pro defense, have good communication in/out of the huddle, audible and execute at a high level.   It's just not gonna happen in this game.

Baltimore is back after a disappointing 2017.  They will have a very good team this year.  Their D is going to be playing with their hair on fire opening day.  I think they'd still beat the Bills even if they started Lamar Jackson (which they won't).   Do I think Nate Peterman will do well if he gets the start?  I doubt it but I'd rather see him in there for this particular game than Allen.   I think Nate has a year under his belt to notice pre-snap reads better than JA and to handle the difficult communication that will be required in a loud road stadium.   

 

If Peterman surprises people and plays well, then it's a nice bonus for everyone and the coaching staff will have a good situation on their hands.  If he lays a big egg (like many will expect him to do)...then it's very justified and easy for McDermott to name Josh Allen the starter for the home opener vs. LA.     I'd much rather see Allen get his first start in a friendly environment than on the road where he will literally have almost no chance to succeed.

 

They won't have their #1 CB for the game or their 1st round pick.  Their offense doesn't impress me honestly, but their defense will be a pain to run on.  Since they have a stout D-line and solid LBs - I like the peterman start because i think the game plan will dictate spreading the field a bit more to try and take advantage of matchups. 

[Mrbojanglezs]

We have 5 years to take advantage of his rookie deal and surround him with expensive pieces to make a run.

 

They better not wait too long...couple weeks is fine. But he needs to play majority of the games this year and get his feet wet. I am a firm believer that QBs learn best by playing regardless of how hostile the environment or bad the team is. If a QB has the mental makeup to be a franchise QB he will get through all the lumps.

Edited August 31, 2018 by Mrbojanglezs

[Woodman19]

Ok I won't.

[Soda Popinski]

If he's ready play him.   Put it on the Oline to give him protection.  Give him quick 3 step drops and quick read options with no more than 2 progressions.    

 

Peterman won't get any more pass protection than Allen will.   So just start the QB who gives us the best chance to win. 

 

I think that is Peterman right now, but if it's Allen I will defer to the staff knowing better than I do.   

[26TrapDraw]

10 minutes ago, Mrbojanglezs said:

We have 5 years to take advantage of his rookie deal and surround him with expensive pieces to make a run.

 

They better not wait too long...couple weeks is fine. But he needs to play majority of the games this year and get his feet wet. I am a firm believer that QBs learn best by playing regardless of how hostile the environment or bad the team is. If a QB has the mental makeup to be a franchise QB he will get through all the lumps.

Sound logic. Although I recommend eating something that won't hurt on the way up when choosing Sundays menu. Watching Peterman throw the out pick 6 is gonna make me yak.

[SoCal Deek]

Please let us know when you think it’s safe to play him.  Tug on you ear or something so we’ll all know. ?

[Soda Popinski]

9 minutes ago, BeefCurtns said:

Sound logic. Although I recommend eating something that won't hurt on the way up when choosing Sundays menu. Watching Peterman throw the out pick 6 is gonna make me yak.

They can't have that route as an option for him, he was almost picked off in every game he played in on that route.   Partially because of his arm, but also because he was late on that throw every time.   That ball has to be in the air when the WR is  making his cut and when his head gets around it should be about 15 yards from him.   When Peterman threw that ball the WR was already coming back and had his head around, giving the DB time to close on the route and almost intercept the ball.  In every one of those throws the WR became the defender. 

 

McCarron did the same thing last night and it went for 6

[CommonCents]

32 minutes ago, zow2 said:

Josh is obviously the future, but hopefully this staff has the smarts to not put the kid in there for game #1.   He and the offense were overwhelmed by Cincinnati's starting D-line just 5 days ago.  He's not ready to go into a hostile environment and read a pro defense, have good communication in/out of the huddle, audible and execute at a high level.   It's just not gonna happen in this game.

Baltimore is back after a disappointing 2017.  They will have a very good team this year.  Their D is going to be playing with their hair on fire opening day.  I think they'd still beat the Bills even if they started Lamar Jackson (which they won't).   Do I think Nate Peterman will do well if he gets the start?  I doubt it but I'd rather see him in there for this particular game than Allen.   I think Nate has a year under his belt to notice pre-snap reads better than JA and to handle the difficult communication that will be required in a loud road stadium.   

 

If Peterman surprises people and plays well, then it's a nice bonus for everyone and the coaching staff will have a good situation on their hands.  If he lays a big egg (like many will expect him to do)...then it's very justified and easy for McDermott to name Josh Allen the starter for the home opener vs. LA.     I'd much rather see Allen get his first start in a friendly environment than on the road where he will literally have almost no chance to succeed.

No one is ready. The coach decided to spend the entire summer rotating 3 QBs and he still hasn’t made a decision for week 1. I still love McD but he better have the dishes done when I get home, I’m getting sick of his ****.

[JerseyBills]

Peterman has slowly won me over as a capable starter . I like his quick release and poise . The turnovers are concerning and turnovers are a major factor in a W or L. 

 

Allen has also won me over , even in an atrocious offensive performance against Bal, he showed poise , confidence and the stage is not to big for him. If anything that game vs Cincy proved that .  His natural ability and progression in a few months has been a fantastic sign , regardless if he's the 1 or 2. 

 

This is where I'm at with both guys - whoever starts , should be put on a very short  leash and if they consistently struggle, we need to get the other one in there imnediately and let the other showcase their ability. 

 

Bottom line - we have 2 Young starters that we can truly move forward with and be content with for 3 years . I also guarantee this offense, specifically OL , won't be that bad . We were missing our top player , Shady, who is a nightmare for defenses, and our best OL. Also respect Daboll enough that he figures out how to scheme around the OL.  

 

Ppl forget McD was EVALUATING positions, not scheming for the Bengals ferocious front 4 . So we need to take a deep breath and remember these variables and wait til week 1 , where I'm confident we look like a different team than we did in a Scrimmage game!

[greeneblitz]

Josh Allen should definitely start every game this year, we have no incumbent starter on the roster and it's his team now, we should have our eye on 2019 and not going into it with Josh Allen still a rookie, no one has ever learned anything from sitting on a bench watching a mediocre 2nd year QB play. We likely aren't going anywhere as a team and whether it's Peterman or Allen, it won't make a difference in the early going, but as the season rolls on Allen will hopefully start to bloom and get better and better with more experience. Whenever Allen goes in, it will be starting from scratch, we can't keep taking shortcuts.

 

 

 

6 minutes ago, JerseyBills said:

This is where I'm at with both guys - whoever starts , should be put on a very short  leash and if they consistently struggle, we need to get the other one in there imnediately and let the other showcase their ability. 

 

This is the single dumbest thing I've ever heard in all of football, that's the exact opposite to develop a young player, only desperate coaches and GM pull that garbage.

Edited August 31, 2018 by greeneblitz

[MAJBobby]

Start him. He is the future. QBs learn with game reps  lets get these reps going sooner than later 

[SCBills]

Peterman has proven enough that if he is named starter, he deserves the chance.  That being said, I want to see Allen.  Daboll can scheme to keep him upright and I'm sure we run a decent amount, along with deploying 2 TE sets to slow the pass rush.

[Dablitzkrieg]

Start Allen and ride the wave.  It is NOT about this year 

[JerseyBills]

4 minutes ago, greeneblitz said:

Josh Allen should definitely start every game this year, we have no incumbent starter on the roster and it's his team now, we should have our eye on 2019 and not going into it with Josh Allen still a rookie, no one has ever learned anything from sitting on a bench watching a mediocre 2nd year QB play. We likely aren't going anywhere as a team and whether it's Peterman or Allen, it won't make a difference in the early going, but as the season rolls on Allen will hopefully start to bloom and get better and better with more experience. Whenever Allen goes in, it will be starting from scratch, we can't keep taking shortcuts.

This is the single dumbest thing I've ever heard in all of football, that's the exact opposite to develop a young player, only desperate coaches and GM pull that garbage.

We pulled that "garbage" just last year to a vet QB on a 5-4 team because he felt another QB can give us a better chance at Winning! It's all about winning.  Are you kidding me??

 

The point is they are both extremely young and each has shown potential in  different areas and have different strengths and weaknesses. McD isn't afraid to pull that move , if the starter isn't getting it done, ya gotta go with the other guy , whoever gives the best chance to win. 

[Seattlebills21]

Start Peterman +710. 

[Wayne Cubed]

I'm not sure how much you are suppose to read into what Allen did or didn't do against the Bengals. Or the offense as a whole, considering they were missing McCoy.  It's preseason. Are you expecting things to look exactly like they did against the Bengals? Are you expecting to get exactly what you got from Peterman in the preseason?

 

I feel like this happens every year, people haven't learned to not base things off of what they see in the preseason. 

[JerseyBills]

3 minutes ago, Dablitzkrieg said:

Start Allen and ride the wave.  It is NOT about this year 

Maybe not to you and other fans.

It is to the men at One Bills Drive , I can guarantee that.

[Dablitzkrieg]

1 minute ago, JerseyBills said:

Maybe not to you and other fans.

It is to the men at One Bills Drive , I can guarantee that.

I am not saying they are not trying to win each week.  I'm pretty sure the staff is smart enough to realize this team is not going to win a championship this year and Allen is the long-term solution.  Better him get the kinks out ASAP, rather than do this next year instead.

[JerseyBills]

2 minutes ago, Dablitzkrieg said:

I am not saying they are not trying to win each week.  I'm pretty sure the staff is smart enough to realize this team is not going to win a championship this year and Allen is the long-term solution.  Better him get the kinks out ASAP, rather than do this next year instead.

I understand and I get it . Especially with the cap space available next year , Beane and McD can build on the foundation and truly put their stamp on this roster.  But in the same breath, you really never know in this league. It's a league of "what ifs" for almost every club.  The standard was set at 9 wins last year, anything less is a failure

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

The first three games are no joke for a rookie QB. @ Baltimore vs. LA Chargers @ Minnesota. 

 

Week one is probably the friendliest of the three. I'd like to see Allen this year. But, Peterman has been the best QB of the three this pre-season. I'm fine with bringing Allen on later in the year but I would like to see him start at least 8 games this year so he's not a complete unknown still going into next season.

[LeGOATski]

I want to see Peterman redeem himself against the Chargers.

 

Feel-good story of the season.

[ProcessAccepted]

59 minutes ago, greeneblitz said:

Josh Allen should definitely start every game this year, we have no incumbent starter on the roster and it's his team now, we should have our eye on 2019 and not going into it with Josh Allen still a rookie, no one has ever learned anything from sitting on a bench watching a mediocre 2nd year QB play. We likely aren't going anywhere as a team and whether it's Peterman or Allen, it won't make a difference in the early going, but as the season rolls on Allen will hopefully start to bloom and get better and better with more experience. Whenever Allen goes in, it will be starting from scratch, we can't keep taking shortcuts.

 

 

 

This is the single dumbest thing I've ever heard in all of football, that's the exact opposite to develop a young player, only desperate coaches and GM pull that garbage.

 

I'm not sure if I've ever disagreed and agreed with a single post so strongly before. ?

 

First the disagreement. You have to admit Peterman did learn a lot during his year on the bench watching Tyrod play (I know he's not a 2nd year QB)

 

Now the agreement. Keeping QBs on a short leash is the worst thing you can do for their development. It reminds me of when Kurt Warner was with the Giants and the added Eli. When the benched Kurt and then wanted to yank Eli because he struggled. Kurt went ape$#!+ because of the damage that does to young QBs. You've got to let them play through the struggles.

 

[Jerome007]

1 hour ago, Soda Popinski said:

They can't have that route as an option for him, he was almost picked off in every game he played in on that route.   Partially because of his arm, but also because he was late on that throw every time.   That ball has to be in the air when the WR is  making his cut and when his head gets around it should be about 15 yards from him.   When Peterman threw that ball the WR was already coming back and had his head around, giving the DB time to close on the route and almost intercept the ball.  In every one of those throws the WR became the defender. 

 

McCarron did the same thing last night and it went for 6

I agree that while Nate does NOT have a stong arm, his near picks have been because he was late. Anyway, take that pass away from him please LOL As otherwise, he's been money.

 

I wanted Josh in there right away. I didn't change my mind because of game 3. Just because if Nate falters and Josh comes in it's good. If Allen falters, then what? If Nate performs superbly well, then it's a great problem to have! So I'd now side with start NP but with a short leash. But I'll support the decision whatever it may be, as there is no clear cut right one! People will blame McD if they lose (and pretend they knew better) but let him do it as he wants it.

 

 

[Soda Popinski]

Just now, Jerome007 said:

I agree that while Nate does NOT have a stong arm, his near picks have been because he was late. Anyway, take that pass away from him please LOL As otherwise, he's been money.

 

I wanted Josh in there right away. I didn't change my mind because of game 3. Just because if Nate falters and Josh comes in it's good. If Allen falters, then what? If Nate performs superbly well, then it's a great problem to have! So I'd now side with start NP but with a short leash. But I'll support the decision whatever it may be, as there is no clear cut right one! People will blame McD if they lose (and pretend they knew better) but let him do it as he wants it.

 

 

My thought process is Wentz started his rookie year, went 7-9 with a 79 passer rating and threw something like 18TDs to 14 interceptions.   He was learning on the job and the following year he was playing like an MVP quarterback.  You could see year 1 that he was progressing, but was making the rookie mistakes, that really accelerated his learning curve IMO.

 

Problem is do people in WNY have the patience for a 7-9 season while Allen learns on the job?    

[Wo-Bah]

1 minute ago, Soda Popinski said:

My thought process is Wentz started his rookie year, went 7-9 with a 79 passer rating and threw something like 18TDs to 14 interceptions.   He was learning on the job and the following year he was playing like an MVP quarterback.  You could see year 1 that he was progressing, but was making the rookie mistakes, that really accelerated his learning curve IMO.

 

Problem is do people in WNY have the patience for a 7-9 season while Allen learns on the job?    

 

To the bold: personally, I think to get out of this season, with this schedule, and these players on this team, I would consider a 7-9 record a success. 

[BillnutinHouston]

1 hour ago, zow2 said:

Josh is obviously the future, but hopefully this staff has the smarts to not put the kid in there for game #1.   He and the offense were overwhelmed by Cincinnati's starting D-line just 5 days ago.  He's not ready to go into a hostile environment and read a pro defense, have good communication in/out of the huddle, audible and execute at a high level.   It's just not gonna happen in this game.

Baltimore is back after a disappointing 2017.  They will have a very good team this year.  Their D is going to be playing with their hair on fire opening day.  I think they'd still beat the Bills even if they started Lamar Jackson (which they won't).   Do I think Nate Peterman will do well if he gets the start?  I doubt it but I'd rather see him in there for this particular game than Allen.   I think Nate has a year under his belt to notice pre-snap reads better than JA and to handle the difficult communication that will be required in a loud road stadium.   

 

If Peterman surprises people and plays well, then it's a nice bonus for everyone and the coaching staff will have a good situation on their hands.  If he lays a big egg (like many will expect him to do)...then it's very justified and easy for McDermott to name Josh Allen the starter for the home opener vs. LA.     I'd much rather see Allen get his first start in a friendly environment than on the road where he will literally have almost no chance to succeed.

 

While my heart disagrees, my head agrees with most of this.  Where you lost me is your thinking there's a chance Peterman would lose the job after only one game.  I think that would ONLY happen after an absolute train wreck.  hed have a slightly longer leash. 

 

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

7 minutes ago, Soda Popinski said:

My thought process is Wentz started his rookie year, went 7-9 with a 79 passer rating and threw something like 18TDs to 14 interceptions.   He was learning on the job and the following year he was playing like an MVP quarterback.  You could see year 1 that he was progressing, but was making the rookie mistakes, that really accelerated his learning curve IMO.

 

Problem is do people in WNY have the patience for a 7-9 season while Allen learns on the job?    

 

I'm nervous about McDermott and his ability to develop a young QB. Wentz, and we can include Goff, had great sophomore seasons. They also had offensive minded head coaches and great talent around them. Especially on the o-line. I'm fearful that Allen's rookie year could look a lot more like Goff's under Jeff Fischer. Good news is that Goff was not permanently damaged by that bad season. But will McDermott be able to bring in the pieces to help Allen in  the future?

[Jerome007]

7 minutes ago, Wo-Bah said:

 

To the bold: personally, I think to get out of this season, with this schedule, and these players on this team, I would consider a 7-9 record a success. 

Ha ha indeed. It's the way he will play that will make people like or boo him. Few people seem to give the Bills any chance to win this season so in that sense Allen could learn with less stress (other that getting killed by a porous OLine...)

 

I repeat that whatever decision McD takes I support. It doesn't mean he has a free pass for how he handles it after, but seriously, who can say for sure who should be the starting QB for game 1? Pros and cons abound. If he does chose McCarron, THEN he will have more justification to do though!

[corta765]

I don't disagree that I wouldn't start him but that would be more because of our teams issues then the Ravens. The Ravens are a 7-9 to 10-6 team. They have some nice pieces on D and some issues in other areas. Even if their offense turns to be better then it was, it'll take a few weeks and the NFL has shown the first 2 weeks of the NFL season mean not much in the grand scheme on what a team truly is.

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

3 minutes ago, BillnutinHouston said:

 

While my heart disagrees, my head agrees with most of this.  Where you lost me is your thinking there's a chance Peterman would lose the job after only one game.  I think that would ONLY happen after an absolute train wreck.  hed have a slightly longer leash. 

 

 

I'd give Peterman a very long leash through the first three games. Unless he pulls another 4 or 5 pick game I would play him through the first three at least. If we are 0-3 at that point and Peterman looks average at best then perfect time to start Allen week four at Green Bay in late September.

[John from Riverside]

Im sorry how exactly do we know that "Baltimore is back"?

 

Missing several key guys

 

I personally am torn on starting Josh on opening day....not because he supposidly is "not ready" but this offensive line is not ready to give him more then 2 seconds to get rid of the ball....if our OL was playing better I would def start him

[Fr. Jerk]

[Jerome007]

Just now, John from Riverside said:

Im sorry how exactly do we know that "Baltimore is back"?

 

Missing several key guys

 

I personally am torn on starting Josh on opening day....not because he supposidly is "not ready" but this offensive line is not ready to give him more then 2 seconds to get rid of the ball....if our OL was playing better I would def start him

Our OL sucks. No getting around that.

 

But we saw very little sweeps, no rolling out of the pocket that I recall, less runs and a lot more passes that we can expect, no max protection plays with only one or 2 receiver going deep, etc. It was preseason and they wanted to evaluate players, not schemes. So it was the right way to do it. Let's just hope that NOW Daboll and McD will use plays adapted to the talent they have. And yes, some max protection plays with Josh's cannon arm can make one dream...

[Soda Popinski]

6 minutes ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:

 

I'm nervous about McDermott and his ability to develop a young QB. Wentz, and we can include Goff, had great sophomore seasons. They also had offensive minded head coaches and great talent around them. Especially on the o-line. I'm fearful that Allen's rookie year could look a lot more like Goff's under Jeff Fischer. Good news is that Goff was not permanently damaged by that bad season. But will McDermott be able to bring in the pieces to help Allen in  the future?

Bringing in Daboll IMO was a great move, he's worked with young QBs and I believe he knows enough about developing talent.  He is the guy I would lean on to develop Allen more than McDermott.    

[John from Riverside]

8 minutes ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:

 

I'm nervous about McDermott and his ability to develop a young QB. Wentz, and we can include Goff, had great sophomore seasons. They also had offensive minded head coaches and great talent around them. Especially on the o-line. I'm fearful that Allen's rookie year could look a lot more like Goff's under Jeff Fischer. Good news is that Goff was not permanently damaged by that bad season. But will McDermott be able to bring in the pieces to help Allen in  the future?

That is why McD was smart enough to bring in Debol

[Tatonka68]

You cannot learn on the bench. Might as well roll him out now. McCarron and Petermen might be slightly better now, but that won.t make a difference in the game.

[billsfan_34]

2 hours ago, Mrbojanglezs said:

We have 5 years to take advantage of his rookie deal and surround him with expensive pieces to make a run.

 

They better not wait too long...couple weeks is fine. But he needs to play majority of the games this year and get his feet wet. I am a firm believer that QBs learn best by playing regardless of how hostile the environment or bad the team is. If a QB has the mental makeup to be a franchise QB he will get through all the lumps.

I want this kid to play as much as anyone but on the flip side this horrid offensive line can ruin him.

Edited August 31, 2018 by billsfan_34

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

4 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

Im sorry how exactly do we know that "Baltimore is back"?

 

They didn't necessarily fall off a cliff. They were 9-7 last year not too bad. Obviously could have easily been 10-6 as we well know. Plus, their defense was their strength last year and likely their strength again this year. And the question at hand is who should we start at QB. What defenses that QB will be facing should be considered.

[Tatonka68]

Just now, billsfan_34 said:

I want this kid to play as much as anyone but on the flip side this horrid offensive line can ruin him.

No it won't, he is used to it. His line at Wyoming sucked also.