CBS.com: This year’s version of Dak Prescott = Mason Rudolph

[YoloinOhio]

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/news/nfl-draft-why-josh-rosen-is-like-eli-mason-rudolph-is-like-dak-prescott-and-more-qb-comparisons/

 

Before the Non-Rudolph people attack this, I understand that this writer really likes Rudolph and has had him as his QB1 all year. But if you listen to him interviewed, he is measured about his approach on that, with balanced perspective on his strengths/weaknesses and I frankly applaud people with the courage to go against the grain. It means they have conviction on their work and don’t just go along with groupthink because they are afraid to be wrong. 

 

That said, the comparison to Dak is interesting and not something I’ve seen before. Usually i see Dalton or Petty. And Dak was drafted in the 3rd, so this isn’t trumpeting him as some top 10 pick.

 

I’m still 1)Rosen 2) Mayfield but I’m keeping an open mind because no one knows who will emerge as a franchise, playoff-level QB. A LOT depends on system, coaching, and situation. Like it did with Dak. So would I be disappointed if we drafted Rudolph instead of Rosen and Mayfield? Admittedly so. But I wouldn’t be pissed. He could end up being perfect for this team. No one knows, yet. It’s a good article. 

 

I found this interview with Trapasso pretty interesting from yesterday as well -

https://d3efjls8gnbg8i.cloudfront.net/1642018/122414888.mp3?rhihttphost=wgr550.hosted.cx

Trapasso said he thinks he will go in the first round, outside top 10, the 5th or 6th QB taken. He indicated how good he is in the classroom and how many defenses and coverages he’s seen being a 3 year starter (similar to Mayfield). He’s able to diagnose a lot and audible at the line, understanding  route concepts.

 

As far as arm strength he indicates it is overhyped because in the last 5 years,  95% of throws in the nfl were under 30 yards in the air and 80% are from the shotgun. It’s outdated thinking that a guy needs to be under center and able to throw it 70-80 yards or he’s not going to succeed in the league. He does think velocity could be an issue (this was also a knock on Deshaun Watson), but everything else with pocket movement, pocket patience, and downfield accuracy are advanced. 

Edited April 8, 2018 by YoloinOhio

[Chuck Wagon]

Everything is relative.

 

If we pick Rudolph #53, I can get on board.  At 12?  storm the castle.

[Kirby Jackson]

If we draft Rudolph over Rosen or Mayfield I’ll be pissed. If I’m wrong, I’m wrong. I am not passing on the superior talent (especially in Rosen’s case). 

Edited April 8, 2018 by Kirby Jackson

[billspro]

It is definitely a breath of fresh air to have a draft analyst formulate an opinion not in line with everyone else. 

[JohnBonhamRocks]

I buy into the line of thinking that trying to compare a prospect to a current player is an exercise in futility. 

 

That said, I think the possibility that Rudolph could go late Round 1 means he might end up in a near ideal situation. 

 

For example, I think going to the Steelers (like in the TSW mock draft) is both realistic and likely to be a benefit to his career. 

[DriveFor1Outta5]

The article might not be “trumpeting” Rudolph as a top 10 pick, but he will likely be drafted higher than Dak. Rudolph would be worth taking a chance on in the third round (where Dak was picked), but I wouldn’t take him much higher. The Cowboys were able to receive a big reward while taking a low risk. Rudolph is likely to go much higher than

any GM should be willing to take him. 

[TigerJ]

8 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

If we draft Rudolph over Rosen or Mayfield I’ll be pissed. If I’m wrong, I’m wrong. I am not passing on the superior talent (especially in Rosen’s case). 

If Rosen and Mayfield are on the board, Mason Rudolph is not getting drafted.  The point of the article is that Mason Rudolph has some positive traits as did Dak Prescott.  Prescott was passed over early in the draft because his college offense was a spread offense where he lined up in the shotgun all the time.  There is always a question about whether or not the skill set of a spread system QB will translate to the NFL.  Dak Prescott had the advantage of going to a team with an outstanding offensive line, so he got better protection than your average rookie.  The Dallas Cowboys also drafted Ezekiel Elliot in the first round of that draft, and Elliot's ability certainly made life easier for Prescott as he made the transition.  Should Buffalo draft Rudolph, their offensive line will not be quite so established, but it may not be bad.  Also, AJ McCarron would probably start while Rudolph makes the transition.  There is reason to believe he could succeed long term.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

19 minutes ago, Chuck Wagon said:

Everything is relative.

 

If we pick Rudolph #53, I can get on board.  At 12?  storm the castle.

 

...what about 22 or with the first 2nd?..........

[Chuck Wagon]

10 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...what about 22 or with the first 2nd?..........

 

 

53 is the first 2nd....

[YoloinOhio]

20 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

If we draft Rudolph over Rosen or Mayfield I’ll be pissed. If I’m wrong, I’m wrong. I am not passing on the superior talent (especially in Rosen’s case). 

I don’t think that will happen unless a team is simply unwilling to trade down regardless of what the Bills offer, which would not allow them the opportunity. I don’t see them “willingly” passing. 

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

1 minute ago, Chuck Wagon said:

 

 

53 is the first 2nd....

 

...so 22 would be out of the mix?...........I should have excluded the "first 2nd" part with my apology............

[Chuck Wagon]

10 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...so 22 would be out of the mix?...........I should have excluded the "first 2nd" part with my apology............

 

Several analysts have said there's ~18-21 players with a "1st round grade".  Rudolph isn't one of them.  If one of those level players is on the board it would be a mistake to take Rudolph over them.  I don't see all that much difference between Rudolph, Lulietta, Luke Falk, Mike White.  If we get shut out of the top 4, using one of the picks betweeen 53-65 on one of those guys isn't a terrible alternative.  

[YoloinOhio]

3 minutes ago, Chuck Wagon said:

 

Several analysts have said there's ~18-21 players with a "1st round grade".  Rudolph isn't one of them.  If one of those level players is on the board it would be a mistake to take Rudolph over them.  I don't see all that much difference between Rudolph, Lulietta, Luke Falk, Mike White.  If we get shut out of the top 4, using one of the picks betweeen 53-65 on one of those guys isn't a terrible alternative.  

The one that I saw with that analysis said that with the caveat that positional value will push up the QBs (as it should). He didn’t have Darnold or Allen there either but they are both going in the 1st. If the Bills can’t trade up then they could stick to 1st rd grades only at 12 and 22, but with the QB position it will likely mean getting a 3rd rd prospect in the 2nd instead of a 2nd round prospect  in the 1st. The advantage of taking a QB in the 1st, if he’s even close,  is the 5th year option as it’s the most expensive position in the league. 

[HappyDays]

The thing that worries me with Rudolph is he comes from the Air Raid offense and there are very few if any Air Raid QBs that have made the transition to the NFL. That being said he seems smart enough to figure out NFL offenses if he's given time to develop. This video made me a believer:

 

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-combine/0ap3000000919190/Combine-Whiteboard-Mason-Rudolph-with-Steve-Mariucci

 

His arm strength doesn't worry me. It is good enough for the NFL. He'll have to get accustomed to NFL speed and learn to work through progressions faster. I'd take him in the 20s and hope his football smarts make him a good one-year project. If he picks up a pro offense quickly enough he could see starting time before his rookie season is over.

[Mr. WEO]

Was his source Jerome Bettis?

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

19 minutes ago, Chuck Wagon said:

 

Several analysts have said there's ~18-21 players with a "1st round grade".  Rudolph isn't one of them.  If one of those level players is on the board it would be a mistake to take Rudolph over them.  I don't see all that much difference between Rudolph, Lulietta, Luke Falk, Mike White.  If we get shut out of the top 4, using one of the picks betweeen 53-65 on one of those guys isn't a terrible alternative.  

 

...nice assessment AND reasonable too....then again, may want to don kevlar when the top four dawgs pundits reign on your reasonableness...........

[thebandit27]

8 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

The thing that worries me with Rudolph is he comes from the Air Raid offense and there are very few if any Air Raid QBs that have made the transition to the NFL. That being said he seems smart enough to figure out NFL offenses if he's given time to develop. This video made me a believer:

 

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-combine/0ap3000000919190/Combine-Whiteboard-Mason-Rudolph-with-Steve-Mariucci

 

His arm strength doesn't worry me. It is good enough for the NFL. He'll have to get accustomed to NFL speed and learn to work through progressions faster. I'd take him in the 20s and hope his football smarts make him a good one-year project. If he picks up a pro offense quickly enough he could see starting time before his rookie season is over.

 

I can't see how some folks could watch Rudolph's throws to the boundary consistently hang up, fade, and miss their proper placement and think that his arm strength is sufficient to make all of the throws an NFL starter needs to make consistently.

 

He's going to have to function in a timing offense that also features a good number of over the top downfield throws to back the coverage away. Press corners on the boundary will eat him alive if he tries to challenge them in the short passing game 

Edited April 8, 2018 by thebandit27

[Passepartout]

Amid Mayfield, Rosen, Allen, Darnold talks. He could sneak up on others.

[NewEra]

Ugh.  NOOOOOOOO

[Domdab99]

This QB class is so confusing. History says at least half of these guys are going to be busts. 

 

I just have no clue about who’s going to be good and who’s not.

[Buffalo Bills Detective]

1 hour ago, YoloinOhio said:

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/news/nfl-draft-why-josh-rosen-is-like-eli-mason-rudolph-is-like-dak-prescott-and-more-qb-comparisons/

 

Before the Non-Rudolph people attack this, I understand that this writer really likes Rudolph and has had him as his QB1 all year. But if you listen to him interviewed, he is measured about his approach on that, with balanced perspective on his strengths/weaknesses and I frankly applaud people with the courage to go against the grain. It means they have conviction on their work and don’t just go along with groupthink because they are afraid to be wrong. 

 

That said, the comparison to Dak is interesting and not something I’ve seen before. Usually i see Dalton or Petty. And Dak was drafted in the 3rd, so this isn’t trumpeting him as some top 10 pick.

 

I’m still 1)Rosen 2) Mayfield but I’m keeping an open mind because no one knows who will emerge as a franchise, playoff-level QB. A LOT depends on system, coaching, and situation. Like it did with Dak. So would I be disappointed if we drafted Rudolph instead of Rosen and Mayfield? Admittedly so. But I wouldn’t be pissed. He could end up being perfect for this team. No one knows, yet. It’s a good article. 

 

I found this interview with Trapasso pretty interesting from yesterday as well -

https://d3efjls8gnbg8i.cloudfront.net/1642018/122414888.mp3?rhihttphost=wgr550.hosted.cx

Trapasso said he thinks he will go in the first round, outside top 10, the 5th or 6th QB taken. He indicated how good he is in the classroom and how many defenses and coverages he’s seen being a 3 year starter (similar to Mayfield). He’s able to diagnose a lot and audible at the line, understanding  route concepts.

 

As far as arm strength he indicates it is overhyped because in the last 5 years,  95% of throws in the nfl were under 30 yards in the air and 80% are from the shotgun. It’s outdated thinking that a guy needs to be under center and able to throw it 70-80 yards or he’s not going to succeed in the league. He does think velocity could be an issue (this was also a knock on Deshaun Watson), but everything else with pocket movement, pocket patience, and downfield accuracy are advanced. 

Dak went in the middle of the 4th, actually.

Also, if Rudolph came here, would he have the following players on the offensive line to block for him: Tyron Smith, Zack Martin, Travis Frederick?  The answer?  NO.

Edited April 8, 2018 by Buffalo Bills Detective

[CuddyDark]

32 minutes ago, Buffalo Bills Detective said:

Dak went in the middle of the 4th, actually.

Also, if Rudolph came here, would he have the following players on the offensive line to block for him: Tyron Smith, Zack Martin, Travis Frederick?  The answer?  NO.

He had a worse Oline in college than Rosen but people don't hold it against Rosen he played with a great line and had all day to throw.

[PromoTheRobot]

1 hour ago, Chuck Wagon said:

Everything is relative.

 

If we pick Rudolph #53, I can get on board.  At 12?  storm the castle.

Even if he becomes your franchise QB?  

[Chuck Wagon]

13 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

Even if he becomes your franchise QB?  

 

This is a dumb question.

 

[Buffalo Bills Detective]

13 minutes ago, CuddyDark said:

He had a worse Oline in college than Rosen but people don't hold it against Rosen he played with a great line and had all day to throw.

Rosen played under center in a pro style offense.  Rudolph played exclusively in the shotgun in a goofy college system that has produced such franchise QBs as Zac Robinson and Brandon Weeden.

[KDIGGZ]

This is Chris Trepasso again. This is garbage. He shows his bias every chance he gets. He latched on to the fact that Rudolph was a senior with good stats so he ranked him higher than he should have and he won't let it go. Nothing to see here.

[CuddyDark]

9 minutes ago, Buffalo Bills Detective said:

Rosen played under center in a pro style offense.  Rudolph played exclusively in the shotgun in a goofy college system that has produced such franchise QBs as Zac Robinson and Brandon Weeden.

Most NFL teams play 70-80% of offensive snaps in shotgun now. Your last post was Rudolph will not have a great Oline. Neither will Rosen, though he did in college. Is that a bigger change for Rudolph or Rosen?

[NoSaint]

59 minutes ago, Domdab99 said:

This QB class is so confusing. History says at least half of these guys are going to be busts. 

 

I just have no clue about who’s going to be good and who’s not.

 

Thats about normal -

 

and you shouldnt know. It’s scheme, and coach and opponents and some luck and health.

 

the top guys any year are a coin flip or so and that’s why they go high.

 

the next tier is a coin flip to be a good backup and long shot to start andvthey land day two ish 

[3rdand12]

36 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

 

Thats about normal -

 

and you shouldnt know. It’s scheme, and coach and opponents and some luck and health.

 

the top guys any year are a coin flip or so and that’s why they go high.

 

the next tier is a coin flip to be a good backup and long shot to start andvthey land day two ish 

Fair take Good Sir.

 

its about fit via Coaching. and that is mostly an x factor for the Bills this year with Daboll.
But i do feel good whichever QB they want to land and do , will have a reasonable chance for success in Buffalo this time around.

Go Bills

[Buffalo Bills Detective]

45 minutes ago, CuddyDark said:

Most NFL teams play 70-80% of offensive snaps in shotgun now. Your last post was Rudolph will not have a great Oline. Neither will Rosen, though he did in college. Is that a bigger change for Rudolph or Rosen?

I give up.  I hope they stay at 12 and take Rudolph at 22.  Then, we can sit on our butts and wait 3 years for him to debut and hope and pray that he's learned how to read a legitimate NFL defense and make throws through tight windows over the middle.  WONDERFUL!!!!!!!!!

[NoSaint]

7 minutes ago, 3rdand12 said:

Fair take Good Sir.

 

its about fit via Coaching. and that is mostly an x factor for the Bills this year with Daboll.
But i do feel good whichever QB they want to land and do , will have a reasonable chance for success in Buffalo this time around.

Go Bills

 

Im optimistic that if we go get our guy instead of taking what’s left we will have a little more talent and a better fit. That fit factor alone might be worth the premium even if we as fans don’t see the prospects wildly different.

 

hope you’re having a nice Sunday, 3rd!

Edited April 8, 2018 by NoSaint

[Bockeye]

2 hours ago, HappyDays said:

The thing that worries me with Rudolph is he comes from the Air Raid offense and there are very few if any Air Raid QBs that have made the transition to the NFL. That being said he seems smart enough to figure out NFL offenses if he's given time to develop. This video made me a believer:

 

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-combine/0ap3000000919190/Combine-Whiteboard-Mason-Rudolph-with-Steve-Mariucci

 

His arm strength doesn't worry me. It is good enough for the NFL. He'll have to get accustomed to NFL speed and learn to work through progressions faster. I'd take him in the 20s and hope his football smarts make him a good one-year project. If he picks up a pro offense quickly enough he could see starting time before his rookie season is over.

Whoa!  That was a very impressive video and made me feel a whole lot better about Rudolph (with a later pick).  

 

Agreed 100% on arm strength.  Waaay overhyped by some. 

[3rdand12]

12 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

 

Im optimistic that if we go get our guy instead of taking what’s left we will have a little more talent and a better fit. That fit factor alone might be worth the premium even if we as fans don’t see the prospects wildly different.

 

hope you’re having a nice Sunday, 3rd!

This is when we Fans  likely need to have a bit of Blind Faith and some trust as well.

Sundays are always pleasant NS. thank you and.. back at ya

[Rico]

3 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/news/nfl-draft-why-josh-rosen-is-like-eli-mason-rudolph-is-like-dak-prescott-and-more-qb-comparisons/

 

Before the Non-Rudolph people attack this, I understand that this writer really likes Rudolph and has had him as his QB1 all year. But if you listen to him interviewed, he is measured about his approach on that, with balanced perspective on his strengths/weaknesses and I frankly applaud people with the courage to go against the grain. It means they have conviction on their work and don’t just go along with groupthink because they are afraid to be wrong. 

 

That said, the comparison to Dak is interesting and not something I’ve seen before. Usually i see Dalton or Petty. And Dak was drafted in the 3rd, so this isn’t trumpeting him as some top 10 pick.

 

I’m still 1)Rosen 2) Mayfield but I’m keeping an open mind because no one knows who will emerge as a franchise, playoff-level QB. A LOT depends on system, coaching, and situation. Like it did with Dak. So would I be disappointed if we drafted Rudolph instead of Rosen and Mayfield? Admittedly so. But I wouldn’t be pissed. He could end up being perfect for this team. No one knows, yet. It’s a good article. 

 

I found this interview with Trapasso pretty interesting from yesterday as well -

https://d3efjls8gnbg8i.cloudfront.net/1642018/122414888.mp3?rhihttphost=wgr550.hosted.cx

Trapasso said he thinks he will go in the first round, outside top 10, the 5th or 6th QB taken. He indicated how good he is in the classroom and how many defenses and coverages he’s seen being a 3 year starter (similar to Mayfield). He’s able to diagnose a lot and audible at the line, understanding  route concepts.

 

As far as arm strength he indicates it is overhyped because in the last 5 years,  95% of throws in the nfl were under 30 yards in the air and 80% are from the shotgun. It’s outdated thinking that a guy needs to be under center and able to throw it 70-80 yards or he’s not going to succeed in the league. He does think velocity could be an issue (this was also a knock on Deshaun Watson), but everything else with pocket movement, pocket patience, and downfield accuracy are advanced. 

I would also be disappointed if we don’t get Mayfield or (especially) Rosen. More than anything at this point though, I am just so ready for a new Chosen One, and if it’s Rudolph, so be it, I will still be excited for the future. Until they prove me wrong, I choose to trust the process.

[PromoTheRobot]

1 hour ago, Chuck Wagon said:

 

This is a dumb question.

 

I don't think so. Draft grades have more to do with how closely you draft to the draft expert's expectations. So a team gets hammered for drafting a player in a spot irregardless of how the player turns out.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

1 minute ago, Rico said:

I would also be disappointed if we don’t get Mayfield or (especially) Rosen. More than anything at this point though, I am just so ready for a new Chosen One, and if it’s Rudolph, so be it, I will still be excited for the future. Until they prove me wrong, I choose to trust the process.

 

...have to agree Rico......probably the most formidable gang ala FO/Admin/Coaching Staff since Polian era.......the debacle in between was as painful as hell......unqualifieds and over the hill space takers calling the shots.....this is Draft #1 for this gang and I think they get at least TWO to prove their mettle.......BUT...brace yourself for 4,782 threads post draft as to how they blew it.....YAWN...........

[JohnC]

3 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said:

If we draft Rudolph over Rosen or Mayfield I’ll be pissed. If I’m wrong, I’m wrong. I am not passing on the superior talent (especially in Rosen’s case). 

I don't believe the Bills would take Rudolph ahead of the top four (not including Jackson). Then the issue is If you liked Rudolph and were afraid to wait to take him with the 22nd pick because you feared another team taking him then is he worth taking at 12? I would say yes because you are keeping your high picks and should come out of this draft with players to address other needs.   

 

If you don't have much regard for Rudolph then taking him at 12 is going to negatively skew your perception of the draft. But if you believe that in time that he can be a franchise qb (as I do) then it wouldn't be a bad strategy to take. 

 

My approach to the qb position isn't so much about the grade (round) attached to the prospect. If a qb has a second round grade but is projected to be capable of being a franchise qb then over-drafting a round makes sense to me. 

 

In this draft the Bills have many options to take. Staying pat and getting a bone fide prospect and being able to fill out a thin roster isn't a losing proposition, it is a winning proposition. I'm open to however this regime is willing to take on this draft with the unyielding condition that it comes out of this draft with a good qb prospect. For me selecting Rudolph at the 12 spot is a reasonable approach to take. 

[Misterbluesky]

3 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/news/nfl-draft-why-josh-rosen-is-like-eli-mason-rudolph-is-like-dak-prescott-and-more-qb-comparisons/

 

Before the Non-Rudolph people attack this, I understand that this writer really likes Rudolph and has had him as his QB1 all year. But if you listen to him interviewed, he is measured about his approach on that, with balanced perspective on his strengths/weaknesses and I frankly applaud people with the courage to go against the grain. It means they have conviction on their work and don’t just go along with groupthink because they are afraid to be wrong. 

 

That said, the comparison to Dak is interesting and not something I’ve seen before. Usually i see Dalton or Petty. And Dak was drafted in the 3rd, so this isn’t trumpeting him as some top 10 pick.

 

I’m still 1)Rosen 2) Mayfield but I’m keeping an open mind because no one knows who will emerge as a franchise, playoff-level QB. A LOT depends on system, coaching, and situation. Like it did with Dak. So would I be disappointed if we drafted Rudolph instead of Rosen and Mayfield? Admittedly so. But I wouldn’t be pissed. He could end up being perfect for this team. No one knows, yet. It’s a good article. 

 

I found this interview with Trapasso pretty interesting from yesterday as well -

https://d3efjls8gnbg8i.cloudfront.net/1642018/122414888.mp3?rhihttphost=wgr550.hosted.cx

Trapasso said he thinks he will go in the first round, outside top 10, the 5th or 6th QB taken. He indicated how good he is in the classroom and how many defenses and coverages he’s seen being a 3 year starter (similar to Mayfield). He’s able to diagnose a lot and audible at the line, understanding  route concepts.

 

As far as arm strength he indicates it is overhyped because in the last 5 years,  95% of throws in the nfl were under 30 yards in the air and 80% are from the shotgun. It’s outdated thinking that a guy needs to be under center and able to throw it 70-80 yards or he’s not going to succeed in the league. He does think velocity could be an issue (this was also a knock on Deshaun Watson), but everything else with pocket movement, pocket patience, and downfield accuracy are advanced. 

That settles that.

[JohnC]

3 hours ago, billspro said:

It is definitely a breath of fresh air to have a draft analyst formulate an opinion not in line with everyone else. 

Are you talking about Gunner? If the criticisms get too heated he puts on his worn out raincoat and gets lost in the crowd at the neighborhood pub.

[Iamkrgr]

I don't think the draft is going to go as many of the analysts would have us believe. We could see a run off of QB's early but something tells me that won't be the case. We might see Mayfield drop to 12. We might see Jackson be available at 22. Rudolph could be available late in the 2nd round. 

 

There are a lot of talented players in the draft beyond just QB.