VIPP Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Where does Charles Clay rank? I love the fact that our owners have directed management to do whatever it takes to makes the Bills a contender again, but when I look at the offer for Charles Clay (5yr 38M with 20M of that guaranteed). Just to put things in perspective, Julius Thomas signed a 5yr 46M (with 24M guaranteed). I appreciate the fact that Clay will be a good fit for the system that Rex wants to implement, but I scratch my head wondering if we might be mortgaging our future on a guy who probably isn't even a top 10 tight end in the league today. I get that he blocks, can line up a number of places, and has good hands etc...but he aint no 8M a year TE. I think a more conservative and better approach would have been to sign a guy like Jermain Gresham. He can probably do everything we need from Clay and comes in at a fraction of the cost. Is Clay even a top 10 TE, because he'll sure as hell be paid like one if the Phins don't match (God i hope they do) Where does he fit? Gronk Graham Julius Thomas Martellus Bennet Greg Olsen Vernon Davis Antonio Gates Jason Witten Kyle Rudolph Fleener Jordan Cameron Dwayne Allen Dennis Pitta Larry Donnel Zach Ertz Travis Kelce If Clay is on the list, he's definitely near the bottom end. He's not worth the money and we will pay for this in the long run. What are your thoughts on where he fits in that list? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmotionallyUnstable Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I'd say somewhere INbetween 1-50, depending on the tide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackFergy Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 More conservative to sign Greshem?? I suppose if we want him to wave a towel on the sidelines in street clothes, sure. He may not be ready after BACK SURGERY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beef Jerky Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) Not worth the money? He isn't costing the Bills that much... Edited March 18, 2015 by Beef Jerky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CNY315 Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) I don't think you're taking into consideration what kind of offense they plan to run. As far as stats, no he isn't top 10 but he has a unique skill set that not many TE's have Edited March 18, 2015 by CNY315 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VIPP Posted March 18, 2015 Author Share Posted March 18, 2015 More conservative to sign Greshem?? I suppose if we want him to wave a towel on the sidelines in street clothes, sure. He may not be ready after BACK SURGERY I just read about the back surgery, i take that back LOL.. Not worth the money? He isn't costing the Bills that much... 8M a year for a TE that isn't top 10.. i woulda brought back Chandler and taken someone in the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 1 2 3 4 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmotionallyUnstable Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I just read about the back surgery, i take that back LOL.. 8M a year for a TE that isn't top 10.. i woulda brought back Chandler and taken someone in the draft. The Bills have the Cap space. It's a well thought out deal structure wisely. Would you rather them not spend the money they have and just sign a lesser player to save a penny? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddenboy Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) Who cares? As long as we get who the FO wants, I dont care. In Doug I trust. In Pegula I trust. (and by the way, its "TEs" and not "TE's." There is no apostrophe in correct English to make something plural. Even the Oakland A's, when going for their trademark, debated heavily about registering something grammatically incorrect, but decided that "A's" had become their brand instead of "As," like it or not. Methinks it has something to do with the difference between American and English. Because the apostrophe can properly be used to take the place of missing letters, and "Athletics" does end in an "s," or something). https://thegrammarvandal.wordpress.com/2007/07/27/apostrophe-for-the-oakland-as/ Now that we have Clay, I think we're pretty much done here. Edited March 18, 2015 by maddenboy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hondo in seattle Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Didn't Whaley say Clay is "special"? I haven't watched Miami that closely but I don't recall a TE so special that he deserves $38 million. What am I missing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbill Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I think it's great that people are complaining that the Bills are spending too much!!!! What a concept!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Didn't Whaley say Clay is "special"? I haven't watched Miami that closely but I don't recall a TE so special that he deserves $38 million. What am I missing? The Playoffs and SuperBowl. Buckle up you chin strap... we're going back to The Game! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Poojer Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I prefer Ranking Rogers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibs Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) As a casual fan of other team's players and not confident about my own scouting abilities, I can understand why there are many people who look at Clay's stats and wonder why there is so much interest in him. I remember doing the same thing when the Pats signed Welker and again when the Seahawks aquired Harvin. Both players had been less than impressive statistically, but were being uniformly spoken about as if they had upper echelon talent. Clay seems to be another one of these statistically hidden stars. A player who was considered to be in the top 100 players in the league by his peers and who is resoundingly rated as a top talent......but doesn't have the stats to back it up. Time will of course tell, but for now I am more than happy to go along with the experts' opinion of Clay. Edited March 18, 2015 by Dibs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan1959 Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I had posted this in another thread: According to PFF metrics, Clay ranked 14th overall among tight ends, 9th in pass receiving, and 11th in run blocking. For reference, Julius Thomas was 13th, 10th, and 33rd respectively and Scott Chandler was 47th, 63rd, and 40th respectively Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Well said, Dibs. Well said. Go Bills! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TPS Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I think it's great that people are complaining that the Bills are spending too much!!!! What a concept!!!Pegula is a spendthrift! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I'd like to give this a shot seeing as I ranked Chandler at 23 last year: Gronk Graham Julius Olsen Bennett Davis Clay I guess that I gave him at 7 in this scheme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyC81 Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I think it's great that people are complaining that the Bills are spending too much!!!! What a concept!!! We have before: Dockery, Langston Walker, Chris Williams, Chris Kelsay, Ryan Fitzpatrick, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan130 Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I would have clay ahead of at least 3 of those guys you listed, and that is being generous, probably more like 4 or 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeverOutNick Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) Clay has consistently been a match up nightmare for us and other teams...not our problem anymore but a luxury we can afford. Franchise qb next year and we'll be set... Hope Cassel can hold the fort til then Edited March 18, 2015 by NeverOutNick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max997 Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) Where does Charles Clay rank? I love the fact that our owners have directed management to do whatever it takes to makes the Bills a contender again, but when I look at the offer for Charles Clay (5yr 38M with 20M of that guaranteed). Just to put things in perspective, Julius Thomas signed a 5yr 46M (with 24M guaranteed). I appreciate the fact that Clay will be a good fit for the system that Rex wants to implement, but I scratch my head wondering if we might be mortgaging our future on a guy who probably isn't even a top 10 tight end in the league today. I get that he blocks, can line up a number of places, and has good hands etc...but he aint no 8M a year TE. If you are going to compare Clay vs Julius Thomas then you have to consider all of the facts. Julius Thomas played with Peyton Manning in a pass happy offense and rarely faced more then single coverage. Clay played with Tannehill in an offense with nowhere near the same talent. How is signing anyone to a 5 year 38 mil contract anywhere close to mortgaging the future? The cap is 143 mil and continues to rise at a fast pace. Edited March 18, 2015 by Max997 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Wagon Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Julius may be the most overrated guy in the entire league, a guy who can't block or stay healthy is not the third best TE in the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max997 Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Julius may be the most overrated guy in the entire league, a guy who can't block or stay healthy is not the third best TE in the league. I agree and think Julius ends up as the free agent bust for this year. Peyton can make just about any TE look good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Clay>>>>>>> Julius. Clay is a TE that can play FB and WR. Thomas is a WR that can't play TE or FB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 What you have to take into consideration is how the TE will actually be USED in a offense when determining value of the TE (I frankly dont care how they are ranked because often players are not used to their max strengths) Clay is Romans new Vernon Davis....... - He blocks - He can bust the seem - He makes big catches - He is a mismatch on the field - Taking him directly hurts a AFC East rival......and we need to win the East to make the playoffs He is right for us..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy1 Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 The other thing to keep in mind is that Clay is entering the prime of his career. The Bills will get his best years of production and he fits their offense. See his plays on Utube - he is matchup problem for defenses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
217014170 Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) What you have to take into consideration is how the TE will actually be USED in a offense when determining value of the TE (I frankly dont care how they are ranked because often players are not used to their max strengths) Clay is Romans new Vernon Davis....... - He blocks - He can bust the seem - He makes big catches - He is a mismatch on the field - Taking him directly hurts a AFC East rival......and we need to win the East to make the playoffs He is right for us..... I agree with everything except the comparison to Vernon Davis. Comparing Clay to Davis is an insult to Clay. Clay is a self made 6th round pick from the Univ. of Tulsa. The nicest thing Roman could say about Davis last year was how great his blocking was. Davis had his worst year statistically (to be fair, he was hurt as well) in 2014 and Roman was basically using him as a decoy and a blocker. Let's hope Roman does not forget to use Clay. He is not supposed to be good...because he is not stage diving or trying to be a WR to get more cash...and is often forgotten when people publish "rankings". You don;t hear anything about Charles Clay except on game day. That's a good thing. He is right for the Bills...for sure. And his financial hit will basically be for this year. I love the fact that the team is fully utilizing the cap and sometimes you have to seemingly overpay to get a guy to move from South Florida to Frozen Tundra East. Edited March 18, 2015 by 217014170 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QuoteTheRaven83 Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) 1. Rob Gronkowski 2. Greg Olsen 3. Jimmy Graham 4. Antonio Gates 5. Martellus Bennett 6. Jason Witten 7. Charles Clay 8. Julius Thomas 9. Vernon Davis I truly think Greg Olsen is the most underrated, and most underappreciated player in the NFL. Not just TE, but player because he does so much for that offense, it's ridiculous. He's one of the best overall, TE in the NFL in my opinion. Edited March 18, 2015 by QuoteTheRaven83 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Presidente Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I think it's great that people are complaining that the Bills are spending too much!!!! What a concept!!! This. I have never seen an off season like this...EVER. This is a new team. We can worry about management blowing cash?? If this is why they raised ticket prices can I pay extra? We are all going to get more product on the field for our ticket price than ever before... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r00tabaga Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Top ten. If he had Brady, Brees or Manning as QB his numbers would be as good as Graham, Gronk & Julius. The main thing is he's gonna be dangerous in our offense and that's all I care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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