It ain't the coaches.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

It's the QB. Sacred cow around here, I know, but Josh Allen has been in the league long enough to know:

 

1) you can't be late over the middle

 

2) you shouldn't throw into triple coverage

 

3) that sometimes a sack and punting the ball away isn't a bad thing.

 

And yet he continues to make those mistakes. Tell me, at what point should the finger of responsibility be pointed at the QB who just crapped his pants on national TV? You can lead a horse to water, but if it does not drink, it's on the horse.

[NastyNateSoldiers]

Also depends how u raise the horse how u nurture the horse. Seems to me like the horse lost his trainer and now needs a new one. 

[dorquemada]

Just now, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

It's the QB. Sacred cow around here, I know, but Josh Allen has been in the league long enough to know:

 

1) you can't be late over the middle

 

2) you shouldn't throw into triple coverage

 

3) that sometimes a sack and punting the ball away isn't a bad thing.

 

And yet he continues to make those mistakes. Tell me, at what point should the finger of responsibility be pointed at the QB who just crapped his pants on national TV? You can lead a horse to water, but if it does not drink, it's on the horse.

 

Allen is a tremendous disappointment.  I guess we'll have to crank up the Excuse Generator and establish some kind of down year narrative. I'll start:

 

It's really hard to tell the Jets players and Bills players apart!

 

New girlfriend keeps him up late

 

Elbow still hurt

 

Feel free to add

[SUNTANBILLS FAN]

3 minutes ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

It's the QB. Sacred cow around here, I know, but Josh Allen has been in the league long enough to know:

 

1) you can't be late over the middle

 

2) you shouldn't throw into triple coverage

 

3) that sometimes a sack and punting the ball away isn't a bad thing.

 

And yet he continues to make those mistakes. Tell me, at what point should the finger of responsibility be pointed at the QB who just crapped his pants on national TV? You can lead a horse to water, but if it does not drink, it's on the horse.

I disagree not one called play from under center! 

[Not at the table Karlos]

Its on both.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

1 minute ago, NastyNateSoldiers said:

Also depends how u raise the horse how u nurture the horse. Seems to me like the horse lost his trainer and now needs a new one. 

Ever own a horse?

 

Like people, some horses are just ignorant #######s, and are just gonna do whatever they want 

[Not at the table Karlos]

16 minutes ago, SUNTANBILLS FAN said:

I disagree not one called play from under center! 

I disagree that there wasn't plays called from under center. It's one of the ways we telegraph we're running. We ran a few plays from under center. Pretty sure all were runs. 

Edited September 12, 2023 by Not at the table Karlos

[SoonerBillsFan]

1 minute ago, NastyNateSoldiers said:

Also depends how u raise the horse how u nurture the horse. Seems to me like the horse lost his trainer and now needs a new one. 

I think after 13 seconds we should have kept Dabol and moved on from McDermott JUST because of Allen.  Hire Jim Schwartz and let him install a blitzing killer Defense and I think we would be better off.

 

I love Sean, but I can't thank him enough for what he has done, and he 100% was the right guy to right this Titanic franchise version. BUT, if you keep Allen as your QB you gotta have a very strong personality that keeps his butt on target. McDermott and Definitely Dorsey isn't that.

[strive_for_five_guy]

1 minute ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

Ever own a horse?

 

Like people, some horses are just ignorant #######s, and are just gonna do whatever they want 

Maybe Josh is better served as a gelding and not a colt? 😝

[Radar]

Josh is very talented. Josh isn't stupid. I do think he tries to force things and do to much. Why? Probably some is just in his DNA but coaching is also questionable. Our coaching seems very average at best.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Just now, strive_for_five_guy said:

Maybe Josh is better served as a gelding and not a colt? 😝

He needs neutering 

[peterpan]

2 minutes ago, SUNTANBILLS FAN said:

I disagree not one called play from under center! 

Allen has been playing so poorly, you can’t even evaluate Dorsey as a play caller, because his plays aren’t being run.

[Roundybout]

Quarterbacks are products of coaching.

[SoonerBillsFan]

1 minute ago, peterpan said:

Allen hasbeen playing so poorly, you can’t even evaluate Dorsey as a play caller, because his plays aren’t being run.

Thank you!  There ARE guys open, he refuses to throw to them

[Chaos]

Its the coaches. 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

5 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

Thank you!  There ARE guys open, he refuses to throw to them

That ain't on the coaches 

[colin]

As soon as we didn't get some 3rd downs (and we were close mind you) doing dink and dunk Josh decided he was just gonna play hero ball.  3 of the 4 turnovers were horrible decisions while not under duress, and he walked into pressure or left clean pockets other times.

 

Dorsey has to figure out how to get the I working best, and he's no where near that yet, but Allen just not throwing those three horrible decision throws means we win walking away

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

1 minute ago, colin said:

As soon as we didn't get some 3rd downs (and we were close mind you) doing dink and dunk Josh decided he was just gonna play hero ball.  3 of the 4 turnovers were horrible decisions while not under duress, and he walked into pressure or left clean pockets other times.

 

Dorsey has to figure out how to get the I working best, and he's no where near that yet, but Allen just not throwing those three horrible decision throws means we win walking away

It was working, the QB abandoned ship when he didn't need to

[Roundybout]

12 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

Thank you!  There ARE guys open, he refuses to throw to them

Did Allen call a draw play on 2nd and 15 in OT?

[KDIGGZ]

BECAUSE it's the QB...it's also the coaches!

 

Josh needs to play in structure. Enough of this running around like an idiot doing whatever he wants. He needs a strong and experienced OC. 3 steps and throw it here. No big hits. For every hit he is fined $5,000. He's not learning or getting better. That's the problem 

[ShakAttack]

I am honestly surprised by how many fans have given up on Allen after this game. I would never consider myself one of the more optimistic fans. In fact, I had the Bills losing this game (granted, with Rodgers at QB) and it was mainly because of how poorly we match up against the Jets. Matchups are everything in this league. Look at the Browns, who have annihilated the Bengals twice in a row now, but can’t seem to do that to anyone else. Meanwhile the Bengals look like a completely different team against the rest of the NFL. It’s like that for us with the Jets, for whatever reason, but what I am saying is this is actually NOTHING NEW against the Jets.  Something about their scheme, their team speed on defense and the fact they are able to generate more pressure than the vast majority of defenses we face has always rattled Allen and forces him into bad decisions. 

 

There have also been plenty of games where Allen has made as many bad throws (unfortunately) it just so happens this time all three of his bad throws were picked off as opposed to dropped, batted down, etc.  

 

There is no doubt this is becoming a sickening trend, but again, I go back to the fact that all 3 of Allen’s least productive games as a QB dating back to last season, have been against the Jets. This is nothing new and the sky certainly isn’t going to be falling after week 1. I am not sure if I can realistically say , but I am feel pretty confident that he is going to play a hell of a lot better than he did against the Jets in the coming weeks.  
 

Here is the silver lining. Allen did seem a little too “chill” to me this off-season, but this game definitely got to him. Hopefully it’s the wake-up call he needed. Also, we still have our starting QB and we didn’t lose anyone to injury in what was a very physical game. That’s a major plus.  

[CoudyBills]

27 minutes ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

It's the QB. Sacred cow around here, I know, but Josh Allen has been in the league long enough to know:

 

1) you can't be late over the middle

 

2) you shouldn't throw into triple coverage

 

3) that sometimes a sack and punting the ball away isn't a bad thing.

 

And yet he continues to make those mistakes. Tell me, at what point should the finger of responsibility be pointed at the QB who just crapped his pants on national TV? You can lead a horse to water, but if it does not drink, it's on the horse.

Is this where this comment goes?

 

"188 yards 13 points

 

On pace for 376 and 26.

 

Train wreck, God some of you are dubious"

 

 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Just now, CoudyBills said:

Is this where this comment goes?

 

"188 yards 13 points

 

On pace for 376 and 26.

 

Train wreck, God some of you are dubious"

 

 

 

his first half was really good.

 

The second, not so much.

 

I'm not a fortune teller, and neither are you.

 

[1onemangang7]

We need Purdy. Then Cook will really be top 5.

[CoudyBills]

1 minute ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

 

his first half was really good.

 

The second, not so much.

 

I'm not a fortune teller, and neither are you.

 

Agree to disagree on the 1st half.  Certainly no fortune teller, not happy it turned out correct for damn sure.

[UKBillFan]

2 minutes ago, CoudyBills said:

Agree to disagree on the 1st half.  Certainly no fortune teller, not happy it turned out correct for damn sure.

 

First half was fine. If he had continued playing that way in the second half the Bills would have won at a canter.

[boyst]

Wgr just nailed it. If you're scheming guys open, if you're calling good plays and the QB ain't running it in structure then you need a new OC.

 

I've been saying this for a long time. This is separate from McChump.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

1 minute ago, boyst said:

Wgr just nailed it. If you're scheming guys open, if you're calling good plays and the QB ain't running it in structure then you need a new OC.

 

I've been saying this for a long time. This is separate from McChump.

 

That literally makes no sense.

 

If you call the plays, and the plays are open but the quarterback doesn't execute the plays, what is the coach gonna do? Climb down out of the booth an run them themselves?

 

 

[UKBillFan]

1 minute ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

 

That literally makes no sense.

 

If you call the plays, and the plays are open but the quarterback doesn't execute the plays, what is the coach gonna do? Climb down out of the booth an run them themselves?

 

 

 

Just said on another thread, if they're incapable of reigning Josh in then there needs to be a change. Do I think he could be reigned in? Yes, with the right approach.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

1 minute ago, UKBillFan said:

 

Just said on another thread, if they're incapable of reigning Josh in then there needs to be a change. Do I think he could be reigned in? Yes, with the right approach.

 

I don't think he can. He is what he is.

 

[ChasBB]

Six years into his career now and it's no longer cute when "Sugar-High Josh Allen" makes an appearance.  You take what the defense gives you and if it's not there you throw it away, punt and live to see another set of downs.  Instead, he continues to force throws and seems overwhelmed in the moment - losing focus on the snap, etc.  That was a very winnable game he essentially gave away.  This is the first time in his career I've had the thought that maybe he's not the answer at QB.  Despite his talent, if he doesn't develop some emotional maturity and stop trying to put everything on his own shoulders he's not going to improve his game.  At this stage in his career, getting better means playing smarter.  Not giving up on him, but very disappointing to see this type of decision making in year six.

Edited September 12, 2023 by ChasBB

[Johnnycage46]

27 minutes ago, Roundybout said:

Did Allen call a draw play on 2nd and 15 in OT?

 

Maybe the OC was saving Allen from himself there.  More likely to go hero ball mode on a 2nd and 15 in OT if it's a passing play.

[Dirtyd415]

Brittany broke him.  Some guys need a strong woman to check them, get them revved up, allow the alpha to let their guard down.  He lost all of that and she took his dog.  He has looked like horse dung since then.  He is a hyper-emotional man, and since he lost her steadying hand he has stunk.  Running around getting your D wet all off-season isn’t the same as a solid woman having your back.

[Beast]

33 minutes ago, KDIGGZ said:

BECAUSE it's the QB...it's also the coaches!

 

Josh needs to play in structure. Enough of this running around like an idiot doing whatever he wants. He needs a strong and experienced OC. 3 steps and throw it here. No big hits. For every hit he is fined $5,000. He's not learning or getting better. That's the problem 

He had a 75 percent completion rate. The INT’s were Josh being stupid. Josh has a tendency to make stupid plays. He has since day 1. Those stupid plays are on him.

Edited September 12, 2023 by Beast

[oldmanfan]

48 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

I think after 13 seconds we should have kept Dabol and moved on from McDermott JUST because of Allen.  Hire Jim Schwartz and let him install a blitzing killer Defense and I think we would be better off.

 

I love Sean, but I can't thank him enough for what he has done, and he 100% was the right guy to right this Titanic franchise version. BUT, if you keep Allen as your QB you gotta have a very strong personality that keeps his butt on target. McDermott and Definitely Dorsey isn't that.

Yeah, because Daboll had his team so well prepared Sunday night.

[peterpan]

33 minutes ago, Roundybout said:

Did Allen call a draw play on 2nd and 15 in OT?

I mean really?  After all the terrible plays allen had to get us to OT, you focus on that?  
 

if I’m the coaches, I’m trying to keep Allen from losing us the game. Draw play was fine.

[oldmanfan]

34 minutes ago, Roundybout said:

Did Allen call a draw play on 2nd and 15 in OT?

If Josh had gotten his head out of his own butt there would not have been an OT.

20 minutes ago, boyst said:

Wgr just nailed it. If you're scheming guys open, if you're calling good plays and the QB ain't running it in structure then you need a new OC.

 

I've been saying this for a long time. This is separate from McChump.

No, you need the QB to see where the throw should go and make the throw.

[boyst]

18 minutes ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

 

That literally makes no sense.

 

If you call the plays, and the plays are open but the quarterback doesn't execute the plays, what is the coach gonna do? Climb down out of the booth an run them themselves?

 

 

You need a coach who can coach one of the top 10 players in the league.

 

What's hard to understand?

 

You can't force a round peg through a square hole.

Edited September 12, 2023 by boyst

[TheWeatherMan]

It both Allen and Dorsey.  Our OC shouldn’t be an OC 

[teef]

the coaching certainly wasn't great, but allen was just so sloppy.  hell, if he had just handled a snap properly, there is no OT.