Case Keenum is more than a target

[Doc Brown]

3 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

Do you think the Bills do it for a fourth?

No.  I think they roll with Kyle Allen.

[GunnerBill]

19 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

No.  I think they roll with Kyle Allen.

 

I really don't. I think they are going to try really had to bring in a QB. 

[Doc Brown]

57 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I really don't. I think they are going to try really had to bring in a QB. 

Who though can you bring in from the outside that knows this offense that you can trust the QB2 spot to right away?  Keenum and Trubisky are pry roster locks for the Texans and Steelers.  They'll definitely sign someone to the practice squad they hope to quickly develop but right now I don't see a better option to start the year at QB2 than Kyle Allen.

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, Doc Brown said:

Who though can you bring in from the outside that knows this offense that you can trust the QB2 spot to right away?  Keenum and Trubisky are pry roster locks for the Texans and Steelers.  They'll definitely sign someone to the practice squad they hope to quickly develop but right now I don't see a better option to start the year at QB2 than Kyle Allen.

 

They were in on Trey Lance who is definitely not a ready now option so I am not sure they are confining themselves to that. I think they feel pretty confident they could get Allen on the PS and elevate him.

[Doc Brown]

3 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

They were in on Trey Lance who is definitely not a ready now option so I am not sure they are confining themselves to that. I think they feel pretty confident they could get Allen on the PS and elevate him.

It would be funny if they only kept Josh Allen on the 53 and then just rolled with practice squad call ups every week.

Edited August 28, 2023 by Doc Brown

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, Doc Brown said:

It would be funny if they only kept Josh Allen on the 53 and then just rolled with practice squad call ups every week.

 

Didn't Belichick do that with kickers a couple of seasons back for like the first 3 or 4 weeks? Didn't roster one had two on the PS. 

 

If Barkley was healthy I don't actually think that would be the worst idea I have ever heard. There isn't much between them, they both know the scheme.... continue the competition for 6 weeks until you have exhausted the call ups and give yourself an extra roster spot to manage any short term injuries. 

 

As it is I think Allen will be on the 53 unless someone else comes in but I think their ideal is to bring someone in and they will turn over every rock to do so.

[Shaw66]

Gotta say I'm surprised you thunk they are that disappointed with Allen.  I never would have guessed in when he signed, and I thought he looked pretty good Saturday.  

[Warriorspikes51]

Is Keenum really even an upgrade from Kyle Allen?   

[Manther]

3 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I really don't. I think they are going to try really had to bring in a QB. 

I agree they are going to bring a QB in.  Based on Kyle Allen's off/preseason and trying to bring in Trey Lance I think Beane will get a new QB in town.

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

They were in on Trey Lance who is definitely not a ready now option so I am not sure they are confining themselves to that. I think they feel pretty confident they could get Allen on the PS and elevate him.

Agreed.  

 

Also, if they can't get Allen on the PS some other team is a disaster that signs him.

[HappyDays]

This is one of the writers for Over The Cap. According to him it doesn't matter if Keenum is cut, the comp pick is locked in. Good news here.

[ALLinALLEN]

So lemme get this straight...people actually want to give up draft picks for a guy that went 2/7 and 8 yards last year because hes.....familiar? 

[Doc]

35 minutes ago, ALLinALLEN said:

So lemme get this straight...people actually want to give up draft picks for a guy that went 2/7 and 8 yards last year because hes.....familiar? 

 

I thought it was only to preserve the 3rd round comp pick.  If they're going away from Kyle Allen, they need someone better than either of those guys.

[SectionC3]

13 hours ago, Sierra Foothills said:

Hmmm... Beane might be reluctant to make that call. As has been pointed out, that would be an invitation for Nick Caserio to bluff Beane and then Beane would have to decide whether to call his bluff. Or is it a bluff?

 

Who cares if we get bluffed?  The only way it would matter is if the capital demanded by Houston to maintain our third round compensatory (and the FA(s) we signed and would have to cut to get the comp pick back) and improve our backup QB situation could have been used to obtain a superior backup QB option.  

1 hour ago, HappyDays said:

This is one of the writers for Over The Cap. According to him it doesn't matter if Keenum is cut, the comp pick is locked in. Good news here.

If that’s the case, then it’s good news - 

[First Round Bust]

make it happen Beane..two major reasons:

 

1. better backup qb depth for sure - Kyle Allen is too erratic...Barkley is good in the room but poor in the field

2. need to protect and gain that holy grail of third or fourth rounder to draft tne next dwarf linebacker with chronic injury history or an athletic OL that cannot perform the basics of the position.

[Warriorspikes51]

Colt McCoy would be a better QB2 

[Buffalo716]

9 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

They were in on Trey Lance who is definitely not a ready now option so I am not sure they are confining themselves to that. I think they feel pretty confident they could get Allen on the PS and elevate him.

Beane said he inquired lol that means he got a feeler.. not that he was super serious about giving up anything serious 

 

Why would he be good as our backup when San Francisco isn't even comfortable?

 

If we tried trading for him I think we tried bringing him in as a three to start ... Because he certainly doesn't know enough to supplant the QBs here right away..

 

 

There's no way the bills were comfortable with him as the primary backup when he's been relegated to third string by his own franchise.. he's an enormous bust

 

I think he would have started as the 3

Edited August 28, 2023 by Buffalo716

[GunnerBill]

13 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Some pundits say they were in on trey... The dude can't even win a backup job from the team that traded three first round picks for him..  I didn't hear beane say he tried making a move

 

Why would he be good as our backup when San Francisco isn't even comfortable?

 

If we tried trading for him I think we tried bringing him in as a three to start ... Because he certainly doesn't know enough to supplant the QBs here right away

 

 

There's no way the bills were comfortable with him as the primary backup when he's been relegated to third string by his own franchise.. he's an enormous bust

 

the bills get linked to everyone lol

 

The reporter that reported that is pretty reliable. 

[Buffalo716]

2 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

The reporter that reported that is pretty reliable. 

Reread my edited post .. I was typing and editing 5, 000 thoughts and you reposted as soon as I finished 

 

I think it would have been strictly to start as the third string

Edited August 28, 2023 by Buffalo716

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, Buffalo716 said:

Reread my edited post .. I was typing and editing 5, 000 thoughts and you reported as soon as I finished 

 

I think they are not happy with the backup competition. There might be lots of circumstantial evidence rather than a smoking gun but when you put together:

 

- McDermott's comments after the first pre-season game;

- the fact they flipped Kyle and Matt in the 2nd game;

- Beane showing an interest (however serious) in Lance;

- the alleged "hot mic" comments from Jim Miller.

 

It is very difficult I think to come to the conclusion they are happy with what they have. People have tried to liken it to Case not having a great pre-season debut last year. Well in that scenario the Bills never waivered for a moment. The way they have responded to Kyle this time is not the same. 

 

I have to imagine Brandon is working the phones. 

 

[Buffalo716]

3 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I think they are not happy with the backup competition. There might be lots of circumstantial evidence rather than a smoking gun but when you put together:

 

- McDermott's comments after the first pre-season game;

- the fact they flipped Kyle and Matt in the 2nd game;

- Beane showing an interest (however serious) in Lance;

- the alleged "hot mic" comments from Jim Miller.

 

It is very difficult I think to come to the conclusion they are happy with what they have. People have tried to liken it to Case not having a great pre-season debut last year. Well in that scenario the Bills never waivered for a moment. The way they have responded to Kyle this time is not the same. 

 

I have to imagine Brandon is working the phones. 

 

I don't know anybody that heard those hot mic comments besides the guy who posted the thread

 

It coulda happened but I would like other bills fans to corroborate the story

 

Again I don't think they're happy with what they have... But I think Trey Lance walking in as the number two is also stupid 

 

I think he would have been the number 3 to start he has no experience in the offense and his career collapsed 

 

That guy is not given the number 2 reigns

Edited August 28, 2023 by Buffalo716

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, Buffalo716 said:

I don't know anybody that heard those hot mic comments besides the guy who posted the thread

 

It coulda happened but I would like other bills fans to corroborate the story

 

Again I don't think they're happy with what they have... But I think Trey Lance walking in as the number two is also stupid 

 

I think he would have been the number 3 to start he has no experience in the offense and his career collapsed 

 

That guy is not given the number 2 reigns

 

Well you need to have been outside the US to have heard them. There are actually two people on that thread who claim to have heard them. I didn't myself personally, but if they are as alleged then I think it is just a further corroboration of them really not being happy with what they have.  

[Buffalo716]

14 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Well you need to have been outside the US to have heard them. There are actually two people on that thread who claim to have heard them. I didn't myself personally, but if they are as alleged then I think it is just a further corroboration of them really not being happy with what they have.  

You can be not happy with your backup quarterback situation... And also not hand Lance the number two job

 

Both could be true

 

This team doesn't need a project... It needs a legitimate NFL backup like Tyrod Taylor 

 

Experience, Conservative with the football, and can pick up first downs with his legs.. that's the type of guy the team needs as QB2

[Simon Says]

I think its time to stop with the "Josh needs a mentor" stuff. 

He doesn't need a washed up, marginal QB to hold his hand. 

I want a backup that can keep the Bills afloat if Josh goes down.

 

[Buffalo716]

14 minutes ago, Herb Nightly said:

I think its time to stop with the "Josh needs a mentor" stuff. 

He doesn't need a washed up, marginal QB to hold his hand. 

I want a backup that can keep the Bills afloat if Josh goes down.

 

Even the best players in the world have coaches to help them.. and lean on other players

 

You know what teams have good backups QBs?  Bad teams 

 

The Chiefs had Chad henne who was nothing more than another Coach ... negative TD-int ratio ... A veteran in the quarterback room never hurts

 

Any good team that loses their starting quarterback for a stretch is basically going to struggle 

 

Edited August 28, 2023 by Buffalo716

[GunnerBill]

45 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

You can be not happy with your backup quarterback situation... And also not hand Lance the number two job

 

Both could be true

 

This team doesn't need a project... It needs a legitimate NFL backup like Tyrod Taylor 

 

Experience, Conservative with the football, and can pick up first downs with his legs.. that's the type of guy the team needs as QB2

 

I agree and I said before news broke that the Bills were in on Lance that I didn't think he made sense for them. We don't know whether they wanted him as a 2 or a 3. We just know that they were interested at some level. We can speculate on the rest. 

 

And I agree on the type the teams needs. That type isn't Kyle Allen.

[Doc]

Not sure what they saw in Lance and glad they didn't get him.  You can tell Dak is pissed.

[Tuco]

Actually, trading for Keenum would cause the Bills to lose their 3rd round pick. Aside from having been pointed out that the rule requiring the player to be on the new team's roster until week 6 has been eliminated (making this whole scenario moot), if the Bills were to trade for Keenum he would then be considered a free agent "lost" and "gained," thereby cancelling him from the equation and costing us our pick.

 

From the CBA, Appendix V, Article 3, subsection A . . . (CFA = Compensatory Free Agent) . . . " If a Club trades for a player who was a CFA during that League Year, whether the player was another Club’s CFA or the acquiring Club’s own CFA, the player will be considered a CFA gained by the acquiring Club and will be included in the Compensatory netting process described above.

 

 

Trading for Keenum would cancel him out of the formula cost us the 3rd round pick.

Edited August 29, 2023 by Tuco

[GunnerBill]

5 hours ago, Tuco said:

Actually, trading for Keenum would cause the Bills to lose their 3rd round pick. Aside from having been pointed out that the rule requiring the player to be on the new team's roster until week 6 has been eliminated (making this whole scenario moot), if the Bills were to trade for Keenum he would then be considered a free agent "lost" and "gained," thereby cancelling him from the equation and costing us our pick.

 

From the CBA, Appendix V, Article 3, subsection A . . . (CFA = Compensatory Free Agent) . . . " If a Club trades for a player who was a CFA during that League Year, whether the player was another Club’s CFA or the acquiring Club’s own CFA, the player will be considered a CFA gained by the acquiring Club and will be included in the Compensatory netting process described above.

 

 

Trading for Keenum would cancel him out of the formula cost us the 3rd round pick.

 

Thanks. Finally some clarity on the rule. Much appreciated. So essentially it doesn't matter now if the Texans cut him, he qualifies. So if we want Keenum as a backup the best outcome to protect our draft pick is they cut him and we sign him? 

[SectionC3]

15 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

I don't know anybody that heard those hot mic comments besides the guy who posted the thread

 

It coulda happened but I would like other bills fans to corroborate the story

 

Again I don't think they're happy with what they have... But I think Trey Lance walking in as the number two is also stupid 

 

I think he would have been the number 3 to start he has no experience in the offense and his career collapsed 

 

That guy is not given the number 2 reigns

It depends how bad Kyle Allen is behind the scenes.  We don't know what we don't see with him.  And it might be bad.  

[Coach Tuesday]

1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Thanks. Finally some clarity on the rule. Much appreciated. So essentially it doesn't matter now if the Texans cut him, he qualifies. So if we want Keenum as a backup the best outcome to protect our draft pick is they cut him and we sign him? 

The Keenum Conundrum has been solved!

[SoonerBillsFan]

14 hours ago, Herb Nightly said:

I think its time to stop with the "Josh needs a mentor" stuff. 

He doesn't need a washed up, marginal QB to hold his hand. 

I want a backup that can keep the Bills afloat if Josh goes down.

 

100%

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

You people better quit jacking around and come to a decision, pronto!  They're trying to set next week's employee schedule for The Bills Store. 🤨

[Sierra Foothills]

49 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said:

The Keenum Conundrum has been solved!

 

Prepare the celebration!

 

Invite the prettiest girls from the village!!!

 

[JDubya76]

6 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said:

The Keenum Conundrum has been solved!

WOO HOO, Beanie gets a third to draft a slow short RB or an O-Line long shot!

[Buffalo716]

7 hours ago, SectionC3 said:

It depends how bad Kyle Allen is behind the scenes.  We don't know what we don't see with him.  And it might be bad.  

And we know that Lance is bad too

 

The dude just keeps moving down the depth chart and his team gave up on him

 

Yeah let's bring him in to be our backup? Lmao I'd rather stick with the trash we have then get newer trash that doesn't know the offense 

 

Lance will be out of the league in 2 years

 

He's nothing 

 

 

Edited August 29, 2023 by Buffalo716

[JoeF]

7 hours ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said:

You people better quit jacking around and come to a decision, pronto!  They're trying to set next week's employee schedule for The Bills Store. 🤨

Case might have to offer a C-Note this year to get someone take the remaining Keenum Jerseys...

[Alphadawg7]

On 8/27/2023 at 11:23 AM, GunnerBill said:

I did ponder this the other week think it was with @Beck Water. It definitely used to be the case that the guys that were qualifying FAs for the purposes of the comp pick formula had to actually make the rosters they signed to (without being cut) and make it a certain number of weeks (think it was 6). If they stay on that contract having been traded to another team they still count.

 

Wasn't sure if that was still the case but it appears so. In which case definitely woth one of our extra 6ths to trade for a better backup and keep our extra 3rd.

 

Yeah, if this is accurate, its a no brainer as it essentially is like upgrading one of our extra 6ths to a 3rd and also upgrades the backup spot.  Do you know how well it works cap wise on the trade?  I mean he can't be making that much right

[GunnerBill]

6 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Yeah, if this is accurate, its a no brainer as it essentially is like upgrading one of our extra 6ths to a 3rd and also upgrades the backup spot.  Do you know how well it works cap wise on the trade?  I mean he can't be making that much right

 

It isn't accurate. See @Tuco above. He has clarified the way the rules work now. The old 6 week cut rules has gone.

[SectionC3]

19 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

And we know that Lance is bad too

 

The dude just keeps moving down the depth chart and his team gave up on him

 

Yeah let's bring him in to be our backup? Lmao I'd rather stick with the trash we have then get newer trash that doesn't know the offense 

 

Lance will be out of the league in 2 years

 

He's nothing 

 

 

And yet the Bills kicked the tires on this guy after having seen Kyle for the entirety of the offseason and in camp.  You’re making my point for me.  They’re so worried about Kyle’s play that the explored employing a raw, unknown quantity in Kyle’s place.  

[Buffalo716]

10 minutes ago, SectionC3 said:

And yet the Bills kicked the tires on this guy after having seen Kyle for the entirety of the offseason and in camp.  You’re making my point for me.  They’re so worried about Kyle’s play that the explored employing a raw, unknown quantity in Kyle’s place.  

You don't know what they offered for tray and what their plans for him was

 

They easily could have offered a 7th round pick for him to start as the third stringer and see what he has

 

Because it's asinine to trade for a colossal bust whose arrow is pointing downwards... Hand him your second string quarterback position on an offense he doesn't know a week before preseason

 

Something tells me that was not the case... And he's 3rd sting in SF and 3rd in Dal

 

Sure, the bills inquired... Doesn't mean they were handing him the backup job willy nilly

Edited August 29, 2023 by Buffalo716