Possible McKenzie Replacement Bills sign Deonte Harty (formally Deonte Harris)

[Buffalo716]

6 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

I know there were reasons that Beane targeted him. 

The problem Harty has had is staying healthy.  He's never had a full season.  He spent most of last season on IR with turf toe.  He's had repeated problems with tweaked hamstrings.  His ceiling is high, but he's by no means a sure contributor.

 

 

 

So Harty didn't play D1.  Assumption College, that's DII, correct?

 

He did get to the league, and make it onto the field as an offensive player for 13 games in 2021.  Also led the league in returns his rook year.

 

He can ball, no doubt.

Assumption would be DII and that’s why I also added or NFL caveat 

 

95% of DI schools will not offer a kid that size unless he is destroying kids in 5AAAAA Florida or Texas

 

even MAC schools are weary of that size with a scholarship out of HS… Jarrett Patterson at UB was 5’7 165 lb and they only offered him because they wanted his brother ( now a bill) and they were a tandem deal

 

good decision 

 

usually at that size you can get a preferred walk on if your a beast with the chance for a scholarship 

[ngbills]

10 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Jeremy White brought up a good point when we signed him.  He said for him to be that small and for an NFL team to hold a roster spot for him, you have to do something special.  He has that.  He just can't stay healthy.  If he does, I predict he will become the greatest receiver of all time and be on the cover of Madden 2 years in a row.  

 

6 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Assumption would be DII and that’s why I also added or NFL caveat 

 

95% of DI schools will not offer a kid that size unless he is destroying kids in 5AAAAA Florida or Texas

 

even MAC schools are weary of that size with a scholarship out of HS… Jarrett Patterson at UB was 5’7 165 lb and they only offered him because they wanted his brother ( now a bill) and they were a tandem deal

 

good decision 

 

usually at that size you can get a preferred walk on if your a beast with the chance for a scholarship 

Isn't Isaiah McK 5'8" / 170lb? And Cole Beasley? And Jamison Crowder? 

[Beck Water]

14 minutes ago, ngbills said:

 

Isn't Isaiah McK 5'8" / 170lb? And Cole Beasley? And Jamison Crowder? 

 

They're none of them big, but Harty is the smallest at 5'6" 170.

Crowder 5'8 185

McKenzie 5'8 173

Beasley 5'8 174

 

Crowder struggled with injuries.  Hasn't played a full season since 2019 and as we know, went out after a broken leg last season.

McKenzie has struggled with hammies but aside from that concussion last season he's been durable

Beasley was a warrior who played through everything but maybe shouldn't have

 

The point is for McKenzie and Beasley, they contributed massively in the regular season but when it was all on the line and the refs were allowing more physical play, they could be taken out (and were)

 

Physics has a tendency to win out, in the end.

Edited June 15, 2023 by Beck Water

[Buffalo716]

3 hours ago, ngbills said:

 

Isn't Isaiah McK 5'8" / 170lb? And Cole Beasley? And Jamison Crowder? 

Again there are a lot of 5’8-5’9 football players … I just said most D1 schools won’t offer a guy that size unless he is special… If 100 5’8 players go to UBs elite camp … maybe 2 would leave with an offer 

 

its just a lot tougher to make it to DI or the league … You can be at a camp in Texas… and I’ve seen This… Where you can just be walking around in shorts and be a 6’4 225 pound JR edge rusher And coaches will just walk up to you and give you a scholarship… on the spot … because of your look … They don’t even need to see you in a drill… you got an invite to the elite camp and have the look they crave 

 

while the 5’9 guy is going to have to bust his ass and kill all the drills… and beat the competition sideways to get that look…

 

mckenzie did star at a 5AAAAA Florida school which is why he’s one of the rarer little guys to go to a big school and play 

 

Most are like Beasley or crowder and have offers to SMU or Duke or wake forest or Kansas or service academies…2* recruits… which is still amazing 

 

but most big time schools would rather have and develop a 6’0 200 lb kid who can run … instead of a 5’7 kid who’s 160

 

and there’s a lot of HS kids to chose from , so even the Small kids who are phenoms , have up hill battles 

Edited June 15, 2023 by Buffalo716

[Beck Water]

6 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Again there are a lot of 5’8-5’9 football players … I just said most D1 schools won’t offer a guy that size unless he is special

 

its just a lot tougher to make it to DI or the league … You can be at a camp in Texas… and I’ve seen This… Where you can just be walking around in shorts and be a 6’4 225 pound JR edge rusher And coaches will just walk up to you and give you a scholarship… on the spot … because of your look … They don’t even need to see you in a drill… you got an invite to the elite camp and have the look they crave 

 

while the 5’9 guy is going to have to bust his ass and kill all the drills… and beat the competition sideways to get that look…

 

mckenzie did star at a 5AAAAA Florida school which is why he’s one of the rarer little guys to go to a big school and play 

 

Most are like Beasley or crowder and have offers to SMU or Duke or wake forest or service academies…2* recruits… which is still amazing 

 

but most big time schools would rather have and develop a 6’0 200 lb kid who can run … instead of a 5’7 kid who’s 160

 

and there’s a lot of HS kids to chose from , so even the Small kids who are phenoms , have up hill battles 

 

McKenzie not only starred at a top Florida HS, he played on the same team as Sony Michel.  So when colleges came to scout Michel, they saw Isaiah.

[Buffalo716]

1 minute ago, Beck Water said:

 

McKenzie not only starred at a top Florida HS, he played on the same team as Sony Michel.  So when colleges came to scout Michel, they saw Isaiah.

That’s also a kicker 

 

Having another big time recruit so scouts can see you when they come to see him

[Beck Water]

11 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

That’s also a kicker 

 

Having another big time recruit so scouts can see you when they come to see him

 

In fact, wasn't that how Josh got his shot at Wyoming?  Buhl sent someone to scout another player on his JuCo team, and while they were there, the QB "popped" at them?

 

Anyway, looping back to Harty - he clearly has the potential to be a dynamic player, both as a returner and as a receiver.  According to what Beane commented when he was signed, he may have some skills they hoped McKenzie would develop but he never did - the ability to track the ball and catch the deep throws, the demonstrated ability for YAC (though I still think YAC have a lot to do with Allen and/or play design not making decisive short throws while the YAC gettin' is good)

 

But I def. see him as a high ceiling/risk of low floor kind of guy due to injury potential (not because he's small, because he's had them)

Edited June 15, 2023 by Beck Water

[Buffalo716]

3 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

In fact, wasn't that how Josh got his shot at Wyoming?  Buhl sent someone to scout another player on his JuCo team, and while they were there, the QB "popped" at them?

I know that Allen sent out like 500 emails to all D1 coaches and only Wyoming and eastern Michigan hit him back 

 

Brent Vigan (OC) then went down to reedley and watched highlights of josh 

 

then bohl made a trip up to the farm and offered Allen a scholarship… eastern Michigan pulled out as soon as Josh took a trip to Wyoming 

[Dillenger4]

Harty is a stud. Fact. He is a burner. Who cares if he went to D1 or D2 school. The dude can all out burn ANY defense with his speed and route running capabilities. Now that he is on a good team he will shine! he can easily become our WR2. Just wait n see.

Also - we can't compare him to McKenzie or Beasly or Brown. Harty is on a different level than those guys.

If Harty was on the Niners or Cowboys he would have already been a household name. Now we have him and we reap the rewards.

 

[3rdand12]

Hoping . expecting that Dorsey will make good use of him and others. Having Josh throw to him is already a bonus above and beyond any statistics he had.

If they play him smartly this kid could really help the Bills offense.

BTW i dont want him running crossing routes under/into LBs for short yards.

 

Hope Bills staff can teach him to take care of his body , on and off the field !

[Mr. WEO]

40 minutes ago, Dillenger4 said:

Harty is a stud. Fact. He is a burner. Who cares if he went to D1 or D2 school. The dude can all out burn ANY defense with his speed and route running capabilities. Now that he is on a good team he will shine! he can easily become our WR2. Just wait n see.

Also - we can't compare him to McKenzie or Beasly or Brown. Harty is on a different level than those guys.

If Harty was on the Niners or Cowboys he would have already been a household name. Now we have him and we reap the rewards.

 

 

He would have been on their IR lists.

 

Who are the WRs (not ones who are also RBs) on the 49ers that are "household names"?

[Buffalo716]

50 minutes ago, Dillenger4 said:

Harty is a stud. Fact. He is a burner. Who cares if he went to D1 or D2 school. The dude can all out burn ANY defense with his speed and route running capabilities. Now that he is on a good team he will shine! he can easily become our WR2. Just wait n see.

Also - we can't compare him to McKenzie or Beasly or Brown. Harty is on a different level than those guys.

If Harty was on the Niners or Cowboys he would have already been a household name. Now we have him and we reap the rewards.

 

I don’t think anybody cares what school he went to…. 
 

The day you get into the NFL… Whether as a first round pick or undrafted free agent… You’re in the league 

 

30% of the league is undrafted free agents…

 

All you need is a shot

 

fred Jackson DIII coe college 

[BillsFanForever19]

2 hours ago, Beck Water said:

 

I know there were reasons that Beane targeted him. 

The problem Harty has had is staying healthy.  He's never had a full season.  He spent most of last season on IR with turf toe.  He's had repeated problems with tweaked hamstrings.  His ceiling is high, but he's by no means a sure contributor.

 

My issue with that statement is that people can have their own personal concerns about that. But Beane signed him and made him a priority. 

 

What posters want is for him to be, at most, the 4th technical WR on the depth chart and the 5th or 6th option in the passing game after Diggs, Hopkins (who fans look at as a "need" and not a luxury), Davis, Kincaid, and Knox. 

 

Beane didn't sign him to a 2 year contract worth 10 million to turn around and go out and spend a boatload more to get another guy because he doesn't see him as a "sure thing". 

 

He'll already surely be behind Diggs, Kincaid, and Davis on players split out Wide. I don't think he's looking to use him even less than that with the investment he made in him.

 

Which is why I think Beane has taken a stance of "If he wants to come here cheap, sure. Otherwise, I don't really need him" with Hopkins.

Edited June 15, 2023 by BillsFanForever19

[Nephilim17]

If Harty splits time in the slot with Kincaid (and I don't mean 50/50; it could be 30/70, whatever) I think defenses will have a very hard time adjusting from big and smooth Kincaid to tiny and explosive Harty.

Just tackling these two different players almost seems like polar opposites.

 

If we want a change-up in the slot, I think Harty will, perhaps in smaller doses, give defenses fits. And I fully expect Kincaid to be a beast in the slot. I'm looking forward to slot play after a crap year of it.

[Buffalo716]

2 hours ago, Dillenger4 said:

Harty is a stud. Fact. He is a burner. Who cares if he went to D1 or D2 school. The dude can all out burn ANY defense with his speed and route running capabilities. Now that he is on a good team he will shine! he can easily become our WR2. Just wait n see.

Also - we can't compare him to McKenzie or Beasly or Brown. Harty is on a different level than those guys.

If Harty was on the Niners or Cowboys he would have already been a household name. Now we have him and we reap the rewards.

 

He’s more deshaun Jackson 

 

I think it’s a great addition …. he has to stay healthy tho

Edited June 15, 2023 by Buffalo716

[Buffalo716]

3 hours ago, Beck Water said:

 

McKenzie not only starred at a top Florida HS, he played on the same team as Sony Michel.  So when colleges came to scout Michel, they saw Isaiah.

How did you remember he played with Sony in HS lol

Edited June 16, 2023 by Buffalo716

[Beck Water]

3 hours ago, Dillenger4 said:

Harty is a stud. Fact. He is a burner. Who cares if he went to D1 or D2 school. The dude can all out burn ANY defense with his speed and route running capabilities. Now that he is on a good team he will shine! he can easily become our WR2. Just wait n see.

Also - we can't compare him to McKenzie or Beasly or Brown. Harty is on a different level than those guys.

If Harty was on the Niners or Cowboys he would have already been a household name. Now we have him and we reap the rewards.

 

 

Are you his agent, or his mom?  😁 Seriously, I love the passion and the enthusiasm. 

 

D1 or D2 was raised only in the context of how hard it is for a small kid to get D1 offers (Buffalo716 may have some experience there).

 

I hope he will stay healthy and shine on the Bills, but I'm a bit skeptical he will become a WR2 at all, much less "easily".  Now sometimes the #2 WR plays a lot from the slot.  In yards, Beasley was our #2 in 2020 and 2021, in part because injuries meant Davis/Brown then Davis/Sanders were splitting time as the #2.  In receptions, unquestioned #2.  It's gonna depend upon how the Bills see Kincaid's role.

 

As far as playing outside - I don't see a guy with 28" arms being able to gain a release and hold off a handsy corner, whether his name is Shakir or Hardy.  I dunno, maybe I'm wrong.

Edited June 16, 2023 by Beck Water

[Beck Water]

28 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

How did you remember he played with Sony in HS lol

 

LOL I have a crazy ass memory.  Can't remember what I said 10 minutes ago or where I put my phone.  Can remember all sorts of junk.

 

I think at one point maybe after he scored a kickoff or punt return TD including some pretty slick moves and good use of his blockers, a reporter asked McKenzie if he'd ever played any RB at any level - HS or college.  He said "no 'cuz I played with Sony Michel"  "How about in HS?"  "Played with him there, too"    Ended that line of questioning!!!

Edited June 16, 2023 by Beck Water

[mrags]

Found a vid of Harty from his first day at mandatory mini camp the other day. 
 

https://www.tiktok.com/@tikkclipz/video/7205918591235935493

[JakeFrommStateFarm]

Mark my words.

 

One day we're going to miss Lil' Dirty

[Coach Tuesday]

13 minutes ago, JakeFrommStateFarm said:

Mark my words.

 

One day we're going to miss Lil' Dirty

lol wut 

[Paul Costa]

17 minutes ago, JakeFrommStateFarm said:

Mark my words.

 

One day we're going to miss Lil' Dirty

Awesome person !!! Ultimate JAG ( Just A Guy)

[mrags]

1 hour ago, JakeFrommStateFarm said:

Mark my words.

 

One day we're going to miss Lil' Dirty

Yeah, as a WR that’s prolly a stretch. But a really good teammate. 

[John from Riverside]

4 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

My issue with that statement is that people can have their own personal concerns about that. But Beane signed him and made him a priority. 

 

What posters want is for him to be, at most, the 4th technical WR on the depth chart and the 5th or 6th option in the passing game after Diggs, Hopkins (who fans look at as a "need" and not a luxury), Davis, Kincaid, and Knox. 

 

Beane didn't sign him to a 2 year contract worth 10 million to turn around and go out and spend a boatload more to get another guy because he doesn't see him as a "sure thing". 

 

He'll already surely be behind Diggs, Kincaid, and Davis on players split out Wide. I don't think he's looking to use him even less than that with the investment he made in him.

 

Which is why I think Beane has taken a stance of "If he wants to come here cheap, sure. Otherwise, I don't really need him" with Hopkins.

I think at the end of the day, and we’re analyzing this upcoming season at the end of the year we’re going to be glad that the general manager did not pull all the levers he was able to, and saved some

 

We did improve our receiving room, not only with Dalton Kincaid, but also with these lesser signings all too soon people forget that wide receivers come to the Buffalo Bills and they have their best years because of the quarterback they’re playing with

 

And there are just so many different receiving options. You’ve got a number one receiver in Dix. You’ve got a number two that’s in a contract year. You got guys like sherfield who have been number threes on other teams with good offenses

 

You got talent that you already put on the team like Khalil Shakir that’s just waiting for an opportunity and then you got wild cards like Deontay Harti

 

We’re fine

1 hour ago, JakeFrommStateFarm said:

Mark my words.

 

One day we're going to miss Lil' Dirty

I think we’re gonna miss his personality
As a player, he was kind of a net 0

[LyndonvilleBill]

14 hours ago, Dillenger4 said:

Harty is a stud. Fact. He is a burner. Who cares if he went to D1 or D2 school. The dude can all out burn ANY defense with his speed and route running capabilities. Now that he is on a good team he will shine! he can easily become our WR2. Just wait n see.

Also - we can't compare him to McKenzie or Beasly or Brown. Harty is on a different level than those guys.

If Harty was on the Niners or Cowboys he would have already been a household name. Now we have him and we reap the rewards.

 

Why do people say he is a "Burner"? His 40 time (4.48) was slower than Diggs (4,46), Shakir (4.43) AND Lil'l Dirty (4.42). I like the enthusiasm, but, Brown (4.34) was probably faster even at his age. Heck, even Beasley had a 4.49. 😉

Edited June 16, 2023 by LyndonvilleBill

[Dillenger4]

1 hour ago, LyndonvilleBill said:

Why do people say he is a "Burner"? His 40 time (4.48) was slower than Diggs (4,46), Shakir (4.43) AND Lil'l Dirty (4.42). I like the enthusiasm, but, Brown (4.34) was probably faster even at his age. Heck, even Beasley had a 4.49. 😉

People say he is a burner, rather KNOW he is a burner, because he can demonstrate it on the field during an NFL game.

The guys you mention in comparison are not considered "burners".

Harty is known for his stretch speed similar to Hill on Miami. Not saying Harty is as good right now but we will see. Depends how the Bills use him.,

He is our fastest WR. (On the field).

[The Jokeman]

1 hour ago, LyndonvilleBill said:

Why do people say he is a "Burner"? His 40 time (4.48) was slower than Diggs (4,46), Shakir (4.43) AND Lil'l Dirty (4.42). I like the enthusiasm, but, Brown (4.34) was probably faster even at his age. Heck, even Beasley had a 4.49. 😉

Watch his highlights, he finds way to break away from other guys. Maybe it's his lower center of gravity but he does look like he has an extra gear. 

[NewEra]

4 hours ago, LyndonvilleBill said:

Why do people say he is a "Burner"? His 40 time (4.48) was slower than Diggs (4,46), Shakir (4.43) AND Lil'l Dirty (4.42). I like the enthusiasm, but, Brown (4.34) was probably faster even at his age. Heck, even Beasley had a 4.49. 😉

Because guys can run more than one 40…… Sometimes they run poorly.  Sometimes they run great.  
 

https://saintswire.usatoday.com/gallery/saints-nfl-draft-alvin-kamara-40-time/

Edited June 16, 2023 by NewEra

[Alphadawg7]

Here is all anyone needs to know when it comes to Harty vs McKenzie

 

McKenzie is a gadget player whose only singular strong attribute is straight line speed but couldn't apply that to be a valid deep threat.  Harty is a legit deep threat who can take the top off the defense.  He does WR things better in almost every aspect of the position than McKenzie despite being similar in stature.  

 

Love McKenzie, his energy, personality etc.  But end of the day, he was out over his ski's as a starting slot WR.  He is a valuable gadget guy, but not someone you can rely on as a heavy minutes player.  He isn't a polished route runner, he doesn't have great hands, he isn't cerebral on the field like Cole was, he isn't very good at tough or contested catches, he isn't physical, and he doesn't track the long ball well.  

 

Harty is more of a talent as a WR and can do more WR things on the field.  His biggest issue is availability in terms of staying healthy.  I don't see Harty as a guy who can be relied on as a starter either with his injury history, but I do feel like he is more of a legit WR when he is on the field and if you lose track of him he can burn you over the top and score on any given play.  I trust him to not only track the ball much better but be someone who can make a catch in traffic down field too.  

 

Going from McKenzie to Harty is a noticeable upgrade IMHO.  

[BADOLBILZ]

3 hours ago, LyndonvilleBill said:

Why do people say he is a "Burner"? His 40 time (4.48) was slower than Diggs (4,46), Shakir (4.43) AND Lil'l Dirty (4.42). I like the enthusiasm, but, Brown (4.34) was probably faster even at his age. Heck, even Beasley had a 4.49. 😉

 

 

I think Harty just runs faster when chased.   Diggs runs faster when chaste........which is why he will never be a burner.

[SCBills]

14 hours ago, JakeFrommStateFarm said:

Mark my words.

 

One day we're going to miss Lil' Dirty

I’ll miss his personality.  The guy is just a fun person.  
 

I won’t miss him as a player. 
 

His Chiefs game this past season might be the worst game for a WR I’ve ever seen. 

I’m very confident that, at least, one of Harty, Sherfield and Shakir can outperform what he provided. 

Edited June 16, 2023 by SCBills

[LyndonvilleBill]

2 hours ago, Dillenger4 said:

People say he is a burner, rather KNOW he is a burner, because he can demonstrate it on the field during an NFL game.

The guys you mention in comparison are not considered "burners".

Harty is known for his stretch speed similar to Hill on Miami. Not saying Harty is as good right now but we will see. Depends how the Bills use him.,

He is our fastest WR. (On the field).

I guess if you say so. I haven't seen him compared to Hill. 

2 hours ago, The Jokeman said:

Watch his highlights, he finds way to break away from other guys. Maybe it's his lower center of gravity but he does look like he has an extra gear. 

I watched a few and he is quick. Still looks similar to Lil' Dirty to me.🤷. Definitely better on Returns.😉

[John from Riverside]

15 hours ago, mrags said:

Found a vid of Harty from his first day at mandatory mini camp the other day. 
 

https://www.tiktok.com/@tikkclipz/video/7205918591235935493

I should not be laughing at this
Why am I laughing at this?

[NewEra]

1 minute ago, LyndonvilleBill said:

I guess if you say so. I haven't seen him compared to Hill. 

The guy is obvious to people that understand football that he’s super fast on the football field.  There aren’t too many WRs with his type of game speed. 
 

The problem is he could get destroyed due to being so small

1 minute ago, John from Riverside said:

I should not be laughing at this
Why am I laughing at this?

Because you’re a bad person John.  Obv

[LyndonvilleBill]

1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Here is all anyone needs to know when it comes to Harty vs McKenzie

 

McKenzie is a gadget player whose only singular strong attribute is straight line speed but couldn't apply that to be a valid deep threat.  Harty is a legit deep threat who can take the top off the defense.  He does WR things better in almost every aspect of the position than McKenzie despite being similar in stature.  

 

Love McKenzie, his energy, personality etc.  But end of the day, he was out over his ski's as a starting slot WR.  He is a valuable gadget guy, but not someone you can rely on as a heavy minutes player.  He isn't a polished route runner, he doesn't have great hands, he isn't cerebral on the field like Cole was, he isn't very good at tough or contested catches, he isn't physical, and he doesn't track the long ball well.  

 

Harty is more of a talent as a WR and can do more WR things on the field.  His biggest issue is availability in terms of staying healthy.  I don't see Harty as a guy who can be relied on as a starter either with his injury history, but I do feel like he is more of a legit WR when he is on the field and if you lose track of him he can burn you over the top and score on any given play.  I trust him to not only track the ball much better but be someone who can make a catch in traffic down field too.  

 

Going from McKenzie to Harty is a noticeable upgrade IMHO.  

I was looking at the stats , but with his injuries, it may be unfair to use them as a comparison. 🤷‍♂️

 

https://stathead.com/football/versus-finder.cgi?player_id2=McKeIs00&player_id1=HarrDe07&request=1&utm_campaign=2023_01_wdgt_player_comparison&utm_source=pfr&utm_medium=sr_xsite&utm_id=HarrDe07

28 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

I think Harty just runs faster when chased.   Diggs runs faster when chaste........which is why he will never be a burner.

If I was 5'6" 170lbs and being chased by bigger guys, I'd run faster too.🤣

[hondo in seattle]

44 minutes ago, LyndonvilleBill said:

I guess if you say so. I haven't seen him compared to Hill. 

I watched a few and he is quick. Still looks similar to Lil' Dirty to me.🤷. Definitely better on Returns.😉

 

A better version of Lil' Dirty.