NFL Week 8: Packers at Bills - post game thread

[newcam2012]

2 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

The Bills were up 17 points and got caught by surprise the Packers still kept running it...they even admitted it. Both Miller and Rousseau. Likely they got a little to antsy to rush the passer and got caught out of position.

I understand that logic but the Packers pretty much ran at will the whole game. It was pretty evident to me that the Bills had major issues stopping their run game. It was more than just your explanation that was the issue. There were huge holes and very long runs. Their were major issues in the Bills rush defense today. The got blasted off the line of scrimmage. No other way to put it. As a defense, the Bills couldn't have been ok or think it was acceptable to give up so many long running plays. How many did they have over 10 yards? 

 

Now, it's only one game and it's not a time to panic. It is concerning though. I didn't think the Bills defense was capable of getting gutted by the run. Last year's defense yes but not this year's. Hopefully, this is just a "one off." It's a little concerning though.

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

6 minutes ago, Billz4ever said:

You're lumping multiple drives together where they either didn't convert or came away with a fg.

 

Bottom line is the run game was just as effective as a pass game there and the defense did not adjust accordingly.

 

If the offense's weakness is their receiving Corp, you make THEM beat you and plug up run.  You shouldn't have to play nickel defense every down if the receivers are the weakness of the other team.

 

 

 Not when you're playing one of the best QBs to ever play the game and can thread the needle from 40-50 yards away. Did you see the first td, a perfect pass. You make someone else beat you. 

 

 That's how they played and you got a tough argument that it didn't work because they only gave up 17 points and won by double digits.

 

 

Edited October 31, 2022 by LOVEMESOMEBILLS

[Billz4ever]

2 minutes ago, LOVEMESOMEBILLS said:

 

 Not when you're playing one of the best QBs to ever play the game and can thread the needle from 40-50 yards away. Did you see the first td, a perfect pass. You make someone else beat you. 

 

 That's how they played and you got a tough argument that it didn't work because they only gave up 17 points and won by double digits.

 

 

And that same pass is something that Mahomes can do as well.  If the D plays like they did tonight the next time they play KC, we will lose.  Let's leave it at that.

Edited October 31, 2022 by Billz4ever

[Doc Brown]

15 minutes ago, Billz4ever said:

What they were giving up on the ground, they might as well have been giving up through the air since the yardage gained was pass like yardage.  We knew they were running but the D still couldn't stop it.  That is rigid play calling and shows a lack of ability to adapt to what the offense is doing.

 

The play calling tonight was questionable on both sides of the ball and the Bills won because they are simple a much better team than GB, but bad execution and play calling kept this game closer than it should've been. This game should've played out how the Pittsburgh game did the second half.

We did?  Most teams down 17 in the second half pass the ball and it seemed the Packers seemed content on not getting embarrassed.  It was really strange.  I don't disagree on any of your other points but the Packers lack of urgency in the 2nd half was baffling to me.

[WideNine]

6 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

I understand that logic but the Packers pretty much ran at will the whole game. It was pretty evident to me that the Bills had major issues stopping their run game. It was more than just your explanation that was the issue. There were huge holes and very long runs. Their were major issues in the Bills rush defense today. The got blasted off the line of scrimmage. No other way to put it. As a defense, the Bills couldn't have been ok or think it was acceptable to give up so many long running plays. How many did they have over 10 yards? 

 

Now, it's only one game and it's not a time to panic. It is concerning though. I didn't think the Bills defense was capable of getting gutted by the run. Last year's defense yes but not this year's. Hopefully, this is just a "one off." It's a little concerning though.

 

I am not too concerned.

 

I do think guys got a bit undisciplined with their gaps thinking pass, but often Frazier had guys in position to make a play.

 

What was uncharacteristic for this team was how many missed or broken tackles happened at or behind the LOS.

 

For the most part this defense has been pretty solid tackling this year.

 

Chalk it up to some decent skills by the GB runningbacks and a bit of rust from the bye.

 

 

Edited October 31, 2022 by WideNine

[Billz4ever]

2 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

We did?  Most teams down 17 in the second half pass the ball and it seemed the Packers seemed content on not getting embarrassed.  It was really strange.  I don't disagree on any of your other points but the Packers lack of urgency in the 2nd half was baffling to me.

At what point in any of that did you think they were passing? Their formations screamed run and if you're that scared of THAT receiving corps, who's essentially a bunch of nobodies, why are you coaching in this league?

 

Yes, it was strange and seemed like they weren't too concerned about the clock, but what is our coaching staff so afraid of? Their receivers are their weakness.  If they are effectively running, make those receivers beat you.  

 

No need to play nickel D when the formation screams run just on the off chance that one play they go play action.  

 Have some faith in the secondary against a weak receiving Corp.

Edited October 31, 2022 by Billz4ever

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

Just now, Billz4ever said:

If the D plays like they did tonight the next time they play KC, we will lose.  Let's leave it at that.

 

 Wrong again. KC doesn't have a RB anywhere neat Aaron Jones caliber.

 

 Again they identified that the only way they could lose is by Aaron Rodgers going off. They made sure that didn't happen. Yards don't mean **** without points to back them up. Need anymore proof, week #3 against Miami. We moved the ball up down the field all day and had the ball for over 40 minutes,  but only scored 17 and lost.

 

 

[Special K]

6 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

We did?  Most teams down 17 in the second half pass the ball and it seemed the Packers seemed content on not getting embarrassed.  It was really strange.  I don't disagree on any of your other points but the Packers lack of urgency in the 2nd half was baffling to me.

 

I said it in another thread, but it reminded me of a Dick Jauron game plan....not a game plan designed to win, but to keep from getting blown out.....losers mentality.

[WideNine]

Just now, LOVEMESOMEBILLS said:

 

 Wrong again. KC doesn't have a RB anywhere neat Aaron Jones caliber.

 

 Again they identified that the only way they could lose is by Aaron Rodgers going off. They made sure that didn't happen. Yards don't mean **** without points to back them up. Need anymore proof, week #3 against Miami. We moved the ball up down the field all day and had the ball for over 40 minutes,  but only scored 17 and lost.

 

 

 

Jones is special.

 

I think last year he led the league for yards after contact... tough runner.

 

Probably helped with Henry out, but still respectable.

 

 

 

[Warcodered]

 

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

5 minutes ago, Billz4ever said:

At what point in any of that did you think they were passing? Their formations screamed run and if you're that scared of THAT receiving corps, who's essentially a bunch of nobodies, why are you coaching in this league?

 

Yes, it was strange and seemed like they weren't too concerned about the clock, but what is our coaching staff so afraid of? Their receivers are their weakness.  If they are effectively running, make those receivers beat you.  

 

No need to play nickel D when the formation screams run just on the off chance that one play they go play action.  

 Have some faith in the secondary against a weak receiving Corp.

 

 Seriously, how much did you lose tonight? You're overreacting so badly it screams I'm pissed I just lost a **** ton of money on a garbage time td.😂

 

 

[Warcodered]

 

[Big Turk]

1 minute ago, WideNine said:

 

Jones is special.

 

I think last year he led the league for yards after contact... tough runner.

 

Probably helped with Henry out, but still respectable.

 

 

 

 

He really impressed me. Dude seemed to get 4-5 extra yards almost every run than what you'd expect. How the heck doesn't GB just feed him the ball?

[Billz4ever]

Just now, LOVEMESOMEBILLS said:

 

 Wrong again. KC doesn't have a RB anywhere neat Aaron Jones caliber.

 

 Again they identified that the only way they could lose is by Aaron Rodgers going off. They made sure that didn't happen. Yards don't mean **** without points to back them up. Need anymore proof, week #3 against Miami. We moved the ball up down the field all day and had the ball for over 40 minutes,  but only scored 17 and lost.

 

 

Mahomes can make those throws and run the ball.  

 

The D was lackluster tonight and the D play calling did not match what the O was doing.  

 

You play to the strengths and weaknesses of the other team.  GBs receivers are not good yet we were treating them like it was Diggs on their side.

 

Their formations repeatedly showed pass and that's what you play for. If you have the better secondary, you make their receivers beat you, not play nickel and let their RBs rip off runs that were equivalent to long passes.

 

That's playing scared instead of playing to your strengths and daring the other team to put their weakness up against a stronger secondary.

3 minutes ago, LOVEMESOMEBILLS said:

 

 Seriously, how much did you lose tonight? You're overreacting so badly it screams I'm pissed I just lost a **** ton of money on a garbage time td.😂

 

 

I see you've quit trying to debate on substance and decided to switch to ad hominem.  Welcome to ignore.

[Big Turk]

1 minute ago, Billz4ever said:

Mahomes can make those throws and run the ball.  

 

The D was lackluster tonight and the D play calling did not match what the O was doing.  

 

You play to the strengths and weaknesses of the other team.  GBs receivers are not good yet we were treating them like it was Diggs on their side.

 

Their formations repeatedly showed pass and that's what you play for. If you have the better secondary, you make their receivers beat you, not play nickel and let their RBs rip off runs that were equivalent to long passes.

 

That's playing scared instead of playing to your strengths and daring the other team to put their weakness up against a stronger secondary.

 

The Bills essentially let them shorten the game for themselves while not doing anything to actually get in position to win the game.

 

They obviously were not happy with giving up so many runs and getting out of position on some runs. However, down 17 points, I am more than happy to let a team run the ball as much as they want. Especially when they aren't running any form of hurry up offense.

[Scott7975]

20 minutes ago, Billz4ever said:

You're lumping multiple drives together where they either didn't convert or came away with a fg.

 

Bottom line is the run game was just as effective as a pass game there and the defense did not adjust accordingly.

 

If the offense's weakness is their receiving Corp, you make THEM beat you and plug up run.  You shouldn't have to play nickel defense every down if the receivers are the weakness of the other team.

 

 

It was not just as effective.  Two drives.  11 minutes of clock down 3 scores.  3 points.  Again... all their running that you are complaining about resulted in 3 points and the death of their own clock. When they scored their sole TD of the second half they ran the ball for 12 yards over 2 plays and passed the rest of the time and that drive took 3 mins and 33 seconds.  You are wrong dude.  

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

4 minutes ago, Billz4ever said:

Mahomes can make those throws and run the ball.  

 

The D was lackluster tonight and the D play calling did not match what the O was doing.  

 

You play to the strengths and weaknesses of the other team.  GBs receivers are not good yet we were treating them like it was Diggs on their side.

 

Their formations repeatedly showed pass and that's what you play for. If you have the better secondary, you make their receivers beat you, not play nickel and let their RBs rip off runs that were equivalent to long passes.

 

That's playing scared instead of playing to your strengths and daring the other team to put their weakness up against a stronger secondary.

 

 But the QB is extraordinary at making precision throws on deep passes. They didn't need to beat the Chiefs tonight, they had to beat Aaron Rodgers. And we already beat the Chiefs at their house this year. With what? A game plan to beat them. Honestly that comparison is ridiculous.

 

 

Edited October 31, 2022 by LOVEMESOMEBILLS

[Billz4ever]

8 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

 

It was not just as effective.  Two drives.  11 minutes of clock down 3 scores.  3 points.  Again... all their running that you are complaining about resulted in 3 points and the death of their own clock. When they scored their sole TD of the second half they ran the ball for 12 yards over 2 plays and passed the rest of the time and that drive took 3 mins and 33 seconds.  You are wrong dude.  

Once again you are comparing the outcome of the drives instead of focusing on how easy they moved the ball.  Not even remotely the same thing at all.

Edited October 31, 2022 by Billz4ever

[RunTheBall]

22 minutes ago, Billz4ever said:

You're lumping multiple drives together where they either didn't convert or came away with a fg.

 

Bottom line is the run game was just as effective as a pass game there and the defense did not adjust accordingly.

 

If the offense's weakness is their receiving Corp, you make THEM beat you and plug up run.  You shouldn't have to play nickel defense every down if the receivers are the weakness of the other team.

 

Do you watch football? Seriously, this crusade is lame. The Bills stayed in nickel against heavy fronts all game. Yes, we would have liked a better run D, BUT, when we were up 2-3 scores and GB continued to run, essentially conceding the game, there was no reason to adjust to 3 LB to stop it. No, running the ball is not the same as passing for the same yardage because the Bills weren’t going to give up the quick score. Get it? We were up 2-3 scores, we weren’t going to let them score quick, so we stayed in nickel and let them run. It’s not that hard.

 

 

[Scott7975]

18 minutes ago, Billz4ever said:

And that same pass is something that Mahomes can do as well.  If the D plays like they did tonight the next time they play KC, we will lose.  Let's leave it at that.

 

If Mahomes is down 3 scores midway through the 3rd quarter they wont be stupid enough to run the football.

[Billz4ever]

1 minute ago, LOVEMESOMEBILLS said:

 

 But the QB is extraordinary at making precision throws on deep passes. They didn't need to beat the Chiefs tonight, they had to beat Aaron Rodgers. And we already beat the Chiefs at their house this year. With what? A game plan to beat them. Honestly that comparison is ridiculous.

 

 

What kind of lukewarm IQ must you have to keep responding to someone who has literally told you that you are ignored?

Just now, Scott7975 said:

 

If Mahomes is down 3 scores midway through the 3rd quarter they wont be stupid enough to run the football.

If that was what was working for them you'd better bet your butt they would, especially when the yardage they were ripping off was the same as pass plays would be.  You must have been watching a different game.

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

Just now, Billz4ever said:

What kind of lukewarm IQ must you have to keep responding to someone who has literally told you that you are ignored?

 

 Very informative response!! And that's what you do when you know you're wrong. It's OK, happens to the best of us.

 

 

[Lothar]

17 minutes ago, WideNine said:

 

For the most part this defense has been pretty solid tackling this year.

 

Chalk it up to some decent skills by the GB runningbacks and a bit of rust from the bye.

 

 

Actually, no.

Joe Marino pointed out on his podcast that since the first two games, the tackling has been near the bottom of the league. We just get away with it because we've made some big impact plays on defense via sacks and turnovers. 

 

Poor tackling is unfortunately a hallmark of this defense - and we're still pretty damn good. You can see how good we'd be if we also were a good tackling defense.

[Billz4ever]

3 minutes ago, RunTheBall said:

Do you watch football? Seriously, this crusade is lame. The Bills stayed in nickel against heavy fronts all game. Yes, we would have liked a better run D, BUT, when we were up 2-3 scores and GB continued to run, essentially conceding the game, there was no reason to adjust to 3 LB to stop it. No, running the ball is not the same as passing for the same yardage because the Bills weren’t going to give up the quick score. Get it? We were up 2-3 scores, we weren’t going to let them score quick, so we stayed in nickel and let them run. It’s not that hard.

 

 

Muted for being clueless but keep making excuses for a defense that didn't adapt and was scared of that receiving Corp.

 

I'm sure you were saying it wasn't the ridiculous play calling that led to the 13 seconds fiasco too.

[Scott7975]

4 minutes ago, Billz4ever said:

Once again you are comparing the outcome of the drives instead of focusing on how easy they moved th3 ball.  Not even remotely the same thing at all.

Once again you are complaining that a team ran the football down 3 scores, scored 3 points, and killed their own clock.  If the Bills lost by 10 points and were running the football are you telling me youd be happy af because we were able to gash yards on the ground?  Their running game didnt matter.  What do you not understand about that?

[JDubya76]

Anyone ask that putz that got ejected what the heck he was thinking?

[Billz4ever]

3 minutes ago, LOVEMESOMEBILLS said:

 

 Very informative response!! And that's what you do when you know you're wrong. It's OK, happens to the best of us.

 

 

My mistake, not lukewarm.  Frigid like a Bills game in January.

[Scott7975]

5 minutes ago, Billz4ever said:

What kind of lukewarm IQ must you have to keep responding to someone who has literally told you that you are ignored?

If that was what was working for them you'd better bet your butt they would, especially when the yardage they were ripping off was the same as pass plays would be.  You must have been watching a different game.

 

You might have a point if it worked for GB but all it did was work against them. 3 points bro... 3 points in 2 drives killing their own clock.

[Billz4ever]

1 minute ago, Scott7975 said:

Once again you are complaining that a team ran the football down 3 scores, scored 3 points, and killed their own clock.  If the Bills lost by 10 points and were running the football are you telling me youd be happy af because we were able to gash yards on the ground?  Their running game didnt matter.  What do you not understand about that?

And yet AGAIN you are talking about the outcome rather than the ease with which they moved the ball.

 You have the luxury of knowing the ultimate outcome, but that was ridiculous what we witnessed tonight.

 

 

[Scott7975]

5 minutes ago, Billz4ever said:

And yet AGAIN you are talking about the outcome rather than the ease with which they moved the ball.

 You have the luxury of knowing the ultimate outcome, but that was ridiculous what we witnessed tonight.

 

 

 

You said it was working for them.  I said it didnt because they only scored 3 points.  You think the outcome doesnt matter?

 

What you witnessed tonight was a team that got some rushing yards and failed to put up points.  Yards dont matter.  Points do.

 

The Bills turned the ball over twice against a team with Aaron Rodgers and you are worried over some rushing yards when this team has been #1 against the rush 6 games in

Edited October 31, 2022 by Scott7975

[Doc Brown]

14 minutes ago, Billz4ever said:

Mahomes can make those throws and run the ball.  

 

The D was lackluster tonight and the D play calling did not match what the O was doing.  

 

You play to the strengths and weaknesses of the other team.  GBs receivers are not good yet we were treating them like it was Diggs on their side.

 

Their formations repeatedly showed pass and that's what you play for. If you have the better secondary, you make their receivers beat you, not play nickel and let their RBs rip off runs that were equivalent to long passes.

 

That's playing scared instead of playing to your strengths and daring the other team to put their weakness up against a stronger secondary.

I see you've quit trying to debate on substance and decided to switch to ad hominem.  Welcome to ignore.

Running over seven minutes of clock and then turning the ball over on a 4th and 1 run was a great strategy down 17 at the start of the 4th quarter.  Rodgers consistently waiting until under five seconds left on the play clock to hand it off after checking to a run was next level stuff.

[Billz4ever]

1 minute ago, Scott7975 said:

 

You said it was working for them.  I said it didnt because they only scored 3 points.  You think the outcome doesnt matter?

 

What you witnessed tonight was a team that got some rushing yards and failed to put up points.  Yards dont matter.  Points do.

So according to you if Rodgers was ripping off those yards it wouldn't matter because they didn't score.

 

Terrible logic because against better teams, they would've scored  and just to prove my point this thread us being bookmarked to be later revisited.  I can't wait.

 

 

 

[Scott7975]

2 minutes ago, Billz4ever said:

So according to you if Rodgers was ripping off those yards it wouldn't matter because they didn't score.

 

Terrible logic because against better teams, they would've scored  and just to prove my point this thread us being bookmarked to be later revisited.  I can't wait.

 

 

 

 

Yes if Aaron Rodgers was ripping it and the Bills kept him out of the end zone it wouldnt matter because they didnt score points.  That is correct.

 

Please do.  Revisit this thread the next time the Bills lose because they got gashed in the run. I'll wait.

Edited October 31, 2022 by Scott7975

[Billz4ever]

3 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

 

Yes if Aaron Rodgers was ripping it and the Bills kept him out of the end zone it wouldnt matter because they didnt score points.  That is correct.

 

Please do.  Revisit this thread the next time the Bills lose because they got gashed in the run. I'll wait.

You just said, it didn't matter if it was run or pass, so whether it's the run tonight or playing the wrong D against the pass against KC and Mahomes in 13 seconds, you can bet your butt this will be thrown in your face.

Edited October 31, 2022 by Billz4ever

[Doc Brown]

3 minutes ago, Billz4ever said:

So according to you if Rodgers was ripping off those yards it wouldn't matter because they didn't score.

 

Terrible logic because against better teams, they would've scored  and just to prove my point this thread us being bookmarked to be later revisited.  I can't wait.

I like how we've gone to "against better teams" when we just beat Aaron Rodgers and the Packers.  We've become a spoiled fan base.

[Billz4ever]

3 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

I like how we've gone to "against better teams" when we just beat Aaron Rodgers and the Packers.  We've become a spoiled fan base.

The Aaron Rodgers and Packers that have lost 4 in a row and are 3-5 on the season.

 

Shouldn't have to be said, but they aren't a good team right now.  We were literally playing against special teamers at LB the second half.

Edited October 31, 2022 by Billz4ever

[WideNine]

10 minutes ago, Lothar said:

Actually, no.

Joe Marino pointed out on his podcast that since the first two games, the tackling has been near the bottom of the league. We just get away with it because we've made some big impact plays on defense via sacks and turnovers. 

 

Poor tackling is unfortunately a hallmark of this defense - and we're still pretty damn good. You can see how good we'd be if we also were a good tackling defense.

 

Hard to reconcile that with the Bills leading the league in defensive DVOA.

 

There have been some sloppy misses especially in the secondary.

 

Remembering that keystone cops moment with the Steelers where they ran into and wiped themselves out and gave up the TD.

 

Been playing a lot of rooks and depth guys back there so understandable that they can be caught out of position to make plays.

 

 

 

 

 

[Mark Vader]

2 hours ago, Trekking said:

All out ugly. They obviously didn’t come prepared 

Who? The Packers?

[Scott7975]

5 minutes ago, Billz4ever said:

You just said, it didn't matter if it was run or pass, so whether it's the run tonight or playing the wrong D against the pass against KC and Mahomes in 13 seconds, you can bet your butt this will be thrown in your face.

 

Im so scared.  Please dont throw stuff in my face.  

[Old Coot]

Josh screwed the pooch in the second half.  If you saw his end of game interview he knows it.  That's refreshing so maybe he'll learn from it.

 

He shotputted some of his throws rather than lazering the ball in there.