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EDIT: Total cost to taxpayers? Bills select sports firm to represent ownership in building new open air stadium in OP, targeted for 2025


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Just now, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

That would be Pork of the Piggiest kind if so.  Infrastructure is supposed to be stuff like highways, bridges, storm sewers, etc.

The 2021 definition of "infrastructure" is wildly different than it was only a few years ago.  We're living in a different world brother.  I can guarantee there are legislators in Congress and in Albany who can make the argument for getting some of that money directed at a new stadium.

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1 hour ago, Mango said:


The Pegulas are not great owners. They extended Whaley, fired Whaley the next year, hired Rex, literally every move with the Sabres. 
 

I view McBeane as a broken clock being right twice a day. 

Seems you know someone personally connected to Terry or past business.  Or maybe I'm misinterpreting your posts.

 

Regarding Sean and Brandon, weird comment by you.  Not sure many coaches and GMs are thought more highly of right now, they are both top 5-10.  Turning a franchise around isn't an easy task and on top of that, the character and leadership they bring is off the charts

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Just now, CuseBill said:

The 2021 definition of "infrastructure" is wildly different than it was only a few years ago.  We're living in a different world brother.  I can guarantee there are legislators in Congress and in Albany who can make the argument for getting some of that money directed at a new stadium.


Somebody get Gillibrand on the line… Bills Stadium is infrastructure. 

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52 minutes ago, dollars 2 donuts said:

Is this the wrong time to bring up the fact that Austin is a great town?

 

The music and the food alone will knock your socks off.


No, thanks. The people in Austin are arrogant, and everything is just an event or party there.  They’d be showing up to games just to have tailgate brunches, drinking mimosas and eating breakfast tacos, and not really caring whether the team wins or loses. 
 

they just got a MLS team, and they already think that makes them extra cooler as a city. 

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1 minute ago, SCBills said:


Somebody get Gillibrand on the line… Bills Stadium is infrastructure. 

We don't need Kirsten on the line....Chuck is the Senate majority leader and he would never let the Bills leave NY so long as he has anything to say about it.

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This is inevitable negotiation noise.  Start high and work back from there.  The taxpayers will be putting money into the new building, but nowhere near carrying the entire cost.  
 

This tactic is used by most owners, across sports,  when it’s new stadium time.  Pegula’s are business people first.  Period.  Don’t cry chicken littles the Bills aren’t going anywhere.  Enjoy the season.

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1 minute ago, Miyagi-Do Karate said:


No, thanks. The people in Austin are arrogant, and everything is just an event or party there.  They’d be showing up to games just to have tailgate brunches, drinking mimosas and eating breakfast tacos, and not really caring whether the team wins or loses. 
 

they just got a MLS team, and they already think that makes them extra cooler as a city. 


MLS suits Austin.  The real football fans that live there are already fans of other teams from where they moved or die hard UT fans.  
 

Their fan base would be nonexistent after the initial excitement.  
 

Can’t wait for the 70% full stadium with a paid hype section and opposing teams fans.  

It’s not happening, but Austin would be such a terrible NFL city…. And everyone I know that likes it, likes it from when they visited five years ago… a lot has changed since then. 

3 minutes ago, CuseBill said:

We don't need Kirsten on the line....Chuck is the Senate majority leader and he would never let the Bills leave NY so long as he has anything to say about it.


I know.. I’m just joking from when she called everything under sun “infrastructure”. 

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1 minute ago, purple haze said:

This is inevitable negotiation noise.  Start high and work back from there.  The taxpayers will be putting money into the new building, but nowhere near carrying the entire cost.  
 

This tactic is used by most owners, across sports,  when it’s new stadium time.  Pegula’s are business people first.  Period.  Don’t cry chicken littles the Bills aren’t going anywhere.  Enjoy the season.

Agreed about it being a negotiation tactic, but it’s not a good look for the Pegulas.  Bills mafia/fan base has reached legendary status nationwide.  Don’t mess with a fan base this loyal.  Stop listening to Jerry Jones. 

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Let me start with my opinion that a 100% taxpayer-paid stadium is not reasonable.

 

Looking at this more deeply there are at least 4 basic ways to have public subsidies:

- Direct public funding (state/county pays, gets nothing in return, taxpayers eat the cost).

- Public financing (state/county floats bonds which are secured by future stadium revenue / team payments)

- Indirect investments (state/county provide free land, roads, or other services)

- Tax rebates (business gets future tax reductions). For purposes of this discussion I think we should ignore this option or treat it the same as the direct funding.

 

The team, meanwhile, has 3 major sources of money:

- Sales to fans (tickets, merchandise, suites, and possibly PSLs)

- Television / shared revenue

- Owner's personal wealth

 

The public financing option should not be ignored in this mix. If the stadium will cost $1.1B, a split between direct public subsidy, public financing, and team money (upfront) is likely to be involved.

 

I am not optimistic about a near term resolution. Asking the team to stay and take $0 in public money of any kind is worse that the status quo (state/county already kick in millons/yr under current agreement). It may seem attractive on principle, but it is barely more realistic than a 100% public paid option.

 

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9 minutes ago, Miyagi-Do Karate said:


No, thanks. The people in Austin are arrogant, and everything is just an event or party there.  They’d be showing up to games just to have tailgate brunches, drinking mimosas and eating breakfast tacos, and not really caring whether the team wins or loses. 
 

they just got a MLS team, and they already think that makes them extra cooler as a city. 


 

You had me at mimosas and eating breakfast tacos.

 

If only we had those things here.

 

😩

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14 minutes ago, CuseBill said:

The 2021 definition of "infrastructure" is wildly different than it was only a few years ago.  We're living in a different world brother.  I can guarantee there are legislators in Congress and in Albany who can make the argument for getting some of that money directed at a new stadium.

Even within the old definition I could get a few hundred million for roads, sewers, street lights, and all of the external needs of the stadium. The stadium itself could then come from state money and Pegs. As you said the new definition might include the stadium itself.

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Just win baby.   They win no politican is going to say publicly they dont want them in Buffalo.  Im curious how much of the 1.5 is for the Sabers?  500 mil?  I could see the state 1 bil for the Bills kick rock on the Sabers, pay that your self.  Reguardless, Buffalo is winning and Allen is playing to good for the Politicans to say anything negative.

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20 minutes ago, MasterStrategist said:

Seems you know someone personally connected to Terry or past business.  Or maybe I'm misinterpreting your posts.

 

Regarding Sean and Brandon, weird comment by you.  Not sure many coaches and GMs are thought more highly of right now, they are both top 5-10.  Turning a franchise around isn't an easy task and on top of that, the character and leadership they bring is off the charts


He means people who get things wrong a lot are bound to get things right every once and a while 

 

Fantastic hires of our Head Coach and GM should not be an indicator of ability as that poster sees it as a fluke or luck.

 

I am not sure if I agree, I don’t really follow Sabers hockey ;) 

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On 6/18/2021 at 1:51 PM, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Is this Good News, or No?

I think its terrible news. Jones has been a vocal opponent of small market teams. Having him involved will mean relocation could enter the picture. 

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35 minutes ago, MasterStrategist said:

Seems you know someone personally connected to Terry or past business.  Or maybe I'm misinterpreting your posts.

 

Regarding Sean and Brandon, weird comment by you.  Not sure many coaches and GMs are thought more highly of right now, they are both top 5-10.  Turning a franchise around isn't an easy task and on top of that, the character and leadership they bring is off the charts


 


I wasn’t pooping on McBeane. I was saying the hire by Pegula is like a clock being right twice a day. Not that those two in particular are bad at their jobs. 

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I just can't see how the Pegulas do this. This has to be a leverage move which would make sense for business. I mean you made a big deal about the Bills staying in Buffalo when you bought the team and even teared up about it in your press conference.

 

I think this is just a way to make the state of NY sweat

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33 minutes ago, CuseBill said:

We don't need Kirsten on the line....Chuck is the Senate majority leader and he would never let the Bills leave NY so long as he has anything to say about it.

Winner winner chicken dinner.  About that 1031 point from earlier in the thread ….

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I’m a Browns fan who just moved to the Buffalo area. It’s probably a long shot that the team will move, but Cleveland is definitely a cautionary tale. Different situations for many reasons, but having a history and a passionate fanbase isn’t enough. I imagine this is Jones advising them to push their only leverage, but if these people think they can make more money in Austin they’ll do it. 
 

I hope it’s BS. Buffalo was the only town that stood up for Cleveland when the Browns moved, and I’ll always have a soft spot for Bills fans because of it. Here’s to many years of good football for both of our teams. Lord knows we’ve all waited long enough. 

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54 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

That would be Pork of the Piggiest kind if so.  Infrastructure is supposed to be stuff like highways, bridges, storm sewers, etc.

Throw in some roadway upgrades/expansion within several miles of OP, maybe a new flyover ramp or 2, to go along with some new pedestrian friendly covered walkways, and voila! Killed 2 birds with 1 stone—there’s some “shovel-ready infrastructure” upgrades cover while the bacon gets funneled into the stadium foundation pour? :w00t:

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"According to The Buffalo News, sources tell them the team has not threatened to leave Buffalo, but that other cities that want an NFL franchise would be willing to pay for it."

 

These other clickbait places can spin stuff however they want to benefit them and their brands

Edited by Big Turk
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Now that the LA and Las Vegas boogyman are gone the NFL doesn’t really have a city to threaten teams with.

 

ohhhh we could move the Bills to…Austin Texas lol. You better pay or we will move your team to Portland Oregan! 
 

St Louis, Oakland, San Diego have already rejected public funds for a stadium. The Pegulas will get taxpayer funding here for their stadium, it won’t be 100%. These leaks of potential moves are becoming funnier and funnier tho. Terry and Kim are not very good at a lot of things. Can’t wait for our new stadium!

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41 minutes ago, Bad Things said:

Because it's disingenuous, mean-spirited and pisses-off your fan base?

Would agree if it was Terry or Kim quoted saying it.. That would carry a different connotation and message to the entire team and fans. 

 

Not going to judge any "leaks", without more context and information.  

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 Both Los Angeles teams will end up paying $645 million each for their moves, just put that for a stadium.

 

Plus Sabres would have to be sold if Bills left due to fan anger. Both will stay when all is done.

 

 

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1 hour ago, BuffaloRebound said:

Agreed about it being a negotiation tactic, but it’s not a good look for the Pegulas.  Bills mafia/fan base has reached legendary status nationwide.  Don’t mess with a fan base this loyal.  Stop listening to Jerry Jones. 

I hear you.  It doesn’t feel good, but it’s     ultimately nothing.  What it does is confirm that they are business people above all else.  But folks should have already known that.

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1 hour ago, stuvian said:

I think its terrible news. Jones has been a vocal opponent of small market teams. Having him involved will mean relocation could enter the picture. 

 

I said something similar way back in June, on page 15....

 

 

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