JGMcD2 Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 If I am reading this tweet from Albert Breer correctly, these are the values for the 5th year options on Josh Allen and Tremaine Edmunds for 2022. Both players will receive the value under “Transition Players” Meaning the 5th year option on Josh will be $23,016,000 and the 5th year option on Tremaine will be $12,716,000. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregthekeg Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 Might as well sign Josh to a long term deal then 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRebound Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 Josh no brainer. Even if I liked Edmunds more, no way I’m committing that to him now. The franchise # isn’t much different and I can delay that decision another year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo_Stampede Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Gregthekeg said: Might as well sign Josh to a long term deal then Doesn't matter when they sign him. I still say wait a season. Why in the world would the Bills or Browns sign Allen and Mayfield to top 3 QB contracts right now. Especially when players like Wentz and Goff were just traded. We're talking a lot of money. More money than Tom Brady ever received. There is no rush. Edited March 10, 2021 by Buffalo_Stampede Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jobot Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 ...what a joke of a process that was created! You're telling me that monetary and CAP decisions have an aspect that hinge on getting voted into the pro bowl by the press and fans?? 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 3 minutes ago, Jobot said: ...what a joke of a process that was created! You're telling me that monetary and CAP decisions have an aspect that hinge on getting voted into the pro bowl by the press and fans?? The pro bowl is voted on by coaches, players, and fans. Each represent 1/3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CincyBillsFan Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 10 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said: Doesn't matter when they sign him. I still say wait a season. Why in the world would the Bills or Browns sign Allen and Mayfield to top 3 QB contracts right now. Especially when players like Wentz and Goff were just traded. We're talking a lot of money. More money than Tom Brady ever received. There is no rush. IMO the reason to sign Allen now is to avoid trouble in the future and get the best possible deal. Since we're all ignorant of what Allen thinks about the process I'm just spitballing here but if Jackson & Mayfield get extended by their teams and Allen doesn't do the Bills create the seeds of discontent and make future negotiations more difficult? I get the Wentz/Goff concerns but honestly Bean has to ignore them. Signing Allen to the best possible long term deal for him and the team will need an imaginative & aggressive approach by Bean. My sense is that once free agency wraps up this will get managements full attention. I don't get the wait until later position on Allen. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JGMcD2 Posted March 10, 2021 Author Share Posted March 10, 2021 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Jobot said: ...what a joke of a process that was created! You're telling me that monetary and CAP decisions have an aspect that hinge on getting voted into the pro bowl by the press and fans?? No... Pro Bowl is coaches, players and fans... Teams have contract incentives (which are monetary and cap related) for MVP and All-Pro and such... which is voted on by the press. Incentives for Pro-Bowl too... any better way to do it? Edited March 10, 2021 by JGMcD2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CorkScrewHill Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 18 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said: Doesn't matter when they sign him. I still say wait a season. Why in the world would the Bills or Browns sign Allen and Mayfield to top 3 QB contracts right now. Especially when players like Wentz and Goff were just traded. We're talking a lot of money. More money than Tom Brady ever received. There is no rush. There is a reason Jerry signed Dak to that contract .. he knows the TV deals will be massive and what he is paying Dak (a lesser talent than Josh) will not seem outlandish in 2 years. If Josh becomes a bust we are hitting reset anyway so one massive cap hit to get rid of him won't matter. However, since he is such a competitor I do hope that he understands a big reason (besides the fact that he is the goat) that Tom went to and won so many Super Bowls is he left cap room for other players by not being the top paid guy. 2 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jobot Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 2 minutes ago, JGMcD2 said: No... Pro Bowl is coaches, players and fans... Teams have contract incentives (which are monetary and cap related) for MVP and All-Pro and such... which is voted on by the press. Incentives for Pro-Bowl too... any better way to do it? That's better.. but players and fans votes should be ignored in the equation. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo_Stampede Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 (edited) 13 minutes ago, CorkScrewHill said: There is a reason Jerry signed Dak to that contract .. he knows the TV deals will be massive and what he is paying Dak (a lesser talent than Josh) will not seem outlandish in 2 years. If Josh becomes a bust we are hitting reset anyway so one massive cap hit to get rid of him won't matter. However, since he is such a competitor I do hope that he understands a big reason (besides the fact that he is the goat) that Tom went to and won so many Super Bowls is he left cap room for other players by not being the top paid guy. Dak was an unrestricted free agent. A franchise tag would've cost like 17m more towards the cap this year. Jerry knew tv contracts were coming last year. Josh is not getting more than Mahomes unless he wins a Super Bowl. In that case he deserves it. QB's are signing deals based on the cap going up already. The Bills lose absolutely nothing by waiting. Josh is under contract for 2 years. If we're talking about signing him as the 10th best QB we should hurry up and get it done. Right now he's projected to be the 2nd highest paid QB in the NFL. There is no rush to get that deal done. Mahomes actually made sense to get done because the Chiefs knew he was #1. If someone signed to a crazy contract before Mahomes then the Chiefs would have to beat it. Josh's market is set. Edited March 10, 2021 by Buffalo_Stampede Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 1 hour ago, JGMcD2 said: If I am reading this tweet from Albert Breer correctly, these are the values for the 5th year options on Josh Allen and Tremaine Edmunds for 2022. Both players will receive the value under “Transition Players” Meaning the 5th year option on Josh will be $23,016,000 and the 5th year option on Tremaine will be $12,716,000. Probably dumb question: Does that full value count against this year's cap as soon as exercised since it's fully guaranteed, or does it go against next year's cap? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo_Stampede Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Probably dumb question: Does that full value count against this year's cap as soon as exercised since it's fully guaranteed, or does it go against next year's cap? Next year. But if they agree to a contract it can change that number. Edit - my mistake. 5th year option is non-negotiable. So if picked up that's his cap hit year 5. Edited March 10, 2021 by Buffalo_Stampede 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warrior9 Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 6 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said: Dak was an unrestricted free agent. A franchise tag would've cost like 17m more towards the cap this year. Jerry knew tv contracts were coming last year. Josh is not getting more than Mahomes unless he wins a Super Bowl. In that case he deserves it. QB's are signing deals based on the cap going up already. The Bills lose absolutely nothing by waiting. Josh is under contract for 2 years. They lose a lot more money if Josh goes out and wins an MVP/ SB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 27 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said: IMO the reason to sign Allen now is to avoid trouble in the future and get the best possible deal. Since we're all ignorant of what Allen thinks about the process I'm just spitballing here but if Jackson & Mayfield get extended by their teams and Allen doesn't do the Bills create the seeds of discontent and make future negotiations more difficult? I get the Wentz/Goff concerns but honestly Bean has to ignore them. Signing Allen to the best possible long term deal for him and the team will need an imaginative & aggressive approach by Bean. My sense is that once free agency wraps up this will get managements full attention. I don't get the wait until later position on Allen. In his appearance on Chris Collinsworth's podcast, Collinsworth essentially tried to set Beane up and bait him (in my opinion). He talked about how beloved and popular Josh Allen has become in Buffalo with all the money donated to Oshei Children's hospital and then asked if that presented a problem to Beane in considering how to handle his contract since we've seen two QBs who had success and were re-signed early in Wentz and Goff whose teams just moved on. Beane just sidestepped the whole thing. Said "I do believe in Josh, but we're gonna focus on free agency and then the draft and then we'll look at what we can do". 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo_Stampede Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 (edited) 5 minutes ago, warrior9 said: They lose a lot more money if Josh goes out and wins an MVP/ SB. Trust me, that's called a good problem. If Allen wins a Super Bowl next year then who would argue who the best QB in football is? He'll deserve that contract. Also I don't think he would even get that much more than Mahomes if it happened. Edited March 10, 2021 by Buffalo_Stampede Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warrior9 Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 10 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said: Trust me, that's called a good problem. If Allen wins a Super Bowl next year then who would argue who the best QB in football is? He'll deserve that contract. Also I don't think he would even get that much more than Mahomes if it happened. I don't think I have to "trust you" to know it's a good problem to have a QB that won a SB/MVP. I think you're under estimating how much that would blow his price up. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 Had Edmunds been kept at OLB that $15M option # might look like a bargain and be incentive for Edmunds to sign a long term extension as the teams primary pass rusher. If he weren't then he would be viewed as nothing less than a likely bust by this point. You gotta' be an absolute top of the league BEAST to be worth that kind of money at MLB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo_Stampede Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 Just now, warrior9 said: I don't think I have to "trust you" to know it's a good problem to have a QB that won a SB/MVP. I think you're under estimating how much that would blow his price up. Tell me how much? Right now we're talking 2-3 million per year difference between Mahomes and Allen. Mahomes has an MVP and a Super Bowl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warrior9 Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said: Tell me how much? Right now we're talking 2-3 million per year difference between Mahomes and Allen. Mahomes has an MVP and a Super Bowl. Uhhh, i'm not a GM and I don't have specifics. Tell me why Dak just got more money than Aaron Rodgers, Watson, Wilson, etc? You can't. It's a market. As the salary cap goes up, so do QB numbers. "Tell me how much" like I know an exact number hahaha How about this: You tell me how much Josh's contract is going to be. Insane and asinine to assume you can. Edited March 10, 2021 by warrior9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo_Stampede Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 Just now, warrior9 said: Uhhh, i'm not a GM and I don't have specifics. Tell me why Dak just got more money than Aaron Rodgers, Watson, Wilson, etc? You can't. It's a market. As the salary cap goes up, so do QB numbers. "Tell me how much" hahaha Josh is grouped with other QB's, Mahomes, Watson, Prescott, Mayfield, Jackson... There's a market for those QB's. Mahomes set the market. It's similar to Jalen Ramsey last year for CB's. Someone in the age group will have to top Mahomes. It could be Allen. But we likely won't see anyone reset the QB market until maybe Joe Burrow or someone younger is up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warrior9 Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 1 minute ago, Buffalo_Stampede said: Josh is grouped with other QB's, Mahomes, Watson, Prescott, Mayfield, Jackson... There's a market for those QB's. Mahomes set the market. It's similar to Jalen Ramsey last year for CB's. Someone in the age group will have to top Mahomes. It could be Allen. But we likely won't see anyone reset the QB market until maybe Joe Burrow or someone younger is up. Glad you're in the know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo_Stampede Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 5 minutes ago, warrior9 said: Glad you're in the know. Use your own logic then. Mahomes Prescott Watson Mayfield Jackson Allen How would you rank these QB's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 2 hours ago, JGMcD2 said: If I am reading this tweet from Albert Breer correctly, these are the values for the 5th year options on Josh Allen and Tremaine Edmunds for 2022. Both players will receive the value under “Transition Players” Meaning the 5th year option on Josh will be $23,016,000 and the 5th year option on Tremaine will be $12,716,000. FWIW Buffalo Fanatics is saying the 5th year option on Tre will be $14.79 🤷♂️ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo_Stampede Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 10 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: FWIW Buffalo Fanatics is saying the 5th year option on Tre will be $14.79 🤷♂️ That should be it. He's made 2 pro bowls. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brand J Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 I wouldn’t pick up the option on Edmunds. He’s a $14M/yr type of talent, but it doesn’t show consistently enough. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
appoo Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 23 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: FWIW Buffalo Fanatics is saying the 5th year option on Tre will be $14.79 🤷♂️ Which is a fair number for him. Should be an easy decision to pick up or extend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victory Formation Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 Might as well just sign Allen now. Sure, there is some risk involved, but relatively low risk at that. Makes sense to pickup his 5th year option and extend him to 5 years on top of that. 5yrs $200M $140M gtd... Something like that. May cost us a lot more if we wait till later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JGMcD2 Posted March 10, 2021 Author Share Posted March 10, 2021 59 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: FWIW Buffalo Fanatics is saying the 5th year option on Tre will be $14.79 🤷♂️ I saw that but I’m 99.9% sure that is wrong because they’re misinterpreting the buckets. Edmunds didn’t make the 2019 Pro Bowl on the original ballot. He was a replacement for Dont’a Hightower. You have to be an initial selection for that to apply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 27 minutes ago, JGMcD2 said: I saw that but I’m 99.9% sure that is wrong because they’re misinterpreting the buckets. Edmunds didn’t make the 2019 Pro Bowl on the original ballot. He was a replacement for Dont’a Hightower. You have to be an initial selection for that to apply. Got it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan89 Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 3 hours ago, BuffaloRebound said: Josh no brainer. Even if I liked Edmunds more, no way I’m committing that to him now. The franchise # isn’t much different and I can delay that decision another year. Pretty much my train of thought. Assuming you get Josh signed to an extension you can just franchise Edumonds. Might as well work on an extension for Edumonds rather than pick up his option if you really like him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jokeman Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 (edited) 3 hours ago, Jobot said: ...what a joke of a process that was created! You're telling me that monetary and CAP decisions have an aspect that hinge on getting voted into the pro bowl by the press and fans?? That's never been the case that I know of unless a recent CBA changed it, I thought it was based on draft position more specifically if selected in the top 10 or not. As this is the rule I knew: The option for top-ten picks is set at an amount equal to the salary of the Transition Tender (set in Article 10, Section 4 of the CBA) for the player’s fourth contract year. This salary is calculated, to put it simply, by finding the average of the top ten highest Prior Year Salaries for players at the same position. Positions are defined by where a player spent the most plays during the previous season (Sec. 7, (a), 31). For players selected between 11th and 32nd in the draft, the same calculation is used to compute their salaries. The difference lies in what is averaged; rather than the top ten, the 3rd-25th highest Prior Year Salaries for the player’s position will be used. Courtesy of https://frontofficenfl.com/2017/03/27/nfl-rookie-contracts-explained-fifth-year-option/ Edited March 10, 2021 by The Jokeman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JGMcD2 Posted March 10, 2021 Author Share Posted March 10, 2021 15 minutes ago, The Jokeman said: That's never been the case that I know of unless a recent CBA changed it, I thought it was based on draft position more specifically if selected in the top 10 or not. As this is the rule I knew: Tweet in the OP says it’s a byproduct of the new CBA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jokeman Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 5 minutes ago, JGMcD2 said: Tweet in the OP says it’s a byproduct of the new CBA. Well that answers that then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsCuse Posted March 10, 2021 Share Posted March 10, 2021 2 hours ago, JayBaller10 said: I wouldn’t pick up the option on Edmunds. He’s a $14M/yr type of talent, but it doesn’t show consistently enough. Agree, plus I believe this the 1st year it is guaranteed per the new CBA unlike past years where it wasn't. I would pass on it and if he has a monster year franchise him if a deal can't get done 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4merper4mer Posted March 11, 2021 Share Posted March 11, 2021 10 hours ago, warrior9 said: They lose a lot more money if Josh goes out and wins an MVP/ SB. Do you think they will let him know? I don’t think he’d hurt the team like that just to win a Super Bowl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarleyNY Posted March 11, 2021 Share Posted March 11, 2021 19 hours ago, Buffalo_Stampede said: Next year. But if they agree to a contract it can change that number. Edit - my mistake. 5th year option is non-negotiable. So if picked up that's his cap hit year 5. One additional point: the team and player can still add an extension to the contract, including guaranteed money paid after the 5th year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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