Canceling student loans

[shoshin]

11 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

I’m powerless brother, relatively speaking.  I’m sensible enough to recognize and support the need for a well-defined and compassionate safety net, proud enough to believe that my investment in my children was important to their development, and apparently foolish enough to not play the hand the right way given the buyout soon to happen.  
 

For all the talk about a pro-Biden vote was really an ‘anti-Trump’ rallying crying, we know with certainty that millions of Biden voters stand to benefit from the Sopranos-esque protection racket about to play out.  And, likely, the Harris plan to follow when Biden taps out in 12-24 months.  In fact, it’s highly probable that was the most important factor in a Biden presidency.  Everyone has a price. 
 

The best I can do is when called by one of the SUNY schools for a parental handout in support of the next crop of students to tell them to call the White House after Jan 20. 

 

Your life is good. 

 

Call out bad behavior. You've done it to me and I am thankful for it. 

[Backintheday544]

24 minutes ago, wAcKy ZeBrA said:

Correct me if I am wrong but if you work for the feds for 10 years and make 10 years of payments, you can apply to have your federal loans forgiven.

 

For those who are anti-forgiveness, do you want to cancel this policy?

All Federal loans have a 10 year public loan forgiveness option where if you work in the government or a non for profit your loan is forgiven after making 10 years worth of payments or 10 years actually pass, whichever is later. (Trump wanted to end this)

 

For people who do not go to one of these jobs, forgiveness is either 20 or 25 years depending on when the loan was signed.

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

5 minutes ago, shoshin said:

 

Your life is good. 

 

Call out bad behavior. You've done it to me and I am thankful for it. 

As have you, and the feeling is mutual. 
 

19 minutes ago, Backintheday544 said:

All Federal loans have a 10 year public loan forgiveness option where if you work in the government or a non for profit your loan is forgiven after making 10 years worth of payments or 10 years actually pass, whichever is later. (Trump wanted to end this)

 

For people who do not go to one of these jobs, forgiveness is either 20 or 25 years depending on when the loan was signed.

And honestly, this shows the type of insider bull#### that should be stopped.  A federal employee, generally speaking, makes good money, with excellent security and is entitled to a benefit rich employer plan.  
 

Give a foreign operative a nice benefit like this?  I’m all for it.  Give it to Jim Smith in the the govt accounting office in West Topeka?  Shouldn’t happen.  

[Backintheday544]

1 hour ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

As have you, and the feeling is mutual. 
 

And honestly, this shows the type of insider bull#### that should be stopped.  A federal employee, generally speaking, makes good money, with excellent security and is entitled to a benefit rich employer plan.  
 

Give a foreign operative a nice benefit like this?  I’m all for it.  Give it to Jim Smith in the the govt accounting office in West Topeka?  Shouldn’t happen.  

Not really. I have a ton friends at the IRS who can make 3 times more if they leave. At least from the accountant/lawyer perspective, it’s a lot less in government.

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

5 minutes ago, Backintheday544 said:

Not really. I have a ton friends at the IRS who can make 3 times more if they leave. At least from the accountant/lawyer perspective, it’s a lot less in government.

Omg I wasn’t talking about the IRS.  That’s widely acknowledged as the Peace Corp of govt work. 
 

Just kidding, I have friends at NYS tax department.  I don’t understand insider programs like this, but whatever.  About 10 years ago, I was looking to move to a new home. I’d have owned the house one side of the county line, and property on the other side in the county we were moving from.  I wanted to keep my children in the school district we were in, and would have been paying taxes in after the purchase. 
 

I was advised that was perfectly doable if I paid $11,000 per child per year.  I knew a few teachers who lived out of district but were allowed to have their children attend school in the district freeing charge.  One of the perks of being an employee, but paying tax in the district didn’t qualify for the same Bennie.  
 

 

 

[billsfan_34]

On 12/11/2020 at 10:22 AM, wAcKy ZeBrA said:

 

What moral basis? I'm not sure. I just know at the age of 32 I am still in debt up to my eyeballs and went to a SUNY School. Most people I know in their 30s are renting because they can't afford a mortgage because they are paying $500 - $100 a month in loans. I think the economic benefits of forgiveness would far outweigh the negatives. 

 

As to a mortgage, when your mortgage is paid off, the value of your home is (hopefully!) still worth at least the principal you paid and likely much more. It's an extremely valuable asset. So too, of course, is an education, but it is not a tangible good.

 

 

How many years were you in school? SUNY schools are not all that expensive. Are you not getting a return on your investment? 

[SoCal Deek]

On 12/11/2020 at 7:22 AM, wAcKy ZeBrA said:

 

What moral basis? I'm not sure. I just know at the age of 32 I am still in debt up to my eyeballs and went to a SUNY School. Most people I know in their 30s are renting because they can't afford a mortgage because they are paying $500 - $100 a month in loans. I think the economic benefits of forgiveness would far outweigh the negatives. 

 

As to a mortgage, when your mortgage is paid off, the value of your home is (hopefully!) still worth at least the principal you paid and likely much more. It's an extremely valuable asset. So too, of course, is an education, but it is not a tangible good.

 

 

Wham! So there it is. A bit of personal honesty from the Zebra. Thanks for sharing, honestly. So now I know a bit more of where you’re coming from. At some point did you not think to do a return on investment study? There are plenty of books out there to help you learn how to get out of debt. It’s not going to happen all in one week but trust me you’ll get there Zebra. Your major earning years are ahead of you. Give it time, control your spending, pay off EVERYTHING as early as possible. I promise it’ll all look a whole lot different when you’re my age. 

[Demongyz]

11 minutes ago, B-Man said:

 

 

Biden to Announce That Taxpayers Will Foot the Bill for a Chunk of Student Loans

By Brandon Morse.

 

 

Congratulations taxpayer, you’re now the owner of student loan debt you never agreed to acquire and will now be responsible for paying it off.

 

According to The Hill, President Joe Biden is to announce a plan to cancel a solid chunk of the nation’s student loan debt on Wednesday:

 

Sources said President Biden’s intended measure will include at least $10,000 in loan forgiveness for borrowers who make less than $125,000 annually, as well as another payment freeze for roughly four months.

 

The $10,000 figure would be the largest forgiveness of federal student loans per individual to date.

 

https://redstate.com/brandon_morse/2022/08/23/biden-to-announce-that-taxpayers-will-foot-the-bill-for-a-chunk-of-student-loans-n616533

 

https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/3612324-white-house-to-announce-10k-student-loan-cancellation-payment-pause-extension-wednesday/

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

‘Takes money from a plumber to pay the debt of a lawyer’:

BRUTAL thread takes Biden’s plan to cancel student loan debt APART

 

Oh, look, another Biden policy that will hurt the middle and lower classes.

 

Yay Democrats.

 

For years, they’ve claimed to be the party of the poor, those in need, and yet every policy they’re shoving through does nothing to help the poor and everything to help their wealthy pals in green energy, and oddly enough, Ukraine.

 

 

 

https://twitchy.com/samj-3930/2022/08/23/takes-money-from-a-plumber-to-pay-the-debt-of-a-lawyer-brutal-thread-takes-bidens-plan-to-cancel-student-loan-debt-apart/

 

 

.

To all you poor bastards that just went into the job market, eat the student loan debt of the morons who got degrees and can't make any money.

 

Take it you losers!!!

 

That's how I read that.  How about all you?

 

 

[dpberr]

His "plan" is simply more evidence that Washington has zero interest in solving real issues affecting the low and middle class American.

 

$10k?  Who cares.  Let students discharge the entire student debt in bankruptcy instead.  Of course, unlike this one time loss, allowing people to discharge the debt via bankruptcy would severely impact .gov's bottom line and constrain .edu's love of jacking up tuition rates annually.  

 

Bankruptcy sucks, but you eventually get to live another day in a few years, free of it.  Student debt is more like decades.  

 

 

[PetermansRedemption]

As many people have said, what does this do? It does absolutely nothing to stop the problem, which is the runaway cost of tuition at any school. Even state schools are getting out of hand. UB is around 10k per year now and that’s sure to rise rapidly. 10k per year means the potential of 40k in debt after your undergrad. And that’s at a state school. Reduce the amount of loans available to all but the poorest students and see how quickly that school price comes down. Tie the loans into job marketability where the school foots the bill if they misrepresent job prospects. Do something, but not this. At least not debt cancellation alone. If it was accompanied by any sort of plan to fix the actual issue then fine. But this is just straight pandering to voters by buying them off, which was illegal the last time I checked. 
 

A far better option that I’ve been saying for years is just set all student loans at 0%. That way the students take what they need, pay back what they take, and don’t have to pay exorbitant amounts of interest. 

Edited August 23, 2022 by PetermansRedemption

[The Frankish Reich]

On 12/26/2020 at 4:53 PM, SoCal Deek said:

Wham! So there it is. A bit of personal honesty from the Zebra. Thanks for sharing, honestly. So now I know a bit more of where you’re coming from. At some point did you not think to do a return on investment study? There are plenty of books out there to help you learn how to get out of debt. It’s not going to happen all in one week but trust me you’ll get there Zebra. Your major earning years are ahead of you. Give it time, control your spending, pay off EVERYTHING as early as possible. I promise it’ll all look a whole lot different when you’re my age. 

Good advice. 
There was a time I felt the same way. In my early 30s, some college loan debt, and a lot of grad school loan debt. Renting, no way to get together the down payment to buy, etc. 

It took time, but it all worked out. Consolidated the loans, then held onto them even when I had the money saved to pay them off because they were (at the time) at an interest rate lower than prevailing rates. It takes time, and yes, sometimes it took sticking with a job when I really would’ve rather moved on to something else. 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

College tuition is out of control… I thought the pandemic, e learning etc would start leveling it quickly once people realized the quality of most education was relatively commensurate.  
 

There is the reality that part of what you pay up for in the top tier schools is access to the elites… but that’s changing a little bit too. 
 

In the mean time helicopter money should solve it!!! 😂 

[All_Pro_Bills]

On 12/14/2020 at 12:36 PM, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

As have you, and the feeling is mutual. 
 

And honestly, this shows the type of insider bull#### that should be stopped.  A federal employee, generally speaking, makes good money, with excellent security and is entitled to a benefit rich employer plan.  
 

Give a foreign operative a nice benefit like this?  I’m all for it.  Give it to Jim Smith in the the govt accounting office in West Topeka?  Shouldn’t happen.  

The public sector is the place to be now.  My brother spent 30 years in Washington working for DEA, Department of State, DOJ, and DHS, got an early retirement offer with a 6-digit pension and fully paid health care benefits.  I on the other hand, working in the private sector will work until 65+, live off my 401K and IRA accounts, and utilize Medicare, probably Medicare Advantage.  

[Precision]

University of NH is over $30K/year for in-state tuition plus room and board.  I have one just graduated and another is a junior.  Both kids had some merit aid, but we paid for nearly all of it, will be nearly $200K when all said and done.   

 

Drove lesser cars and took lesser vacations since they were born and saved/invested whatever money we could.  When they were babies in daycare, we had too many months where our expenses exceeded our income.  Didn't matter we kept saving.  Didn't have cable and the house we were in we purchased from the bank.  I picked up overtime as much as possible and my wife worked weekends in addition to her regular job. 

 

The current generation is too lazy and soft to save like that.  They couldn't survive without their nice car, smartphone, laptop, streaming services and big screen TV.   

 

The government and society is doing these young people a disservice by bailing them out.  They will never grow or learn the meaning of money or hard work unless they have to struggle.  

 

I have met very successful people, many of them have faced difficulties in their past.  From what I've seen, I might say that the greater the struggle, the greater the success of these individuals. 

[SoCal Deek]

1 hour ago, The Frankish Reich said:

Good advice. 
There was a time I felt the same way. In my early 30s, some college loan debt, and a lot of grad school loan debt. Renting, no way to get together the down payment to buy, etc. 

It took time, but it all worked out. Consolidated the loans, then held onto them even when I had the money saved to pay them off because they were (at the time) at an interest rate lower than prevailing rates. It takes time, and yes, sometimes it took sticking with a job when I really would’ve rather moved on to something else. 

Glad to hear it’s all worked for you…and was honestly astonished to see a quote from me dating back over a year and half ago. I got out of debt early on and have never regretted it. Oh sure, could I have made a percentage point on the difference here or there? Probably. But I’ve enjoyed every day of my debt free lifestyle and wouldn’t trade it for the world. It took real discipline early on, and now that I’m recently retired I’m not only glad I made the choices I did but super thankful that my wife was raised with the same spending/saving habits.

Cheers!

[716er]

53 minutes ago, Precision said:

The government and society is doing these young people a disservice by bailing them out.  They will never grow or learn the meaning of money or hard work unless they have to struggle.  

 

Nobody is getting bailed out.

 

Someone $150,000 in debt is now $140,000 in debt. The struggle will continue.

 

[B-Man]

10 minutes ago, 716er said:

 

Nobody is getting bailed out.

 

Someone $150,000 in debt is now $140,000 in debt. The struggle will continue.

 

 

 

People who did not take out the loans will be on the hook for billions,

 

their struggle will increase.

[Precision]

Just now, 716er said:

 

Nobody is getting bailed out.

 

Someone $150,000 in debt is now $140,000 in debt. The struggle will continue.

 

Under what circumstances does someone have $150K in college loans?  Bachelor and Associate degrees are available for much less than that.  If you're taking out loans for that much perhaps you should have chosen a less expensive institution, different curriculum or gone into the trades.  That much debt for college loans is a poor choice completely on the borrower.

[Big Blitz]

I would also like my mortgage paid, credits for groceries and gas, and an Obama phone...

 

 

 

As inflation increases prices, employees want their salaries to increase too

 

https://www.zdnet.com/article/as-inflation-increases-prices-employees-want-their-salaries-to-increase-too/

[The Frankish Reich]

33 minutes ago, Precision said:

1 hour ago, 716er said:

 

Under what circumstances does someone have $150K in college loans?

Really easy to do if you go to graduate or professional school and don't qualify for other financial aid.

If you're going into that kind of debt for film school or to get a Ph.D. in Art History, well, you're a fool.

If you're going to medical school (or law/business/dentistry AND it's a top school): no problem. Really. I get tired of the whining. $150,000 loan debt if you qualify as a cardiologist (median salary: $400,000) is totally manageable. Even a family practitioner (median: $216,000) can live well after a few years of getting their feet on the ground. Totally ordinary lawyer from a totally ordinary school? Well, that gets harder (median salary: $128,000). 

[ALF]

I'm good with $10K relief  for inflation, for earners under $50K.

[Precision]

Just now, The Frankish Reich said:

Really easy to do if you go to graduate or professional school and don't qualify for other financial aid.

If you're going into that kind of debt for film school or to get a Ph.D. in Art History, well, you're a fool.

If you're going to medical school (or law/business/dentistry AND it's a top school): no problem. Really. I get tired of the whining. $150,000 loan debt if you qualify as a cardiologist (median salary: $400,000) is totally manageable. Even a family practitioner (median: $216,000) can live well after a few years of getting their feet on the ground. Totally ordinary lawyer from a totally ordinary school? Well, that gets harder (median salary: $128,000). 

I understand how someone can rack up that much debt but if you can't afford it then you should opt for a lower cost option or suck it up.  No one needs a graduate degree.  I wanted to be a dentist but ended up with a BSEE as there was no way I would be able to afford that much education at that time in my life.   Earned a graduate degree in engineering at night when I was financial able to.  So my dream career never happened, tough sh!t for me.  Life is full of hard choices.  I also am tired of the whining and entitlement.  I wonder how many of these high debt/high earners pocket the $10K relief and never pay it forward once they are able to?  Probably a lot.

Just now, ALF said:

I'm good with $10K relief  for inflation, for earners under $50K.

Why?  If you choose a field of study with low earning potential isn't that on you? 

Edited August 24, 2022 by Precision

[Demongyz]

3 hours ago, ALF said:

I'm good with $10K relief  for inflation, for earners under $50K.

Why?  They can defer that, they can get a gov job and have it wiped out, they could get a better job; lots of things they can do to pay of THEIR debt.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

In a stunning turn of events, while the net takers who got expensive low value degrees and subsist off of government helicopter money and hand outs are in favor of this, the net payers who fund all of this, work hard, paid their college and will pay for their own kids college have reservations about paying off all the moochers loans too. 

[BillStime]

According to the CULT:
 

Student loan relief bad

 

100% PPP loan FORGIVENESS good 

 

f’n idiots 

 

These idiots can’t see how their keepers manipulate the F out of every f’n narrative just to keep us peasants angry and their millionaire and billionaire keepers happy and rich. 

 

IDIOTS

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

3 hours ago, Demongyz said:

Why?  They can defer that, they can get a gov job and have it wiped out, they could get a better job; lots of things they can do to pay of THEIR debt.

There are lots of ways sure. This is about buying vote mobilization from Liberal arts majors that owe student loans for worthless degrees with no career path.

 

the idiots that looked at tens of thousands of dollars of debt as entitlement versus investment. 
 

thats the base of the modern Democratic Party. The leeches on society. You can see the same entitlement, naivety, ignorance and lack of purpose permeating  most of the religious left defenders here. 

[BillStime]

39 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

There are lots of ways sure. This is about buying vote mobilization from Liberal arts majors that owe student loans for worthless degrees with no career path.

 

the idiots that looked at tens of thousands of dollars of debt as entitlement versus investment. 
 

thats the base of the modern Democratic Party. The leeches on society. You can see the same entitlement, naivety, ignorance and lack of purpose permeating  most of the religious left defenders here. 

Ah yes - the little guys are the leaches - they got you right where they want you Mista Independent.

 

idiots 

[ALF]

The problem with fed student loans is the high interest rates even before inflation. $10K would put a dent in those excessive interest charges. Adding more IRS auditors to catch tax cheats will cover the cost.

[All_Pro_Bills]

12 minutes ago, ALF said:

The problem with fed student loans is the high interest rates even before inflation. $10K would put a dent in those excessive interest charges. Adding more IRS auditors to catch tax cheats will cover the cost.

There needs to be an inspection of the entire system that supports excessive tuition and fee charges that the colleges and universities are inflicting on students and parents.      

[PetermansRedemption]

29 minutes ago, ALF said:

The problem with fed student loans is the high interest rates even before inflation. $10K would put a dent in those excessive interest charges. Adding more IRS auditors to catch tax cheats will cover the cost.

They definitely need to start allowing federal borrowers to refinance to lower prevailing rates at least a few times over the course of their 20 year loans. 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

27 minutes ago, ALF said:

The problem with fed student loans is the high interest rates even before inflation. $10K would put a dent in those excessive interest charges. Adding more IRS auditors to catch tax cheats will cover the cost.

Adding 87,000 agent will cost about $15 billion per year and double the size of the irs.
 

See, this is how government waste works…. They won’t even cover that incremental cost, and there will be a collateral impact of people who are completely on the up and up having to suffer through more audits.

 

lasted if you are involved in in any tax implicated way or donate significantly to conservative causes be ready, they are coming for you. Assuming religious NPOs are the first target. 

[Doc]

This ruse again?   

[ALF]

The 87,000 new auditors are just to try and figure out Trump's returns 🙂

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

10 minutes ago, ALF said:

The 87,000 new auditors are just to try and figure out Trump's returns 🙂

I’m sure he will already be in prison by then 

34 minutes ago, PetermansRedemption said:

They definitely need to start allowing federal borrowers to refinance to lower prevailing rates at least a few times over the course of their 20 year loans. 

I believe consolidation to lower rates is very easy or at least it was a long time ago 

[LeviF]

Again, Republicans not only miss the point but miss an opportunity.

 

Democrats understand that politics simply comes down to what Old Hickory practiced: reward friends, punish enemies.

 

IRS, "green" energy, student loan "forgiveness," all just payment programs for dem donors at the expense of those who actually make the system run.

[dpberr]

13 hours ago, Precision said:

Under what circumstances does someone have $150K in college loans?  Bachelor and Associate degrees are available for much less than that.  If you're taking out loans for that much perhaps you should have chosen a less expensive institution, different curriculum or gone into the trades.  That much debt for college loans is a poor choice completely on the borrower.

You can get there pretty easy.  Annual in-state tuition (with meal plan, room and board) at a state school here in PA is now $26k, out of state is $38k.

 

If you manage to get out in four years, that puts you north of 100k.  However, schools play games with scheduling now, so it's more like 4.5-5 years.  

 

Trade school in PA is now up to $22K, all in.  However, that's a two year program.  

[BillStime]

15 minutes ago, LeviF said:

Again, Republicans not only miss the point but miss an opportunity.

 

Democrats understand that politics simply comes down to what Old Hickory practiced: reward friends, punish enemies.

 

IRS, "green" energy, student loan "forgiveness," all just payment programs for dem donors at the expense of those who actually make the system run.

So who makes the system run?

 

1 minute ago, dpberr said:

You can get there pretty easy.  Annual in-state tuition (with meal plan, room and board) at a state school here in PA is now $26k, out of state is $38k.

 

If you manage to get out in four years, that puts you north of 100k.  However, schools play games with scheduling now, so it's more like 4.5-5 years.  

 

Trade school in PA is now up to $22K, all in.  However, that's a two year program.  

Don’t forget about grad school 

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

2 hours ago, ALF said:

The problem with fed student loans is the high interest rates even before inflation. $10K would put a dent in those excessive interest charges. Adding more IRS auditors to catch tax cheats will cover the cost.

It's going to be interesting, as many of the folks who stand to benefit from the loan scheme likely fall into the 'tax cheat' category when viewed through the lens of the tax code.  

 

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

31 minutes ago, dpberr said:

You can get there pretty easy.  Annual in-state tuition (with meal plan, room and board) at a state school here in PA is now $26k, out of state is $38k.

 

If you manage to get out in four years, that puts you north of 100k.  However, schools play games with scheduling now, so it's more like 4.5-5 years.  

 

Trade school in PA is now up to $22K, all in.  However, that's a two year program.  

Oh, absolutely doable.  Sure, a student and/or his/her parents have to struggle with basic math concepts, forgo opportunities to offset costs of higher education, skip the trendy virtual learning opportunities and often drive past 6 community colleges and a couple 'stay at home' options offering more affordable outcomes, but hey, "Jimmy is going to Penn State...".

 

What's incredible to me is how the schools that actually set the standards and requirements are not part of the solution, especially in light of some of the massive endowments in play.  (The aforementioned Penn State is at $6.2 billion).*

 

My children attended SUNY schools, we encouraged a healthy mix of youthful stupidity and commitment to education, and we offered the option for living on campus.  We were able to handle the costs, and feel blessed to have been able to do so. Still, when I get the letter or phone call from one of the schools requesting additional alms for the poor, the first phrase that occurs to me includes only two words.  I recognize the caller is likely a student trying to make a few bucks, so I hold my tongue. 

 

*As @LeviF has suggested, I recognize there is no incentive whatsoever to the dem party for the institution to be part of the solution.  

[The Frankish Reich]

26 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

It's going to be interesting, as many of the folks who stand to benefit from the loan scheme likely fall into the 'tax cheat' category when viewed through the lens of the tax code.  

 

Typically loan forgiveness = imputed income = tax liability. Not sure how this latest plan is going to treat that. $10,000 of extra "income" for someone earning $125,000 in 2022 means about $2200 extra coming back to Uncle Sam. And if you live in NY or CA ....

... so watch this one carefully, and see if they add an IRS special rule treating this forgiveness as a nontaxable event.

(Yes, I hate this plan)