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Phil The Thrill

Deshaun Watson To Patriots Rumours Begin To Swirl

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1 minute ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

I'm waiting for someone to give a definitive answer that ownership is always involved in every trade made in the NFL.

 

So far, everyone here has said "I'd think", or "I feel", or the like. No one has been able to tell me "Yes, when a GM files a trade with the league, there is a paper the owner needs to sign to approve it".

 

For all we know, GMs have the authority to wheel and deal autonomously.

 

I feel like that too, but so far we havent received that confirmation from anyone who definitely knows.

 

Feel free to go figure it out 😄

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If O'Brien wanted to help New England, he would have sent Hopkins there instead of taking peanuts from Arizona to get him out of the AFC. And Watson might be the only person Houston's owners love more than O'Brien. They'd veto any Watson deal, especially one that sends him to New England.

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Posted (edited)
Image result for scared to death gif
 
 
Edited by HOUSE

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1 minute ago, BarleyNY said:


Technically the person who has contractually been given control of the roster has the authority to do as they please.  Some teams don’t have anyone with that.  Dallas, for instance, where Jerruh is the GM.  I’m sure there are others.  The big caveat is that in the vast majority of cases the person with roster control is expected to consult with ownership before major or controversial moves.  Big trades of important players and/or picks are sure on that list.  Adding a player with DV incidents is another example.  But that’s on a team by team basis.  Every team would have its own rules.

 

Trading away the starting QB and face of the franchise would have to be cleared by ownership in basically every case if it’s not something that the GM contractually has to do.  Otherwise that GM would be treading into some seriously dangerous territory.  I’m not sure what constitutes firing an NFL coach with just cause (so the contract can be terminated rather than paid out), but an owner might be looking to see if something the HC did qualifies if he’s pulling crap like that without approval. 

 

"Expected to consult" still doesnt give me the answer I'm looking for that "NO WAY this can happen since the owner MUST approve it".

 

Going off your first sentence, it would seem BOB could make the trade.

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22 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

Yeah, that's a part of what I'm wondering and truly dont know. Do owners have to literally sign paperwork to file with the league in order to make trades happen? Or can GMs basically do what they want?

The GMs ultimately work for the owners. It’s like any other job. You probably have the authority to make minor decisions without running it through ownership. I’ll use the Bills as an example. I’m not sure that the Bills needed Pegula’s approval to bring in Kaare Vidvek. The Bills would absolutely need the Pegula’s approval to trade Josh. There’s no way BOB could deal Watson without ownership.

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1 minute ago, dneveu said:

 

Feel free to go figure it out 😄

 

I'm tryin!

 

I know Im splitting hairs, but Im on Day 14 of quarantine and really bored. Plus, Im interested in how this all works behind the scenes. And whether we can simply dismiss ideas like this.

 

Surpisingly, I havent been able to find anyone who can tell me "NO this isnt possible because ownership must sign off". And the more I pry, the more it looks like he totally could make that trade if he wanted and didnt care about keeping his job.

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56 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

Who in their right mind would trade Watson?   

The same guy that traded the best WR in football for a handful of Vicodin 

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Unpopular opinion alert

 

Honestly, I will be pissed if this happened and Buffalo did not at leastt inquire. Josh might be better down the line, but Watson is a stud right now at a similar age. This is a SB team with Watson right now. I would trade Josh and a 1st in a heart beat.

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Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

The GMs ultimately work for the owners. It’s like any other job. You probably have the authority to make minor decisions without running it through ownership. I’ll use the Bills as an example. I’m not sure that the Bills needed Pegula’s approval to bring in Kaare Vidvek. The Bills would absolutely need the Pegula’s approval to trade Josh. There’s no way BOB could deal Watson without ownership.

 

Finally, the guy Ive been waiting for!

 

How does that work tho?

 

To use your analogy, I can make pricing decisions for minor and even major deals in my job. Since I want to keep my job, I consult with my bosses or other people on major decisions or when I need to step out of our usual boundaries. But if I didnt care about keeping my job, I could totally make decisions they wouldnt approve of and get them under contracts before they could do anything about it.

 

What process would stop BOB from making the deal?

 

When you say "The Bills would absolutely need the Pegula’s approval to trade Josh." How so? And as in, need Pegulas approval to complete the trade? Or need Pegulas approval in order to keep their job?

 

Edited by DrDawkinstein

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35 minutes ago, Johnny Hammersticks said:

I can’t even imagine the draft capital it would take for NE to get Watson away from Houston.  It would have to be at least 3 1st rounders plus...

 

No shot.

I would give up 3 1sts and 3 2nds for Watson if i could lock him up, esp if i am the Pats.

 

Imagine the Pats with Watson, wow, q mobile QB in New England.  

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If this happens, I'm going to start licking every handrail in NYC. 

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7 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

I'm tryin!

 

I know Im splitting hairs, but Im on Day 14 of quarantine and really bored. Plus, Im interested in how this all works behind the scenes. And whether we can simply dismiss ideas like this.

 

Surpisingly, I havent been able to find anyone who can tell me "NO this isnt possible because ownership must sign off". And the more I pry, the more it looks like he totally could make that trade if he wanted and didnt care about keeping his job.

I’d imagine that the optics and intentions matter. I can’t see the NFL allowing the trade to go through if the owner makes a public statement lambasting BOB. Imagine the public reaction and ***** show if the owner made an announcement that BOB made the trade after leaked info about him being fired... 

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1 hour ago, Shaw66 said:

Who in their right mind would trade Watson?   

 

Funny you should ask...

 

And he'd probably do it for N'Keal Harry and a bottle of hand sanitizer.

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Posted (edited)
15 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

"Expected to consult" still doesnt give me the answer I'm looking for that "NO WAY this can happen since the owner MUST approve it".

 

Going off your first sentence, it would seem BOB could make the trade.


I’ve been digging a bit.  Most teams have a GM or HC who has a contract provision giving them roster control and I do not believe that can have exceptions, even for a QB.*  But here’s the kicker, BOB didn’t have that provision when he became HC in Houston.  The GM did.  BOB was given control of personnel after the GM was fired, but that doesn’t mean he had his contract amended.  So I guess my answer is that without seeing his contract we don’t know.
 

* Again, that doesn’t mean that it wouldn’t get someone fired.

Edited by BarleyNY

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Just now, BarleyNY said:


I’ve been digging a bit.  Most teams have a GM or HC who has a contract provision giving them roster control and I do not believe that can have exceptions, even for a QB.  But here’s the kicker, BOB didn’t have that provision when he became HC in Houston.  The GM did.  BOB was given control of personnel after the GM was fired, but that doesn’t mean he had his contract amended.  So I guess my answer is that without seeing his contract we don’t know.

It might be more of any sane GM would run major trades by the owner so they don't get blindsided by their reaction probably wouldn't apply in this situation.

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3 minutes ago, BarleyNY said:


I’ve been digging a bit.  Most teams have a GM or HC who has a contract provision giving them roster control and I do not believe that can have exceptions, even for a QB.*  But here’s the kicker, BOB didn’t have that provision when he became HC in Houston.  The GM did.  BOB was given control of personnel after the GM was fired, but that doesn’t mean he had his contract amended.  So I guess my answer is that without seeing his contract ... we don’t know.
 

* Again, that doesn’t mean that it wouldn’t get someone fired.

 

All that just to blue-ball me again! 😫

 

haha, thanks for trying to research. so until we get a definitive answer, I'm going to assume this could happen.

6 minutes ago, Buffalo Junction said:

I’d imagine that the optics and intentions matter. I can’t see the NFL allowing the trade to go through if the owner makes a public statement lambasting BOB. Imagine the public reaction and ***** show if the owner made an announcement that BOB made the trade after leaked info about him being fired... 

 

I would think the same thing. But has the league ever stepped in and stopped a trade before?

 

I know it's happened in the NBA. I know the NFL "unofficially" did it to the Raiders back in the day.

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1 minute ago, Warcodered said:

It might be more of any sane GM would run major trades by the owner so they don't get blindsided by their reaction probably wouldn't apply in this situation.


I agree.  I was more interested in whether BOB could be fired “with cause” for trading Watson.  That would mean he wouldn’t get paid through 2022 like he would if he was fired in the usual manner.

4 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

All that just to blue-ball me again! 😫

 

haha, thanks for trying to research. so until we get a definitive answer, I'm going to assume this could happen.

 

I would think the same thing. But has the league ever stepped in and stopped a trade before?

 

I know it's happened in the NBA. I know the NFL "unofficially" did it to the Raiders back in the day.


So sorry, man!  I hate to do that to ya. 

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1 hour ago, DrDawkinstein said:

This rumor started on the day BOB traded away Hopkins. The idea is that BOB will trade Watson to the Pats closer to the deadline, and when O'Brien is fired from Houston this year, he'll have a job waiting for him in NE.

 

There is a lot of tin-foil hat conspiracy theory in that, but I wouldnt rule out anything when it comes to BOB's bad ideas and the Patriots making their own loophole to landing a top QB.

 

 

That's the point. If the Texans have a bad year, and BOB finds himself on the hotseat, he'll trade Watson to the Pats, and then go work for the Pats next year.


 

This is about the dumbest thing I’ve heard.  So BOB trades away Hopkins and in that vein ticked off Watson enough that Watson wants out. 
 

He trades Watson to NE for a song - which gets him fired.  Then he gets a job in NE and now all of a sudden Watson is going to be fine with him.

 

If Watson is traded to NE and BOB goes there - Watson is going to want to get away from NE.  
 

It just makes no sense at all.

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There was a joke going around that bill obrien would trade him to the pats and that he would get himself fired or quit the texans job. Just to be named head coach of the pats afterwards

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If they traded away Watson then the GM and Coach would be fired on the spot and i don't think they will go that route IMO. 

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Just a thought. If this rumor is swirling on a BB forum, I would guarantee it has made it to the owner by now. Any inkling of this going down has most likely already been approved or smacked down at this point. 

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I really hate this part of the off-season.  It's when stupid rumors start swirling.  There is no way Watson is traded, much less to New England.

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25 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

Finally, the guy Ive been waiting for!

 

How does that work tho?

 

To use your analogy, I can make pricing decisions for minor and even major deals in my job. Since I want to keep my job, I consult with my bosses or other people on major decisions or when I need to step out of our usual boundaries. But if I didnt care about keeping my job, I could totally make decisions they wouldnt approve of and get them under contracts before they could do anything about it.

 

What process would stop BOB from making the deal?

 

When you say "The Bills would absolutely need the Pegula’s approval to trade Josh." How so? And as in, need Pegulas approval to complete the trade? Or need Pegulas approval in order to keep their job?

 

I don’t know the exact way it works but I can speak to the vetoed Chris Paul trade. That’s actually when I was working there so I know that one pretty well. David Stern didn’t step in as the Commissioner of the NBA but rather as the owner of the Pelicans. The league owned the team at this point. He didn’t do it in the best interest of the league but the Pelicans.

 

I don’t know the specifics of the structure with the Texans. I just know the optics would be disastrous. The public backlash and cries of collusion would make O’Brien toxic (even to the Pats). He’d be committing career suicide (and that’s IF the Texans can’t step in). It just isn’t realistic that Watson can be traded without ownership on board.  Now, O’Brien can lie and try to convince them that trading Watson is a good move. Maybe they will agree but I don’t think it’s possible to trade a franchise player, in any situation, without ownership approval. There are too many dominos tied to that player. 

 

The more likely scenario, IMO, would be O’Brien making Watson’s life miserable. He could try to force him out the door by just being an idiot. He’s off to a good start there.

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12 minutes ago, Rochesterfan said:


 

This is about the dumbest thing I’ve heard.  So BOB trades away Hopkins and in that vein ticked off Watson enough that Watson wants out. 
 

He trades Watson to NE for a song - which gets him fired.  Then he gets a job in NE and now all of a sudden Watson is going to be fine with him.

 

If Watson is traded to NE and BOB goes there - Watson is going to want to get away from NE.  
 

It just makes no sense at all.

 

Bro, these are twitter rumors we're talking about. We could stop the conversation there if we were worried about "making sense". 😂

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