Trent Murphy upped his game late last season and is better than many think

[Kirby Jackson]

6 minutes ago, dneveu said:

 

Great player - not best in the league and thats what he's asking to be paid.  The injury history is very concerning though.  Seems like he is always banged up, and always missing time.  

Yeah, there are certainly concerns. It’s the type of “all in” move that a team makes chasing a Super Bowl. You gamble and hope to be right. It’s a move I’d be interested in.
 

I’m not as high on Ngakoue personally and he’d cost draft compensation as well. I wouldn’t hate it but may prefer Murphy + picks + savings in that case.

[Happy]

19 minutes ago, thebandit27 said:

Why can’t they keep Murphy? So they somehow need the cap space all of a sudden?

 

I keep repeating it: don’t make the team worse for the sake of cap space that you don’t need.

 

Then at least don't play him greater than 33% of the snaps, if that.  Having guys like Star and Murphy simply means you have depth, that's it.

[formerlyofCtown]

1 hour ago, dave mcbride said:

I thought this deserved its own thread given all the talk about the various moving d-line pieces following all of these d-line signings. In the final six games of 2019 including the playoff game, Murphy had six sacks, six tackles for loss, and 8 qb hits. He averaged playing 67 percent of the snaps too. Obviously and inarguably, that is elite production.  I don’t think he’s going anywhere. Many years ago, a wise man named @AKC talked about d-line equity, focusing in particular on the Giants SB teams that beat the Pats (particularly the 07 team). When you can rotate in good d-lineman after good d-lineman over the course of a game, it becomes very, very tough for an offense to produce. The Bills now have d-line equity in spades. It is going to be fun to watch.
 

Here is Murphy’s 2019 game log: https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MurpTr00/gamelog/2019/. 

He is a good DE and he is finally getting healthy.  A lot of people on this board think they are experts on player evaluation or something.  In reality all they do is look at box scores.  It'll be good if he can  fill the box score for them.

[thebandit27]

8 minutes ago, Happy Gilmore said:

 

Then at least don't play him greater than 33% of the snaps, if that.  Having guys like Star and Murphy simply means you have depth, that's it.

Murphy played the most snaps of any DLman last year...and remember: this was the leagues #2 defense in scoring, 

[Mark Vader]

1 hour ago, dave mcbride said:

I thought this deserved its own thread given all the talk about the various moving d-line pieces following all of these d-line signings. In the final six games of 2019 including the playoff game, Murphy had six sacks, six tackles for loss, and 8 qb hits. He averaged playing 67 percent of the snaps too. Obviously and inarguably, that is elite production.  I don’t think he’s going anywhere. Many years ago, a wise man named @AKC talked about d-line equity, focusing in particular on the Giants SB teams that beat the Pats (particularly the 07 team). When you can rotate in good d-lineman after good d-lineman over the course of a game, it becomes very, very tough for an offense to produce. The Bills now have d-line equity in spades. It is going to be fun to watch.
 

Here is Murphy’s 2019 game log: https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MurpTr00/gamelog/2019/. 

Very fair analysis, and it's tough to deny this.

 

Murphy did play better late in the season, and he stood out in the playoff game.

 

Yes, the 8 million on his contract stands out, especially if we could entice Clowney to join the team. In which case Murphy would be out of here.

 

However, if the Bills feel that Murphy can continue to play the way he did at the end of last season, then I trust their judgment.

[SoTier]

39 minutes ago, dneveu said:

 

Are we saving money or trying to win football games?

 

Exactly.  I get really tired of this "penny wise, dollar foolish" attitude that so many Bills fans espouse, which is undoubtedly a product of 2i0+ years of being brain washed by Ralph Wilson and his minions that the Bills can't "afford" to build a winning team.   Other teams figure out how to put together winning teams -- sometimes for only a couple of seasons but others almost continuously -- while paying really expensive players like QBs and DEs that the Bills simply don't have on their roster at present (I think last season, Morris might have been the most expensive Bills player).

 

This is the year for the Bills to go for broke to take over the AFCE while NE is transitioning away from Brady, Miami is still collecting puzzle pieces, and the Jets are simply the Jets.   Murphy seemed to get his act together last season, McDermott knows what he can do, the Bills aren't in need of cap space, and the Bills aren't likely to sign Clowney, so what's the point of cutting him???   They don't have a young stud waiting to take over for him already on the roster, they aren't going to actually save $8 million since they will have to add a replacement.  Even an UDFA rookie is going to cost something just in $$$ and maybe in wins, too.

 

[Happy]

12 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

Two things about this.   

 

First, once the guy is on your team, what you're paying him is not very relevant.   The question is solely about whether he's helping your team and doing what you want him to do.   Every team every year has guys who are getting more than what they'd be worth if they immediately became free agents, and other guys who are getting paid less than they should.   It's just in the nature of how compensation works in the league.  

 

The only question is whether he's doing his job.   I'm guessing that the OP and people who are backing Murphy have it right.   If he weren't doing his job, the Bills probably would have cut him to realize the savings.   The fact that they didn't cut him suggests McD likes what they're getting from him.   

 

My recollection is that Murphy in an interview sometime late last season, when his play had picked up and he was making a difference, Murphy said that he finally was recovered from his surgery.   Essentially he said that he still wasn't right when the 2019 season began.   That would help explain why his play improved, and it also would be part of the reason that the Bills are keeping him.   

 

Plus, as we know, McDermott loves the guy's intensity.  McD wants guys like that on the team, to model their behavior for other players.   Murphy's a mad dog committed to doing his job, and McD wants 60 of those.  

 

I don't think McD is anywhere near as good evaluating the d-line, or really any other position, aside from the defensive backfield.  He made remarks that he wanted to see more QB pressures and sacks from the defensive line; they finished 12th in that category, though largely from Jordan Phillips' and Shaq Lawson's efforts.  Murphy was well below those two in defensive statistics, yet he was paid many times more than them.

Murphy may have a high motor, but has a hard time getting away from the RT, who usually pushes Murphy 10+ yards out of the play. 

Chris Kelsay played with intensity, too.  Dick Jauron loved that high motor.  McD likes Murphy (and Star) because they are 'his' guys; I don't see them playing on better defenses such as SF or Baltimore, for example.  

5 minutes ago, thebandit27 said:

Murphy played the most snaps of any DLman last year...and remember: this was the leagues #2 defense in scoring, 

 

Which had little to nothing to do with Murphy.  If you look at defensive lineman stats on NFL.com, Murphy is well below Lawson and J. Phillips, yet was paid many times more than both.

[dave mcbride]

42 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

You’re with me if they could get Clowney for AAV of $18M?

I think the chances of that happening are basically zero. They have already brought in 3 d-linemen to what is already a good unit. I am confident that they are done on that front, and anyway Clowney doesn’t strike me as the sort of guy who is going to want to play in Buffalo. Seattle makes too much sense.

[formerlyofCtown]

52 minutes ago, Happy Gilmore said:

Murphy (and Star) get paid too much for what they do.  You can't keep Murphy at $8M/year.  Murphy had a good game vs Houston and now all of a sudden he is clutch.  The rest of the year he wasn't anything spectacular.  Counting on Murphy and Star to make your defense stout is like counting on a car air freshener to make an outhouse smell good.

Murphy has had plenty of good games.  The production you are looking for cost 15-20 mil per yr, not 8 mil.

[The Jokeman]

1 hour ago, papazoid said:

too little , too late

 

his contract says they save $8 mil if cut ($1.75 dead money)

 

id say its 75% likely hes gone

So we cut Murphy, curious who you think we'll bring in that's better for $6.25mil (or less) money?

6 minutes ago, Happy Gilmore said:

 

I don't think McD is anywhere near as good evaluating the d-line, or really any other position, aside from the defensive backfield.  He made remarks that he wanted to see more QB pressures and sacks from the defensive line; they finished 12th in that category, though largely from Jordan Phillips' and Shaq Lawson's efforts.  Murphy was well below those two in defensive statistics, yet he was paid many times more than them.

Murphy may have a high motor, but has a hard time getting away from the RT, who usually pushes Murphy 10+ yards out of the play. 

Chris Kelsay played with intensity, too.  Dick Jauron loved that high motor.  McD likes Murphy (and Star) because they are 'his' guys; I don't see them playing on better defenses such as SF or Baltimore, for example.  

 

Which had little to nothing to do with Murphy.  If you look at defensive lineman stats on NFL.com, Murphy is well below Lawson and J. Phillips, yet was paid many times more than both.

You do realize that we added Murphy as an UFA and wasn't working off his rookie contract like Shaq was? Toss in before coming here his 2006 season (his last season played before coming here) was better than anything Shaq had done to that time or since actually. That's why he got the money he did. 

[formerlyofCtown]

1 hour ago, papazoid said:

too little , too late

 

his contract says they save $8 mil if cut ($1.75 dead money)

 

id say its 75% likely hes gone

I'll take that bet.

[SoTier]

33 minutes ago, dneveu said:

 

Great player - not best in the league and thats what he's asking to be paid.  The injury history is very concerning though.  Seems like he is always banged up, and always missing time.  

 

I think that Clowney's injury history is what is keeping teams from considering him at present.  They aren't going to make a deal with him unless they can have their own doctors give him a physical -- and that's not going to change for some time to come.

[Kirby Jackson]

6 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

I think the chances of that happening are basically zero. They have already brought in 3 d-linemen to what is already a good unit. I am confident that they are done on that front, and anyway Clowney doesn’t strike me as the sort of guy who is going to want to play in Buffalo. Seattle makes too much sense.

I never understood the bolded. What does that mean? Athletes want to go to the best situation. There are a lot of factors with money being at or near the top. I never got the “he won’t want to be in Buffalo” sentiment. In general, the Bills have always recruited well in FA. 
 

With his market dropping I think it becomes more likely. Maybe that wasn’t their plan but at some point the value meets the opportunity. I’m not saying it’s likely but the odds increase every hour that passes. 

[Magox]

1 hour ago, dave mcbride said:

I thought this deserved its own thread given all the talk about the various moving d-line pieces following all of these d-line signings. In the final six games of 2019 including the playoff game, Murphy had six sacks, six tackles for loss, and 8 qb hits. He averaged playing 67 percent of the snaps too. Obviously and inarguably, that is elite production.  I don’t think he’s going anywhere. Many years ago, a wise man named @AKC talked about d-line equity, focusing in particular on the Giants SB teams that beat the Pats (particularly the 07 team). When you can rotate in good d-lineman after good d-lineman over the course of a game, it becomes very, very tough for an offense to produce. The Bills now have d-line equity in spades. It is going to be fun to watch.
 

Here is Murphy’s 2019 game log: https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MurpTr00/gamelog/2019/. 

 

This is what I've been saying.  He finished the year strong and showed up when it counted for the Bills.  This idea that the Bills will just drop him all willy nilly I think is premature.

 

Unless the Bills have a better option I just don't see it.  I could be wrong but having Murphy as a solid rotational player makes sense.  The Bills are not in a salary cap crunch and there is absolutely very little reason to drop him unless you have someone else better to replace him with.  Maybe they draft a DE and he becomes expendable or maybe they find someone else in FA.  But as of right now, as the team stands I don't see that as happening.

[BigBillsFan]

Why do headlines on TBD resemble buzzfeed headlines?

 

Kroft's Hidden Production Was Better Than We Think

McDermott's Secret Clap That Signifies War

8 Things Beane Does Before He Signs A Free Agent

 

[Niagara Dude]

59 minutes ago, Happy Gilmore said:

Murphy (and Star) get paid too much for what they do.  You can't keep Murphy at $8M/year.  Murphy had a good game vs Houston and now all of a sudden he is clutch.  The rest of the year he wasn't anything spectacular.  Counting on Murphy and Star to make your defense stout is like counting on a car air freshener to make an outhouse smell good.

He had 3 sacks up until last game against Jets,  how can you justify 10 million for that kind of production and he is very weak against the run. People taking about his great playoff game should review the TD run where he could not bring down Watson.  You take the 8 million savings and add 5-6 and you could sign an upgrade

[dave mcbride]

3 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

I never understood the bolded. What does that mean? Athletes want to go to the best situation. There are a lot of factors with money being at or near the top. I never got the “he won’t want to be in Buffalo” sentiment. In general, the Bills have always recruited well in FA. 
 

With his market dropping I think it becomes more likely. Maybe that wasn’t their plan but at some point the value meets the opportunity. I’m not saying it’s likely but the odds increase every hour that passes. 

It's more of a gut feel. He just strikes me as the sort of guy who wants to play with a "star" team (partly because he seems to want to win). I don't put Buffalo in that category, but I could be wrong. Regardless, I would be absolutely stunned if the Bills are pursuing him. They have something like 9 quality d-linemen now. 

2 minutes ago, BigBillsFan said:

Why do headlines on TBD resemble buzzfeed headlines?

 

Kroft's Hidden Production Was Better Than We Think

McDermott's Secret Clap That Signifies War

8 Things Beane Does Before He Signs A Free Agent

 

Huh??? The mods have pushed for everyone here to provide headlines that are as descriptive as possible regarding the content.

[Kelly the Dog]

Murphy is very good when healthy as Dave said. It took him a long time to return to health. Not his fault but a fact. Remains to be seen if he can keep his health and thus his production. History is not good but he's 100% now. I wouldn't get rid of him except for Clowney, who would transform the defense from very good to great. He may even take a one year prove it deal. 18m. Lose 8 from releasing Murphy. Take the hit. Then Star comes off books next year with Butler still around to take up space in middle. 

[uticaclub]

I would try to restructure, he's not as bad as some people make him out to be, but he's not nearly has good either

[Kirby Jackson]

Just now, dave mcbride said:

It's more of a gut feel. He just strikes me as the sort of guy who wants to play with a "star" team (partly because he seems to want to win). I don't put Buffalo in that category, but I could be wrong. Regardless, I would be absolutely stunned if the Bills are pursuing him. They have something like 9 quality d-linemen now. 

Well, if they were interested it would absolutely be at Murphy’s expense. It’s a situation where they may say “Murphy at $10M or Clowney at $18M?” That’s the kind of decision that they would make. The $8M savings from Murphy would immediately be applied to Clowney. 

[dave mcbride]

1 minute ago, Kelly the Dog said:

Murphy is very good when healthy as Dave said. It took him a long time to return to health. Not his fault but a fact. Remains to be seen if he can keep his health and thus his production. History is not good but he's 100% now. I wouldn't get rid of him except for Clowney, who would transform the defense from very good to great. He may even take a one year prove it deal. 18m. Lose 8 from releasing Murphy. Take the hit. Then Star comes off books next year with Butler still around to take up space in middle. 

Has he ever had an injury issue unrelated to the ACL? 

Just now, Kirby Jackson said:

Well, if they were interested it would absolutely be at Murphy’s expense. It’s a situation where they may say “Murphy at $10M or Clowney at $18M?” That’s the kind of decision that they would make. The $8M savings from Murphy would immediately be applied to Clowney. 

If they're going to spend more money, I'd spend it on an RB or RT. Those spots are the real question marks right now. Maybe you pick up the RB in the draft, of course. 

[BigBillsFan]

5 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

 

Huh??? The mods have pushed for everyone here to provide headlines that are as descriptive as possible regarding the content.

 

I should have realized people are cruelly sarcastic on here but that was to make people laugh. Sorry it could be construed as cruel.

[GG]

He's the most likely cut candidate because there are a lot of mouths to feed on that DL.   Bills lost 3 starting/rotation DLs from last year's season end lineup (Shaq, Phillips & Liuget), and are adding at least 4 starting/rotation DLs in '20 (Addison, Jefferson, Butler & Harry's return).  Plus, Bills have to address a developmental DE in the draft.    

 

The math doesn't bode well for Murphy

[Happy]

18 minutes ago, The Jokeman said:

You do realize that we added Murphy as an UFA and wasn't working off his rookie contract like Shaq was? Toss in before coming here his 2006 season (his last season played before coming here) was better than anything Shaq had done to that time or since actually. That's why he got the money he did. 

 

Good point about the 2016 season, explains a lot.  I believe he did have an injury history which is probably why the Redskins didn't make a real attempt to keep him.  McD and Beane overpaid him and now should either a) cut him, or b) reduce his pay.  True, we have plenty of cap space (not a reason to overpay meh production), so use it to bring in additional offensive linemen, another 1-tech, RB, etc.  I'm sure Shaq Lawson saw what Murphy was making, and wanted more since his production was more than Murphy's.  You would feel the same way if you were Shaq...I know I would.

[Kirby Jackson]

8 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Has he ever had an injury issue unrelated to the ACL? 

If they're going to spend more money, I'd spend it on an RB or RT. Those spots are the real question marks right now. Maybe you pick up the RB in the draft, of course. 

I think RT is the biggest need on the roster at the moment. I just don’t see the guy that moves the needle. The only needle mover on the market for the Bills still is Clowney IMO. 

[Happy]

13 minutes ago, Niagara Dude said:

He had 3 sacks up until last game against Jets,  how can you justify 10 million for that kind of production and he is very weak against the run. People taking about his great playoff game should review the TD run where he could not bring down Watson.  You take the 8 million savings and add 5-6 and you could sign an upgrade

 

I'm glad someone sees the big picture.

28 minutes ago, formerlyofCtown said:

Murphy has had plenty of good games.  The production you are looking for cost 15-20 mil per yr, not 8 mil.

 

Murphy is worth $15-20M/year?  Now I know you've jumped the shark.

[RyanC883]

2 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said:

He definitely played better late last year. I thought there was no chance that he was coming back this year. At this point I believe that he will be back. With that being said if the Bills were to chase Clowney or Ngakoue Murphy’s release will definitely be a part of that. The $8M of space from him would be needed.

 

I'd be find cutting him, but only for an upgrade to Clowney or Ngakoue, or a LB upgrade, but the LB I wanted (Littleton) is gone.  

 

 

[formerlyofCtown]

3 minutes ago, Happy Gilmore said:

 

I'm glad someone sees the big picture.

 

Murphy is worth $15-20M/year?  Now I know you've jumped the shark.

Where on earth did you get that from?

 

At least Murphy knows how to read.  Apparently you do not my friend.

 

I said "the kind of production you are looking for cost 15-20"  I never said anything about Murphy making that.?

[FireChans]

28 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

I never understood the bolded. What does that mean? Athletes want to go to the best situation. There are a lot of factors with money being at or near the top. I never got the “he won’t want to be in Buffalo” sentiment. In general, the Bills have always recruited well in FA. 
 

With his market dropping I think it becomes more likely. Maybe that wasn’t their plan but at some point the value meets the opportunity. I’m not saying it’s likely but the odds increase every hour that passes. 

Buffalo making the playoffs again has upped their status tremendously. Look at Digg’s reaction to Shady’s for example upon being traded.

11 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

I think RT is the biggest need on the roster at the moment. I just don’t see the guy that moves the needle. The only needle mover on the market for the Bills still is Clowney IMO. 

Adding a Clowney, approaching Jerry about a little team friendly restructure, and we honestly are a Super Bowl contender. I believe that.

[TC in St. Louis]

I think Beane knows what he's doing.  

[C.Biscuit97]

Dude is Chris Kelsey.  Not the worst but so easily replaceable for so much cheaper.  He had 3 sacks until that ? fest last game.  He has 24 sacks in 5 years, 10 FF, and 1 int.   He is a JAG and his best feature is setting the edge, which is something you don’t need to spend big money on.

 

this regime has done some really good things.  But they have some outdated views on football with the Star, Murphy, and need for a veteran rb. 

Edited March 19, 2020 by C.Biscuit97

[thebandit27]

1 hour ago, Happy Gilmore said:

 

I don't think McD is anywhere near as good evaluating the d-line, or really any other position, aside from the defensive backfield.  He made remarks that he wanted to see more QB pressures and sacks from the defensive line; they finished 12th in that category, though largely from Jordan Phillips' and Shaq Lawson's efforts.  Murphy was well below those two in defensive statistics, yet he was paid many times more than them.

Murphy may have a high motor, but has a hard time getting away from the RT, who usually pushes Murphy 10+ yards out of the play. 

Chris Kelsay played with intensity, too.  Dick Jauron loved that high motor.  McD likes Murphy (and Star) because they are 'his' guys; I don't see them playing on better defenses such as SF or Baltimore, for example.  

 

Which had little to nothing to do with Murphy.  If you look at defensive lineman stats on NFL.com, Murphy is well below Lawson and J. Phillips, yet was paid many times more than both.

The guy that saw the field the most among DLmen, who was also 2nd among DEs in sacks, and was 2nd on the team in QB hurries, had “little to nothing” to do with the defensive performance?

 

Forgive me, but that’s an overstatement at best.

[Shaw66]

56 minutes ago, Happy Gilmore said:

 

I don't think McD is anywhere near as good evaluating the d-line, or really any other position, aside from the defensive backfield.  He made remarks that he wanted to see more QB pressures and sacks from the defensive line; they finished 12th in that category, though largely from Jordan Phillips' and Shaq Lawson's efforts.  Murphy was well below those two in defensive statistics, yet he was paid many times more than them.

Murphy may have a high motor, but has a hard time getting away from the RT, who usually pushes Murphy 10+ yards out of the play. 

Chris Kelsay played with intensity, too.  Dick Jauron loved that high motor.  McD likes Murphy (and Star) because they are 'his' guys; I don't see them playing on better defenses such as SF or Baltimore, for example.  

 

 

I think you just believe what you choose to believe, instead of actually evaluating what happened.   

 

In his final 8 games (he missed one, so it was the Bills' last 9 games),  Murphy had 5 sacks, 26 total tackles, 6 tackles for loss.   In his last 8 games, Shaq had 4.5 sacks, 21 total tackles and 9 tackles for loss.   In his last 8 games, Phillips had 4.5 sacks, 18 tackles and 6 tackles for loss.  Murphy clearly was not "well below" those two, and keeping Murphy on the team for 2020 costs LESS than it would have cost to keep either Shaq or Phillips. 

 

But please don't let the facts get in the way of your conclusions.   It's obvious that Murphy sucks and only is on the team because McD likes him.    

[GreggTX]

Trent Murphy upped his game a little bit last year, but he's still pretty average. He'll do in a pinch, but he's not much help to the pass rush and Hughes isn't getting any younger. Clowney is very disruptive when healthy. Maybe offer Clowney a 2 year deal to lure him away? None of the players we've signed in FA are anything more than backups. Only Diggs will have an impact from these new arrivals.

[Kelly the Dog]

47 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Has he ever had an injury issue unrelated to the ACL? 

 

He broke his hand and missed a couple games as rookie. But I was referring mostly to it took well over two years to get 100% and playing well from the knee injury. From early August ‘17 to maybe mid November ‘19. He was playing but not great and not full speed. I like him. I want him to stay. I cannot say I’m confident he won’t get hurt this year the way I’m confident Hughes or Oliver or Addison or Jefferson et al won’t be hurt. Clowney would make everyone on that line better. We would be a Super Bowl contender IMO. Why not take that chance. 

[C.Biscuit97]

10 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

I think you just believe what you choose to believe, instead of actually evaluating what happened.   

 

In his final 8 games (he missed one, so it was the Bills' last 9 games),  Murphy had 5 sacks, 26 total tackles, 6 tackles for loss.   In his last 8 games, Shaq had 4.5 sacks, 21 total tackles and 9 tackles for loss.   In his last 8 games, Phillips had 4.5 sacks, 18 tackles and 6 tackles for loss.  Murphy clearly was not "well below" those two, and keeping Murphy on the team for 2020 costs LESS than it would have cost to keep either Shaq or Phillips. 

 

But please don't let the facts get in the way of your conclusions.   It's obvious that Murphy sucks and only is on the team because McD likes him.    

He completely padded his stats with one game.  He was invisible for most of the season.  And Shaq is a younger, ascending player who has rarely been hurt.  I didn’t want to pay him that much but I do wonder if we didn’t have Trent, would we have?  Because I would rather have Shaq than Kelsey 2.0. 

[Happy]

35 minutes ago, formerlyofCtown said:

I said "the kind of production you are looking for cost 15-20"  I never said anything about Murphy making that

 

My bad.  I see what you meant.  I was going through a number of posts fairly quick.  I wouldn't have any problem paying $15M/yr for the type of production I wish Buffalo would get from an edge player.  Unfortunately, that appears to be down the list on McD's priorities; he favors the defensive backfield.

[Happy]

15 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

I think you just believe what you choose to believe, instead of actually evaluating what happened.   

 

In his final 8 games (he missed one, so it was the Bills' last 9 games),  Murphy had 5 sacks, 26 total tackles, 6 tackles for loss.   In his last 8 games, Shaq had 4.5 sacks, 21 total tackles and 9 tackles for loss.   In his last 8 games, Phillips had 4.5 sacks, 18 tackles and 6 tackles for loss.  Murphy clearly was not "well below" those two, and keeping Murphy on the team for 2020 costs LESS than it would have cost to keep either Shaq or Phillips. 

 

But please don't let the facts get in the way of your conclusions.   It's obvious that Murphy sucks and only is on the team because McD likes him.    

 

I didn't let the facts get in the way of my conclusion, they are available on nfl.com if you care to look.  I took his work as the whole of the season, not just an outlier of a couple of games.  Murphy was also credited for 8 or 9 QB hits, IIRC, which is one for every other game.  Not good for a DE who sees the majority of snaps at left DE.  Murphy is also terrible at stopping the run and maintaining disciple at the edge, where he routinely got picked on in misdirection and screen plays.

 

Serious question:  is there anything that McD does wrong to you?  You are clearly one of his biggest defenders.  I think he is excellent in the defensive backfield (Bill Belichick commented that the Bills do a great job of disguising coverages), but I think he is inadequate on the offensive side of the ball as well as the front defensive unit.

[Punching Bag]

2 hours ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

Trying to recall last season did we have a 4 or 3 man rotation at DE?  I know we had Hughes, Lawson, and Murphy mainly.  And 7th rounder Johnson.  Am I forgetting someone that did play a fair amount of snaps?  Now have Addison, Hughes, Murphy, and Johnson. 

 

At tackle had Oliver, Phillips, Star, and Liguit (once Harrison went down).  This year have Oliver, Star, Harrison, the new guy Butler, but also another or does that last one plat both tackle and end?

 

Corey Ligiut has not been signed by any team yet but appears to be on a number of lists.  Guessing he will sign somewhere post draft.

[Kelly the Dog]

9 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

He completely padded his stats with one game.  He was invisible for most of the season.  And Shaq is a younger, ascending player who has rarely been hurt.  I didn’t want to pay him that much but I do wonder if we didn’t have Trent, would we have?  Because I would rather have Shaq than Kelsey 2.0. 

I don’t think Murphy is Kelsay but I do agree overall Shaq was better and more valuable overall than Trent last year. Better against run. Very underrated in blocking passing lanes and tipping passes. Very consistent overall. Trent made a bunch of good plays. Had better pressure than a lot gave him credit for. I thought Shaq was easily better.