Daboll Brutal Down the Stretch

[Scott7975]

4 hours ago, jrober38 said:

 

Calling Allen the hero of the first half is crazy.

 

7 of our points came on a drive dominated by trick plays called by the Offensive Coordinator you're ragging on. 

 

Otherwise we did very little offensively. 

 

With Allen it's always someone else's fault. When he plays poorly, someone else always seems to get the blame for Allen's struggles as a passer against competent competition. 

 

The Texans pass D is horrible and Allen couldn't perform. Our QB posted another rating below 70 against a team that's allowed an average rating of 97.6 this season (25th in the NFL). 

Dominated with trick plays?  You mean the ONE trick play they ran in the redzone?  Allen did a lot actually.  Other people around him performed lackluster.  I could start with the Brown non catch on the 3 yard line when the ball was money.  How he didn't get his feet down is comical.  I could add the Duke non TD catch that Allen again put on the money where it needed to be after a comical play series by McDumboll.  I could still continue on with the run Josh would have had if two players could make one block. I could also add the numerous huge runs Josh had. I could continue with the odd play design that puts Dimarco out 5 wide and has him run a deep route.  I could still continue with taking the best players off the field in the redzone for their "heavy" package with Gore, Dimarco, and Lee... by yet again taking the best players off the field against the worst red zone offense in the league.  I could also add while Singletary was ripping them up both in the ground game and pass game is was better for them to put Gore on the field or not let them run again at all.  Josh did a ton this game and from the players all the way up to McDumboll didn't help him

 

I could also add playing soft on D on 3rd and 18 giving up 19 yards to a dump off pass and a defense that for the last 3 weeks couldn't make a tackle to save their lives.

 

That Allen fumble.... Watson fumbled too no?  Hopkins fumbled too no?  Brees fumbled today too no?

 

Sure Allen made some mistakes but he also balled out and not many around him wanted to help.

 

You keep on being you thinking Josh sucks though.

Edited January 5, 2020 by Scott7975

[LABILLBACKER]

5 hours ago, billsfan_34 said:

Yep- Sean also has to take a hard look this offseason at the offense as a whole and what he wants it to look like. For 3 years now we have been at the bottom.

Exactly,  until we go hard at building a top 10 offense,  this team will wallow around 9 wins every year. It was our offense that got us to 4 straight SB's. Not our defense.  

[Reed83HOF]

3 hours ago, GoBills808 said:

 

@ScottLaw- Circled in red are Knox and Ford, unsurprisingly two rookies who both miss Cunningham. Morse is NOT responsible for picking up the LB. Plain as day.

 

3 players could not block 1 guy

[Buffalo_Stampede]

1 minute ago, Reed83HOF said:

3 players could not block 1 guy

They all thought someone else would get him, nearly got their QB hurt. 

[Phil The Thrill]

21 hours ago, billsfan_34 said:

Dabs called an awful second half and in OT played like we were pressed for time! Please Cleveland you can have him as your next HC. Allen was, at times, doing things that were completely stupid. On to the off-season.

Did Daboll call a bad game?  Or did Allen play below average?  Or was it both?  It’s hard to say

[Reed83HOF]

6 minutes ago, Phil The Thrill said:

Did Daboll call a bad game?  Or did Allen play below average?  Or was it both?  It’s hard to say

see frank gore & our FB & lee smith

[Phil The Thrill]

5 minutes ago, Reed83HOF said:

see frank gore & our FB & lee smith

Ok how about Josh’s fumble or the backward lateral or the pass to the FB?  Like I said, it’s a combination of many things 

[GoBills808]

1 minute ago, Phil The Thrill said:

Ok how about Josh’s fumble or the backward lateral or the pass to the FB?  Like I said, it’s a combination of many things 

Ask yourself why Dimarco is running a go

[Phil The Thrill]

Just now, GoBills808 said:

Ask yourself why Dimarco is running a go

It wasn’t the play call.  He ran out when Josh started scrambling

[Penfield45]

3 hours ago, GoBills808 said:

 

@ScottLaw- Circled in red are Knox and Ford, unsurprisingly two rookies who both miss Cunningham. Morse is NOT responsible for picking up the LB. Plain as day.

 

 

I couldn't believe this

 

it looked like Allen was on his way to a huge gain and the blockers totally let that dude run right passed them. disgusting execution. we could have had a 1st down near the 30 yardline 

[Reed83HOF]

5 minutes ago, Phil The Thrill said:

Ok how about Josh’s fumble or the backward lateral or the pass to the FB?  Like I said, it’s a combination of many things 

don't disagree - just saying that Daboll and what he brings on for personnel plays a big role as well

[GoBills808]

1 minute ago, Phil The Thrill said:

It wasn’t the play call.  He ran out when Josh started scrambling

Wrong. Dimarco was lined up wide and his route was the go. The other guy deep running a post is none other than Lee Smith. So consider the playcall and design.

 

 

[BeastMaster]

I'm ready to move on from him.

 

Just no identity or rhythm to the offense.

[Reed83HOF]

4 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

Wrong. Dimarco was lined up wide and his route was the go. The other guy deep running a post is none other than Lee Smith. So consider the playcall and design.

 

 

It's horrendous

[GoBills808]

Just now, Reed83HOF said:

It's horrendous

It’s simply not winning coaching. And it’s not the only example of some VERY questionable decisions from the staff during the game. The more I watch the more I blame coaching for the loss. They were uncharacteristically awful.

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

5 hours ago, jrober38 said:

 

Calling Allen the hero of the first half is crazy.

 

7 of our points came on a drive dominated by trick plays called by the Offensive Coordinator you're ragging on. 

 

Otherwise we did very little offensively. 

 

With Allen it's always someone else's fault. When he plays poorly, someone else always seems to get the blame for Allen's struggles as a passer against competent competition. 

 

The Texans pass D is horrible and Allen couldn't perform. Our QB posted another rating below 70 against a team that's allowed an average rating of 97.6 this season (25th in the NFL). 

You're not serious are you? We had 4 drives in the first half. In order 75 yards, 9 yards, 69 yards and 74 yards for a total of 227 yards and 3 scoring drives. I quit reading after that astute observation.

Edited January 5, 2020 by LOVEMESOMEBILLS

[Scott7975]

18 minutes ago, Phil The Thrill said:

Ok how about Josh’s fumble or the backward lateral or the pass to the FB?  Like I said, it’s a combination of many things 

Josh fumbled.  Qbs fumble.  Watson fumbled too.  Hopkins fumbled too.  Brees fumbled today too.  Wentz fumbled today.  Tannehill fumbled twice

 

Lateral was a mental mistake but he was trying to make a play.  Mahomes has done that and people call him genius.

 

The pass to the FB.... Why do we have a play design where are FB is even running that route?

Edited January 5, 2020 by Scott7975

[Reed83HOF]

Just now, GoBills808 said:

It’s simply not winning coaching. And it’s not the only example of some VERY questionable decisions from the staff during the game. The more I watch the more I blame coaching for the loss. They were uncharacteristically awful.

I put a lot on them, the players simply didn't execute well either. Whether it is the 3 blockers on the run above, poor tackling on defense, poor pass blocking on the OL, some bad passes from Josh as well. Everyone had a hand in it. The personnel choices, the play concepts, gore being active, calling pass plays instead of runs, all on coaching

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

18 minutes ago, Phil The Thrill said:

Ok how about Josh’s fumble or the backward lateral or the pass to the FB?  Like I said, it’s a combination of many things 

Fumbles happen especially when a QB is scrambling. The lateral was a play that as McClappy says, he would like to have back. The pass to the FB should've been caught, he jumped way too early. Next.

[Nihilarian]

1 hour ago, Meatloaf63 said:

You’re arguing with a brick wall, he made his mind up on draft night and won’t let it go. Better left ignored he doesn’t bring a shred of intelligence to the conversation...

Ahh, thanks. Didn't realize I was dealing with one of them. 

[GoBills808]

Just to reiterate: Daboll actually called a play, in an actual NFL playoff game, consisting of an empty backfield and Pat Dimarco, Devin Singletary, and Lee Smith lined up wide. Brown was lined up in the slot and McKenzie lined up as TE. Deep routes were run by Dimarco (go) and Smith (deep post). None of this a typo.

[Scott7975]

30 minutes ago, Phil The Thrill said:

It wasn’t the play call.  He ran out when Josh started scrambling

 

What? You're joking right?  It absolutely was the call and the design.

[billsfan_34]

48 minutes ago, Phil The Thrill said:

Did Daboll call a bad game?  Or did Allen play below average?  Or was it both?  It’s hard to say

Daboll abandoned the run man- that right there is a punishable offense lol

[Scott7975]

4 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

Just to reiterate: Daboll actually called a play, in an actual NFL playoff game, consisting of an empty backfield and Pat Dimarco, Devin Singletary, and Lee Smith lined up wide. Brown was lined up in the slot and McKenzie lined up as TE. Deep routes were run by Dimarco (go) and Smith (deep post). None of this a typo.

 

Its a freaking joke to go 5 wide with those guys lol.

[billsfan_34]

54 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Exactly,  until we go hard at building a top 10 offense,  this team will wallow around 9 wins every year. It was our offense that got us to 4 straight SB's. Not our defense.  

If you can have both sides top ten or higher your in business!

[Maine-iac]

1 hour ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Exactly,  until we go hard at building a top 10 offense,  this team will wallow around 9 wins every year. It was our offense that got us to 4 straight SB's. Not our defense.  

Can't agree with this.  The 4 SB teams rose from Smerlas, Smith, Bennett, Conlan, Kelso, Odomes ect ect.  In the SB years the offense came around and gets the credit for those SB's but it started with defense.  We are starting with defense and i certainly can't argue that we should stand pat with the offense but I have always and will always say play good defense and find a way to score points.  Having a top 10 offense certainly wouldn't hurt my feelings but I'd settle for scoring 23 or 24 ppg which shouldn't be unthinkable next year.

Edited January 5, 2020 by Maine-iac

[MPT]

25 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

Just to reiterate: Daboll actually called a play, in an actual NFL playoff game, consisting of an empty backfield and Pat Dimarco, Devin Singletary, and Lee Smith lined up wide. Brown was lined up in the slot and McKenzie lined up as TE. Deep routes were run by Dimarco (go) and Smith (deep post). None of this a typo.

 

As bad as this play design was, Allen still made a really bad decision. Brown had tons of space in the middle when the LBs collapsed to McKenzie on the pump fake, and Singletary was wide open with room to run on the sideline. 

 

Daboll should never have DiMarco lined up wide, and Allen should never throw it deep to him into double coverage. They are both to blame on that one.

[Dr.Sack]

Bills could have won. We didn’t make enough plays. Game over. 

[Steptide]

CRAYboll

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

1 hour ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Exactly,  until we go hard at building a top 10 offense,  this team will wallow around 9 wins every year. It was our offense that got us to 4 straight SB's. Not our defense.  

Really? Let's take a look. The first year of our run the defense was 6th in the league in scoring defense & 8th in yards allowed per game. They gave up 16.43 points a game. The last year of the run our defense finished 5th in scoring defense and 2nd in yards allowed per game. They gave up 15.125 points a game. This year we finished 2nd in scoring defense and 3rd in yards allowed per game. We gave up 16.2 points a game. 2 out of the 4 years our defense was as good, if not better than this year's defense, which was really good. 

[Penfield45]

A FB running a go route 20 yards downfield should show you there is zero hope for this team next season with Daboll in charge of the offense 

 

it doesn't matter if we have a top 3 defense for the next decade, we aren't winning anything without a good offense. 

[Phil The Thrill]

13 minutes ago, Penfield45 said:

A FB running a go route 20 yards downfield should show you there is zero hope for this team next season with Daboll in charge of the offense 

 

it doesn't matter if we have a top 3 defense for the next decade, we aren't winning anything without a good offense. 

Or a good QB

[GoBills808]

1 hour ago, MPT said:

 

As bad as this play design was, Allen still made a really bad decision. Brown had tons of space in the middle when the LBs collapsed to McKenzie on the pump fake, and Singletary was wide open with room to run on the sideline. 

 

Daboll should never have DiMarco lined up wide, and Allen should never throw it deep to him into double coverage. They are both to blame on that one.

Brown did not have tons of space. There was no one open. Allen was looking play side the entire time and eventually had to go opposite field to the dummy routes. 

[Nihilarian]

1 hour ago, Maine-iac said:

Can't agree with this.  The 4 SB teams rose from Smerlas, Smith, Bennett, Conlan, Kelso, Odomes ect ect.  In the SB years the offense came around and gets the credit for those SB's but it started with defense.  We are starting with defense and i certainly can't argue that we should stand pat with the offense but I have always and will always say play good defense and find a way to score points.  Having a top 10 offense certainly wouldn't hurt my feelings but I'd settle for scoring 23 or 24 ppg which shouldn't be unthinkable next year.

I disagree with this.

 

In 1990 the Bills had most prolific offense in the league #1 in points scored and with that "hurry up" "run and shoot offense" nobody could keep up with them. #3 in passing TD's, #2 in rushing TD's.

Going into that super bowl they were early +15 point favorites against the NY Giants. 

 

While the defense was good they were #6 points allowed, #8 in yards allowed and most notably weak up the middle against the run.(see NY Giants SB) What made that defense work was that the offense would get the lead and then let Bruce Smith, Biscuit loose in pass rushing.  Perhaps you missed that AFC playoff game against Miami in Buffalo 44-34. After this game Dolphins players were heard saying, "i can't believe we scored 34 points and lost". Championship game against the Raiders, 51-3.  

[Maine-iac]

14 minutes ago, Nihilarian said:

I disagree with this.

 

In 1990 the Bills had most prolific offense in the league #1 in points scored and with that "hurry up" "run and shoot offense" nobody could keep up with them. #3 in passing TD's, #2 in rushing TD's.

Going into that super bowl they were early +15 point favorites against the NY Giants. 

 

While the defense was good they were #6 points allowed, #8 in yards allowed and most notably weak up the middle against the run.(see NY Giants SB) What made that defense work was that the offense would get the lead and then let Bruce Smith, Biscuit loose in pass rushing.  Perhaps you missed that AFC playoff game against Miami in Buffalo 44-34. After this game Dolphins players were heard saying, "i can't believe we scored 34 points and lost". Championship game against the Raiders, 51-3.  

Buffalo emerged as a defensive team in the seasons before that.  We started winning as a defensive team.  Then Thurman emerged (88 or 89) and then Lofton and Beebe came along.  We started winning as a defensive team and were still a very good defensive team.  The offense was the icing on the cake and certainly a large part of going from playoff contender to SB team but that said argue all you want, we started as a defensive team.

Edited January 6, 2020 by Maine-iac

[BigBillsFan]

2 hours ago, Scott7975 said:

The pass to the FB.... Why do we have a play design where are FB is even running that route?

I don't like Daboll, but the play was perfect to be honest. He had the FB running that route to throw the D off defending underneath. It's a confusing play. The problem is you shouldn't pass to the FB there but someone open underneath like Brown. 

[Nihilarian]

8 minutes ago, Maine-iac said:

Buffalo emerged as a defensive team in the seasons before that.  We started winning as a defensive team.  Then Thurman emerged (88 or 89) and then Lofton and Beebe came along.  We started winning as a defensive team and were still a very good defensive team.  The offense was the icing on the cake and certainly a large part of going from playoff contender to SB team but that said argue all you want, we started as a defensive team.

Winning games as a defensive team? They were never the 85 Bears or 2000 Ravens, 1976 Steel curtain, 1972 no name Miami defense. The 2013 Seattle legion of Boom. 

 

I was at a game in 1987, Nov 29th to be exact in which the Bills played the Miami Dolphins. The Dolphins offense didn't cross the 50 yard line until late in the 4th when they benched Dan Marino and put in Don Strock, who promptly drove down the field to the end zone where the phins turned the ball over.

 

Final score, Buffalo 27, Miami 0. After this game I went and bought season tickets. That year the Bills defense was 12th overall. The offense with Ronnie Harmon, Rob Riddick, Kelly and Reed. This was the year they drafted Shane Conlan. the Bills ended that season 7-9. The offense was 24th, 16th.

 

 

In 1988 is what you are thinking of where the defense was 3rd in points, 4th in yards, while the offense was 14th and 12th. That year ended in the AFC Championship game in Cincy. Thurman Thomas was drafted in 88. So, 87, 88 the defense was better stat wise. Bills fans did nickname the Bills defense the "Blizzard defense".  

 

In 1989 the Bills defense was 14th in points allowed, 11th in yards. However, the offense 3rd in points, 5th in yards. That season ended in Cleveland in a wildcard game. Don Beebe was drafted in 89. Lofton was there for the 89 season. The Bills offense pulled to the forefront stat wise during the 89 season and never looked back. 

 

The offense, was never the icing on the cake as Jim Kelly was the main feature of that team since arriving in 1986.  Bills fans went nuts and the stadium started selling out once he was signed and came to Buffalo. While the 88 defense was better stat wise, it was Kelly's arm and Thurman running that got them to 12-4. 

 

 

[Best Williams Available]

5 hours ago, GoBills808 said:

Just to reiterate: Daboll actually called a play, in an actual NFL playoff game, consisting of an empty backfield and Pat Dimarco, Devin Singletary, and Lee Smith lined up wide. Brown was lined up in the slot and McKenzie lined up as TE. Deep routes were run by Dimarco (go) and Smith (deep post). None of this a typo.

With the game on the line ....

[26TrapDraw]

My two cents I am ok with him moving on to the browns or wherever . He's too conservative and at times I scratch my head with his BS conservative playcalling. I realize that some of it may be from McClappy but he's insanely inconsistent and gimmick plays are not a staple. After yesterday's second half dumpster fire he can pound sound.

[Wagon Circler]

There are quarterbacks half as good as Allen putting up much bigger numbers/points.

Daboll has to take some heat for that.

 

Edited January 6, 2020 by Wagon Circler