Joe B.: Bills Sacrificing Miserable Season For Long-Term Growth

[Mat68]

Let's see if McD can keep a team under 20 in a first half.  Buffalo Wrs need to learn how to uncover when Allen breaks the pocket.  How and when to get behind a defense in those circumstances.  Do those 2 things and maybe they can win a game or 2.

[Roundybout]

3 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

 

They gave you JUST AS much as Kerley (gone) Holmes (Cant Catch) 

 

Watkins, Goodwin, Hogan, Woods, Darby, Gilmore, Glenn

 

By all accounts, Coleman wasn't trying at all. 

 

Also come on, Goodwin was everyone's punching bag here, now we think he's some kind of god? Also Watkins and Glenn were hurt all the time and Gilmore still hates tackling.

[metzelaars_lives]

28 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

Then Why is Ducasse playing?

Why did Holmes and Kerley make the team NOT Coleman and Reiley?

Why is Mills and or Newhouse playing?

Why wasnt McCoy Dealt?

Why was cap space used on players that wont be here when rebuild over? 

 

 

This is the latest spin after they have been embarassed for two weeks. 

 

So what happened to win now win in the future did that go out the door with 47-3?

I realize you watch the ball every play like most of us but if you actually read the experts who break down every play, Ducasse is literally the least of our problems on the offensive line.  Why do people just randomly single out Ducasse?  It's actually kind of bizarre.

[Nick the Greek]

Short term pain for long term gain. 

 

this needs to happen. When we are rebuild next year, it will be fun to watch.

 

trust the process my friends.

 

And p.s. we made the playoffs last year. McBean isn’t a total amateur. 

[BuffaloRush]

Just now, MAJBobby said:

 

They gave you JUST AS much as Kerley (gone) Holmes (Cant Catch) 

 

Watkins, Goodwin, Hogan, Woods, Darby 

 

Nope.  Hogan was not this admin, that was Doug Whaley in 2016.  Both Beans and McDermott were in Carolina.

 

The Bills 100% made the right move by trading Sammy.  They weren't going to pick up his option (in fact, I think it was Doug Whaley who declined his option), realizing how much money he would command when his deal was done.  The Rams decided to move on from him as well.  He just wasn't worth the $14 million a year he got from KC.  

 

I think the Bills would have liked to keep Woods, but again, not with the deal he got from the Rams.

Goodwin?  Give me a break.  Sal Carpaccio shut down a fan on WGR when he brought his name up.   All of the fans wanted to move on from Goodwin because they thought he was always injured and could never play a season.  If McDermott or Whaley or whoever else was in charge in 2017, resigns Goodwin, fans would be up in arms.

 

The story on Darby was that it was a scheme issue.  I think the value they got for him was decent.  He's a slightly above average for a starting on a very good defense and they got a 3rd round pick for him.    

4 minutes ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

 

Darby is good and trading Dareus for a 5th was crime. They should have kept them and traded Tyrod and McCoy.

 

 

 

You are unfamiliar with the salary cap...

[jahnyc]

McBeane will need to show us that they know how to build a team, not just tear it down, which is the easy part.  Their free agent signings this offseason and some of their personnel moves have negatively impacted my confidence in their abilities to re-stock the talent on this team.  McBeane will have their opportunity, but the analogy to the Sabres rebuild led by Murray, and the possibility of a similar crummy outcome, does scare me.

[MAJBobby]

1 minute ago, BillsEnthusiast said:

 

By all accounts, Coleman wasn't trying at all. 

 

Also come on, Goodwin was everyone's punching bag here, now we think he's some kind of god? Also Watkins and Glenn were hurt all the time and Gilmore still hates tackling.

 

All youth core. They this Coaching staff got rid off 

[BuffaloRush]

Just now, Idandria said:

Short term pain for long term gain. 

 

this needs to happen. When we are rebuild next year, it will be fun to watch.

 

trust the process my friends.

 

And p.s. we made the playoffs last year. McBean isn’t a total amateur. 

Right on my friend! ? 

[klos63]

What is the long term strategy we are supposed to be seeing here? Who are our long term WR's, who's our future RB, our OL, a couple linebackers, CB.... I don't see any of those people on the roster. How do we get these people?

[BuffaloRush]

Just now, jahnyc said:

McBeane will need to show us that they know how to build a team, not just tear it down, which is the easy part.  Their free agent signings this offseason and some of their personnel moves have negatively impacted my confidence in their abilities to re-stock the talent on this team.  McBeane will have their opportunity, but the analogy to the Sabres rebuild led by Murray, and the possibility of a similar crummy outcome, does scare me.

 

Fair enough - thanks for a balanced opinion

[MAJBobby]

2 minutes ago, metzelaars_lives said:

I realize you watch the ball every play like most of us but if you actually read the experts who break down every play, Ducasse is literally the least of our problems on the offensive line.  Why do people just randomly single out Ducasse?  It's actually kind of bizarre.

 

But the youth movement is what was expected from the regime. So him playing goes directly against this latest propaganda 

[BuffaloRush]

3 minutes ago, BillsEnthusiast said:

 

By all accounts, Coleman wasn't trying at all. 

 

Also come on, Goodwin was everyone's punching bag here, now we think he's some kind of god? Also Watkins and Glenn were hurt all the time and Gilmore still hates tackling.

 

You are spot on here.  This what drives me crazy about the fan base.  You could take a poll and probably 85% of Bills fans would want to move on from Goodwin. 

 

Also fans did quite a bit of complaining about Sammy

[MAJBobby]

2 minutes ago, BuffaloRush said:

 

Nope.  Hogan was not this admin, that was Doug Whaley in 2016.  Both Beans and McDermott were in Carolina.

 

The Bills 100% made the right move by trading Sammy.  They weren't going to pick up his option (in fact, I think it was Doug Whaley who declined his option), realizing how much money he would command when his deal was done.  The Rams decided to move on from him as well.  He just wasn't worth the $14 million a year he got from KC.  

 

I think the Bills would have liked to keep Woods, but again, not with the deal he got from the Rams.

Goodwin?  Give me a break.  Sal Carpaccio shut down a fan on WGR when he brought his name up.   All of the fans wanted to move on from Goodwin because they thought he was always injured and could never play a season.  If McDermott or Whaley or whoever else was in charge in 2017, resigns Goodwin, fans would be up in arms.

 

The story on Darby was that it was a scheme issue.  I think the value they got for him was decent.  He's a slightly above average for a starting on a very good defense and they got a 3rd round pick for him.    

 

You are unfamiliar with the salary cap...

 

So alot of Youth tossed away that are performing all over the league. Put glad you like the latest damage control spin

[klos63]

3 minutes ago, metzelaars_lives said:

I realize you watch the ball every play like most of us but if you actually read the experts who break down every play, Ducasse is literally the least of our problems on the offensive line.  Why do people just randomly single out Ducasse?  It's actually kind of bizarre.

We have 4 problems on the offensive line, being the least of our line problems is still 25% of our line problem.

[Buffalo Barbarian]

2 minutes ago, BuffaloRush said:

 

Nope.  Hogan was not this admin, that was Doug Whaley in 2016.  Both Beans and McDermott were in Carolina.

 

The Bills 100% made the right move by trading Sammy.  They weren't going to pick up his option (in fact, I think it was Doug Whaley who declined his option), realizing how much money he would command when his deal was done.  The Rams decided to move on from him as well.  He just wasn't worth the $14 million a year he got from KC.  

 

I think the Bills would have liked to keep Woods, but again, not with the deal he got from the Rams.

Goodwin?  Give me a break.  Sal Carpaccio shut down a fan on WGR when he brought his name up.   All of the fans wanted to move on from Goodwin because they thought he was always injured and could never play a season.  If McDermott or Whaley or whoever else was in charge in 2017, resigns Goodwin, fans would be up in arms.

 

The story on Darby was that it was a scheme issue.  I think the value they got for him was decent.  He's a slightly above average for a starting on a very good defense and they got a 3rd round pick for him.    

 

You are unfamiliar with the salary cap...

 

Dareus deal could have been reworked, and how much is star costing us for his performance? You have to pay to have/keep good players.

 

 

[Heavy Kevi]

40 minutes ago, BuffaloRush said:

Great comments from Joe B.  He does a great job putting things into perspective and has been echoing what many of us have been saying for a while.  Read the comments in bold

 

https://www.wkbw.com/sports/bills/joe-b-7-observations-from-buffalo-bills-los-angeles-chargers-9_16_18

 

 

 

 

My guess is the Pegulas are feeling pretty optimistic about the Sabres, and they bottomed out for a long time to get where they are.

 

Then Sean McD and Beane come along. They promise to do the same. Tear it down to the studs, and rebuild. And then McB does something nobody saw coming, and takes a ragtag group of guys to the playoffs, followed by drafting the best QB prospect we have had in a score of years. Next year we will have 10ish picks in the draft, 400 gillion dollars in cap space, and the future QB of the offense and defense (MLB) already on the roster.

 

I believe the Pegs are feeling pretty good about McBeane, will stand pat at HC/GM, and are fully prepared to ride out the storm this year (and maybe more).

[Ol Dirty B]

I expected a down year. I expected something like this last year, in fact, I would have preferred it so we only had to give up draft capital to get Edmunds and they could have just had their choice of QB.

 

Instead, they middled it. I don't understand the Benjamin trade to this day at all. I don't get the Zay Jones pick. The timing of the Dareus trade didn't make much sense. The trading of Tyrod, bringing in McCarron then trading him, starting Peterman sequence did make much sense.

 

Ever since Sammy was traded everyone has wondered where the receivers were. Cordy is a proven talent in the league, and despite what everyone on here and the hosts at wgr will tell you "that you can't just trade for a starting o lineman, they're hard to find, they just don't give them away". We did just that.

 

They ate 15 mil in dead money just so they could spend another 10 on a dt who is worse. If anyone could come up with a better example of cutting off your nose to spite your face, please share, as it must be hysterical. 

 

The issue isn't the rebuild, or that they're bad. The issue is that they don't seem to have a plan in place other than cutting guys for not being "their guys" or blaming their predecessors.

 

I don't understand how this fanbase can be behind a guy who is so spineless. McDermott has never taken any responsibility for decisions he makes. He didn't own the Peterman experiment- twice, and he gave this awful comment about how they are a much better roster than what he inherited last week. 

 

 

 

 

[MAJBobby]

Just now, BuffaloRush said:

 

You are spot on here.  This what drives me crazy about the fan base.  You could take a poll and probably 85% of Bills fans would want to move on from Goodwin. 

 

Also fans did quite a bit of complaining about Sammy

 

Again just explain to me HOW Kerley and Holmes fit this expected growth pain year coming out of OBD. 

 

Explain to me how brining Kyle back does

 

how giving an Star big money does

 

Same with Murphy 

 

i mean if it is expected HOW do those offseason moves FIT the plan

[Roundybout]

5 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

 

All youth core. They this Coaching staff got rid off 

 

Assuming we did keep them, how are we paying them all?

[klos63]

1 minute ago, BuffaloRush said:

 

You are spot on here.  This what drives me crazy about the fan base.  You could take a poll and probably 85% of Bills fans would want to move on from Goodwin. 

 

Also fans did quite a bit of complaining about Sammy

the fans aren't being paid to make personnel decisions, it shouldn't matter what the fans think.

[BuffaloRush]

1 minute ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

 

Dareus deal could have been reworked, and how much is star costing us for his performance? You have to pay to have/keep good players.

 

 

 

There’s no guarantee Marcel would rework his phat contract

[Roundybout]

Just now, MAJBobby said:

 

Again just explain to me HOW Kerley and Holmes fit this expected growth pain year coming out of OBD. 

 

Explain to me how brining Kyle back does

 

how giving an Star big money does

 

Same with Murphy 

 

i mean if it is expected HOW do those offseason moves FIT the plan

 

Star and Murphy are the same age as Goodwin (28ish). There is your "youth core." Kyle gives leadership. Kerley did not so he wasn't chopped.

[MAJBobby]

1 minute ago, BillsEnthusiast said:

 

Assuming we did keep them, how are we paying them all?

 

Darby on Rookie Contract 

 

Woods is KBs Contract 

 

Watkins would likely be gone with current cap issues. Though maybe not because wouldnt need Holmes, Coleman, Kerleys cap numbers 

 

goodwin would have likely been the odd man out. Unless kept him and moved on from watkins. 

 

See didnt need to GUT all that youth

 

[BringBackOrton]

We have 3 players on the roster that will for sure be here in three years. That’s Allen, Edmunds and White. That’s not good.

[Big Gun]

20 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

 

They gave you JUST AS much as Kerley (gone) Holmes (Cant Catch) 

 

Watkins, Goodwin, Hogan, Woods, Darby, Gilmore, Glenn

Darius, Preston Brown, Ragland

[reddogblitz]

26 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

The Seahawks? 

 

What about them? They were mediocre for a couple years before taking off. The complete opposite of what the Bills are doing at the moment. 

 

hawks plan was better. The went 7-9 the 2 years before they took off. They then in one off season signed Matt Flynn, kept incumbant Tarvaris , and drafted Russell.

 

build up your team so that when you get a good QB you plug him in and you're off to the races. Saints did a similar thing before getting Brees.

 

bills decided to gut the team of talent and then throw in a rookie project QB. Interesting. I hope it works.

[Rico]

1 minute ago, MAJBobby said:

 

Darby on Rookie Contract 

 

Woods is KBs Contract 

 

Watkins would likely be gone with current cap issues. Though maybe not because wouldnt need Holmes, Coleman, Kerleys cap numbers 

 

goodwin would have likely been the odd man out. Unless kept him and moved on from watkins. 

 

See didnt need to GUT all that youth

 

Woods is the only one I might want now, though I was not a big fan of his while he was still here. I don't think he would've stayed anyways though, USC guy going back to LA and far away from TT.

[MAJBobby]

Just now, Rico said:

Woods is the only one I might want now, though I was not a big fan of his while he was still here. I don't think he would've stayed anyways though, USC guy going back to LA and far away from TT.

 

You wouldnt take Darby on his Rookie deal over well who is the CB now that Davis Quit? Pitts

[BringBackOrton]

4 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

 

Darby on Rookie Contract 

 

Woods is KBs Contract 

 

Watkins would likely be gone with current cap issues. Though maybe not because wouldnt need Holmes, Coleman, Kerleys cap numbers 

 

goodwin would have likely been the odd man out. Unless kept him and moved on from watkins. 

 

See didnt need to GUT all that youth

 

I get it but it was reasonable to get rid of a couple of those guys if they had good replacements in mind. I’m far more concerned after the disastrous results of the first FA period of the McBeane era. Davis retiring and Star looking like the worst FA signing in Bills history scares me.

[Albany,n.y.]

31 minutes ago, Formerly Allan in MD said:

Fine and dandy, but stop making mistakes like trading McCarron before you're convinced your designated starter has progressed from his disastrous rookie season, especially since his back-up is nothing more than a raw rookie you'd like to bring along slowly and not see debilitated since he has a very "offensive" line in front of him.

What if your basic assumption is wrong, and they had no intention of bringing Allen along slowly because after getting to know him they realized he could learn faster by playing, making mistakes, and correcting the mistakes?  

That's what I believe and if that's the case, there was no mistake trading McCarron.  Would they have liked to have sat Allen for the 1st 4 games, probably, but he was going to start by game 5 and beyond.  All Peterman's disaster did was move it up a little, definitely not a lot.  I thought their intentions were pretty obvious the day they put McCarron in for the final exhibition game with what was basically a For Sale sign on his back.  After a lackluster mini-camp & preseason, they didn't have a very high opinion of McCarron and didn't see any value in him playing ahead of Allen-ever. They also were never convinced in Peterman's progress nor did they ever consider Allen a "back-up". 

[MAJBobby]

Just now, BringBackOrton said:

I get it but it was reasonable to get rid of a couple of those guys if they had good replacements in mind. I’m far more concerned after the disastrous results of the first FA period of the McBeane era. Davis retiring and Star looking like the worst FA signing in Bills history scares me.

 

I get it. I would not mid getting rid of Any of them if there was a replacement on the team. Point is there wasnt. And STILL year two isnt 

[BringBackOrton]

Just now, MAJBobby said:

 

I get it. I would not mid getting rid of Any of them if there was a replacement on the team. Point is there wasnt. And STILL year two isnt 

I agree with whoever said above, they expected to be worse last year and they weren’t. Then they had to use more picks to get their guys.

 

imagine if we finished 3-13 last year? We’d have had like 7 picks in the first 3 rounds.

Edited September 17, 2018 by BringBackOrton

[Beast]

The Bills have, unfortunately, multiple lousy units.

 

Our WR’s suck.

 

Our TE aren’t very good.

 

The o-line is bottom of the barrel bad.

 

Our best player is a 30year old RB that will not be here for any “rebuild success”.

 

The QB position appears to have an up and comer but that remains to be seen.

 

The d-line, like the o-line, is absolute garbage.

 

Our LBers are young and suspect.

 

We have a great corner and two pretty good safety’s.

 

This team is so freaking far from being good. Let’s not kid ourselves.

 

 

 

 

[LABILLBACKER]

I don't think the process included accidentally going to the playoffs last year and giving fans some false hope. The rebuild should've started last year. We kept some players that should've been released.  We signed 2-3 mediocre FA's. They probably have a franchise qb but they're a year behind in the rebuild.  This will require us all to have more patience for 2020.

[Bill_with_it]

12 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

 

Again just explain to me HOW Kerley and Holmes fit this expected growth pain year coming out of OBD. 

 

Explain to me how brining Kyle back does

 

how giving an Star big money does

 

Same with Murphy 

 

i mean if it is expected HOW do those offseason moves FIT the plan

They teach. The mentor. They guide. Its a process.

[reddogblitz]

24 minutes ago, BuffaloRush said:

 

Don't be so negative.  Also which GOOD young players did they dump?

 

Darby

Rag!and

 

[Buffalo Barbarian]

10 minutes ago, BuffaloRush said:

 

There’s no guarantee Marcel would rework his phat contract

 

We have a 100 mill in cap space, how much would he actually take up?? And a 5th is still terrible, at minimum should have been a 2nd for a player of his ability.

 

 

[MAJBobby]

Just now, Bill_with_it said:

They teach. The mentor. They guide. Its a process.

 

Ahhh the mythical process that we are supposed to blindly trust and never question. 

[Batman1876]

15 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

 

But the youth movement is what was expected from the regime. So him playing goes directly against this latest propaganda 

The youngest roster is the cowboys they have 21 guys who are rookies or in their 2nd year, we have 20. That’s the “youth movement” that the average age alone doesn’t tell you about. 

[Buffalo Barbarian]

1 minute ago, reddogblitz said:

 

Darby

Rag!and

 

 

Ragland was no great loss.