Bucky Gleason Leaving TBN After Requesting a Buyout - Jerry Sullivan and Now Tim Graham Out

[JohnC]

2 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said:

Of course. But that is avoiding the discussion and seminal point of this specific debate. By saying, in a discussion of Jerry's negativism, that during the majority of Jerry's tenure the Bills and Sabres were poor teams and poorly run orgs, you are implying that those two facts were a large portion of the reason for his negativism. But if he was negative from the get-go, while the teams were not poor and not poorly run, that negates the poorness in your reasoning. 

I don't recall him being negative during the Polian era? He may have been but I don't remember it to be so. 

[IDBillzFan]

17 minutes ago, Peter said:

 

I never understood their disdain for the Pegulas as well. Harrington has displayed the same condescension toward them.

 

You will likely disagree with this, but disdain for the Pegulas comes down to two things: haves and don'ts.

 

Pegulas have a crapload of money and Sully don't. 

[BadLandsMeanie]

3 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

Jerry, you don't get it, even on your way out the door.   "They felt my voice was becoming bad for business."   Yes, Jerry, "they" felt it because it was true, and you refused and refuse to recognize it.   From your point of view, it's always been that your voice was the voice of truth and therefore worthy of publication - just because it came from you.  

 

Well, guess what?   Gifted writer that you are, your voice nevertheless often was rude, insensitive, nasty, biased and downright uncivil.   Your voice offended many, and because nothing is more important to you than your voice, you just didn't care.   People don't like being around nasty people, but you never understood that, so you don't seem to understand why your voice was bad for business.  

 

It's too bad for you, too, because after all the years you invested in covering horrible Bills teams, you're now not going to have a platform from which you could enjoy what looks to be a team on the rise.   Of course, your voice might not have appreciated that, either.   

 

I hope you come at your new gig with a different perspective.  You're insightful and you can write, but if you're lacking basic human decency, you're going to be bad for business. 

Wow!!

 

You have your battles on here but basically you don't go off on people. 

So when you do, it gets my attention and carries more weight. Wow. 

 

 

[Punching Bag]

16 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

I of course hope they find jobs; no reason to wish I'll for them.  But I doubt it will be writing; maybe for Bucky and less likely for Sullivan.  I imagine they'll be talking heads somewhere so they can scream all they want.

 

I DO without reservation and good reasons wish ill will for them.  I am hoping they can get jobs in Boston.  Maybe NE ESPN writer will quit, Rodakent will get NE and Sulky will get Rodakent's beat (and we will not notice difference).

[notwoz]

Sullivan was nothing more than a contrarian impersonating a disinterested observer. He's a pretty good writer, but his schtick had simply grown tiresome. 

To tell the truth, I can't remember anything Bucky wrote: good, bad or indifferent (which is probably not a good thing for a columnist). 

However, Harrington is simply a nobody who confuses snark with insight. I hope he completes the trifecta.

[Lurker]

26 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Sullivan covered two teams that were generationally bad. Of course he was more of a scathing critic than a giddy cheerleader.

 

Larry Felser and Jim Kelley covered just as many years of bad football and hockey and never "pulled a Sully."    Maybe the success of snarky ESPN shows like PTI and Internet bomb throwers changed the columnist playbook.   But both guys wrote themselves into a blind alley by pandering to the lowest common denomiinator of their readership, IMO...

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

1 minute ago, Limeaid said:

 

I DO without reservation and good reasons wish ill will for them.  I am hoping they can get jobs in Boston.  Maybe NE ESPN writer will quit, Rodakent will get NE and Sulky will get Rodakent's beat (and we will not notice difference).

 

...Jerry's calling may be writing obituaries....just sayin'................

[Nick the Greek]

I still refuse to pay $3 a month to read the BN.

 

I always hated Gleason tho so this a step in the right direction. 

[JohnC]

20 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said:

True in theory. But if he started out negative (i don't recall either way) then you cannot say that his negativity had anything to do with the performance of the teams.

I reread your response and what to clarify my response. I have never claimed that his negativity had anything to do with the performance of teams. What I have said is that the systemic failure of the pro teams certainly influenced his writing, as it should.  

[notwoz]

1 minute ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...Jerry's calling may be writing obituaries....just sayin'................

Actually, writing meaningful obituaries is a skill that most journalists never acquire. However, taking death notices from the local funeral parlors is something Sullivan might be able to handle. That or taking bowling scores on Friday nights. 

[Teddy KGB]

Sully was an embarrassment.   Good riddance 

[Kelly the Dog]

1 minute ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...Jerry's calling may be writing obituaries....just sayin'................

He will have a lot of opportunities. Like, for example, he could write for Breitbart News about all the good things the liberals do. He could cover MS-13 for the FBI. He could write about North Korea's humanitarian efforts. There are all kinds of places his unique skills may be coveted.

[JohnC]

3 minutes ago, Lurker said:

 

Larry Felser and Jim Kelley covered just as many years of bad football and hockey and never "pulled a Sully."    Maybe the success of snarky ESPN shows like PTI and Internet bomb throwers changed the columnist playbook.   But both guys wrote themselves into a blind alley by pandering to the lowest common denomiinator of their readership, IMO...

Jerry lasted for 29 years with the BN. That is a pretty long run. His longevity was not based on his lack of competency. 

[Peter]

8 minutes ago, LABillzFan said:

 

You will likely disagree with this, but disdain for the Pegulas comes down to two things: haves and don'ts.

 

Pegulas have a crapload of money and Sully don't. 

 

You probably hit at one of the root causes for their disdain. 

 

Jealousy. 

 

They always thought they knew better than anyone else and could not understand why the Pegulas should have the opportunity to own the teams. 

[HansLanda]

Sully tweeted that TBN said his column wasn't good for business. Do you know what isn't good for business? The entire site layout, design and monetization strategy. 

[Kelly the Dog]

3 minutes ago, JohnC said:

I reread your response and what to clarify my response. I have never claimed that his negativity had anything to do with the performance of teams. What I have said is that the systemic failure of the pro teams certainly influenced his writing, as it should.  

I understood what you said. But how can you say the systemic failure influence his writing if his writing was the same before the systemic failure? I also said that I don't recall either way whether he was negative in the beginning. I was going off a specific memory of a poster whose memory and anecdote seemed to say he was always like that. So I said IF he was always like that, the crappiness of the team can't be a reason.

[Punching Bag]

9 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Jerry lasted for 29 years with the BN. That is a pretty long run. His longevity was not based on his lack of competency. 

No it was based on union rules.

[Kelly the Dog]

This was great. Darryl Talley saying that Sully's criticism of him after one season motivated Talley to play better and a reason he is up on the Wall, so Talley thanked Sully. ?

 

https://twitter.com/DarrylTalley/status/1001603851231940610

[Andrew in CA]

Never like to see someone (essentially) fired but I have avoided reading either of these guys for years.  

[Lurker]

26 minutes ago, JohnC said:

I don't recall him being negative during the Polian era? He may have been but I don't remember it to be so. 

 

Polian and Jerry had some epic battles...

[Punching Bag]

Just now, Lurker said:

 

Polian and Jerry had some epic battles...

 

And if Jerry thinks he is front office material I hope he gets opportunity - in another AFCE team.

[HappyDays]

11 minutes ago, HansLanda said:

Sully tweeted that TBN said his column wasn't good for business. Do you know what isn't good for business? The entire site layout, design and monetization strategy. 

 

What isn't good for business is Twitter and social media. Who wants to pay to read some guy's opinion about the team these days? You can get that for free here. There are a few people here who write as well as any sports columnist. Now you have all-22 footage available to anyone who wants it, and all the interesting analysis that comes along with that. You have people tracking crazy advanced stats that casual fans never had access to. You can follow the players themselves on Twitter and Instagram. All the training camps and games are covered for free by the world at large. That's why local newspapers are dying. What happened to sports media is just a microcosm of what happened to all media.

[Lurker]

21 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Jerry lasted for 29 years with the BN. That is a pretty long run. His longevity was not based on his lack of competency. 

 

The Guild surely played a part in that as well...

[Punching Bag]

Forgot to post this:

[BadLandsMeanie]

It takes me at least 3 to 5 hours of watching all 22 game film to understand what really happened in the games each week. I think  it costs me 80 dollars too.

 

So I will subscribe to anybody who will write about what actually took place in the games in without a boatload of jargon. 

 

2.99 is nothing compared to how much time it takes me to know what is going on out there. It is fascinating all the stuff that really happens out there.

 

But I am not going to pay anybody to read about Bills games when I then still have to go and do the job of finding out the reality myself. 

 

NOBODY writes the story of the games. "Made substitutions" ... "made adjustments". Why? That is just, boring and tell  me nothing.

 

It could be like, Miller was getting beat so they brought the fullback in to help him but then the Pats attacked that set up by..... and so on.

 

Every game is like that. Coaching minds struggling against their counterparts and player against player and guys getting beat and their buddies helping and somebody steps up and pulls the team's berries from the fire with an insanely good play..

 

Stuff like that. Its wonderful. Why I want to pay to read crap that sounds like a stock market analysis?

 

Gimme that I will pay 10.99

 

Meanwhile I will do it myself at home with less than ZERO of the access the press have.

 

The sporting press is being beaten because they can be beaten. Period. Make  it so you are very, very hard to beat at what you are doing and then you will probably not have to worry about how easy it is to get what you do, for free in 10 other places.

 

 

 

 

 

[HalftimeAdjustment]

I don't enjoy the fact that TBN is having financial issues requiring staff cuts. However, I think Sullivan had essentially "jumped the shark" a while ago because his viewpoint was essentially an unchanging drone of negativity by now. I remember his columns as being more worthwhile years ago, and lately I just felt like there was little of substance. 

 

Some poster suggested the news should also drop Tim Graham, that is foolishness. He has (IMO) actually produced some interesting, useful reporting - regardless of whether you appreciate his attitude. 

[Kelly the Dog]

2 minutes ago, HalftimeAdjustment said:

I don't enjoy the fact that TBN is having financial issues requiring staff cuts. However, I think Sullivan had essentially "jumped the shark" a while ago because his viewpoint was essentially an unchanging drone of negativity by now. I remember his columns as being more worthwhile years ago, and lately I just felt like there was little of substance. 

 

Some poster suggested the news should also drop Tim Graham, that is foolishness. He has (IMO) actually produced some interesting, useful reporting - regardless of whether you appreciate his attitude. 

Agreed. Countless people here conflate TG's personality and perceived thin skin with his ability to write stories. He's a very good sportswriter, especially good at longform. He also has thin skin and is snarky, although I personally find him quite funny.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

1 hour ago, Kelly the Dog said:

He will have a lot of opportunities. Like, for example, he could write for Breitbart News about all the good things the liberals do. He could cover MS-13 for the FBI. He could write about North Korea's humanitarian efforts. There are all kinds of places his unique skills may be coveted.

 

...or...perhaps a career with Charmin writing on THEIR product............

[GunnerBill]

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

Jerry lasted for 29 years with the BN. That is a pretty long run. His longevity was not based on his lack of competency. 

 

Well take it from someone who has written for a living my whole career, including some time as a sports journalist, Sully can't write. 

 

33 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said:

Agreed. Countless people here conflate TG's personality and perceived thin skin with his ability to write stories. He's a very good sportswriter, especially good at longform. He also has thin skin and is snarky, although I personally find him quite funny.

 

Tim Graham can write. He is a talented journalist capable of crafting thought provoking and coherent argument... and I think that even when I disagree with him. 

 

That is the difference. 

[Punching Bag]

2 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Well take it from someone who has written for a living my whole career, including some time as a sports journalist, Sully can't write. 

 

 

Sulky CAN write, he just cannot write WELL.   I did spend some time as a newspaper editor.

Edited May 30, 2018 by Limeaid

[GunnerBill]

Just now, Limeaid said:

 

Sulky CAN writer, he just cannot write WELL.   I did spend some time as a newspaper editor.

 

Well obviously he is capable of putting pen to paper. His column was constantly incoherent, poorly structured and lacking a coherent narrative. Oh... and his use of the beautiful language my country gave to the world bordered on butchery. 

[Kelly the Dog]

2 minutes ago, Limeaid said:

 

Sulky CAN write, he just cannot write WELL.   I did spend some time as a newspaper editor.

The Lemonade Stand News?

[Punching Bag]

6 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said:

The Lemonade Stand News?

 

I was thinking of like Rorschach in Watchmen. He already has the attitude and the smell.

[bbb]

2 hours ago, bbb said:

 

He was negative since Day One.  I remember talking to my father about how negative this Sullivan guy is.  My father got Alzheimer's in 1992 and we wouldn't have had that conversation after that. 

 

2 hours ago, JohnC said:

During the major period of time when he covered the Bills the team was not only bad but poorly run. You don't have to be a sports columnist to recognize that. 

 

2 hours ago, Kelly the Dog said:

True in theory. But if he started out negative (i don't recall either way) then you cannot say that his negativity had anything to do with the performance of the teams.

 

Exactly.  I know for a fact he was negative right away.  I mean look above where people talk about Bruce Smith, Darryl Talley and Bill Polian all being targets.

 

BTW, I think he had some talent - I remember the Talley plugging in article, and a great summary of the Sabres playoff run during the Finals in '99 - "it's not life or death, but it is life" - I'll never forget that line.............And, he wrote glowing articles about a family friend.

 

But, for the most part, he mailed it in and just sucked on a sour grape.  The BN agenda (or at least Bucky, Sully and Harrington) is sickening.  As I said, he just said a few months ago "I have little regard for Buffalo sports fans" 

[JohnC]

1 hour ago, Lurker said:

 

The Guild surely played a part in that as well...

The BN could have fired him anytime they wanted to regardless what the guild thought. 

1 hour ago, Lurker said:

 

Polian and Jerry had some epic battles...

So what? Bill Polian is a HOF GM. But he had a volatile temper especially when challenged. So he got challenged and reacted and vice a versa. What's so unusual about a media member in any town  questioning those involved in running a franchise in any sport? What did you expect him to do, kneel? 

[bbb]

10 minutes ago, JohnC said:

The BN could have fired him anytime they wanted to regardless what the guild thought.

 

Not from what I heard.  I was told they couldn't even fire Rodney McKissic when he was caught plagiarizing. 

[jwhit34]

6 hours ago, K-9 said:

Hopefully, new columnists will emerge who can offer biting criticism when warranted without the childish and unprofessional snark that too often littered their work. For example, old school journalists like Larry Felser had no problem leveling strong opinions against the Bills while maintaining their professionalism which allowed them to also maintain solid relationships within organization. Bucky and Sully were esentially blacklisted because of their inability in doing so which only served to further feed their spite and cloud their objectivity far too often in their work.

 

They are not offering to buy these guys out to hire new columnists, they are eliminating jobs, it's a central element to the cost cutting happening at newspapers. In Rochester, they got rid of Scott Pitoniak and Bob Matthews in the sports department and guys like Jeff Spevak in the Arts/Living dept. a few years ago and they were not replaced. It's different with the Democrat & Chronicle because they are a Gannett newspaper and they have replaced the writers on staff with USA Today content. There used to be opinion pieces 6-7 days a week now Leo Roth does 1 or 2. TBN will do the same. 

 

Newspapers have been slow to react to the changing times, they didn't figure out how to migrate to online profitably and not enough people still want to get a newspaper. 

[That's No Moon]

1 hour ago, HansLanda said:

Sully tweeted that TBN said his column wasn't good for business. Do you know what isn't good for business? The entire site layout, design and monetization strategy. 

All of those things are also true but kudos to the people who complained about him for years.  They stopped clicking on his work and that eventually made it go away.

[PromoTheRobot]

2 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

http://www.trendingbuffalo.com/life/heres-proof-bucky-gleason-is-full-of-****/

 

 

Remember this? 

 

Bucky Gleason, June 23, 2013:

Bucky Gleason in today’s Buffalo News:

LoL! Both links have been scrubbed from the Buffalo News website.

6 minutes ago, bbb said:

 

Not from what I heard.  I was told they couldn't even fire Rodney McKissic when he was caught plagiarizing. 

Both Gleason and Sullivan had job protection from their union. Note that Sully wasn't fired. He quit after a demotion, losing his column. Quit in a snit. 

[Lurker]

15 minutes ago, JohnC said:

The BN could have fired him anytime they wanted to regardless what the guild thought. 

 

 

Nope.

 

Article 5 of the Guild contract:  Job Security      http://www.buffaloguild.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/2016-Guild-Contract-.pdf

 

1. There will be no discharge or dismissal except for just and sufficient cause.

 

4. The News will be the judge of the competence of all employees covered by this contract, provided this is not construed to take away the right of a discharged employee or the Guild to take up the merits of a competency discharge as provided in Article 17 (Grievance and Arbitration Article).

 

Article 6—Dismissals to Reduce the Force

 

1. The News is responsible for controlling the size of its working force. Any dismissal to reduce the force will be only for economic reasons to remedy the stability of the newspaper.

 

2. All dismissals that may be necessary to reduce the force will be made in each job classification in reverse order of bargaining unit seniority. However, any employee dismissed from their classification may use their bargaining unit seniority to displace a less senior employee in another classification or group, which provides an equal or less rate of pay, if they are competent and able to perform the duties of such junior employee and if bumped to a job in the same group they will retain the same rate of pay and, if in a lower rated group, they will receive the maximum salary of that group or their present salary, whichever is less.