Why all the picks for a project QB?

[Niagara Dude]

Beane and company are idoits giving up (2) number 2's to move 5 spots when the only team in front of them who may have been looking to draft a QB was Miami.  We really could of used both those 2 picks in the second round.  So many holes on this roster giving up picks for a guy who is a project with high end arm talent was a stupid move.  Not other team was going to give that many picks for a project type of player.  

 

www.nfl.com/videos/.../Soul-Science-How-fast-can-Josh-Allen-throw

Edited April 27, 2018 by Niagara Dude

[Buffalo_Stampede]

Why? Because they believe in him. 

[D521646]

Just now, TheTruthHurts said:

Why? Because they believe in him. 

 

 

They "believed" in NP, too..

 

Just sayin.

 

Tim-

[dlonce]

6 minutes ago, Niagara Dude said:

Beane and company are idoits giving up (2) number 2's to move 5 spots when the only team in front of them who may have been looking to draft a QB was Miami.  We really could of used both those 2 picks in the second round.  So many holes on this roster giving up picks for a guy who is a project with high end arm talent was a stupid move.  Not other team was going to give that many picks for a project type of player.  

 

 

 

There were teams behind them that might have been looking to trade up to get a QB. Sitting and waiting is a dangerous game.

Who says Miami didn’t want one of these guys too.

 

Two solid first rounders out of this draft. I’m fine with using those second rounders.

Edited April 27, 2018 by dlonce

[Ramza86]

6 minutes ago, Niagara Dude said:

Beane and company are idoits giving up (2) number 2's to move 5 spots when the only team in front of them who may have been looking to draft a QB was Miami.  We really could of used both those 2 picks in the second round.  So many holes on this roster giving up picks for a guy who is a project with high end arm talent was a stupid move.  Not other team was going to give that many picks for a project type of player.  

 

 

 

I disagree. The Cardinals jumped the Dolphins. The fins would have taken either QB. 

 

Two 2s is actually not a bad price for the guy you want there. 

[dgrochester55]

I have my worries on Allen, but I do not get why people are saying "we shouldn't have traded up to seven because only Miami needed a QB"  Clearly other teams were going to trade up.   Even after Buffalo, Arizona traded up for Rosen.    That is two teams right there that wanted to trade and MIami as a threat to draft a QB ahead of Buffalo, plus whoever else wanted to trade up that you didn't hear about. 

 

Regardless of competency level, no front office of a team is going to give up extra picks without a valid reason.   The reality is, if Buffalo waited at 12, none of the top 4 quarterbacks were going to be left. 

Edited April 27, 2018 by dgrochester55

[Chris66]

Miami wasnt trading up they were staying put and grabbing Fitzpatrick anyway.

Cardinals would still have traded for Rosen. Allen would have been thete for free

[greeneblitz]

This ignorant attitude only happens because you are wrong in youre evaluation of Josh Allen, many had him going 1st overall to the Browns, all had him in the top 10, that's not a project QB, at least anymore of a project QB than every rookie QB should be.

4 minutes ago, Chris66 said:

Miami wasnt trading up they were staying put and grabbing Fitzpatrick anyway.

Cardinals would still have traded for Rosen. Allen would have been thete for free

Miami had every single QB in for a visit, they were near certainly taking Rosen or Allen. not to mention many other QB needy teams would have had the ammo to get him before the Bills picked.

Edited April 27, 2018 by greeneblitz

[HailMary]

22 minutes ago, Niagara Dude said:

Beane and company are idoits giving up (2) number 2's to move 5 spots when the only team in front of them who may have been looking to draft a QB was Miami.  We really could of used both those 2 picks in the second round.  So many holes on this roster giving up picks for a guy who is a project with high end arm talent was a stupid move.  Not other team was going to give that many picks for a project type of player.  

 

 

And you can confirm there was no other team on the phone with Tampa trying to swing a deal? 

[Niagara Dude]

19 minutes ago, TheTruthHurts said:

Why? Because they believe in him. 

You can believe in him and still get him for less,  look at what the Cardinals gave up for Rosen.  I thought one number 2 and a later pick would have been more then enough.

[Chris66]

You dont give up 2 good picks for a qb that needs to learn how to be a qb.

[Beast]

1 minute ago, Niagara Dude said:

You can believe in him and still get him for less,  look at what the Cardinals gave up for Rosen.  I thought one number 2 and a later pick would have been more then enough.

 

Just stop.

 

Not freaking one of us knows how the draft was going so quit pretending like you do.

 

I have no damned idea how Allen will turn out. None. But people that know football better than I do had him mocked higher than seven in drafts I saw.

 

Let’s hope it works out. 

19 minutes ago, Chris66 said:

Miami wasnt trading up they were staying put and grabbing Fitzpatrick anyway.

Cardinals would still have traded for Rosen. Allen would have been thete for free

 

Hey, another guy that had access to war rooms around the league.

 

I feel privileged to be on a board with so many NFL insiders.

 

 

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

6 minutes ago, Niagara Dude said:

You can believe in him and still get him for less,  look at what the Cardinals gave up for Rosen.  I thought one number 2 and a later pick would have been more then enough.

 

As has been stated likely the Bills were competing against the Cardinals and maybe Miami too.  So they had to give up more to get the deal done.  Did Tampa play them a bit maybe, would a #2 and the 65th also got the deal, maybe, but not a huge difference anyway between 56 and 65.  Once the Bills made the trade, Arizona likely didn't have any competition in the trade they made so they were able to give up less, plus was a lower pick to start off with.  Oakland also may have been more eager to trade down so took less to do it.  

 

When you consider a couple of the trades Beane has made, TT, Glenn I'd tend to give him the benefit of the doubt too.

 

One thing I know for certain is that I know as much as anyone on this board knows about who will be good and who won't and that is that I have no idea, and neither does anyone else.

Edited April 27, 2018 by Ed_Formerly_of_Roch
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[Buffalo_Stampede]

8 minutes ago, Niagara Dude said:

You can believe in him and still get him for less,  look at what the Cardinals gave up for Rosen.  I thought one number 2 and a later pick would have been more then enough.

Not in their opinion. Why did they spend what they did? Because that's what they felt they had to do. Pretty simple. 

 

Were they right? We won't know for a few years. Do I think they're right? No. I think they just fired themselves. 

[Woodman19]

I personally love the irony of all the people who hate Peterman for having no arm strength are generally the same ones who also hate Allen.

[CaptnCoke11]

40 minutes ago, Niagara Dude said:

Beane and company are idoits giving up (2) number 2's to move 5 spots when the only team in front of them who may have been looking to draft a QB was Miami.  We really could of used both those 2 picks in the second round.  So many holes on this roster giving up picks for a guy who is a project with high end arm talent was a stupid move.  Not other team was going to give that many picks for a project type of player.  

 

www.nfl.com/videos/.../Soul-Science-How-fast-can-Josh-Allen-throw

And you’d be sitting here today calling them idiots If they waited and missed out.. 

Edited April 27, 2018 by CaptnCoke11

[atlbillsfan1975]

Has anyone checked into the Dolphin board to see what their fans are saying?

 

[thebandit27]

10 minutes ago, Chris66 said:

You dont give up 2 good picks for a qb that needs to learn how to be a qb.

 

You also don't spend a 1st round pick on a 6'2" guard with T-Rex arms and ask him to play LT

 

But some teams are stupid

[billsbackto81]

7 minutes ago, Chris66 said:

You dont give up 2 good picks for a qb that needs to learn how to be a qb.

That's nonsense. He may need some seasoning with certain mechanics but he's not that raw a prospect. He was Top 3 in mostly everyone's  charts.

[Chris66]

Arm strength you can work on. Not understanding what defenses are doing is a bit different.

[thebandit27]

Just now, CaptnCoke11 said:

And you’d be sitting here today calling them idiots I’d they waited and missed out.. 

 

No, he'd be calling them "idoits"

[Thurman#1]

 

33 minutes ago, Niagara Dude said:

Why all the picks for a project QB?

 

 

Probably because they think of him less as a project and more of a development guy. There's a small difference there in that project QBs are sort of maybe possibly after a while types while the idea behind a development guy is that with development he stands a good chance. Clearly the Bills think he's more than a project.

 

Besides, the whole "he has to be able to start immediately" thing is more a fan concern than a team concern. The teams tend to hope they start immediately but be willing to spend time if it's necessary, though plenty of teams then end up bowing to pressure and playing the guy too soon and undermining their chances. Hopefully this administration will be stronger than that.

[RiotAct]

it’s okay, our amazing Offensive/Quarterbacks staff will turn him into a star.

[thebandit27]

Just now, Chris66 said:

Arm strength you can work on. Not understanding what defenses are doing is a bit different.

 

Technique and reading keys you can work on, T-Rex arms and guard bodies can't be fixed

 

See how easy this is?

[Chris66]

Just now, thebandit27 said:

 

You also don't spend a 1st round pick on a 6'2" guard with T-Rex arms and ask him to play LT

 

But some teams are stupid

I think BB has earned the benefit of the doubt. At least he has won something or five. People Blasted the Mankins pick as well

[thebandit27]

Just now, Chris66 said:

I think BB has earned the benefit of the doubt. At least he has won something or five. People Blasted the Mankins pick as well

 

He's been mediocre at best as a drafter.

 

And you probably weren't around if you think the Mankins pick was similar. People said he couldn't play OT in the NFL--they were right.

[Rob's House]

I'm imagining the reaction had the Bills stayed at 12, missed out on the top 4 QBs, and then it came out that it would have only cost 2 2nds to move up.

[Thurman#1]

13 minutes ago, Chris66 said:

You dont give up 2 good picks for a qb that needs to learn how to be a qb.

 

 

Yeah. But Allen doesn't need to learn to be a QB. He needs to develop some areas of his knowledge and mechanics. If he's successful this will have been a brilliant move. You're focusing on entirely the wrong question.

 

The right question isn't how long it will take for him to be a starter. It's whether he will be a top ten or top twelve starter. And that we don't know.

[Chris66]

1 minute ago, thebandit27 said:

 

He's been mediocre at best as a drafter.

 

And you probably weren't around if you think the Mankins pick was similar. People said he couldn't play OT in the NFL--they were right.

He was never drafted to play ot. So not sure what your point is.

They are most likely going to move Cannon to Lt and use him at rt.

[thebandit27]

1 minute ago, Chris66 said:

He was never drafted to play ot. So not sure what your point is.

They are most likely going to move Cannon to Lt and use him at rt.

 

Nobody criticized the Mankins pick in light of his moving to guard 

 

Please, please move Cannon to LT. I can't wait to see that.

[Thurman#1]

4 minutes ago, thebandit27 said:

 

He's been mediocre at best as a drafter.

 

And you probably weren't around if you think the Mankins pick was similar. People said he couldn't play OT in the NFL--they were right.

 

 

I wish this was so. 

 

For a team that has drafted consistently in the late 20s, he's done a damn good job keeping the team at that level. And yeah, sure Brady and Belichick's own abilities have meant a lot. But nonetheless they've managed to keep that machine stoked and rolling for a very long time. He's drafted well, partly because he arbitrages picks so well. But drafting late is a handicap that never seems to have troubled them. That's good drafting.

 

[peterpan]

Allen has all the physical tools.  Mentally he is really slow and doesn't see simple blitzes or make easy High school level reads consistently. 

 

In 2-4 years he MIGHT develop and be as good as Josn Rosen is right now.  Rosen will likely be competing for Superbowls on his rookie contract while the Bills are still wondering if Allen will be the guy or not. 

 

McBean just penned their own oink slips if this kid doesn't perform. 

[Chris66]

4 minutes ago, thebandit27 said:

 

Nobody criticized the Mankins pick in light of his moving to guard 

 

Please, please move Cannon to LT. I can't wait to see that.

Cannon has been their best lineman for the last 2 years. He played quite well when he filled in for Solder.

Also not worried about the pick Scar gave his seal of approval. If he thinks he can play thats good enough for me

[billsfan_34]

57 minutes ago, Niagara Dude said:

Beane and company are idoits giving up (2) number 2's to move 5 spots when the only team in front of them who may have been looking to draft a QB was Miami.  We really could of used both those 2 picks in the second round.  So many holes on this roster giving up picks for a guy who is a project with high end arm talent was a stupid move.  Not other team was going to give that many picks for a project type of player.  

 

www.nfl.com/videos/.../Soul-Science-How-fast-can-Josh-Allen-throw

Because Tanny has no one behind him and has knee problems. Good chance if Allen is there the Fins take him. This team believes he can be a franchise guy- time will tell.

[thebandit27]

Just now, Chris66 said:

Cannon has been their best lineman for the last 2 years. He played quite well when he filled in for Solder.

Also not worried about the pick Scar gave his seal of approval. If he thinks he can play thats good enough for me

 

The point is it's easy to criticize a pick from here based on meaningless platitudes 

[xRUSHx]

47 minutes ago, Niagara Dude said:

You can believe in him and still get him for less,  look at what the Cardinals gave up for Rosen.  I thought one number 2 and a later pick would have been more then enough.

Nobody knows if Arizona or even Miami was willing to pay almost as much for that 7 pick. They might have got a call that said hey Arizona/Miami called they want our pick do you want it or does Arizona/Miami get it? Eitherway they got who they wanted and didnt lose out like Miami did. I wanted Rosen but I am more then ok with the move up for who they wanted the most over just taking the one that was left or got stuck with a Jackson or 2nd-3rd round prospect. Arizona was worried enough about Miami to jump them so insider information I am sure prompted the trades that happened.The Whaley waiting to long game is why this team always missed on getting a QB that ended up on a team willing to spend. Now Miami has to wait for a lower rated QB since no other was worth such a high pick. 

 .

Edited April 27, 2018 by xRUSHx

[rodneykm]

25 minutes ago, thebandit27 said:

He's been mediocre at best as a drafter.

 

 

I may be mistaken, but wasn't Beane hired after last years draft? 

[Rosen-not-Chosen]

They paid more than double to make the move to 7.  Foolish.

[xRUSHx]

Just now, Rosen-not-Chosen said:

They paid more than double to make the move to 7.  Foolish.

Again how do you know Arizona or Miami didn't call to offer almost as much for pick 7? 

[SoCal Deek]

The real question is who made the better deal? The Bills or Arizona? Each got a QB and you could’ve swapped the names. Rosen and Allen will be linked for a few years now....just like Darnold and Mayfield will be.