Andrew Luck to Bills speculation/chatter

[SouthNYfan]

38 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

The winning records came it what was literally the worst division in the history of football.

 

The Colts lost on purpose to get him and then let go of an all time great with Super Bowls in his FUTURE to clear a spot.  He cost them a lot and would cost us a ton of picks too.

 

I don't think I have ever called him a bust.  He is not Ryan Leaf.  But he had the highest expectations of anyone ever coming out of college.  He has come nowhere close to meeting them.  8 years later Emperor Luck is still having everyone tell him his new clothes look awesome.

 

Where are you getting 8 years?

He has been in the league for 4 full seasons, one half season, and one missed season.

He was drafted in 2012.

Manning barely had any years left in the tank when he left them, and his neck was a complete question mark.

He played 3 great seasons with Denver, then his neck was done for by the last one.

 

Worst division in the history of football?

I guess he didn't beat anybody but his division.

Division wasn't good, but to call them the worst in the history of football is absurd.

 

2012 the Texans were 12-4

 

2013 Luck beat both the broncos and Seahawks (you know, the legion of boom Superbowl champs that year) where he led them to 34 and 39 points against those teams.

 

2014 the Texans were 9-7, hardly "worst division ever" territory, and he went to the AFC championship game

 

Your bias against luck is obvious.

The fact that you don't think he was one of the top5 QBs in the game before his injury removes all credibility you have in regards to him.

 

Edited February 2, 2018 by SouthNYfan

[YoloinOhio]

2 minutes ago, SouthNYfan said:

 

Where are you getting 8 years?

He has been in the league for 4 full seasons, one half season, and one missed season.

He was drafted in 2012.

Manning barely had any years left in the tank when he left them, and his neck was a complete question mark.

He played 3 great seasons with Denver, then his neck was done for by the last one.

 

Worst division in the history of football?

I guess he didn't beat anybody but his division.

Division wasn't good, but to call them the worst in the history of football is absurd.

 

2012 the Texans were 12-4

 

2013 Luck beat both the broncos and Seahawks (you know, the legion of boom Superbowl champs that year) where he led them to 34 and 39 points against those teams.

 

2014 the Texans were 9-7, hardly "worst division ever" territory, and he went to the AFC championship game

 

Your bias against luck is obvious.

The fact that you don't think he was one of the top5 QBs in the game before his injury removes all credibility you have in regards to him.

 

4merper4mer is known for comparing Luck to a certain North Korean dictator in the sense that neither is able to be criticized 

[Sherlock Holmes]

4 hours ago, nucci said:

You want guys with serious injuries on this team? Kuechly has had 3 bad concussions already and Luck hasn't thrown pain free in over a year

They should be cheap then right? I mean they're boh ready for the glue factory apparently.

[Nihilarian]

37 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

The winning records came it what was literally the worst division in the history of football.

 

The Colts lost on purpose to get him and then let go of an all time great with Super Bowls in his FUTURE to clear a spot.  He cost them a lot and would cost us a ton of picks too.

 

I don't think I have ever called him a bust.  He is not Ryan Leaf.  But he had the highest expectations of anyone ever coming out of college.  He has come nowhere close to meeting them.  8 years later Emperor Luck is still having everyone tell him his new clothes look awesome.

Jeez, Dude, the guy has only been in the NFL for 5 years now and he took that hapless Colts team to an 11-5 record in his first three seasons. 

 

The Colts run game and defense have been pretty bad his entire time with the Colts not to mention the offensive line protecting him has been just as bad. No QB in the NFL can win without a decent team around him and AFAIC Luck has carried that team on his back his entire NFL career. Besides TY Hilton name me one player on offense that has made the pro bowl other than Luck. 

[prissythecat]

3 minutes ago, Nihilarian said:

Jeez, Dude, the guy has only been in the NFL for 5 years now and he took that hapless Colts team to an 11-5 record in his first three seasons. 

 

The Colts run game and defense have been pretty bad his entire time with the Colts not to mention the offensive line protecting him has been just as bad. No QB in the NFL can win without a decent team around him and AFAIC Luck has carried that team on his back his entire NFL career. Besides TY Hilton name me one player on offense that has made the pro bowl other than Luck. 

 

You are not going to convince 4merper4mer that Luck is a very good quarterback lol.    

[SouthNYfan]

5 minutes ago, prissythecat said:

 

You are not going to convince 4merper4mer that Luck is a very good quarterback lol.    

 

I'm starting to see that.

 

Look, I know I'm pretty opinionated, and at times more adamant than I should be with my assessment of things, but Jesus Christ...

This guy seems like he's an agent who Andrew Luck fired and now has a vendetta.

 

I wonder if it's a girl that Andrew Luck wouldn't go to the junior prom with??

[4merper4mer]

32 minutes ago, SouthNYfan said:

 

Where are you getting 8 years?

He has been in the league for 4 full seasons, one half season, and one missed season.

He was drafted in 2012.

Manning barely had any years left in the tank when he left them, and his neck was a complete question mark.

He played 3 great seasons with Denver, then his neck was done for by the last one.

 

Worst division in the history of football?

I guess he didn't beat anybody but his division.

Division wasn't good, but to call them the worst in the history of football is absurd.

 

2012 the Texans were 12-4

 

2013 Luck beat both the broncos and Seahawks (you know, the legion of boom Superbowl champs that year) where he led them to 34 and 39 points against those teams.

 

2014 the Texans were 9-7, hardly "worst division ever" territory, and he went to the AFC championship game

 

Your bias against luck is obvious.

The fact that you don't think he was one of the top5 QBs in the game before his injury removes all credibility you have in regards to him.

 

The 8 years includes 2 years plus of super hype while he was Stanford.  Are you denying this happened?

 

Do you think he has lived up to his status as greatest prospect in football history?

[SouthNYfan]

1 minute ago, 4merper4mer said:

The 8 years includes 2 years plus of super hype while he was Stanford.  Are you denying this happened?

 

Do you think he has lived up to his status as greatest prospect in football history?

 

I think he was well on his way there until the shoulder injury, which as it stands, is a complete unknown.

 

He stepped into the NFL and performed at an elite level from year one.

 

The fact that you act like he's been hot garbage is completely confusing.

[RochesterRob]

1 hour ago, thebandit27 said:

 

Imagine if they traded Luck and then both Cleveland and the Giants picked QBs in front of them...they'd be trading a franchise QB for the 3rd QB in the class.  It wouldn't be whichever QB he wants.

 

Which is why, IMO, the trade of Luck wouldn't happen until--at the earliest--the Colts are on the clock.  More likely, they'd make their pick (assuming the QB that they want is there), then trade Luck to someone else in time to make their other pick(s) in the first round.

  My feeling as well that the Colts will not doing anything until they are on the clock.  

[4merper4mer]

5 minutes ago, SouthNYfan said:

 

I think he was well on his way there until the shoulder injury, which as it stands, is a complete unknown.

 

He stepped into the NFL and performed at an elite level from year one.

 

The fact that you act like he's been hot garbage is completely confusing.

Never said he was hot garbage....I said he hasn't lived up to his hype.  Was the time Matt Hasselbeck replaced Luck and improved the Colts record considered pre injury or post injury?  Which injuries are you counting?

[Cruiserplayer]

5 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

Never said he was hot garbage....I said he hasn't lived up to his hype.  Was the time Matt Hasselbeck replaced Luck and improved the Colts record considered pre injury or post injury?  Which injuries are you counting?

Should this trade be an easy sell to the Colts?Luck hasn’t lived up to his hype. Brissett  on the other hand is better than we thought he would be. Maybe they should give us a draft pick to take him.

[KDIGGZ]

2 hours ago, thebandit27 said:

 

Imagine if they traded Luck and then both Cleveland and the Giants picked QBs in front of them...they'd be trading a franchise QB for the 3rd QB in the class.  It wouldn't be whichever QB he wants.

 

Which is why, IMO, the trade of Luck wouldn't happen until--at the earliest--the Colts are on the clock.  More likely, they'd make their pick (assuming the QB that they want is there), then trade Luck to someone else in time to make their other pick(s) in the first round.

that is what the discussions now could be around.  "hypothetically, if we take a QB would you give us your 1st and a player for Luck?"  they will want a deal in principle and then wait until the draft to make sure they get their guy.  it's likely that someone could trade up and get that player before so of course they need to hold their cards close to the vest

[BigBuff423]

One issue I see with any team, be it Bills or someone else, with waiting until Colts are on the clock - and I agree that it would make sense for the Colts to do just that - is regarding the ability to actually have Luck take the physical. 

 

If Colts and let's say, Bills, wait until #3 is on the clock, and they trade Luck, then the Bills would presumably lose let's say, #21, Glenn, and 2nd this year, and a 3rd next year (just for the sake or argument)....then, Luck would need to pass a physical and meet the medical criteria the Bills believe is acceptable. If that's the case, that can't be done on the night of the Draft, so then what? Do the Bills four days later say to Colts, nope, Luck isn't good enough to go, give us all the picks and Glenn back. Your medical staff fouled this one up...?? 

 

At that point, obviously it's too late....and if the argument is, Well, Colts doctors say he's good to go, gave the records to the Bills and then the Bills doctors reviewed those records provided by the Colts.......but there's just so much wrong with that and it would still need to be done on that evening....I would HOPE the Bills would demand to review Luck themselves, along with the records and to test his shoulder by throwing / evaluating his motion at least before actually consummating the trade, i.e. the standard "must pass a physical" clause, but again that can't be done on Draft night. So, the only way this would make sense for any team, including the Bills, is:

1. Trade is done before the Draft, even if it is two days before but Bills' doctors and trainers were able to look at, poke, prod and review his shoulder and motion plus the records and interview him directly to see what he says

2. Trade the night of, but everything would have to be for 2019 picks or Day 2 / 3 picks....I sincerely hope the Bills are NOT dumb enough to try and trade for a guy who might not ever throw again the same way he did a few years ago, which is the version of Luck you'd be trading for.....

Edited February 2, 2018 by BigBuff423

[CritMark]

43 minutes ago, Nihilarian said:

Jeez, Dude, the guy has only been in the NFL for 5 years now and he took that hapless Colts team to an 11-5 record in his first three seasons. 

 

 

I happen to agree that Luck is a top tier talent but I am afraid the 'hapless Colts' description may be a bit of revisionist history.  In 2010 Manning led them to a 10-6 record.  Without any Qb anyone would remember in 2011 with Manning out, they were indeed awful.  Luck comes in in 2012 and restores order.

 

The whole team did not fall apart the year before luck arrived, just the QB play.  For those who forget:

 

Kerry Collins - 3 games, 49.0% completions, 2 TD/1 Int and a rating of 65.9 

 

Curtis Painter - 9 games, 54.3% completions, 5 TD/9 INT and a rating of 66.6 (that was the highest rating of his career, the other two years with very limited games 9.8 & 19.0 rating respectively)

 

Dan Orlovsky - 8 games, 63.2% completions, 6 TD/4 INT and a rating of 82.4 (Also the highest rating of his career)

 

Obviously some games w/multiple QBs but the point is, they were BAD.  This was not a perpetually bad team, just a one year bump due to QB issues.

 

 

[billsfan89]

If the Colts want to trade Luck for a decent but not spectacular return (Let's say pick 21 and our 4th round pick this year plus a pick next year) I would stay the !@#$ away from that trade. The Colts wouldn't trade Luck away for such a low return unless he was damaged goods. 

[YoloinOhio]

2 minutes ago, billsfan89 said:

If the Colts want to trade Luck for a decent but not spectacular return (Let's say pick 21 and our 4th round pick this year plus a pick next year) I would stay the !@#$ away from that trade. The Colts wouldn't trade Luck away for such a low return unless he was damaged goods. 

I tend to agree with that... but i also think there could be some push from Luck’s side to be traded (possibly) and don’t forget irsay  is crazy 

Edited February 2, 2018 by YoloinOhio

[SWATeam]

1 minute ago, billsfan89 said:

If the Colts want to trade Luck for a decent but not spectacular return (Let's say pick 21 and our 4th round pick this year plus a pick next year) I would stay the !@#$ away from that trade. The Colts wouldn't trade Luck away for such a low return unless he was damaged goods. 

I wouldn't assume the Colts know what they are doing.  I mean they did trade us Hughes for Sheppard

[26CornerBlitz]

3 minutes ago, SWATeam said:

I wouldn't assume the Colts know what they are doing.  I mean they did trade us Hughes for Sheppard

 

The GM who made that deal is long gone. 

[ndirish1978]

What IS the procedure for trading a player during the draft if they fail their physical?

[BuffaloHokie13]

8 minutes ago, billsfan89 said:

If the Colts want to trade Luck for a decent but not spectacular return (Let's say pick 21 and our 4th round pick this year plus a pick next year) I would stay the !@#$ away from that trade. The Colts wouldn't trade Luck away for such a low return unless he was damaged goods. 

What if it were, say, 21, 22, next year's 1st, and Glenn?

[ndirish1978]

So the "source" for this is a confirmed gossip website with no actual insiders? I'm in. 

[4merper4mer]

22 minutes ago, Cruiserplayer said:

Should this trade be an easy sell to the Colts?Luck hasn’t lived up to his hype. Brissett  on the other hand is better than we thought he would be. Maybe they should give us a draft pick to take him.

The market should dictate whether the Colts or their trade partner want to trade.  I assume the Colts take a cap hit for the bonus if they trade him.  They would certainly acknowledge being in rebuild mode.  They would also lose a popular community guy.

 

Although he hasn't lived up to his hype, he isn't bad or anything.  Of course the Colts wouldn't and shouldn't trade him without getting value back. He isn't Osweiler.  He nearly matched Hasselbeck who had a nice career.  I do question what the other team should do given his name alone connotes visions of his projections.  Should a team give up several ones because he was the be all and end all 8 years ago?  

 

Im leaving the shoulder out of this because we only know it has been a while and we don't know the prognosis.  The Colts might and they would share the info in a trade.  The whack a doo trip to Europe doesn't have a good look though.

 

If I were the Bills I'd have a long talk with the kid to see where his head is at, I'd offer the Colts a 2018 2 and 2019 2 with the 2019 turning into a 1 if he plays 14 regular season games, and turning into a 4 if he plays less than 8.  If I'm the Colts that probably isn't enough.

[BillsFan2313]

29 minutes ago, CritMark said:

 

I happen to agree that Luck is a top tier talent but I am afraid the 'hapless Colts' description may be a bit of revisionist history.  In 2010 Manning led them to a 10-6 record.  Without any Qb anyone would remember in 2011 with Manning out, they were indeed awful.  Luck comes in in 2012 and restores order.

 

The whole team did not fall apart the year before luck arrived, just the QB play.  For those who forget:

 

Kerry Collins - 3 games, 49.0% completions, 2 TD/1 Int and a rating of 65.9 

 

Curtis Painter - 9 games, 54.3% completions, 5 TD/9 INT and a rating of 66.6 (that was the highest rating of his career, the other two years with very limited games 9.8 & 19.0 rating respectively)

 

Dan Orlovsky - 8 games, 63.2% completions, 6 TD/4 INT and a rating of 82.4 (Also the highest rating of his career)

 

Obviously some games w/multiple QBs but the point is, they were BAD.  This was not a perpetually bad team, just a one year bump due to QB issues.

 

 

 

So, the one year they didn't have a great QB in that time frame, they were awful? I think you just proved his point.

[buffalobloodfloridahome]

On ‎2‎/‎1‎/‎2018 at 4:11 PM, dorquemada said:

 

it's not as far fetched as some are making it out to be.  he carries a lot of risk right now, and is making crazy money.  I bet if the Bills offered them their 2 firsts and a player, maybe a little more, it would be a coup for the Colts, 3 first round pics, and a credible player like Glenn?  I think McDaniels would like that.  First off, it would immediately make the Colts HIS team versus Luck's, and he'd have the draft capital to build a contender, almost immediately.

Plus they have Brissett who can hold place until the Rookie gets in. They have allot of holes on that team and Luck draws a huge salary. Sounds crazy but who knows. All I know is that I would be buying his jersey immediately.

[BuffaloHokie13]

pre 6/1 trade: $22.2M Dead Cap, $2.2M Cap Savings

post 6/1 trade: $9.4M Dead Cap, $15M Cap Savings, $12.8M Dead cap in 2019

[YoloinOhio]

22 minutes ago, BuffaloHokie13 said:

What if it were, say, 21, 22, next year's 1st, and Glenn?

IF healthy and fully cleared, i do it

[BuffaloHokie13]

1 minute ago, YoloinOhio said:

IF healthy and fully cleared, i do it

I guess my question is if that were the price, are you less suspicious of the medicals? Obviously we'd never know either way until things played themselves out.

[Fan in Chicago]

28 minutes ago, BuffaloHokie13 said:

What if it were, say, 21, 22, next year's 1st, and Glenn?

That is a lot particularly for the reasons crayonz wrote about. For that price, we should be able to move up and grab aQB from this years draft, no?

[SouthNYfan]

51 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

Never said he was hot garbage....I said he hasn't lived up to his hype.  Was the time Matt Hasselbeck replaced Luck and improved the Colts record considered pre injury or post injury?  Which injuries are you counting?

 

 

You mean the time luck tore cartridge in multiple ribs in week 3 against the Titans, in which he won the game, missed 3 weeks, then tried to play through it for 4 more games before being shutdown for the season due to the injury, after receiving painkiller injections before and during each game, games which they lost to:

 

-the eventual 12-4 Patriots and Brady

-the eventual 15-1 Panthers and cam during his mvp and Superbowl season

-the 7-9 saints with Brees during a 3 game hot streak of them scoring 31, 27, 52 points 

 

All of which were 1 score loses

 

Then he beat the broncos, you know, who went 12-4 and won the Superbowl, before he was shutdown for the season from a kidney laceration he received during a hit that game.

 

 

Your a moron when it comes to Andrew Luck.

[CritMark]

10 minutes ago, BillsFan2313 said:

 

So, the one year they didn't have a great QB in that time frame, they were awful? I think you just proved his point.

 

Quite the contrary.  Having a good team with a good QB, being bad with AWFUL QB play, and returning to a good team does not mean the whole team was inherently bad.  What it means is the team has the capacity to be at least a respectable team with a good QB.

 

I have read on here more times than I can count how if we had QB XXX we would win x # games more.  That doesn't mean the whole team was bad.  

 

Let's look at past year.  The Bills win 9 games.  If a QB of the equivalent talent of Painter is at the helm we may win maybe 3 or 4 and I'm not sure I would bet on that.  Does that mean all the rest of the players on the team went to ****? 

 

The point I was making was Luck did not take over a terrible team.  He inherited a better than average team that went through a year with awful QB play. 

[Augie]

5 minutes ago, Fan in Chicago said:

That is a lot particularly for the reasons crayonz wrote about. For that price, we should be able to move up and grab aQB from this years draft, no?

 

It would have to be Darnold or Rosen, and even then it’s a gamble. A healthy Luck is a sure thing, in my mind. Expensive, but a known and proven talent.

 

What is the deal with  Luck’s giant contract, anyway? I probably missed that somewhere...

[Cruiserplayer]

5 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

It would have to be Darnold or Rosen, and even then it’s a gamble. A healthy Luck is a sure thing, in my mind. Expensive, but a known and proven talent.

 

What is the deal with  Luck’s giant contract, anyway? I probably missed that somewhere...

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/indianapolis-colts/andrew-luck-9811/ approximately 23 mill left in guarantees.

[4merper4mer]

14 minutes ago, Fan in Chicago said:

That is a lot particularly for the reasons crayonz wrote about. For that price, we should be able to move up and grab aQB from this years draft, no?

Sadly, it might not be enough.

[YoloinOhio]

7 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

It would have to be Darnold or Rosen, and even then it’s a gamble. A healthy Luck is a sure thing, in my mind. Expensive, but a known and proven talent.

 

What is the deal with  Luck’s giant contract, anyway? I probably missed that somewhere...

His contract looks a lot better now post Carr, Stafford, and (soon) Cousins

[4merper4mer]

13 minutes ago, SouthNYfan said:

 

 

 

 

 

Your a moron when it comes to Andrew Luck.

 

Kim Jung QB acknowledges your appreciation for his perfection but demands the use of proper grammar in doing so.  Anything less will sully his image.

[Bruce_Stools]

1 minute ago, 4merper4mer said:

 

Kim Jung QB acknowledges your appreciation for his perfection but demands the use of proper grammar in doing so.  Anything less will sully his image.

Yea idiot, it's YORE.  Get it right next time

[HansLanda]

I like this in theory, but when was the last time Luck actually participated fully in even a practice? Hell, when was the last time he threw period? 

 

If Luck's health is back, I'm 100% on board with trying to get him. I just have questions about that shoulder. 

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

1 minute ago, HansLanda said:

I like this in theory, but when was the last time Luck actually participated fully in even a practice? Hell, when was the last time he threw period? 

 

If Luck's health is back, I'm 100% on board with trying to get him. I just have questions about that shoulder. 

 

...agree.....and I think the ONLY way you could ever pull a deal off is if Irsay is HEAVILY sedated (......shouldn't be a problem then).....................

[Fan in Chicago]

29 minutes ago, SouthNYfan said:

 

.

 

 

Your a moron when it comes to Andrew Luck.

Even ignoring your rather ironic choice of words, you need to be careful disparaging this particular poster. 

[Augie]

12 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

His contract looks a lot better now post Carr, Stafford, and (soon) Cousins

 

Just saw that.... that’s always the case, I guess. What seems absurd today will eventually be a deal. These guys now get generational wealth. I bet some people thought we gave Jack Kemp too many peanuts at some point.