Blame this loss on FO

[Nihilarian]

Watkins does nothing if the QB can't get the ball to him or sails it ten feet over his head or at his feet.

Actually, Watkins did nothing for the Rams today as he was targeted 4 times and caught nothing.

 

This team needs an AJ Green clone in a guy that can stay healthy and help win games every week.

 

This week the team was screwed once Charles Clay went out.

 

 

O-line is a disgrace. Why sign Groy and start Ducasse?

Why is Mills in the NFL? If the wanted to rest Glenn until Tampa then why dress him this week?

Dawkins is much much worse than CK.

The run scheme blows too.

I also agree with this. The current Bills O line coach sucks and the OC isn't far behind him.

 

The run game went from first in the league the last two years to 17th this year!

[JohnC]

They definitely purged talent. That's undeniable. At the same time it's a big picture type of approach. They are a little ahead of schedule. They shouldn't have hired Castillo and they should use guys to their strengths. They have done that on the defensive side and to an extent with Tyrod. The design of the running game doesn't fit the personnel and the OL is being wasted. The pass catchers are the worst in the league. They hate Dareus even though he makes plays when he's out there. Lastly, Tre White is the only draft pick that we can feel good about at this time.

 

At the same time they are a big upgrade from Rex. They need to do some things right and check their arrogance a little (i.e. Glenn may not be starting). In general 3-2 is about what we could have hoped for but this team has some major issues. Maybe they will be able to address some over the break.

Excellent analysis although I will quibble with some of your positions. Where I strongly agree with you is that this new regime is taking a big picture approach. That's why it purged some talent that in the short run would have clearly made a difference. Watkins is an obvious example of that. As far as the stalled running game the problem as I see it is mostly due to the lack of a credible/modern passing game that will open up more space. The defenses are stacking the line and there is too much congestion for McCoy to find a lane. Even working with such a handicap he is playing heroically.

 

As I have said on other posts this staff has done a masterful job in reconstituting the defense. This was done in one offseason. This regime needs to be saluted for their smart and cost effective player acquisitions. Next offseason attention has to be focused on the offense. Until the qb position is upgraded so a modern passing game can be run this franchise will continue to be stuck in the muck of mediocrity. I have felt all along that this was a three to four year rebuilding project. If the Bills can get a qb such as Mayfield on its roster that time frame will be shortened. Tyrod Taylor is an earnest player who is simply a bridge qb. Anyone who thinks otherwise is not worth arguing with. Either the qb issue is addressed this offseason or the same status of irrelevance will be maintained.

 

I want to make it clear I'm not feeling pessimistic with what has gone on with this new staff. Quite the opposite---I'm impressed with what has been done so far. Next offseason, the wrestling coach and his staff have to do what they could have done the previous offseason i.e. address the most influential position on the field.

[Bill_with_it]

The Rams have so many options though on O. Maybe they will share?

He is being labeled as other worldly talent wise; if that is the case there is literally zero that should stop him from producing. Sooner or later the fans here will recognize that Sammy stops Sammy from producing.

[Scott7975]

Actually, Watkins did nothing for the Rams today as he was targeted 4 times and caught nothing.

 

This team needs an AJ Green clone in a guy that can stay healthy and help win games every week.

 

This week the team was screwed once Charles Clay went out.

 

 

I also agree with this. The current Bills O line coach sucks and the OC isn't far behind him.

 

The run game went from first in the league the last two years to 17th this year!

Its even worse than that I'm afraid. Not only are we 16th/17th in yards but we are second in attempts. If our attempts were average we would be around last in the league.

[FLXbillsmafia]

Its even worse than that I'm afraid. Not only are we 16th/17th in yards but we are second in attempts. If our attempts were average we would be around last in the league.

You're right, it is worse. Last year, we were not only first in yards, but first in yards per rush with 5.3. This year we are 27th in the league with 3.4 yards per rush.

 

I do think the Shotgun style of running we had with Lynn really maximized McCoy's and Tyrod's running abilities. Having Gilislee didn't hurt either. We have played some of the higher ranked rush defenses, but there is no doubt that this running game is a far cry from what the Bills had in 15 and 16.

[BurpleBull]

O-line is a disgrace. Why sign Groy and start Ducasse?

Why is Mills in the NFL? If the wanted to rest Glenn until Tampa then why dress him this week?

Dawkins is much much worse than CK.

The run scheme blows too.

I find it extremely weird how when a lot of you guys speak badly about the O-line you manage to miss out on badmouthing Incognito.

 

C. Kouandjio was not garbage by the way. Was good pass blocking.

[bigduke6]

FO dumped Sammy cuz Sammy was only worried about Sammy. Could he have helped our putrid passing O this year? of course. Was his lockerroom cancer worth a coupla wins? Nope. This team isnt set up to bow to the needs of a diva WR who really hasnt done anything except get hurt multiple times.

 

So OBD shipped him off and got what they could for him.

 

Some of you are acting like Tyrod was good when Sammy was healthy, know what i remember? Sammy bitching cuz Taylor wasnt targeting him, or when he did target him, he threw Sammy into terrible spots so he could take big hits. There was a 4 game stretch at one point that it looked like Tyrod was going to get all our receivers at the time killed.

 

Taylor hasnt progressed. I fully believe that the 3-1 start is a surprise to the coaches and the FO.

 

You say the right things, but sometimes u dont really believe them. This was a get started year, not, hey its playoffs or bust year. You dont stockpile picks if your heading for the playoffs.

[White Linen]

The WR's suck and Tyrod is even worse. Not a good combo.

 

Tyrod can't get it done with viable WR's - how is it supposed to work with no WR's?

 

If you're not wide open and his first option - Tyrod can't get the ball to you. It's a lot to expect out of this group of WR's.

[BringBackFergy]

I like the team comes 1st concept , but its very possible Buffalo is 5 - 0 with Sammy IMO.

Absolutely. Sammy was 0-0 with 4 targets today. He would have killed it today in Cinci!!!

 

I've been saying this too and I've never even been a Watkins fan.

 

It's just hard to understand this new regime's thought process if they truly weren't tanking and expected to compete with a makeshift WR roster that's arguably among the worst, if not the absolute worst, since the drought started 17 years ago.

 

Bottom line is Beane telegraphed this offense being one dimensional and the consequences that have resulted now that McCoy and the entire running game has been rendered obsolete in Buffalo.

Love how you fellas say Ive been saying this for weeks. Show me the link.

[Figster]

Absolutely. Sammy was 0-0 with 4 targets today. He would have killed it today in Cinci!!!

Love how you fellas say Ive been saying this for weeks. Show me the link.

If your comment was meant to convince me Sammy sucks at the WR position good luck with that Fergy.

[Kelly the Dog]

Absolutely. Sammy was 0-0 with 4 targets today. He would have killed it today in Cinci!!!

So if OBJ played on the Bills today in Cincinnati he would have fractured his ankle the same way? Of all the stupid analogies going around every week, the one that makes the point if talented player A played in a different game with different plays and different players under different circumstances the exact same thing would have happened may be the very stupidest.

[Figster]

So if OBJ played on the Bills today in Cincinnati he would have fractured his ankle the same way? Of all the stupid analogies going around every week, the one that makes the point if talented player A played in a different game with different plays and different players under different circumstances the exact same thing would have happened may be the very stupidest.

I won't go that far but...

[BringBackFergy]

So if OBJ played on the Bills today in Cincinnati he would have fractured his ankle the same way? Of all the stupid analogies going around every week, the one that makes the point if talented player A played in a different game with different plays and different players under different circumstances the exact same thing would have happened may be the very stupidest.

Nice try. Stop crying about SW14 and his Facebook merchandise...hes gone and wouldnt have helped when you have a QB that cant decide whether to throw, run or take a ****. Dumb argument if you ask me.

[Kelly the Dog]

Nice try. Stop crying about SW14 and his Facebook merchandise...hes gone and wouldnt have helped when you have a QB that cant decide whether to throw, run or take a ****. Dumb argument if you ask me.

How can you say with a straight face that because he got 4-0 in one game - or totally ineffective - that would have happened in this game. Because that is what you said. It's beyond stupid for a talented player.

 

For a non talented player he will likely suck in both games.

[BringBackFergy]

How can you say with a straight face that because he got 4-0 in one game - or totally ineffective - that would have happened in this game. Because that is what you said. It's beyond stupid for a talented player.

 

For a non talented player he will likely suck in both games.

Hey Einstein...you jumped on my ass for a comment to Figster who said the Bills would likely be 5-0 if we retained Sammy. How is it that your in-depth criticism didnt pick up on that gem of analysis? Same concept you are criticizing right?

[Boatdrinks]

He is being labeled as other worldly talent wise; if that is the case there is literally zero that should stop him from producing. Sooner or later the fans here will recognize that Sammy stops Sammy from producing.

This team is better with Watkins than they are without right now. I doubt Goff was going Shermans way very often. He's barely comfortable throwing to SW yet. He's a talented WR yes, something the Bills have precious little of right now. SW has still had more pr Alice time with TT at this point than with Goff

[Kelly the Dog]

Hey Einstein...you jumped on my ass for a comment to Figster who said the Bills would likely be 5-0 if we retained Sammy. How is it that your in-depth criticism didnt pick up on that gem of analysis? Same concept you are criticizing right?

We may be 5-0 if we had Sammy. Impossible to know but its the one glaring thing we are missing. You said he had no catches and used his stats from a different game to sarcastically say he wouldn't have helped. Its stupid.

[BringBackFergy]

This team is better with Watkins than they are without right now. I doubt Goff was going Shermans way very often. He's barely comfortable throwing to SW yet. He's a talented WR yes, something the Bills have precious little of right now. SW has still had more pr Alice time with TT at this point than with Goff

Kelly the Dog said we cant compare Sammy on the Rams to having Sammy on this team. Your argument fails.

[Boatdrinks]

How can you say with a straight face that because he got 4-0 in one game - or totally ineffective - that would have happened in this game. Because that is what you said. It's beyond stupid for a talented player.

For a non talented player he will likely suck in both games.

Is the CIN defense as good as SEA now? Do they have Sherman? I don't think the Bills played vs the legion of Boom today. It's a terrible comparison. SW would have more value to the Bills this year than the Rams I'm agreeing with you Kelly btw Edited October 9, 2017 by Boatdrinks

[BringBackFergy]

We may be 5-0 if we had Sammy. Impossible to know but its the one glaring thing we are missing. You said he had no catches and used his stats from a different game to sarcastically say he wouldn't have helped. Its stupid.

LOL. LOL. Great logic.

Is the CIN defense as good as SEA now? Do they have Sherman? I don't think the Bills played vs the legion of Boom today. It's a terrible comparison. SW would have more value to the Bills this year than the Rams

Nope. Cant compare the same player on two different fields. Good play or piss poor play. And Sammy didnt catch a ball today, not because of the great Legion...it was because LA has so many other weapons (like Robert Woods...and Kupp). Lol

[Kelly the Dog]

Is the CIN defense as good as SEA now? Do they have Sherman? I don't think the Bills played vs the legion of Boom today. It's a terrible comparison. SW would have more value to the Bills this year than the Rams

I didn't in any way make that comparison. Never said we would win. Only that it's possible. I was only saying that it's stupid to assume in a different game with different players and different plays under different circumstances the same result will happen. That's all.

Kelly the Dog said we cant compare Sammy on the Rams to having Sammy on this team. Your argument fails.

That is what I said! You said it would be the same! Jesus.

[CanadianFan]

Steelers lost to the Jags, its called the NFL.

 

Jags have a lot of talent. Marrone is finally making them play up to their talent. On alternative weekends. And this is the difference between great coaching and merely good coaching. Great coaches keep their teams from having emotional let downs. And re-focus the players mentally for the next opponent regardless of their quality. And that's what I'm going to keep harping on.

[BringBackFergy]

I didn't in any way make that comparison. Never said we would win. Only that it's possible. I was only saying that it's stupid to assume in a different game with different players and different plays under different circumstances the same result will happen. That's all.

Cool. Then its stupid to assume wed be 5-0 if we retained Sammy. Thats what I thought.

[Kelly the Dog]

Cool. Then its stupid to assume wed be 5-0 if we retained Sammy. Thats what I thought.

I said "we may be..." - "it's impossible to know." Look it up.

[CanadianFan]

8 players now have at least 1 catch for Goff. Watkins 0.

He was keeping Sherman busy. Corner explained to you the offensive concepts last week didn't he? Still didn't get it?

 

 

Bills' WRs today caught 3 passes for 34 yards. A big play threat would really help the offense.

Exactly. Imagine if we could have taken advantage of Bengal's WEAK SECONDARY. Instead we had UB wideouts playing as pro receivers.

Edited October 9, 2017 by CanadianFan

[Noogie75]

don't trade for anyone, this is not a superbowl winning team a WR does not put us over the top.

A good QB does.

[HappyDays]

I saw two of the targets. One Sammy just gave up on. Didn't think pass was coming. I think those are inexcusable. One in first half he was open deep. Good pass is a long completion.

If Sammy is nothing but a deep threat on a complementary offense, we made a great move trading him for a 2nd.

Edited October 9, 2017 by HappyDays

[Watkins90]

I say trade a fourth to the Rams for Watkins. Doesn't look like Goeff wants to use him anyways.

[Kelly the Dog]

If Sammy is nothing but a deep threat on a complementary offense, we made a great move trading him for a 2nd.

I didn't watch the whole game. Seemed like Sherman just lined up right across from him most every play. I will have to watch the replay to see if that was true. Or rely on someone who watched it close.

[Boatdrinks]

If Sammy is nothing but a deep threat on a complementary offense, we made a great move trading him for a 2nd.

He's more than that , but he got there in August. It'll take awhile to get involved and establish a chemistry with Goff . This team has no WRs and he'd mean more to the Bills than the Rams this season

[Sweats]

Putting a rookie CB on a premier WR was a HUGE mistake, but what else are they supposed to do when that rookie is the best of the bunch..................YIKES!!!

[HappyDays]

He's more than that , but he got there in August. It'll take awhile to get involved and establish a chemistry with Goff . This team has no WRs and he'd mean more to the Bills than the Rams this season

That argument is starting to wear thin. 0 catches on 4 targets, I can't believe that's just because he got there late. Gaines got here at the same time and fits right in. I would say his role is much harder to learn than Sammy's.

 

No doubt Sammy would help the team this season. I'm not saying he's trash, he's just not worth the money he'll want and the return we got on him is easily worth it because he's not elite. We weren't winning the Super Bowl this year with Sammy here, and we weren't paying him next offseason. Even the franchise tag has a value beyond what he actually provides IMO. Thinking for the future it made too much sense.

Edited October 9, 2017 by HappyDays

[Kelly the Dog]

Putting a rookie CB on a premier WR was a HUGE mistake, but what else are they supposed to do when that rookie is the best of the bunch..................YIKES!!!

Those two long plays were the entire game. I don't blame White too much.

[aristocrat]

If Matthews was playing we win this game. Injuries got us

 

 

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[dubs]

Watkins is on a team with multiple downfield threats. That contributes to the season that Gurley is having, as he's facing fewer 8 and 9 man fronts than he did last year. While the Rams receiving group is dividing the targets, their running game is taking advantage and making plays and scoring points.

 

The Bills don't have the down field threat to take the heat off the running game. Watkins, or a receiver like him, would help the offense immensely, because he would move defenders out of the box.

 

Not having Watkins, or a speedy downfield threat to replace him, is a hole for the offense. And since the defense looks as though it's ready to win now, not addressing the lack of speed on offense is frustrating to fans who value wins over draft picks.

Watkins would obviously help this offense, but let's be realistic people. He's got 12 catches for 200 yards in 5 games. Getting EJ Gaines and a second round pick for that is a pretty good haul.

 

This is a "process". I didn't have high expectations for the year and they are already exceeding them. Obviously the FO needs to address WR, OL, and QB in the offseason. Let's give this team time.

 

And if we're lucky, the Bills can take advantage of some weak spots in the schedule and make the playoffs while loaded in next years draft.

 

At this point, I'm pretty happy with the "process".

That argument is starting to wear thin. 0 catches on 4 targets, I can't believe that's just because he got there late. Gaines got here at the same time and fits right in. I would say his role is much harder to learn than Sammy's.

 

No doubt Sammy would help the team this season. I'm not saying he's trash, he's just not worth the money he'll want and the return we got on him is easily worth it because he's not elite. We weren't winning the Super Bowl this year with Sammy here, and we weren't paying him next offseason. Even the franchise tag has a value beyond what he actually provides IMO. Thinking for the future it made too much sense.

Bingo! I endorse this sentiment.

[Boatdrinks]

That argument is starting to wear thin. 0 catches on 4 targets, I can't believe that's just because he got there late. Gaines got here at the same time and fits right in. I would say his role is much harder to learn than Sammy's.

No doubt Sammy would help the team this season. I'm not saying he's trash, he's just not worth the money he'll want and the return we got on him is easily worth it because he's not elite. We weren't winning the Super Bowl this year with Sammy here, and we weren't paying him next offseason. Even the franchise tag has a value beyond what he actually provides IMO. Thinking for the future it made too much sense.

Gaines is a zone corner. He doesn't need chemistry with a QB to do his job. Goff passed up a wide open Watkins in the end zone to throw an out cut to Kupp last week. I could give a crap about money. This team has no stars to pay and no expensive QB contracts . It's the NFL in 2017 after all. A DB being asked to learn zone coverages and calls is a bit easier than learning an offense . The practice time is the big thing and CBA rules mean it is minimal in season these days. I doubt the Rams are too concerned . They know what they have.

[Kirby Jackson]

Excellent analysis although I will quibble with some of your positions. Where I strongly agree with you is that this new regime is taking a big picture approach. That's why it purged some talent that in the short run would have clearly made a difference. Watkins is an obvious example of that. As far as the stalled running game the problem as I see it is mostly due to the lack of a credible/modern passing game that will open up more space. The defenses are stacking the line and there is too much congestion for McCoy to find a lane. Even working with such a handicap he is playing heroically.

 

As I have said on other posts this staff has done a masterful job in reconstituting the defense. This was done in one offseason. This regime needs to be saluted for their smart and cost effective player acquisitions. Next offseason attention has to be focused on the offense. Until the qb position is upgraded so a modern passing game can be run this franchise will continue to be stuck in the muck of mediocrity. I have felt all along that this was a three to four year rebuilding project. If the Bills can get a qb such as Mayfield on its roster that time frame will be shortened. Tyrod Taylor is an earnest player who is simply a bridge qb. Anyone who thinks otherwise is not worth arguing with. Either the qb issue is addressed this offseason or the same status of irrelevance will be maintained.

 

I want to make it clear I'm not feeling pessimistic with what has gone on with this new staff. Quite the opposite---I'm impressed with what has been done so far. Next offseason, the wrestling coach and his staff have to do what they could have done the previous offseason i.e. address the most influential position on the field.

The issue is that they were the best running team in the league for 2 years with much of the same personnel. It's design. I get that they have no one that scares people on the outside but our receivers, especially minus a healthy Watkins, weren't exactly elite.

[ChasBB]

Perhaps consideration is due here that the veteran QB who can't throw may be having some impact on the rookie WR who can't catch?

[BigBuff423]

don't trade for anyone, this is not a superbowl winning team a WR does not put us over the top.

The other thing we often forget: this is a re-build year. The Offense is pretty much what we thought it would be. The Defense and Special Teams have made this team competitive, and surprisingly so...therefore, were frustrated because we can see how this team could be 5-0 with a competent to good QB and WRs who can catch. I do blame Tyrod for the Offense. No doubt in my mind.

[blacklabel]

I feel similar to the OP here. I feel like the FO sold them short as did the coaches decision to roll with only four healthy receivers. One is a second round rookie who can't find his hands, another is a 6'5" vet who must be on Taylor's s-list because he doesn't target him at all, then they have a career special teams guy and a kid who was on a CFL practice squad a couple years ago. I understand the focus is on the future but in the present tense, they have a defense that is good enough to keep them in every game but on offense they really set those guys up to fail yesterday. May have been a different story if Clay hadn't gotten hurt, but now they really need to explore other options because they're not going anywhere with that current WR group. Call up Reilly, flip one of those six early-round picks for a pass catcher, do something, because if they don't, I feel like that's a slap in the face to the guys on defense. Those dudes are balling out, getting turnovers, limiting teams to 20 points or less. And then the offense gets on the field and can't get out of their own way. If part of the "process" is to neglect your offense and waste a super talented defense this season then I'm not sure what their real plans are.