Inside Info Brandon Spikes at the Lafayette

[YoloinOhio]

I know but it seems very strange he would fly back to Buffalo for one night and fly back.

Oh - maybe he was there for the the wknd? Hanging out with Harvin? Either way it sounds like he wasn't there to sign a contract.

[C.Biscuit97]

Oh - maybe he was there for the the wknd? Hanging out with Harvin? Either way it sounds like he wasn't there to sign a contract.

Well since he doesn't have a deal yet, he should be more careful in wasting money on flights.

 

And I think the problem is he thinks he is more valuable than he actually is. He would be a part time player here and you can't pay him a ton of money for that role.

[3rdand12]

Torell Troupe spent 1000 bucks to run at the Vet Combine

A man has got to make the effort.

spikes would be an asset playing to his strength. can we afford him?

some say we can afford Phillip Rivers. not sure.
i want some BrandonS in Bills country

[Big Turk]

Whaley going to reach out to Spikes about a potential return:

 

http://espn.go.com/blog/buffalo-bills/post/_/id/18162/bills-will-reach-out-to-brandon-spikes-about-return

[KDIGGZ]

I still bet we get Spikes on a 1 yr close to league min "prove it" deal. I bet Rex will warm up to him soon enough. The guy is an animal vs the run and he's a vocal leader in the locker room. How can you not like having a vet like that on your team? He loves Buffalo and he wants to win here and put a hurting on the Pats. Sign this man already!

[NoSaint]

I still bet we get Spikes on a 1 yr close to league min "prove it" deal. I bet Rex will warm up to him soon enough. The guy is an animal vs the run and he's a vocal leader in the locker room. How can you not like having a vet like that on your team? He loves Buffalo and he wants to win here and put a hurting on the Pats. Sign this man already!

How many times do we get to call it a prove it deal? Why do we get him 3m cheaper than last year?

[KDIGGZ]

How many times do we get to call it a prove it deal? Why do we get him 3m cheaper than last year?

Rex doesn't think he fits what he wants to do so he has to prove himself to a new coaching staff. I don't see anyone else knocking down his door. He has the reputation of a 2 down player. Teams would rather get a more athletic guy in the draft. I think we can get him super cheap

[NoSaint]

Rex doesn't think he fits what he wants to do so he has to prove himself to a new coaching staff. I don't see anyone else knocking down his door. He has the reputation of a 2 down player. Teams would rather get a more athletic guy in the draft. I think we can get him super cheap

All fair but I guess the flip side was why so much last year then? I'm genuinely curious what his value on the market is, or why last year may have swayed it.... Or if we just got a little ahead of ourselves giving him that much(not a big deal)

[KDIGGZ]

All fair but I guess the flip side was why so much last year then? I'm genuinely curious what his value on the market is, or why last year may have swayed it.... Or if we just got a little ahead of ourselves giving him that much(not a big deal)

I think last year he was the perfect fit for our system and he was a big name guy so that's probably why he was more valuable. I think he showed that he wasn't good in coverage though and couldn't stay on the field for us except for running downs. That's probably why he's not getting any big offers this year. I think if someone wanted him they would have brought him in by now. Whaley seems petty non chalent about it saying he will call him next week so they must know he doesn't have a lot of suitors. But I think they know he meant more to this team as a leader than just what he did on the field so they probably figure once he tests the market and sees there's not much out there then he will be OK with coming back for much less money. We'll see though! I think he wants to be back and we want him back as long as it's at the right price

http://m.espn.go.com/general/blogs/blogpost?blogname=nflnation&id=165037&src=desktop&rand=ref~%7B%22ref%22%3A%22http%3A%2F%2Ft.co%2FasuLv2SxaI%22%7D

[White Linen]

Rex doesn't think he fits what he wants to do so he has to prove himself to a new coaching staff. I don't see anyone else knocking down his door. He has the reputation of a 2 down player. Teams would rather get a more athletic guy in the draft. I think we can get him super cheap

 

Are you normally privy to the interest free agents are getting?

[KDIGGZ]

Are you normally privy to the interest free agents are getting?

I follow this stuff non stop so I have a good idea

[NickelCity]

I think our run D could regress without him. Loved having him aboard, hope we can sign him on a deal that makes everyone happy. Count me as surprised he hasn't been snapped up. I know he feels he's a 3 down player, but you would think someone would show him the money and convince him he'll get a "chance to compete" for a 3 down role.

[BillnutinHouston]

I follow this stuff non stop so I have a good idea

 

[KOKBILLS]

Rex doesn't think he fits what he wants to do so he has to prove himself to a new coaching staff.

 

Not saying I know, but I kind of doubt that...

 

I think it's all about the fact that Spikes is going to be a situational player on this Defense and the Bills have a clear understanding of what they are willing to pay for it...And...of course...Spikes would like more...At least until he's sure he can't actually get more...That's all...

 

Rex knows Defense and he knows a good player when he sees one...Spikes may have a limited area of expertise, but he's pretty darn good in that area, and furthermore it worked last year...Rex is no dummy when it comes to understanding Defensive talent...Plus Spikes was a Captain on a REAL good Defensive football team...

 

I don't think there's any way Whaley says publicly that the Bills are going to reach out to Spikes unless Rex wants him...It's all about how he slots into the cap based on what he does...But again, I doubt Rex has much of a problem with what Spikes does best...

Edited March 26, 2015 by KOKBILLS

[John from Riverside]

In many ways Brandon Spikes is like his older ILB he had back with the jets.....pure run stuffer and not much for pass coverage

 

I dont know why Rex wouldnt want him....that doesnt make sense

[KDIGGZ]

 

Not saying I know, but I kind of doubt that...

 

I think it's all about the fact that Spikes is going to be a situational player on this Defense and the Bills have a clear understanding of what they are willing to pay for it...And...of course...Spikes would like more...At least until he's sure he can't actually get more...That's all...

 

Rex knows Defense and he knows a good player when he sees one...Spikes may have a limited area of expertise, but he's pretty darn good in that area, and furthermore it worked last year...Rex is no dummy when it comes to understanding Defensive talent...Plus Spikes was a Captain on a REAL good Defensive football team...

 

I don't think there's any way Whaley says publicly that the Bills are going to reach out to Spikes unless Rex wants him...It's all about how he slots into the cap based on what he does...But again, I doubt Rex has much of a problem with what Spikes does best...

 

 

In many ways Brandon Spikes is like his older ILB he had back with the jets.....pure run stuffer and not much for pass coverage

 

I dont know why Rex wouldnt want him....that doesnt make sense

It's not that he doesn't want him, he just doesn't fit his scheme. Rex runs a 3-4 and the ILB's have to be athletic, especially on our team, because our "OLB" are going to be our DE's (Hughes, Mario) and they will want them rushing the passer as much as possible. That leaves coverage responsibilities on the ILB on passing downs.

This pic shows Rex's typical defensive front. There are 3 down lineman and the ends are actually OLB's. In this pic, Mario (on the left end) has his hand in the ground which would make the offense think he is rushing. However, it may be a disguise and he might actually be acting as a LB and have responsibilities for passes in the flats. The offense won't know until the ball is snapped. But if he is rushing the passer (which is what we pay Mario to do) then that would leave pass coverage responsibilities to that ILB so you need someone who can cover some ground in case the QB throws a quick swing pass to the flats. Spikes has shown that he can't do that and is an easy target to pick on when he is in the game. If the QB sees Mario rush then that FB or HB can run a pass route vs that LB so you need a LB that is good enough in coverage to be able to take that play away. Bradham is super athletic and Brown is athletic enough. Spikes just is not and would fit much better in a 4-3 where he can just play the middle of the field and not have to chase RB's into the flats

[billsfan1959]

 

 

It's not that he doesn't want him, he just doesn't fit his scheme. Rex runs a 3-4 and the ILB's have to be athletic, especially on our team, because our "OLB" are going to be our DE's (Hughes, Mario) and they will want them rushing the passer as much as possible. That leaves coverage responsibilities on the ILB on passing downs.

This pic shows Rex's typical defensive front. There are 3 down lineman and the ends are actually OLB's. In this pic, Mario (on the left end) has his hand in the ground which would make the offense think he is rushing. However, it may be a disguise and he might actually be acting as a LB and have responsibilities for passes in the flats. The offense won't know until the ball is snapped. But if he is rushing the passer (which is what we pay Mario to do) then that would leave pass coverage responsibilities to that ILB so you need someone who can cover some ground in case the QB throws a quick swing pass to the flats. Spikes has shown that he can't do that and is an easy target to pick on when he is in the game. If the QB sees Mario rush then that FB or HB can run a pass route vs that LB so you need a LB that is good enough in coverage to be able to take that play away. Bradham is super athletic and Brown is athletic enough. Spikes just is not and would fit much better in a 4-3 where he can just play the middle of the field and not have to chase RB's into the flats

IMO, David Harris is as much of a liability in coverage as Spikes, and not as good as Spikes in the run game - and Ryan managed to find a way to use him in his schemes

[KDIGGZ]

IMO, David Harris is as much of a liability in coverage as Spikes, and not as good as Spikes in the run game - and Ryan managed to find a way to use him in his schemes

Maybe and maybe that's why Spikes said this:

"Of course I'd like to go back, but you know how it goes in this league," Spikes said. "Guys with a new staff they like their guys and everybody understands that."

 

Whaley told Spikes that he should go out and find a team with a scheme that fits his talents better because we would only use him (and pay him) as a 2-down LB to add depth. Spikes hasn't had any interest and so Whaley said at the owner's meetings that he would give Spikes a call next week to discuss him coming back. It's going to be at a very low price or not at all though.

[CountDorkula]

 

 

It's not that he doesn't want him, he just doesn't fit his scheme. Rex runs a 3-4 and the ILB's have to be athletic, especially on our team, because our "OLB" are going to be our DE's (Hughes, Mario) and they will want them rushing the passer as much as possible. That leaves coverage responsibilities on the ILB on passing downs.

This pic shows Rex's typical defensive front. There are 3 down lineman and the ends are actually OLB's. In this pic, Mario (on the left end) has his hand in the ground which would make the offense think he is rushing. However, it may be a disguise and he might actually be acting as a LB and have responsibilities for passes in the flats. The offense won't know until the ball is snapped. But if he is rushing the passer (which is what we pay Mario to do) then that would leave pass coverage responsibilities to that ILB so you need someone who can cover some ground in case the QB throws a quick swing pass to the flats. Spikes has shown that he can't do that and is an easy target to pick on when he is in the game. If the QB sees Mario rush then that FB or HB can run a pass route vs that LB so you need a LB that is good enough in coverage to be able to take that play away. Bradham is super athletic and Brown is athletic enough. Spikes just is not and would fit much better in a 4-3 where he can just play the middle of the field and not have to chase RB's into the flats

 

Um... I count 4 down lineman in this picture shifted to the weak side with 3 LBS and 2 safteys. AKA a 4-3............ So from the start your premise is wrong. And also nothing based on fact. just a hypothetical situation you made up from somewhere.

[KDIGGZ]

 

Um... I count 4 down lineman in this picture shifted to the weak side with 3 LBS and 2 safteys. AKA a 4-3............ So from the start your premise is wrong. And also nothing based on fact. just a hypothetical situation you made up from somewhere.

Um...lol. That's Rex's base defense. I guess you better tell Rex he runs a 4-3 because he's been confused this whole time. Like I said, the end with his hand in the ground is an OLB. You won't know what he's doing until the ball is snapped. He might be back peddling into coverage.

Edited March 26, 2015 by kdiggz

[Nanker]

Is Spikes still at the Lafayette and, if so, what does this all mean?

He's sleeping it off, and getting room service.

 

I follow this stuff non stop so I have a good idea

So you're not nonchalant about it then.

[GG]

Um...lol. That's Rex's base defense. I guess you better tell Rex he runs a 4-3 because he's been confused this whole time. Like I said, the end with his hand in the ground is an OLB. You won't know what he's doing until the ball is snapped. He might be back peddling into coverage.

 

Forget the 3-4 vs 4-3 distinction - who are the front 7 that Ryan will line up on opening day?

 

I count 6 that are definites. So are you saying that there's a bigger role for Lawson than for Spikes in this defense?

 

Base Jets D: Richardson, Harrison, Wilkerson, Babin, Harris, Pace, Davis

Edited March 26, 2015 by GG

[KDIGGZ]

 

Forget the 3-4 vs 4-3 distinction - who are the front 7 that Ryan will line up on opening day?

 

I count 6 that are definites. So are you saying that there's a bigger role for Lawson than for Spikes in this defense?

This might help illustrate the base defense. Keep in mind this is the base, which is only used probably 50% of the time in the pass happy NFL. They will probably play a lot of Nickel vs a team like the Pats but we won't get into that. That would basically be swapping in an extra DB.

 

We have Mario as the "Rush" OLB and Hughes or Lawson at the "Sam." The "Mike" will be Preston Brown or Spikes if they decide to bring him back. Bradham is the "Jack." The 3 down lineman will be Dareus and Kyle and the other spot is going to depend on down and distance and will probably be interchangeable but it will most likely be Wynn.

Nickel package might look something like this...

 

 

^oops sorry have to click it to make it viewable

Edited March 26, 2015 by kdiggz

[GG]

This might help illustrate the base defense. Keep in mind this is the base, which is only used probably 50% of the time in the pass happy NFL. They will probably play a lot of Nickel vs a team like the Pats but we won't get into that. That would basically be swapping in an extra DB.

 

We have Mario as the "Rush" OLB and Hughes or Lawson at the "Sam." The "Mike" will be Preston Brown or Spikes if they decide to bring him back. Bradham is the "Jack." The 3 down lineman will be Dareus and Kyle and the other spot is going to depend on down and distance and will probably be interchangeable but it will most likely be Wynn.

Nickel package might look something like this...

 

bufpersonnel.jpg

 

^oops sorry have to click it to make it viewable

 

Which is precisely why Bills aren't looking to give Spikes a contract that's in line with an every down backer. But that's not the same as saying that there's no role for Spikes in Ryan's defense.

[Nanker]

Or this:

 

Or this:

[KDIGGZ]

 

Which is precisely why Bills aren't looking to give Spikes a contract that's in line with an every down backer. But that's not the same as saying that there's no role for Spikes in Ryan's defense.

Yes that's true. I'm actually for it. He can play the Preston Brown spot, he's just not the ideal fit. But at a lower contract price it would make sense to add some depth at that position. And Spikes is a great vocal leader on the team. And short yardage he is going to be lights out. He's just not an every down player so he if he wants to come back he can't expect to be paid like one

[billsfan1959]

Maybe and maybe that's why Spikes said this:

"Of course I'd like to go back, but you know how it goes in this league," Spikes said. "Guys with a new staff they like their guys and everybody understands that."

 

Whaley told Spikes that he should go out and find a team with a scheme that fits his talents better because we would only use him (and pay him) as a 2-down LB to add depth. Spikes hasn't had any interest and so Whaley said at the owner's meetings that he would give Spikes a call next week to discuss him coming back. It's going to be at a very low price or not at all though.

This idea that Ryan will run a 3-4 is incredibly simplistic. Ryan's strength is his ability to draw from many different schemes and to play to the strengths of the players he has. I think Ryan would prefer to have defensive players that can play all three downs and that can adapt to which ever scheme he decides to employ in any given situation. I think that Whaley understands that Spikes would be utilized in a more limited role, and, to a certain extent, you are right that Whaley is allowing Spikes to look for a "better fit for his talents," particularly at the salary Spikes wants. However, that is different than saying he doesn't fit Ryan's "scheme." I think Whaley would sign Spikes for the right price and I have no doubt that Ryan would find a way to use Spikes in a way that maximizes his skills. That was my point with David Harris. He is very similar to Spikes in terms of skill set, and Ryan found a way to utilize his talents.

[NoSaint]

Yes that's true. I'm actually for it. He can play the Preston Brown spot, he's just not the ideal fit. But at a lower contract price it would make sense to add some depth at that position. And Spikes is a great vocal leader on the team. And short yardage he is going to be lights out. He's just not an every down player so he if he wants to come back he can't expect to be paid like one

it would be interesting to see how his defacto captain/vocal leader/heart and soul of the defense role would be effected if he came back under the oft discussed 1 year, league minimum, very part time role that some discuss. im having a hard time thinking of a similar player/role

[KDIGGZ]

This idea that Ryan will run a 3-4 is incredibly simplistic. Ryan's strength is his ability to draw from many different schemes and to play to the strengths of the players he has. I think Ryan would prefer to have defensive players that can play all three downs and that can adapt to which ever scheme he decides to employ in any given situation. I think that Whaley understands that Spikes would be utilized in a more limited role, and, to a certain extent, you are right that Whaley is allowing Spikes to look for a "better fit for his talents," particularly at the salary Spikes wants. However, that is different than saying he doesn't fit Ryan's "scheme." I think Whaley would sign Spikes for the right price and I have no doubt that Ryan would find a way to use Spikes in a way that maximizes his skills. That was my point with David Harris. He is very similar to Spikes in terms of skill set, and Ryan found a way to utilize his talents.

Right. I too feel that way. I guess I was trying to explain why he wasn't a good fit and thus would be de-valued in this defense vs a base 4-3. But at the right price I'm sure they would love to have him. If they are going to start talks with him as Whaley suggested then Spikes must be interested in coming back at this lower priced role. I'm sure Rex can think of ways to use him so it would be win-win for us if the price is right!

it would be interesting to see how his defacto captain/vocal leader/heart and soul of the defense role would be effected if he came back under the oft discussed 1 year, league minimum, very part time role that some discuss. im having a hard time thinking of a similar player/role

true... he still could be on the field a lot on 1st and 2nd downs and short yardage though. Cory Graham was a captain last year and before McLovin got hurt he wasn't a starter. Fred will have a similar role on the team this year too. I don't really follow other teams close enough to be able to think of other players in similar roles off the top of my head, but I'm sure a lot of the leadership stuff can continue off the field and in the locker room even if the player isn't on the field a lot of the time

[billsfan1959]

Right. I too feel that way. I guess I was trying to explain why he wasn't a good fit and thus would be de-valued in this defense vs a base 4-3. But at the right price I'm sure they would love to have him. If they are going to start talks with him as Whaley suggested then Spikes must be interested in coming back at this lower priced role. I'm sure Rex can think of ways to use him so it would be win-win for us if the price is right!

true... he still could be on the field a lot on 1st and 2nd downs and short yardage though. Cory Graham was a captain last year and before McLovin got hurt he wasn't a starter. Fred will have a similar role on the team this year too. I don't really follow other teams close enough to be able to think of other players in similar roles off the top of my head, but I'm sure a lot of the leadership stuff can continue off the field and in the locker room even if the player isn't on the field a lot of the time

I kinda figured we were saying something similar

[Ontario51]

This might help illustrate the base defense. Keep in mind this is the base, which is only used probably 50% of the time in the pass happy NFL. They will probably play a lot of Nickel vs a team like the Pats but we won't get into that. That would basically be swapping in an extra DB.

 

We have Mario as the "Rush" OLB and Hughes or Lawson at the "Sam." The "Mike" will be Preston Brown or Spikes if they decide to bring him back. Bradham is the "Jack." The 3 down lineman will be Dareus and Kyle and the other spot is going to depend on down and distance and will probably be interchangeable but it will most likely be Wynn.

Nickel package might look something like this...

 

bufpersonnel.jpg

 

^oops sorry have to click it to make it viewable

Hey Mayor this is good stuff you are providing. Keep Spikes he makes big plays.

[johnwalter]

judging by this guy's twitter, he really, really wants to be back in a bills uniform. perhaps he'd be willing to take a discount to stay in buffalo (probably the only way we could afford him as a role-player, albeit a locker room guy) - maybe whaley's counting on that.

[KOKBILLS]

 

Which is precisely why Bills aren't looking to give Spikes a contract that's in line with an every down backer. But that's not the same as saying that there's no role for Spikes in Ryan's defense.

 

Exactly...

[billsfan89]

judging by this guy's twitter, he really, really wants to be back in a bills uniform. perhaps he'd be willing to take a discount to stay in buffalo (probably the only way we could afford him as a role-player, albeit a locker room guy) - maybe whaley's counting on that.

 

I think the Bills are also the only team to give him a concrete contract offer. Seems like only Buffalo is interested in him with numbers to offer. Spikes will probably sign a one year deal for 2+ million and take his chances on the market again next year.

[johnwalter]

 

I think the Bills are also the only team to give him a concrete contract offer. Seems like only Buffalo is interested in him with numbers to offer. Spikes will probably sign a one year deal for 2+ million and take his chances on the market again next year.

 

i was almost thinking the opposite: that he had drawn interest from others but is still holding out hoping for an offer from the bills that he can stomach (because he wants to stay so badly - as evidenced by his twitter).

[billsfan89]

 

i was almost thinking the opposite: that he had drawn interest from others but is still holding out hoping for an offer from the bills that he can stomach (because he wants to stay so badly - as evidenced by his twitter).

 

I think the market for him as a starter isn't there. He wants starter money (3+ million a year 4-5 years with a guaranteed in the 1st and 2nd year) and starter playing time. No team has really offered him that. The Bills probably have been talking to him about being a 1-2 down LB on a one year deal for over 2 million. I think he feels that's the best he is going to get with his skill set being less in demand in a passing league.

[YoloinOhio]

 

i was almost thinking the opposite: that he had drawn interest from others but is still holding out hoping for an offer from the bills that he can stomach (because he wants to stay so badly - as evidenced by his twitter).

i agree that I get the feeling he wants to play for the bills. I have see over the past few days that there is interest from the Vikings and Niners, but not sure if he's visited. The ILB market has been pretty bad. Mason Foster just signed with the Bears this week. I personally think it would be wise to bring him back. We are thin at LB and I think he has a role. He was elected a captain last year too, and is only 27. He is also very close with Harvin and that doesn't hurt with that investment that he'd have a comfort level with at least one guy. Most importantly, I think the guy can play. And would be used correctly in this scheme. Edited March 26, 2015 by YoloinOhio

[White Linen]

This might help illustrate the base defense. Keep in mind this is the base, which is only used probably 50% of the time in the pass happy NFL. They will probably play a lot of Nickel vs a team like the Pats but we won't get into that. That would basically be swapping in an extra DB.

 

We have Mario as the "Rush" OLB and Hughes or Lawson at the "Sam." The "Mike" will be Preston Brown or Spikes if they decide to bring him back. Bradham is the "Jack." The 3 down lineman will be Dareus and Kyle and the other spot is going to depend on down and distance and will probably be interchangeable but it will most likely be Wynn.

Nickel package might look something like this...

 

bufpersonnel.jpg

 

^oops sorry have to click it to make it viewable

 

I must be in the minority by thinking the 295lb Mario Williams will be the 3rd down lineman and not the rush OLB. I see him in the exact role as Watt. He's the 3rd down lineman with his hand in the dirt that in certain formations may be asked to drop back - however this won't be by our choice this will because the offense exploits Mario and we'll have to make an adjustment. His job should be to rush the passer on every passing down, help with the inside rush, and contain the outside run.

 

I see Spikes and Brown in the middle with Bradham and Hughes as the OLB's. Hughes is the rush OLB and when they switch to the 4-3 it will look very similar to last year.

Edited March 26, 2015 by Triple Threat

[Big C]

I get the feeling that Spikes has been in the plans the whole time, but has been waiting on the FO to get everything else in order first. His responses to some questions in NFLN gave me the impression that he was not looking for a job.

[MDH]

it would be interesting to see how his defacto captain/vocal leader/heart and soul of the defense role would be effected if he came back under the oft discussed 1 year, league minimum, very part time role that some discuss. im having a hard time thinking of a similar player/role

 

 

Look no farther than the offensive side of the ball and Fred Jackson. Not the one year, league minimum part but the part time player/heart and soul aspects.