So glad Frazier is gone

[Ethan in Cleveland]

I said before the season started I thought it was great Frazier was gone for one simple reason. McDermott has no more excuses. 

It's now obvious the prior failures had nothing to do with Frazier. Frazier got scapegoated by this loser coach who talks about accountability but has none for himself. I wish Frazier would spill the truth on 13 seconds. 

[Roundybout]

Oh no, let’s not kid ourselves. Frazier stunk too. Unless you guys ENJOY getting annihilated by 40 points to Indianapolis.

Edited November 27, 2023 by Roundybout

[RoyBatty is alive]

Just now, Ethan in Cleveland said:

I said before the season started I thought it was great Frazier was gone for one simple reason. McDermott has no more excuses. 

It's now obvious the prior failures had nothing to do with Frazier. Frazier got scapegoated by this loser coach who talks about accountability but has none for himself. I wish Frazier would spill the truth on 13 seconds. 

Spill the truth on 13 seconds huh.  What if in fact it was 100% his (Frazier's) call, would that make you happy?

 

No you are frustrated we lost yesterday and want to get some psychological payback on McDermott and hope Frazier would come out and say it was all McDermott's fault.

[Beast]

4 minutes ago, RoyBatty is alive said:

Spill the truth on 13 seconds huh.  What if in fact it was 100% his (Frazier's) call, would that make you happy?

 

No you are frustrated we lost yesterday and want to get some psychological payback on McDermott and hope Frazier would come out and say it was all McDermott's fault.

Right.

 

And, everyone knows McDermott didn’t blame Leslie for that game. He blamed the special teams coach and fired him.

 

Frazier was last season’s McDermott scapegoat.

 

This year it has been Ken Dorsey.

Meanwhile, Sean’s defense can’t stop any offense when the game is on the line.

 

Who will he blame for that?

Edited November 27, 2023 by Beast

[C.Biscuit97]

9 minutes ago, Roundybout said:

Oh no, let’s not kid ourselves. Frazier stunk too.

It was awful having a top 3 defense every year. Awful!!!

2 minutes ago, Beast said:

Right.

 

And, everyone knows McDermott didn’t blame Leslie for that game. He blamed the special teams coach and fired him.

 

Frazier was last season’s McDermott scapegoat.

 

This year it has been Ken Dorsey.

Meanwhile, Sean’s defense can’t stop any offense when the game is on the line.

 

Who will he blame for that?

He’s firing himself as DC.

 

in a weird way, the Brady looking good thing is even worse for him because why did he stay with Dorsey so long.

[Einstein]

11 minutes ago, Roundybout said:

Oh no, let’s not kid ourselves. Frazier stunk too.

Frazier was frustrating in that he played so conservatively.

But I don't recall ever giving up so many game winning drives with him. 

Or maybe I just have amnesia.

[nedboy7]

20 seconds left and you burn one of your 2 TO icing the wet kicker??   Who does he blame that on? 

[0017]

And the offense played the best game of complimentary football, they slowed it down and ran the ball to give the defense a rest, no excuses there McD!! Your Defense sucks!!!!!

[HomeskillitMoorman]

3 minutes ago, Einstein said:

Frazier was frustrating in that he played so conservatively.

But I don't recall ever giving up so many game winning drives with him. 

Or maybe I just have amnesia.

What do you call what McD does late in games? We were giving their receivers 8 yards of cushion on 3rd and shorts. 
 

McD’s philosophy late in yesterdays game in the 4th and OT was literally to leave their receivers wide open on any short pass and just hope they dropped them. 

[Bruffalo]

12 minutes ago, Beast said:

Right.

 

And, everyone knows McDermott didn’t blame Leslie for that game. He blamed the special teams coach and fired him.

 

Frazier was last season’s McDermott scapegoat.

 

This year it has been Ken Dorsey.

Meanwhile, Sean’s defense can’t stop any offense when the game is on the line.

 

Who will he blame for that?

Not defending McDermott at all here but Dorsey was a legitimate problem.  The difference in Allen has been night and day once he got canned.

 

It's a McDermott issue ultimately anyways. Dorsey should have been canned before the season started. 

[Alphadawg7]

2 hours ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

I said before the season started I thought it was great Frazier was gone for one simple reason. McDermott has no more excuses. 

It's now obvious the prior failures had nothing to do with Frazier. Frazier got scapegoated by this loser coach who talks about accountability but has none for himself. I wish Frazier would spill the truth on 13 seconds. 

He wasn’t a scapegoat, Frazier has said 100 times why he left, this narrative he was forced out is pretty ridiculous.  
 

Doesn’t mean McD doesn’t have a lot to answer for, but Frazier was not a scapegoat and he left on his own…those are the facts.  
 

Doesn't mean you can’t still be happy he is gone for the reasons you stated, but this “scapegoat” narrative is just another false story around here.  
 

McD for sure though put a target on his back by wearing two hats though when Frazier stepped away.  
 

And to be quite honest, it’s not his DC hat that is going to get him fired.  Defense has dealt with a lot and still played well enough for this team to be the #1 seed in AFC right now had the Dorsey led offense not sucked for most of the season.  
 

But, his HC hat is where he is really in trouble this year as there are now a pile of glaring coaching decisions that have really been hard to ignore.  And the end of the Philly game wasting a timeout to ice a kicker attempting a rushed 59 yard FG in bad weather was about as stupid as it gets, especially since we could have had 20 seconds and TWO timeouts to try and get a FG ourselves.  
 

KC scored a FG in 13 seconds against us then did it again the following regular season against us last year at end of half in LESS time with only 12 seconds to go and get a FG.
 

As soon as we took a knee to end the 4th I knew that if we lose this game after not trying to win it there that McD may have just sealed his fate.  
 

And most of us knew Dorsey should have been fired even sooner than he did.  Seeing this offense ball out 2 weeks straight and avg 33 points a game after Dorsey (against weaker defenses) averaged 20.5 for 6 weeks shows just how stupid it was to keep sticking with Dorsey until it was near too late.  And that choice also put this team in such a hole that even if we play great down the stretch and win out from here, we could very easily still miss playoffs.  
 

Edited November 27, 2023 by Alphadawg7

[Roundybout]

11 minutes ago, Einstein said:

Frazier was frustrating in that he played so conservatively.

But I don't recall ever giving up so many game winning drives with him. 

Or maybe I just have amnesia.

He was here for Hail Murray and the Titans disaster in 2020, off the top of my head.

[Bermuda Triangle]

19 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

It was awful having a top 3 defense every year. Awful!!!

 

It was great having a defense that regularly stepped up in late & close game situations.  Great!!!

[1onemangang7]

All these coaches but nobody calls out the GM. They were given Allen. No Johnson, Lombardi, Parcells or Gibbs is gonna win with the little guy at RB1. Still beyond the obvious they weren't given enough to work with. Every year those close to the team, like Kelly, and nationwide ask when they'll get the qb some help. Last year's blame was the OL, and  now the coaches. Cut to the chase and stop wasting this guy's career.

[Bermuda Triangle]

19 minutes ago, Einstein said:

Frazier was frustrating in that he played so conservatively.

But I don't recall ever giving up so many game winning drives with him. 

Or maybe I just have amnesia.

https://twitter.com/lifewithmikey52/status/1728980593269256601?s=46&t=5bplTLuS1AHzrnPA9SMGhQ

[Einstein]

7 minutes ago, Roundybout said:

He was here for Hail Murray and the Titans disaster in 2020, off the top of my head.

We lost the Titans game on offense (failed 4th down). Unless you mean the other Titans game where we were blown out - that wasn't a game winning drive scenario.

[McBean]

35 minutes ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

I said before the season started I thought it was great Frazier was gone for one simple reason. McDermott has no more excuses. 

It's now obvious the prior failures had nothing to do with Frazier. Frazier got scapegoated by this loser coach who talks about accountability but has none for himself. I wish Frazier would spill the truth on 13 seconds. 

Preach 

[Bermuda Triangle]

Just now, Einstein said:

We lost the Titans game on offense (failed 4th down). Unless you mean the other Titans game where we were blown out - that wasn't a game winning drive scenario.

Gave up a late TD to the Titans in that game too.  
 

Henry with 20 carries for 143 yards, 3 TDs

[Beast]

10 minutes ago, Bruffalo said:

Not defending McDermott at all here but Dorsey was a legitimate problem.  The difference in Allen has been night and day once he got canned.

 

It's a McDermott issue ultimately anyways. Dorsey should have been canned before the season started. 

Yes, Dorsey is 100% on McDermott. I don’t care if there were influences when he made that hire. The Bills were in a championship window and he hired someone that never called a game or implemented an offense.

 

And why does Sean McDermott have a job when his defense can’t stop anyone when the game is on the line? When is he going to be held accountable? He sure likes to hold other coaches accountable. And players. (See Cook benched again early after his drop yesterday.)

 

Screw Sean McDermott. The ultimate do as I say and not as I do guy in this league. He looks in the mirror and sees others.

 

 

[Roundybout]

4 minutes ago, Einstein said:

We lost the Titans game on offense (failed 4th down). Unless you mean the other Titans game where we were blown out - that wasn't a game winning drive scenario.

 

Yes the blowout one. The one where Norman got stiff armed into oblivion. 
 

We had so many blowout losses under Frazier. 

[Heitz]

11 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

...but this “scapegoat” narrative is just another false story around here.  

 

I don't understand the "scapegoat" logic of some fans who play both the "I would have fired both Fraizer and Dorsey, they suck", but when they both get fired (or leave on their own) they say "Coach is just firing scapegoats". 🤷‍♂️  

[PromoTheRobot]

38 minutes ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

I said before the season started I thought it was great Frazier was gone for one simple reason. McDermott has no more excuses. 

It's now obvious the prior failures had nothing to do with Frazier. Frazier got scapegoated by this loser coach who talks about accountability but has none for himself. I wish Frazier would spill the truth on 13 seconds. 

 

Frazier being gone clears up the ambiguity over who's fault 13 seconds was.

[1onemangang7]

3 minutes ago, Beast said:

 (See Cook benched again early after his drop 

 

 

Good excuse. Beane shoves Cook on him and gives him a handicap. Everybody knows,but the Bills fantasy football fanatics

Edited November 27, 2023 by 1onemangang7

[juno999]

16 minutes ago, Bruffalo said:

Not defending McDermott at all here but Dorsey was a legitimate problem.  The difference in Allen has been night and day once he got canned.

 

It's a McDermott issue ultimately anyways. Dorsey should have been canned before the season started. 

Dorsey shouldn't have been promoted to OC.  Dorsey had no experience calling plays as an OC.  McD's fingerprints all over the issues with this team.  He's the root of the problem.

[Einstein]

5 minutes ago, Roundybout said:

We had so many blowout losses under Frazier. 

Not sure why you think that.

In the last 3 years under Frazier, we had 2 regular season games we were blown out in.

Titans in 2020. Colts in 2021. 

That's it. That's the entire list.

Most losses were by 4 or less.
 

[Bermuda Triangle]

6 minutes ago, Einstein said:

Not sure why you think that.

In the last 3 years under Frazier, we had 2 regular season games we were blown out in.

Titans in 2020. Colts in 2021. 

That's it. That's the entire list.

Most losses were by 4 or less.
 

Eagles in 2019…why limit this to 3 years?

 

ETA: KC loss in 2020 was a 2 score loss as well.

Edited November 27, 2023 by Bermuda Triangle

[HumbleAndHungry]

Next, the equipment staff and water boys will be fired to try to rekindle the culture 

[Einstein]

7 minutes ago, Bermuda Triangle said:

Eagles in 2019…why limit this to 3 years?

How far back do you want to go in order to stay relevant to our current player group? Or do you simply want to go back as far as you can to justify crapping on Frazier?
 

7 minutes ago, Bermuda Triangle said:

 

ETA: KC loss in 2020 was a 2 score loss as well.

 

a 9 point loss is not a blowout.

[1onemangang7]

42 minutes ago, Bruffalo said:

Not defending McDermott at all here but Dorsey was a legitimate problem.  The difference in Allen has been night and day once he got canned.

 

It's a McDermott issue ultimately anyways. Dorsey should have been canned before the season started. 

Pretty sure the coordinator didn't change Allen. It was team philosophy to save on the number of hits and pass off the rushing duties. Except they didn't roster a real rushing threat the equivalent of Allen and it didn't work. Guys like you were satisfied with the dismissal til the problem persists and leaves zero doubt. 

Edited November 27, 2023 by 1onemangang7

[Bermuda Triangle]

7 minutes ago, Einstein said:

How far back do you want to go in order to stay relevant to our current player group? Or do you simply want to go back as far as you can to justify crapping on Frazier?
 

 

a 9 point loss is not a blowout.

Same HC/DC, and same core players on defense.  

[Einstein]

15 minutes ago, Bermuda Triangle said:

Same HC/DC, and same core players on defense.  

Not really.

In 2019 we were starting Star Lotuleli, Trent Murphy and Jerry hughes on the D-Line.

2020 had 3 new starters and by 2022 we had an entirely new D-line and two new starting CB's.

[mrags]

38 minutes ago, HumbleAndHungry said:

Next, the equipment staff and water boys will be fired to try to rekindle the culture 

Well. Maybe a joke I bet he has something to do with the training staff. Or whoever he will blame for all the injuries the past 2 seasons. 

[Bruffalo]

28 minutes ago, 1onemangang7 said:

Pretty sure the coordinator didn't change Allen. It was team philosophy to save on the number of hits and pass off the rushing duties. Except they didn't roster a real rushing threat the equivalent of Allen and it didn't work. Guys like you were satisfied with the dismissal til the problem persists and leaves zero doubt. 

I don't even understand what you're trying to say here. The coordinator change certainly has helped. 

[MJS]

1 hour ago, Beast said:

Right.

 

And, everyone knows McDermott didn’t blame Leslie for that game. He blamed the special teams coach and fired him.

 

Frazier was last season’s McDermott scapegoat.

 

This year it has been Ken Dorsey.

Meanwhile, Sean’s defense can’t stop any offense when the game is on the line.

 

Who will he blame for that?

Firing Rick Dennison was the correct move. Firing the special teams coordinator was the right move. Moving on from Frazier was the right move. Firing Ken Dorsey was the right move.

 

So far he is got all of those right. There were major improvements to each of those units after those coordinators left. Our special teams last year were one of the best in the league, but they have taken a step back this year, for some reason.

 

I'd say the big mistake McDermott made was promoting Dorsey, but there was a lot playing into that, especially with how vocal Josh Allen was about it.

44 minutes ago, HumbleAndHungry said:

Next, the equipment staff and water boys will be fired to try to rekindle the culture 

Have any of the firings been a mistake? I don't get it. The fans called for those coordinators to be fired too, and when McDermott actually does it, fans complain about it?

[Beast]

16 minutes ago, MJS said:

Firing Rick Dennison was the correct move. Firing the special teams coordinator was the right move. Moving on from Frazier was the right move. Firing Ken Dorsey was the right move.

 

So far he is got all of those right. There were major improvements to each of those units after those coordinators left. Our special teams last year were one of the best in the league, but they have taken a step back this year, for some reason.

 

I'd say the big mistake McDermott made was promoting Dorsey, but there was a lot playing into that, especially with how vocal Josh Allen was about it.

Have any of the firings been a mistake? I don't get it. The fans called for those coordinators to be fired too, and when McDermott actually does it, fans complain about it?

So, who holds McDermott accountable?

 

The defense, under Frazier, was much better than what we are seeing under McDermott.

 

And he’s the head coach of a loaded football team that is 6-6 and a major disappointment.

Edited November 27, 2023 by Beast

[MJS]

2 minutes ago, Beast said:

So, who holds McDermott accountable?

 

The defense, under Frazier, was much better than what we are seeing under McDermott.

 

And he’s the head coach of a loaded football team that is 6-6 and a major disappointment.

The Bills aren't loaded. They have holes due to lack of talent and injury, especially on defense. But receiver is a problem on offense.

 

Pegula holds McDermott accountable. He is the only one.

 

And I MUCH prefer McDermott's aggressive defense to Frazier's passive defense. McDermott just needs to make some adjustments and rethink what he calls in certain situations. He might not be able to do that. We'll see.

 

McDermott should be feeling the heat, but not for making the correct call on moving on from those coordinators.

[BBFL]

28 minutes ago, MJS said:

Firing Rick Dennison was the correct move. Firing the special teams coordinator was the right move. Moving on from Frazier was the right move. Firing Ken Dorsey was the right move.

 

So far he is got all of those right. There were major improvements to each of those units after those coordinators left. Our special teams last year were one of the best in the league, but they have taken a step back this year, for some reason.

 

I'd say the big mistake McDermott made was promoting Dorsey, but there was a lot playing into that, especially with how vocal Josh Allen was about it.

Have any of the firings been a mistake? I don't get it. The fans called for those coordinators to be fired too, and when McDermott actually does it, fans complain about it?

So that means there only one firing left to correct the situation…

 

🤔

[HomeskillitMoorman]

6 minutes ago, MJS said:

The Bills aren't loaded. They have holes due to lack of talent and injury, especially on defense. But receiver is a problem on offense.

 

Pegula holds McDermott accountable. He is the only one.

 

And I MUCH prefer McDermott's aggressive defense to Frazier's passive defense. McDermott just needs to make some adjustments and rethink what he calls in certain situations. He might not be able to do that. We'll see.

 

McDermott should be feeling the heat, but not for making the correct call on moving on from those coordinators.

 

Who hired the two coordinators that he had to move on from? One of which he had here for like 6 years? He should absolutely be feeling the heat for that. 

 

And McD hasn't changed or improved at all as a Head Coach for 7 years now, what makes you believe he's going to make huge adjustments for year 8? It would be utter insanity to move forward with him. 

[strive_for_five_guy]

I’ll tell you what’s going to happen, whether folks like it or not.  The offense will continue to look good the rest of the season, solidifying Brady’s role as OC.  This will make it tough for Beane and Terry to justify tearing it all apart.  When pressed on the defense, McD will reference injuries, conclude that having a D coordinator is beneficial, and Frazier will be back.  McD will be back as HC, with Brady and Frazier as his coordinators.  
 

Not saying these would be the right moves, just my prediction.

[MJS]

3 minutes ago, HomeskillitMoorman said:

Who hired the two coordinators that he had to move on from? One of which he had here for like 6 years? He should absolutely be feeling the heat for that. 

 

And McD hasn't changed or improved at all as a Head Coach for 7 years now, what makes you believe he's going to make huge adjustments for year 8? It would be utter insanity to move forward with him. 

Frazier was great for the Bills... until he wasn't. It was time to move on, but he had some great years in Buffalo.

 

Dorsey was a mistake, but it was a complicated one, especially since Allen was so vocally advocating for him. It was a risk that did not work.

 

McDermott can and has made changes to the defensive scheme as a coordinator. I'm not sure what you mean. As a head coach? Not sure. But as a coordinator, he does a lot of good stuff with a tough injury situation.

Edited November 27, 2023 by MJS