McDermott on Dorsey

[boyst]

2 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said:

True but it also somehow felt like they went away from the run too often.  Seemed like they could’ve run the ball 48 times and won easily or at least waited until it forced Denver to totally load the box.

 

But whatever.  This is a poorly-coached team in complete free fall and the only thing preventing change at this point is Pegula’s own laziness.

1) we went away from the run when McDermott took away a primary piece of Dorseys gameplan. Especially the scripted plays. The Broncos run defense was their weakness. McDermott hobbled the offense pulling out Cook. Maybe it made him hungry to come back in and we saw the result but we will never know.

 

2) the offense was much better game planned and schemed than the defense. too many give up 3rd downs, too many rushers/blitzers leaving too few in coverage when we were not getting to Wilson, just a bunch of things on defense that were not working.

 

Note: the defense executed better than the offense but that is not high bar. the defense could not tackle, rush the qb, and were poor in coverage.

[Playoffs?]

McD looked like he knew he is about to be fired at the end of the game. 

[Coach Tuesday]

2 minutes ago, boyst said:

1) we went away from the run when McDermott took away a primary piece of Dorseys gameplan. Especially the scripted plays. The Broncos run defense was their weakness. McDermott hobbled the offense pulling out Cook. Maybe it made him hungry to come back in and we saw the result but we will never know.

 

2) the offense was much better game planned and schemed than the defense. too many give up 3rd downs, too many rushers/blitzers leaving too few in coverage when we were not getting to Wilson, just a bunch of things on defense that were not working.

 

Note: the defense executed better than the offense but that is not high bar. the defense could not tackle, rush the qb, and were poor in coverage.

Agree w most of that.  Certainly the blitzes last night were insanely dumb - and even when they only rushed 3 or 4, they kept rushing too far downfield and letting Wilson easily step up and reset or scramble.

 

The gym teacher coach has lost his team.

[JerseyBills]

7 hours ago, BillsFan692 said:

Scoring too fast??? ***** me what is wrong with this coach... 

And he's a defensive  oach lol. D played solid to be fair , considering their injuries but ya i hate that mentality 

[MAJBobby]

The regression of this team since the 13 seconds cannot be ignored. 
 

2020 - lost in Championship Game 

2021 - Lost in Divisional game 13 seconds

2022 - lost by 17 at home in Divisional Game. 
 

2023 - 5-5 

 

The “Process” is stale and unfortunately I don’t see an easy way to solve this next year either with the Cap the Bills currently have. 
 

the team is Old, slow and the coaching is Stale. 
 

we are the Marvin Lewis Bengals of this era at this point. 
 

And yes while I am going to blame coaching right now. 
 

Josh REALLY can you finally improve on ball security. You have been in the league long enough to freaking go at least back to back games without a turnover. How about you end your ***** streak of what 6 games with a pick to start. 

[UKBillFan]

3 minutes ago, JerseyBills said:

And he's a defensive  oach lol. D played solid to be fair , considering their injuries but ya i hate that mentality 

 

McDermott's defense chokes in clutch situations. Always has, seemingly always will. The offense is opposite at the moment - only turns up in clutch situations, which can be a case of too little too late.

[JerseyBills]

3 minutes ago, UKBillFan said:

 

McDermott's defense chokes in clutch situations. Always has, seemingly always will. The offense is opposite at the moment - only turns up in clutch situations, which can be a case of too little too late.

2nd time this year, including NE and many times recently,  especially playoffs 

[UKBillFan]

Just now, JerseyBills said:

2nd time this year, including NE and many times recently,  especially playoffs 

 

Arguably yesterday was the third time this year - the Giants came was a fortunate mess of an ending. And the Bucs offense came so close to nailing a Hail Mary, though won't say that's the fourth.

[yall]

Dorsey didn't call a terrible offense last night. The players dropping easy catches and allowing 4 turnovers killed it though.

 

McDermott on the other hand still refuses to hold himself accountable for the overall performance of the team, clock management and decision making. Or you know the things we otherwise refer to as "his ***** job".

[Coach Tuesday]

Just now, yall said:

Dorsey didn't call a terrible offense last night. The players dropping easy catches and allowing 4 turnovers killed it though.

 

McDermott on the other hand still refuses to hold himself accountable for the overall performance of the team, clock management and decision making. Or you know the things we otherwise refer to as "his ***** job".

He seems to be one of the most unaccountable executives in the entire country.

[bostonadguy]

I wonder if he being DC is making it hard to oversee the whole operation.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

18 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

The regression of this team since the 13 seconds cannot be ignored. 
 

2020 - lost in Championship Game 

2021 - Lost in Divisional game 13 seconds

2022 - lost by 17 at home in Divisional Game. 
 

2023 - 5-5 

 

The “Process” is stale and unfortunately I don’t see an easy way to solve this next year either with the Cap the Bills currently have. 
 

the team is Old, slow and the coaching is Stale. 
 

we are the Marvin Lewis Bengals of this era at this point. 
 

And yes while I am going to blame coaching right now. 
 

Josh REALLY can you finally improve on ball security. You have been in the league long enough to freaking go at least back to back games without a turnover. How about you end your ***** streak of what 6 games with a pick to start. 

Allen just isn't that good.

 

Period. Yes, the coaching sucks, yes, the GM sucks. But yes, the QB ALSO ducks.

[MAJBobby]

2 minutes ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

Allen just isn't that good.

 

Period. Yes, the coaching sucks, yes, the GM sucks. But yes, the QB ALSO ducks.

So where in my post did I not put a heaping serving of blame for where we are on the QB?  
 

I have been a pretty harsh critic of Josh this year take a lot of heat about it. But it is what it is. The guy cannot do basic stuff at this point. Even in this very basic offense.

 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Just now, MAJBobby said:

So where in my post did I not put a heaping serving of blame for where we are on the QB?  
 

I have been a pretty harsh critic of Josh this year take a lot of heat about it. But it is what it is. The guy cannot do basic stuff at this point. Even in this very basic offense.

 

You and I are in synch about this team for the first time ever.

 

This team has run it's course. Though I think my prescription for what to do is likely harsher than yours 

[MAJBobby]

Just now, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

You and I are in synch about this team for the first time ever.

 

This team has run it's course. Though I think my prescription for what to do is likely harsher than yours 

My solution would be Fire the HC and entire Offensive Staff. 
 

defensive position group coaches can stay pending an evaluation from your new Offensive minded coach. 
 

That coach then makes the decision on Allen. I am not forcing Allen on a coach. But there are enough coaches that will love to coach him. Allen is salvageable In my opinion. And if he isn’t you eventually will get a top pick to get a new one 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Just now, MAJBobby said:

My solution would be Fire the HC and entire Offensive Staff. 
 

defensive position group coaches can stay pending an evaluation from your new Offensive minded coach. 
 

That coach then makes the decision on Allen. I am not forcing Allen on a coach. But there are enough coaches that will love to coach him. Allen is salvageable In my opinion. And if he isn’t you eventually will get a top pick to get a new one 

Yeah, that's more conservative than I'd like 

 

I agree on firing pretty much everyone, but I'd also move on from Josh. That contract for a guy who's pretty average is just not doable.

[BillsFan130]

4 minutes ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

Yeah, that's more conservative than I'd like 

 

I agree on firing pretty much everyone, but I'd also move on from Josh. That contract for a guy who's pretty average is just not doable.

Move on from Josh, Are we serious right now?

 

And get who as our QB? Take a big Gamble on a mid round draft pick or get another re tread QB who sucks?

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Just now, BillsFan130 said:

Move on from Josh, Are we serious right now?

 

And get who as our QB? Take a big Gamble on a mid round draft pick or get another re tread QB who sucks?

Trade him to a top 5 draft position team like Chicago for a draft haul and try with a rookie. Josh is what he is at this point and what he is isn't good enough.

[BillsFan130]

Just now, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

Trade him to a top 5 draft position team like Chicago for a draft haul and try with a rookie. Josh is what he is at this point and what he is isn't good enough.

I mean, is what he is?

 

He leads the league in total TDS for even how inconsistent he has played.

 

Josh isn’t playing great football now, no doubt.

 

But Mahomes is actually on a colder streak than him, but no one talks about that cause he has defence and coaching bail him out with wins 

 

 

[MAJBobby]

10 minutes ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

Yeah, that's more conservative than I'd like 

 

I agree on firing pretty much everyone, but I'd also move on from Josh. That contract for a guy who's pretty average is just not doable.

That contract is unmovable so you give your new offensive minded head coach a shot with him. 
 

He is light years more talented that a Goff and look what coaching has done for him. 
 

I can say the same for Stafford 

 

[Low Positive]

12 minutes ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

Yeah, that's more conservative than I'd like 

 

I agree on firing pretty much everyone, but I'd also move on from Josh. That contract for a guy who's pretty average is just not doable.

If the Bills traded Josh Allen and Von Miller they would have so much dead cap that they would have trouble fielding a team next year.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Just now, BillsFan130 said:

I mean, is what he is?

 

He leads the league in total TDS for even how inconsistent he has played.

 

Josh isn’t playing great football now, no doubt.

 

But Mahomes is actually on a colder streak than him, but no one talks about that cause he has defence and coaching bail him out with wins 

 

 

 

At a minimum, Josh is responsible for two losses this year. The Jets and this game. You could probably argue he's responsible for the Jags loss too. There's not a franchise QB in the league OTHER than him that I think you can say that about.

 

I mean, the man is also leading the league in turnovers, again.

 

It's not all the coordinator. A majority share for that lies with him

 

 

 

Just now, FrenchConnection said:

If the Bills traded Josh Allen and Von Miller they would have so much dead cap that they would have trouble fielding a team next year.

 

Which would then allow them to reap the benefit of high picks in the following year.

This team NEEDS to get younger and more talented because right now it's old and untalented.

 

2 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

That contract is unmovable so you give your new offensive minded head coach a shot with him. 
 

He is light years more talented that a Goff and look what coaching has done for him. 
 

I can say the same for Stafford 

 

 

I mean, maybe. He doesn't seem like the most coachable guy these days.

 

[Low Positive]

1 minute ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

 

At a minimum, Josh is responsible for two losses this year. The Jets and this game. You could probably argue he's responsible for the Jags loss too. There's not a franchise QB in the league OTHER than him that I think you can say that about.

 

I mean, the man is also leading the league in turnovers, again.

 

It's not all the coordinator. A majority share for that lies with him

 

 

 

 

Which would then allow them to reap the benefit of high picks in the following year.

This team NEEDS to get younger and more talented because right now it's old and untalented.

 

I don’t mean fielding a good team. I mean even having enough cap space to put a team on the field. Von, Josh, and Diggs have so much dead cap that it would absorb 3/4 of the cap. Not going to happen. 

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Just now, FrenchConnection said:

I don’t mean fielding a good team. I mean even having enough cap space to put a team on the field. Von, Josh, and Diggs have so much dead cap that it would absorb 3/4 of the cap. Not going to happen. 

 

One would have to assume that with Josh, at least, some arrangement for sharing the cap hit with the receiving team would be worked out.

 

[stlbills13]

I'm sure today/tomorrow we will hear from McDermott, Dorsey, Allen, Von, etc.

 

"We know we are close to turning it around"

 

"It's just time to have some urgency"

 

"We have to take care of the ball"

 

"I have to play better"

 

"I'm not worried yet"

 

"There's a lot of belief in this locker room"

 

Nothing is going to change. Pegula will keep McDermott. McDermott will keep Dorsey. Allen will keep turning it over. etc

 

I actually don't think the season is completely lost. I see this team playing to the level of each of their final 7 opponents meaning all the games are winnable. But they may not win any of them if there aren't drastic changes. It's November 14th. You are 5-5. It's time for drastic changes even if you believe the season is lost.

[BillsFan130]

5 minutes ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

 

At a minimum, Josh is responsible for two losses this year. The Jets and this game. You could probably argue he's responsible for the Jags loss too. There's not a franchise QB in the league OTHER than him that I think you can say that about.

 

I mean, the man is also leading the league in turnovers, again.

 

It's not all the coordinator. A majority share for that lies with him

 

 

 

Mahomes against Denver was 100 percent on him but people will use the flu excuse cause it’s the “great Patrick”.

 

He also had 3 turnovers against the jets but got bailed out by the worst PI call.

 

He also had multiple turnovers against JAX and Denver on their other wins, but their defence held the offences to under 10 points those games

 

literally the only difference between the two this year is that his defences have bailed him out where Joshs defences have not.

 

 

Edited November 14, 2023 by BillsFan130

[MAJBobby]

7 minutes ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

 

At a minimum, Josh is responsible for two losses this year. The Jets and this game. You could probably argue he's responsible for the Jags loss too. There's not a franchise QB in the league OTHER than him that I think you can say that about.

 

I mean, the man is also leading the league in turnovers, again.

 

It's not all the coordinator. A majority share for that lies with him

 

 

 

 

Which would then allow them to reap the benefit of high picks in the following year.

This team NEEDS to get younger and more talented because right now it's old and untalented.

 

 

I mean, maybe. He doesn't seem like the most coachable guy these days.

 

Why doesn’t he seem coachable?  Because he has completely changed out he plays the position for the OC and McD?  
 

I can point to many Franchise QBs that lost the football games so that is nothing more than hyperbole 

[FireChans]

Just now, BillsFan130 said:

Mahomes against Denver was 100 percent on him but people will use the flu excuse cause it’s the “great Patrick”.

 

He also had 3 turnovers against the jets but got bailed out by the worst PI call.

 

He also had multiple turnovers against JAX and Denver on their other wins, but their defence held the offences to under 10 points that game.

 

literally the only difference between the two this year is that his defences have bailed him out where Joshs defences have not.

 

 

Mahomes carried the 24th defense to 12-4 and the AFCCG 

[BillsFan130]

1 minute ago, FireChans said:

Mahomes carried the 24th defense to 12-4 and the AFCCG 

I’m not talking about last year. I’m talking about this year

[Southern_Bills]

1 minute ago, FireChans said:

Mahomes carried the 24th defense to 12-4 and the AFCCG 

 

Overall defense is such a misleading stat. KC always has an opportunistic defense who tightens up when they have to.

 

The Bills defense doesn't get alot of turnovers and dissappear when you have to have them. Been that way a while now.

 

Entire coaching staff should be looking for a job.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

1 minute ago, MAJBobby said:

Why doesn’t he seem coachable?  Because he has completely changed out he plays the position for the OC and McD?  
 

I can point to many Franchise QBs that lost the football games so that is nothing more than hyperbole 

 

He still exhibits the same issues he has his whole career. If he was in year two, I wouldn't be worried. But he is consistently poor at reading defenses, poor at finding his outlet man, poor at decision making pre and post snap. If he was coachable, this wouldn't be a problem. He, in my opinion, thinks far too highly of his physical gifts to the point where he ignores the things that make truly great QBs great.

 

[SoCal Deek]

Don’t get me wrong, I think Dorsey and McD are both incompetent…but Josh Allen isn’t supposed to need great coaching at this point in the arc of his career. There’s nothing he shouldn’t have already seen on a football field. He’s either going to put this team on his back and will them to victory or he isn’t. Right now, he certainly looks like he isn’t. 

[MAJBobby]

2 minutes ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

 

He still exhibits the same issues he has his whole career. If he was in year two, I wouldn't be worried. But he is consistently poor at reading defenses, poor at finding his outlet man, poor at decision making pre and post snap. If he was coachable, this wouldn't be a problem. He, in my opinion, thinks far too highly of his physical gifts to the point where he ignores the things that make truly great QBs great.

 

They all do. Again you let your next Offensive Minded (hopefully) Head Coach make the decision on Josh. It really isn’t that hard 

[BillsFan2313]

8 hours ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

Said he has confidence in him but things could have been better, then brings up scoring too fast when we got down to the endzone.

 

That tells me he is not happy with Dorsey.

 

 

 

Can you share the quote? I didn't hear that

[Milanos Milano]

3 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

Don’t get me wrong, I think Dorsey and McD are both incompetent…but Josh Allen isn’t supposed to need great coaching at this point in the arc of his career. There’s nothing he shouldn’t have already seen on a football field. He’s either going to put this team on his back and will them to victory or he isn’t. Right now, he certainly looks like he isn’t. 

This is definitely true and concerning, but I chalk some of that up to coaching as well. Part of coaching is helping players build confidence when they are in a rut. Part of coaching is not allowing your players to fall into such ruts by designing better schemes. Our scheme is so bad, that it has infected Allen.  

[DapperCam]

22 minutes ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

 

At a minimum, Josh is responsible for two losses this year. The Jets and this game. You could probably argue he's responsible for the Jags loss too. There's not a franchise QB in the league OTHER than him that I think you can say that about.

I don’t have a specific example, but I really doubt that’s true. A lot of trash QBs all over the league throwing away games every week.

 

Burrow had a historically bad 3-4 first games this year, so how about him? Lamar Jackson gave the game away to the Browns this week with a pick 6. Mahomes gifted the Dolphins a sack fumble last week that led to a TD.

 

I think we just have very high expectations for Allen (rightfully so).

[HappyDays]

1 hour ago, Coach Tuesday said:

Agree w most of that.  Certainly the blitzes last night were insanely dumb - and even when they only rushed 3 or 4, they kept rushing too far downfield and letting Wilson easily step up and reset or scramble.

 

The gym teacher coach has lost his team.

 

I kept asking, how many times is Wilson going to step up and pitch it to his RB leaking out before McDermott actually does something about it? It happened over and over and over again, including the first play of their final drive.

 

The defense played their asses off, but the scheme and play calling was Rex Ryan levels of bad.

[MasterStrategist]

30 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

I kept asking, how many times is Wilson going to step up and pitch it to his RB leaking out before McDermott actually does something about it? It happened over and over and over again, including the first play of their final drive.

 

The defense played their asses off, but the scheme and play calling was Rex Ryan levels of bad.

Defense wasn't the problem last night, albeit they gave up the game winning drive.  

 

Down 5 starters, 4 turnovers by offense, poor field position from turnovers/bad ST punting coverage, etc.  

 

They played hard, as you said.  In no world should this offense be held to 3 scoring drives an entire game.  It's happened way too often.  On top of that, turning it over 4 times.

 

Offense is just plain bad right now.  Josh included. Point the finger wherever, but definitely in direction of offense.  Dorsey in particular.  Execution is awful, mostly on players, but have to ask why it's become so bad so fast.  To me it's coaching/philosophy of running the offense.  

 

If Dorsey isn't fired today, then I'm more angry at Sean/Beane.  

 

Sean is on thin ice too.  He's a much better coach than Dorsey/most others we have.  IMO, better defensive coordinator than head coach. 

 

Can't full reset the offense 10 games in.  But we can see if Shula/someone else can get more consistency/production, and get an extended look at what might be coaching OR determine if it's more player-driven.

[Roundybout]

56 minutes ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

 

He still exhibits the same issues he has his whole career. If he was in year two, I wouldn't be worried. But he is consistently poor at reading defenses, poor at finding his outlet man, poor at decision making pre and post snap. If he was coachable, this wouldn't be a problem. He, in my opinion, thinks far too highly of his physical gifts to the point where he ignores the things that make truly great QBs great.

 

If this was the case he would still be running like he did a few seasons ago. He’s been coached not to, it’s blatantly obvious.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

8 minutes ago, Roundybout said:

If this was the case he would still be running like he did a few seasons ago. He’s been coached not to, it’s blatantly obvious.

he's been coached not to run, yes, but he hasn't been coached out of not giving a damn about actually reading defenses