Pressure is on McBeane - PFT discussion

[balln]

I was saying early this year, pressure is ratcheting up on McD. Needed to make super bowl this year - team looked stacked early in the year. Now national media ( i think of all the talking heads - sims and florio are the most reasonable and legit ) starting to recognize McD and Beane arent getting the job done. Sims is a little more on the side of needing more impact players which I agree. I still think think the right move was keeping Daboll and leaving frazier and McD in kc parking lot after 13 seconds (and hous and kc playoff game poor D performances)

 

 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

60% of the draft allocation is defense.

 

McDermott has gotten his way since 2017.

 

We can bring up he tried Peterman - not once, but twice.

My initial read on him when he was hired was he sounded like Jauron, a typical defensive coach who talked about snowy weather and the physical run game. 

 

13 seconds started his clock ticking, we all saw the passive prevent defense him and Frazier played against Cincinnati, showing they learned nothing from 13 seconds. Meanwhile the Bengals coaching staff had a great plan for Allen. 

 

He’s definitely under the microscope now, with Diggs starting to get more vocal now on every interview about what are we doing and the growing angst of Allen being asked about his elbow non-stop.

 

I think Kansas City was always the backstop. They are the bar of excellence. But to see you’ve also been passed by the Bengals now, has been a harder pill to swallow. 
 

Is he the Marty Schottenheimer of our era? And can Beane actually Draft well enough to stock the shelves? 

 

[H2o]

I'm not saying McDermott is the coach we need long term, but look at Andy Reid in Philly. He won 6 division titles, 10 Playoff games overall, made 5 NFCC games, lost 3 NFCC games in a row, won the 4th of those NFCC games, and lost to the Pats in his only SB appearance. He then goes to KC, has a very talented group from FO to players, now has two Lombardi's, and is considered one of the greatest coaches of all time. 

 

The pressure is squarely on the FO and coaching staff to get this right though. Everyone on the outside looking in says the exact same things. Sports media, fans, everyone sees the Bills need OL help and more weapons for Josh. No QB in the NFL has achieved more with less. 

[LeGOATski]

The pressure's been on to make the SB the last two years. Nothing's changed. I don't think "media pressure" should be a thing. Not something that affects a franchise, anyway. I'm more interested in what the owners think and what kind of pressure they're putting on the FO, which we may never know.

[colin]

only the real extra positive people are still not openly questioning our FO and coaches (cover 1 guys are pretty pollyanna, but i bet they come around).

 

all im gonna say is better coaches have been fired from less stacked teams for better results.

[LeGOATski]

3 minutes ago, colin said:

all im gonna say is better coaches have been fired from less stacked teams for better results.

who?

 

There comes a time when a coach's tenure with a team runs its course, but it's usually after they miss the playoffs and/or lose the locker room somehow.

[balln]

12 minutes ago, LeGOATski said:

The pressure's been on to make the SB the last two years. Nothing's changed. I don't think "media pressure" should be a thing. Not something that affects a franchise, anyway. I'm more interested in what the owners think and what kind of pressure they're putting on the FO, which we may never know.

Owners know nothing about football. Media has a huge influence on them 

[FireChans]

1 hour ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

60% of the draft allocation is defense.

 

McDermott has gotten his way since 2017.

 

We can bring up he tried Peterman - not once, but twice.

My initial read on him when he was hired was he sounded like Jauron, a typical defensive coach who talked about snowy weather and the physical run game. 

 

13 seconds started his clock ticking, we all saw the passive prevent defense him and Frazier played against Cincinnati, showing they learned nothing from 13 seconds. Meanwhile the Bengals coaching staff had a great plan for Allen. 

 

He’s definitely under the microscope now, with Diggs starting to get more vocal now on every interview about what are we doing and the growing angst of Allen being asked about his elbow non-stop.

 

I think Kansas City was always the backstop. They are the bar of excellence. But to see you’ve also been passed by the Bengals now, has been a harder pill to swallow. 
 

Is he the Marty Schottenheimer of our era? And can Beane actually Draft well enough to stock the shelves? 

 

KC has also drafted majority defense.

[balln]

1 hour ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

60% of the draft allocation is defense.

 

McDermott has gotten his way since 2017.

 

We can bring up he tried Peterman - not once, but twice.

My initial read on him when he was hired was he sounded like Jauron, a typical defensive coach who talked about snowy weather and the physical run game. 

 

13 seconds started his clock ticking, we all saw the passive prevent defense him and Frazier played against Cincinnati, showing they learned nothing from 13 seconds. Meanwhile the Bengals coaching staff had a great plan for Allen. 

 

He’s definitely under the microscope now, with Diggs starting to get more vocal now on every interview about what are we doing and the growing angst of Allen being asked about his elbow non-stop.

 

I think Kansas City was always the backstop. They are the bar of excellence. But to see you’ve also been passed by the Bengals now, has been a harder pill to swallow. 
 

Is he the Marty Schottenheimer of our era? And can Beane actually Draft well enough to stock the shelves? 

 

For sure- had same jauron vibes. “We’ll we gotta look at the tape”

 

”gotta have faith”

 

”hard to win in this league”

[Gregg]

Beane has to do 3 things well this offseason for the Bills to have a good chance to win the Super Bowl.

 

1. Improve the OL. Everyone knows it's been said a billion times on this message board.

2. Get an #2 WR

3. Plug in the holes on D as we are probably losing Edmunds and Poyer.

Edited February 24, 2023 by Gregg

[LeGOATski]

1 minute ago, balln said:

Owners know nothing about football. Media has a huge influence on them 

I would hope not. That's a sure sign of a poorly run franchise. Have the Bills under Pegulas/Beane/McDermott shown any signs of being affected by the pressures of a fickle media?

[bobobonators]

14 minutes ago, colin said:

only the real extra positive people are still not openly questioning our FO and coaches (cover 1 guys are pretty pollyanna, but i bet they come around).

 

all im gonna say is better coaches have been fired from less stacked teams for better results.

Which “better” coaches have achieved  more with less and been fired. Im dying to see this list you come up with. 

[Billsflyer12]

The Five-Year Rule: No team has ever started the same quarterback under the same head coach for more than five years and seen that duo win its first championship.

[colin]

Just now, bobobonators said:

Which “better” coaches have achieved  more with less and been fired. Im dying to see this list you come up with. 

 

bobobonators, you came back!  i thought you were out!  

 

I missed you.

[balln]

12 minutes ago, LeGOATski said:

I would hope not. That's a sure sign of a poorly run franchise. Have the Bills under Pegulas/Beane/McDermott shown any signs of being affected by the pressures of a fickle media?

Yea. They fired Ralph Kruger 

 

they also hired Rex Ryan 

Edited February 24, 2023 by balln

[colin]

23 minutes ago, LeGOATski said:

who?

 

There comes a time when a coach's tenure with a team runs its course, but it's usually after they miss the playoffs and/or lose the locker room somehow.

 

brian billick, marty shotty, reid in philly, many more if you include coordinators who got sacrificed.

 

HC and DC staying after 13 seconds and the failure last year is legit crazy.  baltimore (and you can perhaps say these moves were sacrificial, but it's at least action) shot their OC and DC after not being satisfied w how they have done, and they played cinci way better than we did in back to back weeks (shoulda won the last one), and that's w a UPS driver at QB.  

 

like, how would our team look if allen was hurt and not playing?  to me the fact that we'd all assume a terrible loss (hell, we had one vs cincy w our goat qb ready to go) is a real reflection on what the coaches and front office have here sans josh allen.

 

 

edit: to your point -- we have been just savagely trucked at least once in every single year that mcd has been here.  sadly in 2022/2023 it was in a home divisional playoff game.  between those total team lay downs and the chirping from diggs and allen, i think it's safe to say that the bills players are wise to the fact that their roster is not balanced and that their coaches are not top shelf.

Edited February 24, 2023 by colin

[Mrbojanglezs]

Beane hasn't done a great job filling this team with cheap productive draft picks

[balln]

3 minutes ago, Mrbojanglezs said:

Beane hasn't done a great job filling this team with cheap productive draft picks

Nope Jake Fromm , Ricky proehl, Matt arazia , VOsean , not even in the league 

10 minutes ago, colin said:

 

brian billick, marty shotty, reid in philly, many more if you include coordinators who got sacrificed.

 

HC and DC staying after 13 seconds and the failure last year is legit crazy.  baltimore (and you can perhaps say these moves were sacrificial, but it's at least action) shot their OC and DC after not being satisfied w how they have done, and they played cinci way better than we did in back to back weeks (shoulda won the last one), and that's w a UPS driver at QB.  

 

like, how would our team look if allen was hurt and not playing?  to me the fact that we'd all assume a terrible loss (hell, we had one vs cincy w our goat qb ready to go) is a real reflection on what the coaches and front office have here sans josh allen.

 

 

edit: to your point -- we have been just savagely trucked at least once in every single year that mcd has been here.  sadly in 2022/2023 it was in a home divisional playoff game.  between those total team lay downs and the chirping from diggs and allen, i think it's safe to say that the bills players are wise to the fact that their roster is not balanced and that their coaches are not top shelf.

Yea kc / cincy never look like they don’t belong in any game. 
 

bills v Indy 

bills vs Philly / Carson 

bills vs saints at home 

 

bills and cincy looked like a preseason game / drought era drubbing 

[Gregg]

5 minutes ago, balln said:

Nope Jake Fromm , Ricky proehl, Matt arazia , VOsean , not even in the league 

Yea kc / cincy never look like they don’t belong in any game. 
 

bills v Indy 

bills vs Philly / Carson 

bills vs saints at home 

 

bills and cincy looked like a preseason game / drought era drubbing 

 

Didn't the Bengals get blown out by the Browns this past year.

[colin]

2 minutes ago, Gregg said:

 

Didn't the Bengals get blown out by the Browns this past year.

 

they had the excuse of top talent being hurt.

 

im not saying cinci and kc are perfect, but they are our afc rivals and they are way way better than us as teams when the chips are down.  when i see the bills falter, i see either obvious coaching blunders (13 seconds) or i see a team that lacks preparation and confidence, which to me is on the coaches.

 

my bottom line -- if the results of the bills are evidence of good coaching, then the results of marvin lewis in cinci was evidence of good coaching.

[balln]

5 minutes ago, Gregg said:

 

Didn't the Bengals get blown out by the Browns this past year.

Blown out ? nah- just a one of those games against a div opp. They at least looked like they belong 

[nucci]

There's pressure on every team, GM, coach to win in this league

[balln]

1 minute ago, colin said:

 

they had the excuse of top talent being hurt.

 

im not saying cinci and kc are perfect, but they are our afc rivals and they are way way better than us as teams when the chips are down.  when i see the bills falter, i see either obvious coaching blunders (13 seconds) or i see a team that lacks preparation and confidence, which to me is on the coaches.

 

my bottom line -- if the results of the bills are evidence of good coaching, then the results of marvin lewis in cinci was evidence of good coaching.

The other thing is - cincy and kc even if down 14 or 21. Can come back and win.

 

im pretty sure buf / Allen haven’t seen that yet

[Gregg]

2 minutes ago, balln said:

Blown out ? nah- just a one of those games against a div opp. They at least looked like they belong 

 

32-13 isn't a blowout?

[balln]

4 minutes ago, Gregg said:

 

32-13 isn't a blowout?

Did Jamar chase play ? Did you watch the game ? 
 

you also aren’t as POd off about it as bengals fan bc your HC and QB took down kc in kc and played in a Super Bowl in year 2

Edited February 24, 2023 by balln

[colin]

Just now, balln said:

The other thing is - cincy and kc even if down 14 or 21. Can come back and win.

 

im pretty sure buf / Allen haven’t seen that yet

 

since the season before the one just ended, when we were spread covering monsters, into the beginning of the past season, we were huge front runners.  deadly when we had a decent start and lead, but if the other team hung around we basically lost them all.

 

now, we won some close games just this past season and our O results were identical to the prior season just more consistent, but the team didn't seem to buy in and we heard that form the diggs and allen interviews recently.  that's a low confidence front runner mind set -- like a boxer who doesn't trust his own chin/toughness.  

 

 

[loveorhatembillsfan4life]

Do you think Mcd is still too slow to adapt mid season or  this braint trust has gone too far with the belief of having our players grow and get better..Maybe just another trait of being too safe?

 

I was thinking about the Hines trade. He was traded for on November 1 and saw little to no action in his first few games.  Meanwhile  McCaffrey was on a plane learning the playbook and involved right away. I know they are not on the same level of talent  but it seemed like a  awfully long time to figure out a way to get Hines involved. 

 

Maybe Sims is right and we need to be more open to brining guys in like a K Toney. We always find some reason to say nah we don’t need a guy like that but on the flip side the Chiefs are saying yeah another weapon for Mahomes. Anytime I hear a Wr is available you can bet the Chiefs are seriously looking into them. 
 

Veach right now is taking Beanes lunch money. Maybe time to get a bit more out of the comfort zone? I don’t know I’m just spitballing thoughts.. this off-season still feels about as depressing as Beanes PC. 
 

I want a SB! 

 

 

[McBean]

2 hours ago, balln said:

I was saying early this year, pressure is ratcheting up on McD. Needed to make super bowl this year - team looked stacked early in the year. Now national media ( i think of all the talking heads - sims and florio are the most reasonable and legit ) starting to recognize McD and Beane arent getting the job done. Sims is a little more on the side of needing more impact players which I agree. I still think think the right move was keeping Daboll and leaving frazier and McD in kc parking lot after 13 seconds (and hous and kc playoff game poor D performances)

 

 

Keeping McClappy over WNY homeboy Brian “Coach of the Year” Daboll will haunt this organization for a long time.

 

I pounded the table for Daboll as HC. We let Phil Jackson walk out the building and kept Doug Collins. What happened in KC that night was nothing short of robbery. Sean McDermott robbed us of a Super Bowl. I know for a fact he had no clue KC had 3 timeouts left with 13 seconds. They also didn’t get it into Bass to squib kick. Total disaster. 
 

Sad thing is McDermott won’t ever get fired because he has a QB with so much talent that we could coach them to 10+ wins with him under center.

 

We are stuck in coaching purgatory and wasting the best QB to ever put on a Bills jersey.

 

Sad!

Edited February 24, 2023 by McBean

[balln]

2 minutes ago, colin said:

 

since the season before the one just ended, when we were spread covering monsters, into the beginning of the past season, we were huge front runners.  deadly when we had a decent start and lead, but if the other team hung around we basically lost them all.

 

now, we won some close games just this past season and our O results were identical to the prior season just more consistent, but the team didn't seem to buy in and we heard that form the diggs and allen interviews recently.  that's a low confidence front runner mind set -- like a boxer who doesn't trust his own chin/toughness.  

 

 

Yea and we get Von / a winner and a leader. And he has to “coach” our guys to “not blink.”

 

it’s disturbing 

 

The more we’re discussing this- further makes me want McD gone 

[Gregg]

4 minutes ago, balln said:

Did Jamar chase play ? Did you watch the game ? 
 

you also aren’t as POd off about it as bengals fan bc your HC and QB took down kc in kc and played in a Super Bowl in year 2

 

Injuries happen. Doesn't change the fact that it was blowout. I give the Bengals credit for beating KC and getting to the Super Bowl 2 years in ago. I also give them credit for kicking the Bills ass these past playoffs.

[Bill from NYC]

51 minutes ago, balln said:

For sure- had same jauron vibes. “We’ll we gotta look at the tape”

 

”gotta have faith”

 

”hard to win in this league”

Main priority is secondary.  

[Negan]

Florio is right, another season of not making a Super Bowl and McDermott should be fired, probably Beane too

[Ga boy]

49 minutes ago, Gregg said:

Beane has to do 3 things well this offseason for the Bills to have a good chance to win the Super Bowl.

 

1. Improve the OL. Everyone knows it's been said a billion times on this message board.

2. Get an #2 WR

3. Plug in the holes on D as we are probably losing Edmunds and Poyer.

I think these areas will get better.  Other AFCE teams will be better.  It would take a 7 or 8 win season to axe the coach.  Won’t happen.  Even with 13 seconds and Cincy, McD is in the same security category as Tomlin.  He’s secure unless a complete collapse which can’t happen as long as JA17 is healthy.

[Gregg]

1 minute ago, Ga boy said:

I think these areas will get better.  Other AFCE teams will be better.  It would take a 7 or 8 win season to axe the coach.  Won’t happen.  Even with 13 seconds and Cincy, McD is in the same security category as Tomlin.  He’s secure unless a complete collapse which can’t happen as long as JA17 is healthy.

 

You are probably right as the Bills have done a lot of winning since McDermott took over. But as we have seen with the Sabres, Terry is not afraid to make changes. Granted the Sabres for a long time were a joke. But fans, media, DIGGS, are starting to run out of patience with these playoff failures. Tomlin has won a Lombardi along with all of the successful seasons the Steelers have had. McDermott hasn't done that yet.

[CheshireCT]

1 hour ago, balln said:

For sure- had same jauron vibes. “We’ll we gotta look at the tape”

 

”gotta have faith”

 

”hard to win in this league”

 

except McDermott Bills broke the draught in his first season (ahem with less than stellar talent), went 13-3 last season, made the playoffs every season but one (Josh's rookie season), and reached one AFC Championship game.

 

Jauron's highlight season was what, 7-9?

 

Jauron was a walking ghost, McDermott is fired up and working his tail off, while owning up to mistakes and working to correct them. I just don't see any comparison between the two.

Edited February 24, 2023 by CheshireCT

[CheshireCT]

2 hours ago, balln said:

I was saying early this year, pressure is ratcheting up on McD. Needed to make super bowl this year - team looked stacked early in the year. Now national media ( i think of all the talking heads - sims and florio are the most reasonable and legit ) starting to recognize McD and Beane arent getting the job done. Sims is a little more on the side of needing more impact players which I agree. I still think think the right move was keeping Daboll and leaving frazier and McD in kc parking lot after 13 seconds (and hous and kc playoff game poor D performances)

 

 

 

A year ago, everyone said the Bills had the best roster in the league. We had an unfortunate rash of injuries this season. Now we're going to lose some important players to free agency. At this point, yeah we need some roster improvements, that's clear.

 

Complaints about the coaching staff and front office? Total bull####. Any team that's winning their division and in the playoffs every year has a winning formula. As far as I'm concerned, as long as they have JA and they keep working at it, they're gonna crack through eventually. We can complain about the Chiefs all we want, but the way down is far. Fire McDermott and Beane? This team is more likely to end up back in 7-9 purgatory than win the Super Bowl.

[Ga boy]

20 minutes ago, Gregg said:

 

You are probably right as the Bills have done a lot of winning since McDermott took over. But as we have seen with the Sabres, Terry is not afraid to make changes. Granted the Sabres for a long time were a joke. But fans, media, DIGGS, are starting to run out of patience with these playoff failures. Tomlin has won a Lombardi along with all of the successful seasons the Steelers have had. McDermott hasn't done that yet.

Hope we don’t look back and think that our best chance was the 13 seconds.  Bowing out early this year was a “blessing in disguise” since we didn’t have the team to win AFC or SB.  I still believe in McD.

[PBF81]

2 hours ago, H2o said:

I'm not saying McDermott is the coach we need long term, but look at Andy Reid in Philly. He won 6 division titles, 10 Playoff games overall, made 5 NFCC games, lost 3 NFCC games in a row, won the 4th of those NFCC games, and lost to the Pats in his only SB appearance. He then goes to KC, has a very talented group from FO to players, now has two Lombardi's, and is considered one of the greatest coaches of all time. 

 

The pressure is squarely on the FO and coaching staff to get this right though. Everyone on the outside looking in says the exact same things. Sports media, fans, everyone sees the Bills need OL help and more weapons for Josh. No QB in the NFL has achieved more with less. 

 

Reid didn't have anything close to Allen either.

 

16 minutes ago, CheshireCT said:

 

except McDermott Bills broke the draught in his first season (ahem with less than stellar talent), went 13-3 last season, made the playoffs every season but one (Josh's rookie season), and reached one AFC Championship game.

 

Jauron's highlight season was what, 7-9?

 

Jauron was a walking ghost, McDermott is fired up and working his tail off, while owning up to mistakes and working to correct them. I just don't see any comparison between the two.

 

If those teams had all had Allen we'd have made the playoffs a bunch of times during that "Last 20 Years ". 

 

People understand Allen's impact.

[TheFunPolice]

McDermott is going to need to get this team further in the playoffs.

 

This management is becoming known for coming up short. 

[Gregg]

21 minutes ago, CheshireCT said:

 

except McDermott Bills broke the draught in his first season (ahem with less than stellar talent), went 13-3 last season, made the playoffs every season but one (Josh's rookie season), and reached one AFC Championship game.

 

Jauron's highlight season was what, 7-9?

 

Jauron was a walking ghost, McDermott is fired up and working his tail off, while owning up to mistakes and working to correct them. I just don't see any comparison between the two.

 

He isn't owning up to his biggest mistake and that is keeping Frazier on as DC.