Post-game thoughts after a disappointing loss

[Governor]

1 hour ago, stevestojan said:

Anyone else strangely calm after this? Maybe I’m getting used to it or maybe I just never saw a path to beat the Bengals. 
 

But I’m over it already. I do think changes need to be made at the very highest levels, but I’m not going to let this ruin my day. 
 

Maybe next year. 

This game went exactly like the first one was going to go until it was canceled. I can’t believe they trotted out this garbage D again. 

[DuckyBoys]

1 minute ago, LeGOATski said:

The Bengals aren't a power football team either and had a bunch of backups playing on the line. It was equal playing conditions for both teams.

you kind of made my point Bengals crushed us on both sides of the los  Bills are a team built for fast track dome shootouts

[jkeerie]

1 minute ago, LeGOATski said:

The Bengals aren't a power football team either and had a bunch of backups playing on the line. It was equal playing conditions for both teams.

In my opinion, we played with a backup oline as well.  Maybe one or two could be starters on a real oline.  We need ro set a higher standard.

[jaybills]

1 hour ago, RiotAct said:

we’re never winning a Super Bowl.  That’s a given at this point.  This was our year, and we blew it.

 

 

We are Charlie Brown incarnate!!!!

This was not our year. I have to believe that you didn't feel the same way about this team in the 2nd half of the year, as well. Last year's team was our year and we blew it. I believe I started to noticed the difference between this year and last year after the Green Bay game. We just seemed off a little offensively and we still put points on the board all year. There will be more "our year" teams in the future. I honestly just didn't feel that this year. We had a f**kton of adversity (injuries, weather, mass shooting, Hamlin, Knox's brother, etc...) and am damn proud how these guys battled week in and week out regardless of any excuse(s). This year was rough for players, coaches, and everyone else involved. We will get a Super Bowl victory under Allen and Co. McBeane will right the ship and always put whatever they can into making this team better. I fully trust their desire to do such things. Bengals are a juggernaut and they showed us why....again how good they are. To brighter seasons ahead, ladies and gents. Go Bills!

[LeGOATski]

Just now, DuckyBoys said:

you kind of made my point Bengals crushed us on both sides of the los  Bills are a team built for fast track dome shootouts

No I didn't. You're adopting my point that the weather didn't matter. If any team in the league is built for fast track shootouts, it's the Bengals. Have you not seen their receivers, their pass catching RB, and the West Coast system they run? 

[thenorthremembers]

My thoughts:

Dorsey is not good offensive coordinator.  Josh being so good off script saved his butt this year, but he has no imagination and because of that the Bills had no identity on offense this year beyond Josh willing them to victory. 

 

The Offensive and Defensive Lines are woeful and a real mirror on how well Brandon Beane is drafting and spending free agent money.   Ed Oliver is on the hook for 10.5 million dollars next year, and he is a JAG.   Feel like he should be a prime candidate to be moved in the offseason because the contract is way too much for his output.   Outside of DaQuan Jones and Von Miller on the dline they have a bunch of replacement level players who were either drafted way too high, or paid way too much.  I am not positive Tim Settle was ever even in shape this season.   On the offensive line Saffold, Bates, and Brown all need to be replaced next year, and if Dawkins doesnt feel like getting in shape to help deal with his complete inability to handle outside rush moves he needs to be moved to RT.  

 

Wideouts and Tightends:  Gabe Davis should be a part time player moving forward.  Just way too inconsistent to be considered a #2 wideout in the league, at least on a team with Super Bowl aspirations.    No way you ever consider giving him a second contract.   That should be McKenzie's last game in a Bills uniform.  Very glad they paid him around league minimum the last two years because thats exactly what he has earned.  Too many drops, too many stupid plays.   They should be first in line to try and bring in DeAndre Hopkins, and Id be glad to send Tre White the Cards way to help the deal move forward.    Knox was overpaid plain and simple. It is what it is but he is an average tight end in the league nothing more.  

 

It's time to wipe the slate clean of older players on this team.  Moving forward it needs to be Josh Allen's team because his talent has made up for a lot of bs on the team this year.    Stop signing players to big deals on defensive unless they are responsible for getting to the QB.

[Alphadawg7]

14 minutes ago, LeGOATski said:

The Bills have a great home field record in the playoffs. Losing this one game doesn't suddenly mean playing at home doesn't matter. What point are you trying to make? They need to build a dome? Teams lose home playoff games in domes, too.

My point is pretty clear.  This team is at a DISADVANTAGE on both sides of the ball in bad weather.  I didn’t say at home, I said in bad weather.  We are built soft like a dome team.  

We do not have any kind of “advantage” in bad weather, regardless where the game is played when facing these other top teams.  

[DuckyBoys]

7 minutes ago, LeGOATski said:

No I didn't. You're adopting my point that the weather didn't matter. If any team in the league is built for fast track shootouts, it's the Bengals. Have you not seen their receivers, their pass catching RB, and the West Coast system they run? 

my point is both of their lines are far superior to ours  They can still stop the run and get to the qb and obviously had no issue protecting Joe Burrow even with 3/5th backups

[Eastport bills]

The most disappointing thing about the game was that we were timid. That’s on Sean. Not being physical enough in our own building is unacceptable. We didn’t tackle, we were a step slow in coverage and Josh was pressured on every pass play. Our O-line and D -line were outplayed and our secondary was out of position. Does White expect to get away with the PIs against big time receivers every time?

[LeGOATski]

6 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

My point is pretty clear.  This team is at a DISADVANTAGE on both sides of the ball in bad weather.  I didn’t say at home, I said in bad weather.  We are built soft like a dome team.  

We do not have any kind of “advantage” in bad weather, regardless where the game is played when facing these other top teams.  

What advantage did the Bengals have then, that they wouldn't have also had in a dome?

5 minutes ago, DuckyBoys said:

my point is both of their lines are far superior to ours  They can still stop the run and get to the qb and obviously had no issue protecting Joe Burrow even with 3/5th backups

Based on what exactly? Or are you just basing this off of today's performance?

[Scott7975]

1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

I told you all year…we do NOT have any kind of advantage in bad weather games, it’s all make believe.  Also said both Mahomes and Burrow were fully capable of playing well in bad weather.  
 

Everyone argued.  But here it is once again…soft finesse football on both sides of the ball.  
 

I don’t ever want to hear we have some sort of advantage in bad weather, it’s a myth.  

 

Ditto. There is no home field advantage.  Especially for a team like ours.  Its a detriment to our offense and even a detriment to our D.  The only true playoff advantage is getting the 1 seed, having a bye, and playing a crap team that doesnt belong in the playoffs before you play the real team.  Great teams can win on the road.  We didnt lose last year just because we played at Arrowhead.

Edited January 23, 2023 by Scott7975

[LeGOATski]

1 minute ago, Scott7975 said:

 

Ditto. There is no home field advantage.  Especially for a team like ours.  Its a detriment to our offense and even a detriment to our D.  The only true playoff advantage is getting the 1 seed, having a bye, and playing a crap team that doesnt belong in the playoffs before you play the real team.

What advantages did the Bengals have that they wouldn't have had in a dome?

 

This is gonna be a fun narrative to hear all offseason 🙄

[Scott7975]

2 minutes ago, LeGOATski said:

What advantages did the Bengals have that they wouldn't have had in a dome?

 

This is gonna be a fun narrative to hear all offseason 🙄

 

Our team does not play as well in crap weather as they do in nice weather.  Thats just a fact.  Im not even trying to make this like a dome thing.  

Edited January 23, 2023 by Scott7975

[Alphadawg7]

5 minutes ago, LeGOATski said:

What advantage did the Bengals have then, that they wouldn't have also had in a dome?

What?  Lol come on, go rewatch the game.  

Just now, Scott7975 said:

 

Our team does not play as well in crap weather as they do in nice weather.  Thats just a fact.

Yeah, I don’t know how that isn’t more clear to some.  
 

The drop off in play on both sides of the ball is more significant for us than our opponents in bad weather.  
 

The way this team is built, it’s hurting us more than it’s helping us.  

[muppy]

47 minutes ago, Bermuda Triangle said:

The loss to KC in 2020 showed us that our OL and DL sucked.  Two seasons later, this loss showed us that our OL and DL still suck.

***Pouts**** just sayin' Im sad.

[purple haze]

1 hour ago, BillsFanSD said:

Couldn't agree more.  Very nice write-up.

 

My only caveat would be that this seemed to be "one of those days" in terms of it being a total team breakdown.  And the Bengals are a very good team.  Let's hold off drawing sweeping conclusions from this one game in particular.  But man, we've had issues with both lines all season . . . 

The offensive line needs to be revamped with major resources and possibly position switches.  They also badly need another playmaker on the outside to get the double-teams off Diggs.   I think doing that will see Beane have to let a few significant guys walk because Allen’s new cap hit starts next season.    

[LeGOATski]

4 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

 

Our team does not play as well in crap weather as they do in nice weather.  Thats just a fact.  Im not even trying to make this like a dome thing.  

Based on what? What's their overall record in crap weather? Do you think the Bengals play better in crap weather? What did weather have to do with this? I'm not seeing any reasons related to weather.

6 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

What?  Lol come on, go rewatch the game.  

You go rewatch the game. What advantage did the Bengals have then, that they wouldn't have also had in a dome? If it's so simple, just answer it.

[purple haze]

10 minutes ago, LeGOATski said:

What advantages did the Bengals have that they wouldn't have had in a dome?

 

This is gonna be a fun narrative to hear all offseason 🙄

Bengals have a better team wherever the game would be played.  Both lines getting beaten up had nothing to do with weather.  But folks gotta search for reasons, especially when the loss is still fresh.

 

 

[muppy]

3 minutes ago, purple haze said:

Bengals have a better team wherever the game would be played.  Both lines getting beaten up had nothing to do with weather.  But folks gotta search for reasons, especially when the loss is still fresh.

 

 

YEP

[Scott7975]

2 minutes ago, LeGOATski said:

Based on what? What's their overall record in crap weather? Do you think the Bengals play better in crap weather? What did weather have to do with this? I'm not seeing any reasons related to weather.

 

Their team has big tough guys.  Our team has finesse type smurfs.  

 

I'm not going to argue with you all night.  This isnt the first game we lost due to bad weather.  This isnt the 90's Bills with an amazing run game that can play well when the passing game isnt there.  They dont even have the o line of the 90s.  We have a bunch or revolving door slack asses.  This team is not built for weather.  This team is build to throw the ball all over the field.  Thats what Josh and this team excell at.  They dont excell at the run game.  They dont excell at dink and dunk.

[LeGOATski]

1 minute ago, purple haze said:

Bengals have a better team wherever the game would be played.  Both lines getting beaten up had nothing to do with weather.  But folks gotta search for reasons, especially when the loss is still fresh.

 

 

Yeah, the Bengals execution and coaching were much better today.

 

Historically, light snow has never been an issue. Wind or heavy precip would've been an actual issue for both teams today, but this was not such a day.

[Mark92]

Has Frazier been fired yet?? No. I'll check back later

[Billz4ever]

2 hours ago, Logic said:

I'm just gonna get my thoughts out about this painful loss before I take some time away from this forum. It takes me a while to get over season ending losses, so I'm gonna take a break for a bit, and I'll be back for free agency and draft season. Until then...

Right now, I'm not angry, I'm just really disappointed. What a painful way for this season to end. After a season in which the Bills only ever really beat themselves and lost just three games by a combined eight points, the Bills picked a hell of a time to get thoroughly dominated on both sides of the ball. This loss is so disappointing, so painful, exactly for that reason: because the Bills were just thoroughly and absolutely dominated. This game was never really close. The Bills never really had a chance. With as talented a team as they are -- that was a really painful and deflating way for the season to end.

As Brandon Beane is fond of saying, playoff losses show you where you're NOT as a football team. They show you where you're lacking. Well, what did today's loss show us?

 

To start with, this was a total team loss. No one unit or coach or player is solely to blame. From the front office, to the coaching staff, to the players, everyone shares the blame for this loss. 

If you want to understand the main reason the Bills lost the game, just look at the battles in the trenches. The Bills were outclassed convincingly on both the offensive and defensive lines. This is a failure of the front office -- Yes, of Brandon Beane, who we all love. So much draft capital and money spent on the defensive line, and they couldn't even SNIFF Burrow today. Yes, Jones and Miller were out, but that's no excuse. The Bills still boasted multiple 1st round players on the d-line. Couldn't stop the run, couldn't pressure the passer. Absolute domination. The front office also deserves blame for the mediocre-at-best offensive line they trotted out there this season, which was soundly beaten multiple times by Cincinnati defensive linemen. Brandon Beane needs to take a long hard look this offseason at the offensive line and yes, somehow, again, at the defensive line.

Next up we have the coaches. It is hard to conclude anything other than this: The Bills offensive and defensive coaching staffs were BOTH outcoached today. The offense lacked creativity, rhythm, reason. The defense -- which, yes, was without some key players -- looked absolutely toothless. When you boast defensive minds like Sean McDermott and Leslie Frazier, getting out-schemed and beaten as badly as they were today by the Cincy offense simply should never happen -- injured players or not. Today saw total failures of coaching on both sides of the ball.

Lastly, the players deserve blame. For as much as I can say about the personnel and the coaching, at the end of the day, it's up to the players to make the plays. The offensive linemen got whipped all day. The defensive linemen got driven off the ball all day. The corners and linebackers had multiple coverage mixups. The receivers dropped passes. The quarterback missed open receivers or went big play hunting at inopportune times -- again. 

The bottom line is this: Despite a season with many highs and many great moments and a 13-3 record, all of the Bills' season-long deficiencies caught up with them today. The sky is not falling, and the Bills are likely to be playoff and title contenders for years to come. But unless they want to exist a Groundhog's Day of painful yearly playoff exits, they're going to have to take a long, hard look in the mirror, and figure out a way to fix the multiple things that ail them. 

Personnel, coaching, execution in big moments, all of it needs to be better. It was a hell of a season, and I'm proud of the Bills for weathering an insane amount of adversity to make it to the Divisional round of the playoffs. But that's not enough for me, and I know it's not enough for the players and coaches either. It's up to them to figure out how to make sure it doesn't happen again in 2023.

Excellent post.  I don't even have anything to add.  You said it all.  Enjoy your break and time to decompress from this.

[purple haze]

1 minute ago, LeGOATski said:

Yeah, the Bengals execution and coaching were much better today.

 

Historically, light snow has never been an issue. Wind or heavy precip would've been an actual issue for both teams today, but this was not such a day.

Have to get better up front.  Have to.  Beane should focus on the O-line first.  So many resources already spent on the D-line.

[LeGOATski]

1 minute ago, Scott7975 said:

 

Their team has big tough guys.  Our team has finesse type smurfs.  

 

I'm not going to argue with you all night.  This isnt the first game we lost due to bad weather.  This isnt the 90's Bills with an amazing run game that can play well when the passing game isnt there.  They dont even have the o line of the 90s.  We have a bunch or revolving door slack asses.  This team is not built for weather.  This team is build to throw the ball all over the field.  Thats what Josh and this team excell at.  They dont excell at the run game.  They dont excell at dink and dunk.

Based on what exactly? Are you looking at their heights and weights? What stats are you looking at?

 

You can just say the Bills were out coached and out executed and the weather had nothing to do with it. 

 

It's okay for you to just say that.

[LeGOATski]

Just now, purple haze said:

Have to get better up front.  Have to.  Beane should focus on the O-line first.  So many resources already spent on the D-line.

Yep, offense offense offense. They need stars. It's an offensive league.

 

They keep losing to offensive juggernauts in the playoffs.

[Billz4ever]

2 hours ago, Big Turk said:

I just think they were spent. They looked spent. They looked flat and they looked like the tank was on E. 

 

People may say otherwise but based on the accumulation of things week after week to overcome, at some point you just have nothing left to give.

 

I can't be mad at them. They went thru so much this year, probably more than any team in history when you look at everything combined.

 

Hamlin is OK, that's good enough for me. 

 

They need to sort things out, figure out what they are going to do and come up with ways to overcome their shortcomings which look far bigger than they did at the start of the season right now.

Honestly, I'm glad we lost this game.  Once we got into the 3rd quarter and it became pretty clear to me there was not going to be a dramatic comeback, I accepted it and was thankful we didn't have to deal with the hype of the KC game where we'd have to live with getting bounced by KC again and this time, the narrative would be that it was by a hobbled Mahomes...or even worse, somehow manage to survive KC, advance to the SB and then be staring at the Bills 5th loss after getting crushed by SF or Philly.

 

This was a crazy season and the hype was real since the end of last season. This was probably the most hopeful year for Bills fans since the 4 in a row trips.  As the season went on and Von went down, I just had that feeling this team wasn't going to be good enough this year.  Turns out, I was right.

Edited January 23, 2023 by Billz4ever

[SectionC3]

8 minutes ago, Mark92 said:

Has Frazier been fired yet?? No. I'll check back later

I’m more worried about getting the OC a new job.  There’s a temptation to say that we screwed up letting Daboll leave after 13 seconds.  But this year was one thing after another with Tops,  Araiza, snowstorm #1, the Tre white drama, the Miller injury, snowstorm #2, the frigidity in Chicago, and the the Hamlin crisis.  I think they were gassed, and McD deserves credit for getting them this far in view of all of the adversity.  
 

That said, I’m done with Dorsey.  I heard during the year that certain people in the building thought he was in over his head.  It sort of makes sense now.   Everything seemed forced in the second of the year.  We cannot waste another year of Josh/Diggs with this BS.  

[Nextmanup]

2 hours ago, MAJBobby said:

So glad they got run out of the stadium if they were losing. Exposes how bad the construction of this team is. Need a real OL, Real WR2  protect Josh and Give Josh weapons. We have the worst Weapons group in the playoffs this year and one of the worst OLs. Stop spending All you premier assets in Defense. They are irrelevant in the Modern NFL when facing a top end Offense.

This entire post is the best thing I've read here today/tonight.

 

Having a defensive coordinator masquerading as your head coach is always going to be a problem, however.  He is ALWAYS going to be D first.  It's just how he thinks and what's in his blood.

 

You'll notice all other teams playing this weekend are coached by offensive guys!

 

 

[Norcalbillsfan]

19 minutes ago, LeGOATski said:

Yeah, the Bengals execution and coaching were much better today.

 

Historically, light snow has never been an issue. Wind or heavy precip would've been an actual issue for both teams today, but this was not such a day.

Heavy wind and rain would have been worse for the bills. The Bengals run game destroyed us. We had no run game, would have been a blood bath.

[LeGOATski]

1 minute ago, Norcalbillsfan said:

Heavy wind and rain would have been worse for the bills. The Bengals run game destroyed us. We had no run game, would have been a blood bath.

And they would've destroyed us in a dome too. It wasn't weather related. The Bengals O line and D line were playing in the same conditions as the Bills O line and D line.

[Scott7975]

23 minutes ago, LeGOATski said:

Yeah, the Bengals execution and coaching were much better today.

 

Historically, light snow has never been an issue. Wind or heavy precip would've been an actual issue for both teams today, but this was not such a day.

 

So their run game picking up like 10 yards a clip with 3rd string linement vs ours picking up like 2 yards a clip with all of our starters was just coaching?  I dont think so. Its ok to admit weather slows down our offense.

[LeGOATski]

1 minute ago, Scott7975 said:

 

So their run game picking up like 10 yards a clip with 3rd string linement vs ours picking up like 2 yards a clip with all of our starters was just coaching?  I dont think so.

Yes. Better execution. Better coaching. They were playing in the same conditions. Their backup linemen didn't have some kind of magical weather advantage.

[Scott7975]

1 minute ago, LeGOATski said:

Yes. Better execution. Better coaching. They were playing in the same conditions. Their backup linemen didn't have some kind of magical weather advantage.

 

How do you know the execution didnt have anything to do with the weather?

[LeGOATski]

8 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

 Its ok to admit weather slows down our offense.

What historical trends are you looking at that show weather slows down the Bills offense more than other offenses? This is paramount to your point.

[dakrider]

Bills beat KC in week 6 and then had their bye in week 7.  They just never seemed to come out after that with the same fire.  They were mostly beating inferior teams in a lot of close games.  Last year as some have mentioned, Bills seemed to pick it up the 2nd half of the Tampa Bay game and then looked really good to end the season. They just couldn't find that gear this year.

 

[Scott7975]

1 minute ago, LeGOATski said:

What historical trends are you looking at that show weather slows down the Bills offense more than other offenses? This is paramount to your point.

 

Pats game last season.  We lost because they ran the football and we couldn't pass the ball.  True or no?  Our offense was held to its lowest points of the season today true or no?  

 

Even if you come up with some theory that says both teams are affected exactly the same then its still not an advantage, which is what I said... there is no home field advantage.  This team is not built to play in crap weather.  That is a fact.  To play in crap weather then you need a good run game.  Im not talking running a few times a game and having a good YPC... im talking an actual good run game where you can pound the football like they did to us today.  This is why they were less affected by the weather than we were... because they COULD pound the rock which opened ***** up for their dink and dunk. We cant.

[BobbyC81]

I was originally going to respond to the OP with ‘’Ditto’ but changed my mind.  I also was so disappointed in this game that I was reluctant to come here today, but here I am.

 

As with probably all of you, if this had been a good game but the Bengals just made more big plays, I’d still be disappointed but not as much as I am now.  We go thru the year of free agency, the draft, minicamps, preseason with great hopes.  The regular season showed some warts but the team still went 13-3.  For the season to end this way, it’ll take a while to get over.

 

For some teams with Super Bowl aspirations, a game like this could cause them to go back to the drawing board.  I don’t know what this franchise will do.  Many of us have been critical of the soft zone defense with some hoping Frazier would get a head coaching job this off-season.  With today’s game being the most recent on his resume, I don’t see it happening.  So, unless he retires, resigns or  Pegula pressures Beane and McD for a fall guy, I don’t see him going anywhere.

 

Bottom line was this team did not look good enough today.

 

Silver lining: this team likely would have really gotten slaughtered in the Super Bowl.

 

Like the OP, time for a break from Bills football, and maybe football altogether.  I’ve watched every Super Bowl since V so it could be time to end my streak.  Out.

[CircleTheWagons99]

3rd Best team in the AFC. 

[LeGOATski]

1 minute ago, Scott7975 said:

 

How do you know the execution didnt have anything to do with the weather?

Because I saw no Daquan Jones to plug up the middle and Ed Oliver getting double teamed by a well schemed rushing attack. I saw zero stunts or disguised blitzes to confuse the Bengals O line. I saw zero press coverage or shallow zones to take away the quick passes. I saw plenty of missed tackles by the Bills and not as many by the Bengals. Everything being coaching/execution. 

 

There was no wind.

 

There was light flurries.

 

The Bills have put up huge games before in those same conditions.

 

So what historical trends are you seeing that point to a big weather disadvantage for the Bills?