Defund the Police?

[snafu]

3 minutes ago, The Guy In Pants said:

I will personally speak to A.O.C at our next lunch and learn and see what we can work out.

 

A simple no would have sufficed. ?

[The Guy In Pants]

Just now, snafu said:

 

A simple no would have sufficed. ?

 

I’m sensing that you are a Cortez-ist. She’s not some scatterbrained nincompoop with the IQ of butter. She’s got a degree in Finance from General Mills. She can help you save money.

1 minute ago, Jaraxxus said:

 

Sorry, just had to express my whiteness there for a minute.

 

Did you just assume my gender?

[snafu]

2 minutes ago, The Guy In Pants said:

 

I’m sensing that you are a Cortez-ist. She’s not some scatterbrained nincompoop with the IQ of butter. She’s got a degree in Finance from General Mills. She can help you save money.

 

Did you just assume my gender?

 

 

Yes, add that to my apparently long and growing list of -ists.  

 

 

[The Guy In Pants]

Just now, Jaraxxus said:

 

Ok now I'm confused. Wait, is ok racist? I'm not getting rid of any of my Hawaiian shirts, so don't ask.

 

Yowzers. We have a live one here. You’re not welcome in CHAZ. 

[RocCityRoller]

So I missed most of this fun the past few days due to work.The last I checked, I was being called dumb by a moron OP.

 

I had noted that local police departments are under the rule of the local Mayor and City Council. I also pointed out that Minneapolis City Hall had been under the rule of Democrats for over 45 years, and Baltimore City Hall for more than 50 years.

 

How does a 'racist regime' occur under such circumstances I asked? I then got called dumb again; great dialectic. Does the OP understand that Marx was a student of Hegel? Modern lefties do not seem to understand the dialectics of Phenomenology (Thesis and Antithesis to provide a more robust synthesis). Still no answer to the original question, but I guess arriving to synthesis would require an exposure to and understanding of counter view points....

 

I was trying to aid my idiot opponent by even highlighting and bolding my Baltimore example, where Baltimore 'defunded their police dept' in the past. The OP was too stupid to pick up on the bolded hint to provide a solid example where a PD was 'defunded' in BALTIMORE. <= (Hint # 2 dumb ass)

 

I lived in Philadelphia across the river from Camden from 2000-2010. I still have good friends in the NJ suburbs around Philadelphia. Both Camden, NJ and Baltimore, MD have 'defunded their police departments' in the last 10-15 yrs.

 

• Camden, NJ was bankrupt. They simply dissolved the Camden PD to escape police union contracts they could not afford. The Camden County Sheriffs office now is responsible for policing the city of Camden, NJ. About 70% of the Camden City PD were re-hired as Camden County Sheriffs. Basically the city of Camden said 'we can not oversee or afford a police dept, so we will pass the buck onto the adults governing the surrounding county.' Now the townships of Cherry Hill, Gloucester, Winslow, Pennsauken, Voorhees, Lindenwold etc pay to police Camden. It is still a hell-hole.
• In Baltimore regulation changes took place and funding was reduced after the Freddie Grey incident in 2015. Now the Baltimore PD has gone from 'Active PD' to 'Passive PD'. The Baltimore PD will respond to 911 calls ASAP. But they refuse to actively police drug markets, prostitution rings and other street crime. As is expected reported 'street crime' is down (police not reporting street crimes) but the murder rate has shot up two fold..... no kidding.
• https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2018/07/12/baltimore-police-not-noticing-crime-after-freddie-gray-wave-killings-followed/744741002/
• https://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/13/us/after-freddie-gray-death-west-baltimores-police-presence-drops-and-murders-soar.html
• https://www.cbsnews.com/news/violent-crime-rate-spikes-baltimore-freddie-gray-death-police-custody-2015/

 

At best we here in the Buffalo and Rochester suburbs can expect for a call to dissolve the BPD and RPD and expand the Erie County Sheriffs Office/ Monroe County Sheriffs Office since only the 'conservative/ Republican/ racist' areas seem to know how to police itself. It is an increased tax on suburban property owners, and more of the same.

 

40+ yrs of monopoly politics in the city = screw the suburbs and leave it up to the adults

Edited June 14, 2020 by RocCityRoller

[B-Man]

 

 

ENTIRE SWAT TEAM IN FLORIDA CITY RESIGNS AFTER POLICE CHIEF KNEELS WITH PROTESTERS.

 

 

 

 

 

[Cinga]

9 hours ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

 

 

LMAO...where's Ventura now that MN is the "land of 10,000 fakes"?................

 

He's probably in hiding since he pissed off virtually every other Navy Seal when he dissed Chris Kyle... 

[RocCityRoller]

Dear OP

 

It is clear you are a wannabe anarchist, post-modernist Marxist. I myself laugh at people calling modern leftists 'liberals' since it is clearly apparent the modern far left has abandoned any basis of classical liberalism (primacy of the individual) and has fully embraced post modern precepts.

 

As energetic, brave and 'smart' as you want to try to appear you have the energy of a radical, but lack the substance of understanding the very basis of your own Marxist argument. You can not be both Marxist and Anarchist in the same breath. That is silly. A fair and equitable society redistributing wealth can not occur in anarchy. The wealthy will always find a safe harbor to move its money during a period of anarchy. At best you will penalize the middle class ('junkers' and 'kulaks' of the past) of a society. Eventually you will run out of 'wealthy' to tax and redistribute wealth from and become stagnant. See Cuba, USSR or NY State and blame the weather like idiot Cuomo.

 

I am a self reformed Marxist, educated with multiple Lib Arts degrees, and realized I was by my own behaviors a Libertarian, and have accepted my position as such. This pisses off both my dyed in the wool Democrat and Republican friends. I spent a decade mad at everyone but myself. I then learned how to 'play the game'.

 

An unwillingness to argue points and counterpoints (Thesis and Antithesis) in an argument is philosophical weakness. In your case it probably derives from the group think you experience in college. When I noted an unwillingness to change dynamics in either city I presented (Minneapolis and I gave you a freebie in Baltimore) you were unwilling or unable to argue any point. You suck at dialectics and debate. This is a symptom of radicalized group think, where basis platforms of theory are not challenged or debated.

 

You could have argued:

• For abolition of the police unions to hold individuals accountable (my argument btw, and a truly radical argument to separate yourself from the typical Democrats)
• Pointed to the experiments in Camden or Baltimore (I even bolded the font for you in Baltimore, duh)

In order to make you a little smarter I'll give you this primer on Hegelian Dialectics:

 

Hegel's Dialectics:

 

“Dialectics” is a term used to describe a method of philosophical argument that involves some sort of contradictory process between opposing sides. In what is perhaps the most classic version of “dialectics”, the ancient Greek philosopher, Plato presented his philosophical argument as a back-and-forth dialogue or debate, generally between the character of Socrates, on one side, and some person or group of people to whom Socrates was talking (his interlocutors), on the other. In the course of the dialogues, Socrates’ interlocutors propose definitions of philosophical concepts or express views that Socrates challenges or opposes. The back-and-forth debate between opposing sides produces a kind of linear progression or evolution in philosophical views or positions: as the dialogues go along, Socrates’ interlocutors change or refine their views in response to Socrates’ challenges and come to adopt more sophisticated views. The back-and-forth dialectic between Socrates and his interlocutors thus becomes Plato’s way of arguing against the earlier, less sophisticated views or positions and for the more sophisticated ones later.

 

“Hegel’s dialectics” refers to the particular dialectical method of argument employed by the 19th Century German philosopher, G.W.F. Hegel which, like other “dialectical” methods, relies on a contradictory process between opposing sides. Whereas Plato’s “opposing sides” were people, Hegel’s work depends on the subject matter he discusses. In his work on logic, for instance, the “opposing sides” are different definitions of logical concepts that are opposed to one another. In the Phenomenology of Spirit, which presents Hegel’s epistemology or philosophy of knowledge, the “opposing sides” are different definitions of consciousness and of the object that consciousness is aware of or claims to know. As in Plato’s dialogues, a contradictory process between “opposing sides” in Hegel’s dialectics leads to a linear evolution or development from less sophisticated definitions or views to more sophisticated ones later. The dialectical process thus constitutes Hegel’s method for arguing against the earlier, less sophisticated definitions or views and for the more sophisticated ones later. Hegel regarded this dialectical method or “speculative mode of cognition” as the hallmark of his philosophy, and used the same method in the Phenomenology of Spirit as well as in all of the mature works he published later.

Edited June 14, 2020 by RocCityRoller

[The Guy In Pants]

12 minutes ago, Cinga said:

 

He's probably in hiding since he pissed off virtually every other Navy Seal when he dissed Chris Kyle... 

 

 

I last knew him to live in Mexico; I believe. That was some years ago

Edited June 14, 2020 by The Guy In Pants

[B-Man]

 

 

RAYSHARD BROOKS AND DEADLY FORCE:

 

“Let us stipulate here that drunk-driving Rayshard Brooks would be alive today if he had complied with the lawful orders of police, who treated him with courtesy.

Let us stipulate that Rayshard Brooks would be alive today if he had not stolen a police taser and fired it at cops.

Let us also stipulate that burning down a Wendy’s, as the Atlanta mob did, is not a reasonable response to a police-involved shooting that takes place in its parking lot.

Now, watch that video and put yourself in Officer Rolfe’s shoes. Could you make the call not to shoot, in a split second, under taser fire from a violent fleeing suspect?”

 

 

 

[Deranged Rhino]

 

[B-Man]

 

 

Bad News Poll For ‘Defund the Police’ Radicals: Only Privileged White Leftists Support It

 

 

 

[ALF]

1 hour ago, B-Man said:

 

 

RAYSHARD BROOKS AND DEADLY FORCE:

 

“Let us stipulate here that drunk-driving Rayshard Brooks would be alive today if he had complied with the lawful orders of police, who treated him with courtesy.

Let us stipulate that Rayshard Brooks would be alive today if he had not stolen a police taser and fired it at cops.

Let us also stipulate that burning down a Wendy’s, as the Atlanta mob did, is not a reasonable response to a police-involved shooting that takes place in its parking lot.

Now, watch that video and put yourself in Officer Rolfe’s shoes. Could you make the call not to shoot, in a split second, under taser fire from a violent fleeing suspect?”

 

 

 

 

The police were calm and polite until he resisted . Not likely mental illness or drugs what the heck made him fight and run ?

[TakeYouToTasker]

Thought experiment:

 

Regarding underperforming schools, the refrain from the left is that they are underfunded, and need more money in order to improve performance.

 

The same individuals, when confronted with substandard policing, insist that police forces be defunded in order to improve performance.

 

How are these two positions congruent?

[3rdnlng]

26 minutes ago, TakeYouToTasker said:

Thought experiment:

 

Regarding underperforming schools, the refrain from the left is that they are underfunded, and need more money in order to improve performance.

 

The same individuals, when confronted with substandard policing, insist that police forces be defunded in order to improve performance.

 

How are these two positions congruent?

I don't believe that is consistently true. Many of the crappiest school systems spend some of the most per student. 

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

51 minutes ago, B-Man said:

 

 

Bad News Poll For ‘Defund the Police’ Radicals: Only Privileged White Leftists Support It

 

 

 

 

...damn crackers are responsible for everything.......

[TakeYouToTasker]

2 minutes ago, 3rdnlng said:

I don't believe that is consistently true. Many of the crappiest school systems spend some of the most per student. 

It is correct that some of the worst performing schools are those with the most funding.  However, the solution offered by the left continues to be even more funding.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

6 minutes ago, TakeYouToTasker said:

It is correct that some of the worst performing schools are those with the most funding.  However, the solution offered by the left continues to be even more funding.

 

...isn't that the American governmental way regardless of aisle side?.....throw money at the problem and make us pay more......results don't mean jack....political capital is in legislation to fund billions more......waste, fraud, and abuse?...huh?......

[BillStime]

[Chef Jim]

Just now, BillStime said:

Please explain how we have defunded any of those things. And please use the definition of defund prior to the past couple weeks. 

[3rdnlng]

Just now, Chef Jim said:

Please explain how we have defunded any of those things. And please use the definition of defund prior to the past couple weeks. 

It has to be true, the meme was posted on the internet.

[SoCal Deek]

9 minutes ago, BillStime said:

So you’re saying we’d have less police brutality if only people could go to Yosemite? Or eat better chicken? Or mail letters more frequently? Or perhaps go to the opera? Or get cheaper solar panels?

Who knew?

[Doc Brown]

4 hours ago, TakeYouToTasker said:

Thought experiment:

 

Regarding underperforming schools, the refrain from the left is that they are underfunded, and need more money in order to improve performance.

 

The same individuals, when confronted with substandard policing, insist that police forces be defunded in order to improve performance.

 

How are these two positions congruent?

I was going to write that more (not less) money should go into policing if they truly want to take steps to improve police performance.  That includes more money for basic entry-level recruit training and ongoing yearly training (de-esculation training, mental health response training, etc.).  If these cities cut funding for the police the first thing that will go are training programs.

[BillStime]

1 minute ago, SoCal Deek said:

So you’re saying we’d have less police brutality if only people could go to Yosemite? Or eat better chicken? Or mail letters more frequently? Or perhaps go to the opera? Or get cheaper solar panels?

Who knew?

yup that’s right - that is precisely what is intended.

[Chef Jim]

2 minutes ago, BillStime said:

yup that’s right - that is precisely what is intended.

Well it makes about as much sense as your meme. 

[SoCal Deek]

2 minutes ago, BillStime said:

yup that’s right - that is precisely what is intended.

Cool! This should be an interesting societal experiment for sure! But let me ask you....are the police the ones who’re supposed to be at Yosemite eating better chicken, and mailing postcards? 

[B-Man]

 

 

 

[Tiberius]

So corrupt. I hung out at this place in the '90's 

 

https://buffalonews.com/2020/06/14/bar-owner-describes-police-shakedown-before-mollys-pub-death/

[Hedge]

 

 

[B-Man]

George Floyd Family Members Gave an Interview Sunday That Every 'Defund the Police' Proponent Should Watch

 

 

.

[Buffalo_Gal]

This will end well:
 

NYPD disbands plainclothes anti-crime units
 

The NYPD is eliminating its Anti-Crime Units on the precinct level and public housing area level, Commissioner Dermot Shea announced on Monday. About 600 officers will be reassigned to the detective bureau, neighborhood policing program, and other units effective immediately.
 

Anti-crime officers typically operate in plainclothes, Shea said, and focus on getting illegal guns off the streets of New York. That has led to those cops being involved in a number of shootings, the commissioner said.
 

</snip>

[Hedge]

 

 

[Hedge]

 

 

Edit to add a follow up the next day:

 

 

Edited June 16, 2020 by Hedge

[Buffalo_Gal]

 

[Hedge]

 

 

[ComradeKayAdams]

On 6/12/2020 at 10:03 PM, GregPersons said:

Where does language come from? God? 

 

Really love the folks dying on this hill. "Language never changes, snowflake!" lol 

 

Kind of a really direct example of how racists really need to insist on their own fictional reality with highly developed selective listening skills. Let's see how it manifests this time...

 

"Defund" is the right word.

 

It means starting the conversation from 0 and building up. 

 

Not starting from current police budgets and working down.

 

It's strong language for a reason. It's a negotiating tactic. It communicates the severity and vastness of change needed.

 

It's the right word.

 

It's arguably not strong enough. "Imprison the police" once we remove legal qualified immunity... that's gonna be a fun conversation.

 

<< TLDR Summary: please reconsider the “defund the police” slogan. >>

 

Good post, Mr. Persons.

 

Correct, language is constantly evolving. I’m sure Noam Chomsky and Richard Dawkins were smiling as they read your post. Unfortunately, the evolution of language is also a major contributor to miscommunication between people of different classes, generations, races, geographical regions, and even political affiliations…as we’re now seeing in real time.

 

Today I won’t push back on the merit of “defunding” the police, to use your intended meaning of the word. We agree on many of the institutional changes that need to happen within American police forces, though I’m not convinced that your process of getting there is the best one. Maybe I will soon? The argument that this drastic method is necessary to break those irrationally intransigent police unions is a compelling one, but I need to learn more. Any specific articles you recommend I read? Should I finally finish watching The Wire series?!

 

What I want to discuss is the merit of the marketing strategy behind the slogan, “defund the police.” Defunding only references the first of many steps that likely need to be taken. It’s a severe use of the word which has definitely captured national attention and sparked discussion, but I’m concerned about the transition from the bull-in-the-china-shop attention-capturing phase to the persuasion phase. Right now the polling numbers show roughly two-thirds of Americans do not agree in any way with the “defund the police” movement. BLM is a bottom-up grassroots organization that can’t so easily control the messaging like a top-down organization can. We may be passing a point in time where the BLM movement is losing much of its power leverage, in much the same way that additional quarantine enforcements are no longer on the political table following the public Floyd protests and the upcoming Trump rallies. Anyone with a TV or internet connection by now should be aware of the police brutality crisis toward blacks. Those who are unsure, indifferent, or outright hostile to the solution-seeking stages are probably pulling further away as each day passes with more news of protests and outbreaks of riots but inadequate discussion of solutions. This country has had plenty of race protests and riots by now. How much positive change has actually resulted from each of them? Take the infamous LA Police Department, for example: 1943 Zoot Suit riots to 1965 Watts riots to 1992 Rodney King riots to where they still are today. Why did nothing fundamentally change?

 

I’d like the BLM movement to consider changes to their use of language. Try alternate words like “reform” the police. Or try word qualifiers like “Camden” defund the police. Or try newly invented words like “floydund” the police or whatever to change the trajectory of the public discourse. I would also reconsider recent efforts to change the Webster’s Dictionary meaning of the word “racism” into one with a unidirectional power dynamic component to it. Maybe introduce a phrase like “racially insensitive” into the vernacular to replace the “racist” label that is used so often. This isn’t about capitulation. This is about the efficacy of an activist movement’s communication. A large majority of Americans are moderate-minded people inclined to favor institutions of law and order. The reality is that more of their support is needed to force Democratic Party political leaders of all levels (local, state, national), as well as black community leaders, to enact positive change in multiple areas (police relations, economic class politics, stable black family structures…yeah yeah I know, that last one is supposed to be a white nationalist talking point…).

 

A very personal example of how the misuse of words can derail a movement: Bernie’s 2016 and 2020 presidential campaigns. As you know, “socialism” in America is a word hopelessly laden with all sorts of residual Cold War fearmongering that the more successful American progressive/populist movements of the early twentieth century didn’t have to worry about. Bernie’s campaign was a top-down organization that had no excuse for failing to control the language in a national discussion. I would have used “social democracy” and dropped “socialism” altogether. And to be more precise, social democracy should be differentiated with a qualifier like “permanent” or “finalized” social democracy since the original meaning of this phrase is supposed to represent a transitional stage on the way to replacing capitalism for good. I once recommended rebranding with newly invented singular words like “Bolshevista” to represent transitional social democracy and “Sandernista” to represent our permanent version. These did not catch on because I was a lowest-level campaign volunteer and because no one ever listens to me. But maybe when dealing with time-sensitive political movements, sometimes it’s just best to stick with more familiar word qualifiers to convey your message. Example: I often use country qualifiers to clarify nuanced political positions I have. Sometimes I’ll call myself a supporter of German-style socialism. Hmmm but I can see how that could be misconstrued, so I should stop doing that.

[GregPersons]

1 minute ago, RealKayAdams said:

 

<< TLDR Summary: please reconsider the “defund the police” slogan. >>

 

Good post, Mr. Persons.

 

Correct, language is constantly evolving. I’m sure Noam Chomsky and Richard Dawkins were smiling as they read your post. Unfortunately, the evolution of language is also a major contributor to miscommunication between people of different classes, generations, races, geographical regions, and even political affiliations…as we’re now seeing in real time.

 

Today I won’t push back on the merit of “defunding” the police, to use your intended meaning of the word. We agree on many of the institutional changes that need to happen within American police forces, though I’m not convinced that your process of getting there is the best one. Maybe I will soon? The argument that this drastic method is necessary to break those irrationally intransigent police unions is a compelling one, but I need to learn more. Any specific articles you recommend I read? Should I finally finish watching The Wire series?!

 

What I want to discuss is the merit of the marketing strategy behind the slogan, “defund the police.” Defunding only references the first of many steps that likely need to be taken. It’s a severe use of the word which has definitely captured national attention and sparked discussion, but I’m concerned about the transition from the bull-in-the-china-shop attention-capturing phase to the persuasion phase. Right now the polling numbers show roughly two-thirds of Americans do not agree in any way with the “defund the police” movement. BLM is a bottom-up grassroots organization that can’t so easily control the messaging like a top-down organization can. We may be passing a point in time where the BLM movement is losing much of its power leverage, in much the same way that additional quarantine enforcements are no longer on the political table following the public Floyd protests and the upcoming Trump rallies. Anyone with a TV or internet connection by now should be aware of the police brutality crisis toward blacks. Those who are unsure, indifferent, or outright hostile to the solution-seeking stages are probably pulling further away as each day passes with more news of protests and outbreaks of riots but inadequate discussion of solutions. This country has had plenty of race protests and riots by now. How much positive change has actually resulted from each of them? Take the infamous LA Police Department, for example: 1943 Zoot Suit riots to 1965 Watts riots to 1992 Rodney King riots to where they still are today. Why did nothing fundamentally change?

 

I’d like the BLM movement to consider changes to their use of language. Try alternate words like “reform” the police. Or try word qualifiers like “Camden” defund the police. Or try newly invented words like “floydund” the police or whatever to change the trajectory of the public discourse. I would also reconsider recent efforts to change the Webster’s Dictionary meaning of the word “racism” into one with a unidirectional power dynamic component to it. Maybe introduce a phrase like “racially insensitive” into the vernacular to replace the “racist” label that is used so often. This isn’t about capitulation. This is about the efficacy of an activist movement’s communication. A large majority of Americans are moderate-minded people inclined to favor institutions of law and order. The reality is that more of their support is needed to force Democratic Party political leaders of all levels (local, state, national), as well as black community leaders, to enact positive change in multiple areas (police relations, economic class politics, stable black family structures…yeah yeah I know, that last one is supposed to be a white nationalist talking point…).

 

A very personal example of how the misuse of words can derail a movement: Bernie’s 2016 and 2020 presidential campaigns. As you know, “socialism” in America is a word hopelessly laden with all sorts of residual Cold War fearmongering that the more successful American progressive/populist movements of the early twentieth century didn’t have to worry about. Bernie’s campaign was a top-down organization that had no excuse for failing to control the language in a national discussion. I would have used “social democracy” and dropped “socialism” altogether. And to be more precise, social democracy should be differentiated with a qualifier like “permanent” or “finalized” social democracy since the original meaning of this phrase is supposed to represent a transitional stage on the way to replacing capitalism for good. I once recommended rebranding with newly invented singular words like “Bolshevista” to represent transitional social democracy and “Sandernista” to represent our permanent version. These did not catch on because I was a lowest-level campaign volunteer and because no one ever listens to me. But maybe when dealing with time-sensitive political movements, sometimes it’s just best to stick with more familiar word qualifiers to convey your message. Example: I often use country qualifiers to clarify nuanced political positions I have. Sometimes I’ll call myself a supporter of German-style socialism. Hmmm but I can see how that could be misconstrued, so I should stop doing that.

 

 

Well you made me chuckle a few times anyway. Yes you should finish The Wire, it pays off very nicely.

 

I disagree on changing words to the benefit of people deliberately distorting their meaning. Bernie using socialism was and is accurate; the fact that it is scary because of McCarthyist remnants is a complication but doesn't change the meaning of the word, just the understanding.  It would be like saying it's unacceptable for Christians to call themselves that, because of all of the horrible murders and crusades carried out in Christ's name. Right?

 

"Defund" is correct. "Abolish" is correct. There is no true need for "police." There is a need for social workers and forward-thinking specialized teams to handle and resolve the root causes of civil unrest and crime. Don't take my word for it.  I highly recommend spending time with both this essay AND the comments section to listen to police officers calling for both "defund" and "abolish". https://medium.com/@OfcrACab/confessions-of-a-former-bastard-cop-bb14d17bc759 

 

In a society where everybody's basic needs are met -- which if we do the math.... carry the 1..... yes, in the RICHEST COUNTRY IN THE HISTORY OF HUMAN CIVILIZATION... we should be able to provide this easily. And still send Elon Musk to Mars without a problem. 

[ALF]

Never ever resist arrest , even if innocent . Mental illness and drugs on the other hand likely to resist.

[Buffalo Bills Fan]

33 minutes ago, GregPersons said:

 

 

Well you made me chuckle a few times anyway. Yes you should finish The Wire, it pays off very nicely.

 

I disagree on changing words to the benefit of people deliberately distorting their meaning. Bernie using socialism was and is accurate; the fact that it is scary because of McCarthyist remnants is a complication but doesn't change the meaning of the word, just the understanding.  It would be like saying it's unacceptable for Christians to call themselves that, because of all of the horrible murders and crusades carried out in Christ's name. Right?

 

"Defund" is correct. "Abolish" is correct. There is no true need for "police." There is a need for social workers and forward-thinking specialized teams to handle and resolve the root causes of civil unrest and crime. Don't take my word for it.  I highly recommend spending time with both this essay AND the comments section to listen to police officers calling for both "defund" and "abolish". https://medium.com/@OfcrACab/confessions-of-a-former-bastard-cop-bb14d17bc759 

 

In a society where everybody's basic needs are met -- which if we do the math.... carry the 1..... yes, in the RICHEST COUNTRY IN THE HISTORY OF HUMAN CIVILIZATION... we should be able to provide this easily. And still send Elon Musk to Mars without a problem. 

 

Agree to disagree with you man  (on police) in a respectful way. But people have to change who they are. Police, or whoever else hell civilian. End being racist now. (people out there) No need for it.  No need to hurt others.   People should unite and help each other no matter who they are.

 

But read thanks for link any info helps. But please don't put me in column. My mother and I helped all different kinds of people, drive them to stores, help them get jobs.  

 

But anyway's just want all the stupid how people treat others to stop plus unite treat each other well.

[B-Man]