Noah Fant - TE Iowa - Should Bills pick at 8

[Mr. WEO]

22 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

Ebron's in his 5th season and with a different team than the one who drafted him.  He like Olsen were late bloomers, although Ebron still has a ton more to prove.  Howard is doing well.  Njoku is actually 14th in receptions. 

 

Davis was worth the pick but it took him until his 4th season to get going.  Watson is JAG but has played for 15 seasons.  Eifert was a 2nd rounder. 

 

 

Valid point on Eifert.

 

Invalid on Njoku, on NFL.ocm stats right now, he's tied with Graham at 9 with 44 catches each.

 

Invalid on Watson.  5 seasons for over 500 yards---on 4 different teams.  You make being a productive 1st rounder for 15 years sound like a bad thing! 

 

Also, once Olsen was regularly starting, he was fine.  By his second season, he was 54/574/5 TDs in 7 starts. Fantastic investment by the Panthers. 

 

Also, Ebron, by his second season  he had 47/537/5 TD in 8 starts.  240 catches 22 TDs in 4+ seasons.  What's wrong with that?  As for not currently playing for the team that drafted him....so what?  That team sucks.  On his new team, he's got 54 catches/589 yards/11TDs---and he just got there. 

 

Also, Davis in his first season had a young Alex Smith who through for under 3000 yards and only 16 TDs.  By the next season, he was SF's 2nd leading receiver (check out his QB roster in '07 and '08).

 

Olsen, Ebron, Njoku, Davis---all great picks for TE.  I'm not sure what your point is if it took them a little time to "get going".  So what?  Look at their circumstances and how quickly they actually productive. 

[mannc]

44 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

Ebron's in his 5th season and with a different team than the one who drafted him.  He like Olsen were late bloomers, although Ebron still has a ton more to prove.  Howard is doing well.  Njoku is actually 14th in receptions. 

 

Davis was worth the pick but it took him until his 4th season to get going.  Watson is JAG but has played for 15 seasons.  Eifert was a 2nd rounder. 

 

There is another second round TE that turned to be pretty good.  I haven’t seen his name mentioned in this thread...

[John from Riverside]

1 minute ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

Valid point on Eifert.

 

Invalid on Njoku, on NFL.ocm stats right now, he's tied with Graham at 9 with 44 catches each.

 

Invalid on Watson.  5 seasons for over 500 yards---on 4 different teams.  You make being a productive 1st rounder for 15 years sound like a bad thing! 

 

Also, once Olsen was regularly starting, he was fine.  By his second season, he was 54/574/5 TDs in 7 starts. Fantastic investment by the Panthers. 

 

Also, Ebron, by his second season  he had 47/537/5 TD in 8 starts.  240 catches 22 TDs in 4+ seasons.  What's wrong with that?  As for not currently playing for the team that drafted him....so what?  That team sucks.  On his new team, he's got 54 catches/589 yards/11TDs---and he just got there. 

 

Also, Davis in his first season had a young Alex Smith who through for under 3000 yards and only 16 TDs.  By the next season, he was SF's 2nd leading receiver (check out his QB roster in '07 and '08).

 

Olsen, Ebron, Njoku, Davis---all great picks for TE.  I'm not sure what your point is if it took them a little time to "get going".  So what?  Look at their circumstances and how quickly they actually productive. 

Ebron was not a great pick

[Mr. WEO]

2 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

Ebron was not a great pick

 

Ok....you can simply say that, I guess.  It's a free country.

 

But the Bills could have had him in 2014 and not given up the next year's 1st and 4th rounder for him.

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

I wonder if Tampa Bay would have any interest with trading Howard to Buffalo.  It would be unique to have Moe Howard's great grandson playing for the Bills.

[John from Riverside]

Just now, Mr. WEO said:

 

Ok....you can simply say that, I guess.  It's a free country.

 

But the Bills could have had him in 2014 and not given up the next year's 1st and 4th rounder for him.

And you think he would have done well on this team?   The guy had a legit QB passer THROWING TO HIM and he is now on his second team....meaning they didnt want him.

 

He also doesnt block.

 

I am not singing our TE's praises at all....to me Clay is done.....the other guys are number 2's at best.   We do need a TE that can do it all.....but NOT AT 8 please

 

We need to put a line in front of Josh Allen that can actually make a real NFL pocket to throw from....if we want him to develop into a legit pocket passer

[Rufridr101]

Trade back draft a center to anchor the line TE should come later 

[DJB]

Fant might not even be the best TE on his team. 

 

 

Also this sounds just like when this board was clamoring for E Ebron when we should have drafted Odell instead.  Nobody on here wanted Odell. 

[Mr. WEO]

7 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

And you think he would have done well on this team?   The guy had a legit QB passer THROWING TO HIM and he is now on his second team....meaning they didnt want him.

 

He also doesnt block.

 

I am not singing our TE's praises at all....to me Clay is done.....the other guys are number 2's at best.   We do need a TE that can do it all.....but NOT AT 8 please

 

We need to put a line in front of Josh Allen that can actually make a real NFL pocket to throw from....if we want him to develop into a legit pocket passer

Yeah and he had over 700 yards in a season in Detroit and they got rid of him.  The Bills got rid of Watkins and the 2 1st round picks it took to rent him for a few years.

 

On "this team?"  This team has kept Clay around for years and he sucks.

 

Draft a HOF LT at 8 then.  It will have no impact on the Bills offense.  Teams have already done this---over and over.

 

The Bills, of all teams, have proven that you can find very good LTs wherever.  Blowing a top 10 pick on a nonplaymaker pick is a wasted pick.

Edited December 3, 2018 by Mr. WEO

[John from Riverside]

Just now, Mr. WEO said:

 

Draft a HOF LT at 8 then.  It will have no impact on the Bills offense.  Teams have already done this---over and over.

 

The Bills, of all teams, have proven that you can find very good LTs wherever.  Blowing a top 10 pick on a nonplaymaker pick is a wasted pick.

To invest in the uglies that play up on the lines is absolutely not a wasted pick.....I do however hope we use several picks (and free agency money) on playmakers this offseason

As the fine fanny woman said on the movie the blindside said

 

"The first check you write is for the house"

"The second is for the insurance"

[Monty98]

Personally I like Issac Nauta, but if we can nab Fant in round 2 I'm all in

[John from Riverside]

I am perfectly ok with a 2nd round TE

Ideally I would like to trade down and get more picks......but I think Jonah starts day 1 at LT on this team.....moving Dawkins to LG......grab a free agent center and guard...

 

We NEED to get this running game going.....and we need to protect our investment

[ColoradoBills]

If the Bills signed Jesse James or CJ Uzomah they wouldn't need to draft a TE in the top rounds.

Just saying........LOL........FA first.

[Mat68]

8 too high for a flex.  If he runs sub 4.5 maybe late teens early 20's.  If Font had the ability to inline block I would be more intrigued.

[N.Y. Orangeman]

Albert O out of Mizzou is better.

[Buffalo03]

6 hours ago, BillsRdue said:

Not at 8. No TE is worth that.  Tampa drafted OJ Howard at 19 and are still looking for a payday after 2 years. He is coming on, but not a game-changer. Ebron went  10th and it's taken him 4 years and 2 teams to make any impact. Ertz and Gronk were drafted in the 2nd round.  Kelce and Cook went in the 3rd. We need a stud, game changing WR if we draft in the top 10.  OL, TE, RB stars have been found in rounds 2-5 and beyond.

OJ Howard is certainly becoming one of the better TEs in this league. He's a physical freak. I had him in fantasy this year so I'm aware of his production. I think the only thing keeping him from turning into an all pro tight end at this point is he is in a crowded offense. There are a ton of mouths to feed between Mike Evans, DeSean Jackson, Chris Godwin, Adam Humphries and Cameron Brate. In an offense with a couple less mouths to feed and no turnover prone QBs like Winston and Fitzpatrick, I certainly believe he can and would be a game changing tight end

Edited December 4, 2018 by Buffalo03

[C.Biscuit97]

I’m always on the TE train (both in football and real life  ).  It’s the second most neglected position in this franchise besides qb.  I think every qb needs a monster mismatch to throw to.

 

that said, we have far too many needs to spend a top 10 pick on a TE.  But I’m good with one any other round.  I want a monster.

2 hours ago, ColoradoBills said:

If the Bills signed Jesse James or CJ Uzomah they wouldn't need to draft a TE in the top rounds.

Just saying........LOL........FA first.

CJ has frying pans for hands and James is slow. I’m fine with them as number 2 types but let’s get a legit game breaker.

Edited December 4, 2018 by C.Biscuit97

[LSHMEAB]

5 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

I’m always on the TE train (both in football and real life  ).  It’s the second most neglected position in this franchise besides qb.  I think every qb needs a monster mismatch to throw to.

 

that said, we have far too many needs to spend a top 10 pick on a TE.  But I’m good with one any other round.  I want a monster.

CJ has frying pans for hands and James is slow. I’m fine with them as number 2 types but let’s get a legit game breaker.

When Jay Riemersma is the standard bearer for the last time we had a great tight end, it's a systemic problem.

 

I don't have a major problem keeping Clay around. He's not terrible despite the knee jerk reaction hatred from the missed opportunity yesterday. He's also not good enough and not worth the contract. He's our best blocker, so it may make sense to keep him around as a TE2. If Croom makes strides and it's neck and neck between the two, then you obviously dump Clay.

[ColoradoBills]

4 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

I’m always on the TE train (both in football and real life  ).  It’s the second most neglected position in this franchise besides qb.  I think every qb needs a monster mismatch to throw to.

 

that said, we have far too many needs to spend a top 10 pick on a TE.  But I’m good with one any other round.  I want a monster.

CJ has frying pans for hands

 

Good start to your reply. LOL.

They got to replace Clay and I agree with your monster sized TE not in the 1st round.

 

My FA remarks were mainly about all the draft talk already.   

 

ps.  I do get a good laugh when people use the ".....has frying pans for hands" image!

[Doc]

15 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

Valid point on Eifert.

 

Invalid on Njoku, on NFL.ocm stats right now, he's tied with Graham at 9 with 44 catches each.

 

Invalid on Watson.  5 seasons for over 500 yards---on 4 different teams.  You make being a productive 1st rounder for 15 years sound like a bad thing! 

 

Also, once Olsen was regularly starting, he was fine.  By his second season, he was 54/574/5 TDs in 7 starts. Fantastic investment by the Panthers. 

 

Also, Ebron, by his second season  he had 47/537/5 TD in 8 starts.  240 catches 22 TDs in 4+ seasons.  What's wrong with that?  As for not currently playing for the team that drafted him....so what?  That team sucks.  On his new team, he's got 54 catches/589 yards/11TDs---and he just got there. 

 

Also, Davis in his first season had a young Alex Smith who through for under 3000 yards and only 16 TDs.  By the next season, he was SF's 2nd leading receiver (check out his QB roster in '07 and '08).

 

Olsen, Ebron, Njoku, Davis---all great picks for TE.  I'm not sure what your point is if it took them a little time to "get going".  So what?  Look at their circumstances and how quickly they actually productive. 

 

Sorry, Njoku is 14th in yards. 

 

And my point is you can get a good TE outside the 1st round and there have been more than a few 1st round busts.  But that goes for every position.

[ColoradoBills]

2 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said:

When Jay Riemersma is the standard bearer for the last time we had a great tight end, it's a systemic problem.

 

I don't have a major problem keeping Clay around. He's not terrible despite the knee jerk reaction hatred from the missed opportunity yesterday. He's also not good enough and not worth the contract. He's our best blocker, so it may make sense to keep him around as a TE2. If Croom makes strides and it's neck and neck between the two, then you obviously dump Clay.

 

My thoughts on Clay go farther than the drop in Miami.

The biggest problem is he misses way to much practice with nagging problems, maintenance days and vet days.

JA needs a full time TE to get comfortable with.

 

The next is, unless the Bills plan on extending him (which I doubt entirely) they probably should move on from him and get a guy who can grow

with the offense.

 

Lastly, he costs too much and is getting slow.

[C.Biscuit97]

8 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said:

When Jay Riemersma is the standard bearer for the last time we had a great tight end, it's a systemic problem.

 

I don't have a major problem keeping Clay around. He's not terrible despite the knee jerk reaction hatred from the missed opportunity yesterday. He's also not good enough and not worth the contract. He's our best blocker, so it may make sense to keep him around as a TE2. If Croom makes strides and it's neck and neck between the two, then you obviously dump Clay.

How dare you talk about Lee Smith!!!

 

and I agree about Clay.  I just think the injuries have just killed him.  With a better qb, he could have been a weapon but it’s time to move on.

[LSHMEAB]

3 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

My thoughts on Clay go farther than the drop in Miami.

The biggest problem is he misses way to much practice with nagging problems, maintenance days and vet days.

JA needs a full time TE to get comfortable with.

 

The next is, unless the Bills plan on extending him (which I doubt entirely) they probably should move on from him and get a guy who can grow

with the offense.

 

Lastly, he costs too much and is getting slow.

I think they absolutely must address the position and draft a legit number 1 TE.

 

That being said, it doesn't really save us much to cut bait after this season, which means you may as well keep him unless you think Croom or a second replacement is better.

 

I highly doubt they will be hamstrung by the cap in any way, shape or form next season. I'd be surprised if they got within 10 million of the cap to be honest.

Edited December 4, 2018 by LSHMEAB

[Mr. WEO]

4 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

Sorry, Njoku is 14th in yards. 

 

And my point is you can get a good TE outside the 1st round and there have been more than a few 1st round busts.  But that goes for every position.

 

 

I don't know anything about this kid from Iowa.  I just think dismissing a TE as a top 10 pick isn't wise.

 

I'd bet the hit rate is higher than WRs...

[LSHMEAB]

3 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

How dare you talk about Lee Smith!!!

 

and I agree about Clay.  I just think the injuries have just killed him.  With a better qb, he could have been a weapon but it’s time to move on.

I don't disagree. I just don't think it's prudent to dump him for what he's ALREADY been overpaid.

 

If he's the second best TE on the team next season, why not keep him around? If he's the BEST TE on the team next season, we've got a real problem.

1 minute ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

I don't know anything about this kid from Iowa.  I just think dismissing a TE as a top 10 pick isn't wise.

 

I'd bet the hit rate is higher than WRs...

Meh. It's actually pretty low, although there's not a huge sample size recently. Pretty much all the top TE's went after the first round.

[Mr. WEO]

3 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said:

I don't disagree. I just don't think it's prudent to dump him for what he's ALREADY been overpaid.

 

If he's the second best TE on the team next season, why not keep him around? If he's the BEST TE on the team next season, we've got a real problem.

Meh. It's actually pretty low, although there's not a huge sample size recently. Pretty much all the top TE's went after the first round.

 

 

Ok, how low is it, actually?

 

And you have to look beyond the current year's stats and at careers since picked.

[LSHMEAB]

3 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

Ok, how low is it, actually?

 

And you have to look beyond the current year's stats and at careers since picked.

The only top ten pick in the last decade is Ebron, and he's been a disappointment. It's pretty hit or miss later in the first round.

 

It just seems anecdotally that you can find really good TE's in the 3rd or 4th almost every year whereas the number 1 receivers are almost always top picks.

 

If they were blown away by a TE, I wouldn't dismiss it. This guy from Iowa doesn't strike me as worthy of that kind of investment. Would much rather take the best WR first and look for TE later on.

[Mr. WEO]

Just now, LSHMEAB said:

The only top ten pick in the last decade is Ebron, and he's been a disappointment. It's pretty hit or miss later in the first round.

 

It just seems anecdotally that you can find really good TE's in the 3rd or 4th almost every year whereas the number 1 receivers are almost always top picks.

 

If they were blown away by a TE, I wouldn't dismiss it. This guy from Iowa doesn't strike me as worthy of that kind of investment. Would much rather take the best WR first and look for TE later on.

 

 

I was thinking 1st round TE vs WR.

[ColoradoBills]

11 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said:

I think they absolutely must address the position and draft a legit number 1 TE.

 

That being said, it doesn't really save us much to cut bait after this season, which means you may as well keep him unless you think Croom or a second replacement is better.

 

I highly doubt they will be hamstrung by the cap in any way, shape or form next season. I'd be surprised if they got within 10 million of the cap to be honest.

 

Beane may keep him for his last year paying him to hopefully be a #2 but I just get the feeling he is the big vet that goes.

 

As to the cap stuff..........it isn't about cap space for next year.  Just more about $'s vs. production.

Personally (and I've posted this a few times already)  I think some people will be a little shocked when the Bills have 20+ million

to carry over to 2020.  I agree with you that there is no way Beane spends it all on 1 FA season. 

[LSHMEAB]

13 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

I was thinking 1st round TE vs WR.

That sounds like a lot of work!

 

But it would be interesting to see actual data. 

 

There are more top TE'S drafted in the middle rounds than there are top receivers. Not quite sure what the relative bust PCTG. actually is because obviously more WR's are taken.

9 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

Beane may keep him for his last year paying him to hopefully be a #2 but I just get the feeling he is the big vet that goes.

 

As to the cap stuff..........it isn't about cap space for next year.  Just more about $'s vs. production.

Personally (and I've posted this a few times already)  I think some people will be a little shocked when the Bills have 20+ million

to carry over to 2020.  I agree with you that there is no way Beane spends it all on 1 FA season. 

The thing is 2019 is Clay's last season under contract so there's no real issue going forward.

 

I would only advocate keeping Clay if he's truly  our 2nd best TE. Bemoaning the money he's already earned won't recoup any of it nor will cutting bait. I could see him sticking around as a number 2. I don't buy the lack of effort arguments. He misplayed a not so great pass. Should have caught it, but didn't. He's not a KB type slouch IMO and he can block.

Edited December 4, 2018 by LSHMEAB

[schoolhouserock]

I am a die hard Hawkeye fan. I pray that the Bills stay away from Fant.

 

I can already tell you how Fant will play out as a pro: he will flash as a rookie, receive lots of hype, underperform until his contract year, and then he will flash again when the money is on the line.

 

He played this entire season to not get hurt.

 

the REAL TE on the Hawkeyes is TJ Hockenson. He is a George Kittle clone in terms of playing style. Great blocker, great hands, and an underrated athlete. Plus he gives great effort and is consistent. Fant disappears and is inconsistent.

 

It sickens me what that team could have done this year if Fant was not playing scared. He’s a great talent, but playing not to get hurt is a HUGE red flag, IMO.

 

(edit to clarify last sentence)

Edited December 4, 2018 by schoolhouserock

[njbuff]

1 hour ago, N.Y. Orangeman said:

Albert O out of Mizzou is better.

 

You are correct.

 

And no one responding to this thread seems to care.

 

I told everyone on BBMB that Josh Allen was the target for the Bills QB position back in 2016 once McDermott took over.

 

I will tell everyone on here right now that Albert O is the target of the Bills for 2019. As of now, they think he is the perfect fit for Allen.

 

But, we shall see as things change by the second leading up to the draft and/or FA.

[Cripple Creek]

9 hours ago, Sanners said:

With Fant declaring for the 2019 draft, and the Bills big time need for a TE, do you think we select him at 8 (our current position).  I’ve seen a couple games and he looks the part. Anyone a Hawkeye fan with more insight?

I would be disappointed by such a high pick on a TE.

[Big Blitz]

No.

 

The corner from LSU.  

[26CornerBlitz]

3 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

6. Buffalo Bills D.K. Metcalf, WR, Ole Miss

 

Even though the Bills could stand to improve on the defensive line, their defense has been a great story this year; it’s their offense that needs the most help.

 

Quarterback Josh Allen has been fine, and even though the media loves to beat up on Allen because it’s low hanging fruit, he has progressed. What would allow him to take the next step is if the Bills’ second best wide receiver wasn’t Robert Foster.

 

D.K. Metcalf would not only be Buffalo’s second best wide receiver, he’d be their first best wide receiver — Trevor, you don’t have to say “first best,” best is implied.

 

Metcalf missed the last portion of Ole Miss’ season with a neck injury. As long as the neck checks out, this 6-3, 225-pound outside wide receiver was just starting to scratch the surface of what he’s capable of.

 

37. Buffalo Bills: Noah Fant, TE, Iowa

 

[MrEpsYtown]

14 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

 

Looks like Noah Fant is going to the Mason Rudolph of this year. The guy people want us to draft in the top ten, who goes significantly lower than that on draft day. 

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, MrEpsYtown said:

 

Looks like Noah Fant is going to the Mason Rudolph of this year. The guy people want us to draft in the top ten, who goes significantly lower than that on draft day. 

 

No way a TE should be the Bills' pick in the 1st round with the OL being a much higher priority.  A number of other positions are greater needs such as WR, CB, and maybe DL. 

[MrEpsYtown]

4 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

No way a TE should be the Bills' pick in the 1st round with the OL being a much higher priority.  A number of other positions are greater needs such as WR, CB, and maybe DL. 

 

Agreed (I think OL is fixed in FA and defense is drafted early). I'm just saying this two Noah Fant threads so far and we are months away from the draft. My fear is that there will be many, many, many more threads advocating picking the dude in the top ten. 

Edited December 10, 2018 by MrEpsYtown

[HuSeYiN_NYC]

What's our current draft position after the loss yesterday and the games played by other teams? Anybody know? Thanks

[26CornerBlitz]

Just now, MrEpsYtown said:

 

Agreed (I think OL is fixed in FA and defense is drafted early). I'm just saying this two Noah Fant posts so far and we are months away from the draft. My fear is that there will be many, many, many more posts advocating picking the dude in the top ten. 

 

That would be unwise and I don't believe it'll happen.