Julio Jones is not going to report to Camp.

[Cornette's Commentary]

1 minute ago, BuffaloHokie13 said:

30 year old Randy Moss fetched a 4th round pick and went on to set the single season TD catch record. Not interested in giving up a 1st whatsoever.

Who was throwing the ball to him?

[Soda Popinski]

We still need to find our QB before we worry about spending 100 million on a WR.   We have put the cart before the horse half a dozen times in the past 15 years.   No more.   Get the QB.   And go from there.  

[BuffaloHokie13]

3 minutes ago, Cornette's Commentary said:

Who was throwing the ball to him?

Doesn't effect the point whatsoever. He was a 30 year old, disgruntled but still excellent WR. He fetched a 4th.

[Cornette's Commentary]

3 minutes ago, BuffaloHokie13 said:

Doesn't effect the point whatsoever. He was a 30 year old, disgruntled but still excellent WR. He fetched a 4th.

He fetched a 4th because Lane Kiffin didn't know what he was doing.  Dimitroff would ask for at least a 1st for Julio.

[Soda Popinski]

5 minutes ago, BuffaloHokie13 said:

Doesn't effect the point whatsoever. He was a 30 year old, disgruntled but still excellent WR. He fetched a 4th.

Moss was coming off a couple of down seasons though.   JJ is still very much at the peak of his game.  People thought Moss was washed up and done.   And if he didn't have Brady throwing him the ball he may have been.  

[Virgil]

1 hour ago, nucci said:

does that include threatening a player to take a pay cut or be released as well?

 

There are penalties for the team to do that as well 

[Augie]

We are looking for our QB and building for our future. His window will have passed by the time we peak. Bad timing here, even if you wanted to pay a WR top dollar. 

[MJS]

I don't know why fans defend the teams so much. Teams cut players all the time when they are under contract, or try to renegotiate their contracts for smaller cap hits. If teams can do that, the players should be able to hold out. It makes it more balanced.

[Virgil]

4 minutes ago, MJS said:

I don't know why fans defend the teams so much. Teams cut players all the time when they are under contract, or try to renegotiate their contracts for smaller cap hits. If teams can do that, the players should be able to hold out. It makes it more balanced.

 

I think the dead money should go to the players

[nucci]

15 minutes ago, Virgil said:

 

There are penalties for the team to do that as well 

ok then

[dave mcbride]

16 minutes ago, MJS said:

I don't know why fans defend the teams so much. Teams cut players all the time when they are under contract, or try to renegotiate their contracts for smaller cap hits. If teams can do that, the players should be able to hold out. It makes it more balanced.

I agree 100 percent. 

[Mark Vader]

1 hour ago, Cornette's Commentary said:

Who was throwing the ball to him?

Who were the idiots who made that trade?

[BillsFan130]

1 hour ago, BuffaloHokie13 said:

Doesn't effect the point whatsoever. He was a 30 year old, disgruntled but still excellent WR. He fetched a 4th.

I don't really think you can compare the two.

 

Sure Moss was a great player, but when he was traded he was coming off 2 pretty bad seasons for his standards.

 

The year he got traded he came off a season where he played 13 games and got 42 catches for 553 yards.

 

The year before that he played 16 games and had 60 catches for 1005 yards.

 

Julio is coming off back to back 1400 plus yards seasons, is a year younger, and is a class act.

 

Randy Moss was a complete head case who wasn't producing that well as he was reaching his 30s.

 

What I am trying to say is for the bills to get Julio , it will take A LOT more than a 4th round pick

 

 

Edited July 24, 2018 by billsfan11

[DrDawkinstein]

Just gonna leave this here. Julio has spent most of the summer working out/hanging out with TO...

 

[CommonCents]

8 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

Just gonna leave this here. Julio has spent most of the summer working out/hanging out with TO...

 

Blehhhh. The falcons opened the can of worms when they drafted Ridley. It’s bad enough guys like Watkins will make more than Julio this season because of how his contract was structured and now the slight of looking at his eventual replacement. The contract is the same thing Gronk is going through. Making less than lesser TEs if he looks at it on a one year basis.

 

The players are up against it in the NFL and I try not to fault them for maximizing their value. It does suck seeing stars sit out or come in during regular season and end up pulling a hammy. 

[Fadingpain]

3 hours ago, MAJBobby said:

https://929thegame.radio.com/articles/atlanta-falcons-will-reportedly-not-rework-contract-wide-receiver-julio-jones

 

Beane Make the Call. See what that package is that they would move him for. 

Until we know we have a QB who can deliver the ball, wasting big money on a top WR is foolish.

 

See Failed Sammy Watkins Project.

 

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

3 hours ago, Thunderstruck said:

the most physically dominant WR in the game, and it isn't even close. i'll bet matt ryan signs up to give half of his salary to jones to keep him around. half of his stats are thanks to the jump balls this guy hauls in.

 

I dunno about half, but there's no question that just as AJ Green makes Dalton look better than he is, so Julio Jones makes Ryan look better than he is.

 

Allegedly the Falcons have informed Jones they have no $$ to rework his contract, but I do wonder if he'd be open to a compromise that they could afford - say, guaranteeing part or all of his salary etc.

[Thunderstruck]

1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I dunno about half, but there's no question that just as AJ Green makes Dalton look better than he is, so Julio Jones makes Ryan look better than he is.

 

 

but who doesn't love them a little hyperbole early in the morning?

[BuffaloHokie13]

46 minutes ago, billsfan11 said:

I don't really think you can compare the two.

 

Sure Moss was a great player, but when he was traded he was coming off 2 pretty bad seasons for his standards.

 

The year he got traded he came off a season where he played 13 games and got 42 catches for 553 yards.

 

The year before that he played 16 games and had 60 catches for 1005 yards.

 

Julio is coming off back to back 1400 plus yards seasons, is a year younger, and is a class act.

 

Randy Moss was a complete head case who wasn't producing that well as he was reaching his 30s.

 

What I am trying to say is for the bills to get Julio , it will take A LOT more than a 4th round pick

I don't think a 4th will get him, but I don't think many teams will offer much more. Maybe a 3rd. Ultimately I don't think he's going anywhere.

[C.Biscuit97]

Until there are guaranteed contracts, this will keep happening.  I get why fans don’t like, but are you going to care if he blows out his knee and never earns a cent more?  

[Gugny]

3 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Until there are guaranteed contracts, this will keep happening.  I get why fans don’t like, but are you going to care if he blows out his knee and never earns a cent more?  

 

That all depends on everyone's Empathy Test scores.

[Wayne Cubed]

1 hour ago, Commonsense said:

Blehhhh. The falcons opened the can of worms when they drafted Ridley. It’s bad enough guys like Watkins will make more than Julio this season because of how his contract was structured and now the slight of looking at his eventual replacement. The contract is the same thing Gronk is going through. Making less than lesser TEs if he looks at it on a one year basis.

 

The players are up against it in the NFL and I try not to fault them for maximizing their value. It does suck seeing stars sit out or come in during regular season and end up pulling a hammy. 

 

Jones just wants more guaranteed money, which makes a lot of sense from a business stand point. He’s made all the $47m guaranteed money from the current contract. The $12.5m he’s going to get this year isn’t guaranteed until day 1 of the season. The Falcons had to know this was coming and there is an easy solution for this year, which they’ve done already for other players. Convert some of his salary to a signing bonus.

[C.Biscuit97]

3 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

That all depends on everyone's Empathy Test scores.

Link? 

[Gugny]

1 minute ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Link? 

 

 

[BillsFan130]

1 hour ago, BuffaloHokie13 said:

I don't think a 4th will get him, but I don't think many teams will offer much more. Maybe a 3rd. Ultimately I don't think he's going anywhere.

I’ll respectfully disagree about the 3rd. I think it will be much more.

 

You made the example about Randy Moss and the 4th. I’ll use the example of how a headcase like Percy Harvin landed a 1st and a 2nd I believe?Jones is three times the player he was and he’s not a clown like him.

 

I will agree with you in saying I think he stays in Atlanta though

[DrDawkinstein]

32 minutes ago, Wayne Cubed said:

 

Jones just wants more guaranteed money, which makes a lot of sense from a business stand point. He’s made all the $47m guaranteed money from the current contract. The $12.5m he’s going to get this year isn’t guaranteed until day 1 of the season. The Falcons had to know this was coming and there is an easy solution for this year, which they’ve done already for other players. Convert some of his salary to a signing bonus.

 

Except he doesnt only want guaranteed money. If so, that would be easy to do. He wants MORE money. He wants to be paid more than Watkins and Cooks. Which is ridiculous since he had to know there would be other players signing big contracts over the course of his 5 year contract. I'm pretty sure the contract HE SIGNED broke down X amount of money over 5 years. What he should have asked for is "every year Y+$1, where Y is the new highest paid WR". But he didnt, since that would be stupid.

2 hours ago, Commonsense said:

Blehhhh. The falcons opened the can of worms when they drafted Ridley. It’s bad enough guys like Watkins will make more than Julio this season because of how his contract was structured and now the slight of looking at his eventual replacement. The contract is the same thing Gronk is going through. Making less than lesser TEs if he looks at it on a one year basis.

 

The players are up against it in the NFL and I try not to fault them for maximizing their value. It does suck seeing stars sit out or come in during regular season and end up pulling a hammy. 

 

Then these guys who think they are "the best" need to have their agents negotiate contracts that pay them Y+$1, where Y is the newest, highest paid player at their position. That is basically what they are demanding right now. But do you really think that would fly during contract negotiations?

[MAJBobby]

2 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

Just gonna leave this here. Julio has spent most of the summer working out/hanging out with TO...

 

 

Ok great. Spent time with a HOFer that ALWAYS Produced on the field. 

[DrDawkinstein]

1 minute ago, MAJBobby said:

 

Ok great. Spent time with a HOFer that ALWAYS Produced on the field. 

 

That description of TO is incomplete and you know it.

[MAJBobby]

Just now, DrDawkinstein said:

 

That description of TO is incomplete and you know it.

Is he in the HOF?

 

Did ge produce on the field?

 

did he ever get arrested or those type of issues?

 

only questions I really Care about when it comes to a football player 

[stony]

I'll be at a wedding in two weeks where there's a strong possibility Arthur Blank will be a guest. 

 

Over/under on number of drinks before I propose a trade for Julio set at 4.  

[Wayne Cubed]

21 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

Except he doesnt only want guaranteed money. If so, that would be easy to do. He wants MORE money. He wants to be paid more than Watkins and Cooks. Which is ridiculous since he had to know there would be other players signing big contracts over the course of his 5 year contract. I'm pretty sure the contract HE SIGNED broke down X amount of money over 5 years. What he should have asked for is "every year Y+$1, where Y is the new highest paid WR". But he didnt, since that would be stupid.

 

Except it’s not easy when the Falcons have told him they have other players they want to take care of first. They aren’t going to even talk about his contract with him, they’ve said next year. So again, no easy if the team isn’t willing to talk.

[DrDawkinstein]

16 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

Is he in the HOF?

 

Did ge produce on the field?

 

did he ever get arrested or those type of issues?

 

only questions I really Care about when it comes to a football player 

 

Look, I like TO as a player too. But by willfully ignoring his issues he brought into the locker room, you're making your points invalid. Whether we "care" about them or not doesnt change the FACT they existed. Your opinion doesnt change reality.

Just now, Wayne Cubed said:

 

Except it’s not easy when the Falcons have told him they have other players they want to take care of first. They aren’t going to even talk about his contract with him, they’ve said next year. So again, no easy if the team isn’t willing to talk.

 

Because its not about guaranteed money, it's about MORE money. You just proved my point.

[Fr. Jerk]

I didn't know he only had 3 TD's last season. 

[Soda Popinski]

One thing I remember from the Shady trade was we got him from Philly with 3 years left on his contract and virtually zero guaranteed money and instead of making him play out that deal, we gave him a new deal and paid him good money.  A lot of people including myself scratched our heads at the time because we had him under contract, there was nothing he could do but play, but I think we did the right thing in hindsight because they showed him some love right away where it counted, in the wallet.  

 

Maybe just adding some guaranteed money to JJ's contract would make him happy IDK.   But it's hard to argue what he means to that offense.  

1 minute ago, The Jerk said:

I didn't know he only had 3 TD's last season. 

They went out and got Ridley, someone who can actually take some of the pressure off of Jones.   Their offense last year hurt because the lost their OC and I don't care what team you are when you lose your OC your offense suffers.   When we lost Ted Marchibroda to the Colts I knew our offense would lose something, it didn't fall flat but there is always dropoff.  

[DrDawkinstein]

5 minutes ago, Soda Popinski said:

 

Maybe just adding some guaranteed money to JJ's contract would make him happy IDK.   But it's hard to argue what he means to that offense.  

 

 

From all reports here in Atlanta, it isnt about guaranteed money. It's about the fact that WRs who he considers "lesser than" are making more money than him.

 

Sammy is making $16M/yr, Cooks is making $16M/yr, Julio is going to make $10M this year and he doesnt like it.

[Wayne Cubed]

11 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

Because its not about guaranteed money, it's about MORE money. You just proved my point.

 

Uh, nope I actually didn't. 

 

If Julio wants guaranteed money that money needs to come from somewhere on the salary cap.  He has $34.5m left on this contract, only $4.8m of that money is counted against the cap(dead cap). The Falcons could cut him right now, and have little cap ramifications. The money only counts against the cap on DAY 1 of the regular season, as a vested veteran. He can literally blow out his knee and the Falcons can cut him and not pay him any of that $34.5m.

 

To guarantee some money and give him more this year and next lets say, not more than the amount of the contract, so take that $34.5m and convert it to a signing bonus so he averages $17m a year. That requires reworking of the cap because that money comes with dead cap ramifications. And if the Falcons plan on signing other players to contracts, they may have ear marked that cap space for them. See how that works? Not MORE money, just more guaranteed money.

 

As a player, as I said before, it's smart business and he should do it. The Falcons KNEW it was coming and the out was always going to be this year. The Falcons are just playing the game and seeing if they can stretch this to another year. 

Edited July 24, 2018 by Wayne Cubed

[Soda Popinski]

2 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

From all reports here in Atlanta, it isnt about guaranteed money. It's about the fact that WRs who he considers "lesser than" are making more money than him.

 

Sammy is making $16M/yr, Cooks is making $16M/yr, Julio is going to make $10M this year and he doesnt like it.

He's not wrong.   Cooks has done well everywhere he's gone.    But Sammy's deal is laughable, it's not Aaron "give back some of that money you ain't earned yet" Maybin laughable, but are they paying him 500k per reception?   

[DrDawkinstein]

4 minutes ago, Wayne Cubed said:

 

Uh, nope I actually didn't. 

 

If Julio wants guaranteed money that money needs to come from somewhere on the salary cap.  He has $34.5m left on this contract, only $4.8m of that money is counted against the cap(dead cap). The Falcons could cut him right now, and have little cap ramifications. The money only counts against the cap on DAY 1 of the regular season, as a vested veteran. He can literally blow out his knee and the Falcons can cut him and not pay him any of that $34.5m.

 

To guarantee some money and give him more this year and next lets say, not more than the amount of the contract, so take that $34.5m and convert it to a signing bonus so he averages $17m a year. That requires reworking of the cap because that money comes with dead cap ramifications. And if the Falcons plan on signing other players to contracts, they may have ear marked that cap space for them. See how that works? Not MORE money, just more guaranteed money.

 

As a player, as I said before, it's smart business and he should do it. The Falcons KNEW it was coming and the out was always going to be this year. The Falcons are just playing the game and seeing if they can stretch this to another year. 

 

Sorry bud, you go off track right from the start. His cap hit this season is $12.9M, not $4.8M. That $4.8M is what counts against their cap only if they were to cut him. So they could save $8M in cap space this year by cutting him. If they dont, he counts $12.9M against.

 

If it was just about guaranteed money, they could flip some of his $10.5M salary to guaranteed and keep the same cap hits. But he wants an extra $6-7M to put him above Sammy and Cooks.

 

Dead cap ramifications dont matter if you dont plan on cutting him. Which they dont.

6 minutes ago, Soda Popinski said:

He's not wrong.   Cooks has done well everywhere he's gone.    But Sammy's deal is laughable, it's not Aaron "give back some of that money you ain't earned yet" Maybin laughable, but are they paying him 500k per reception?   

 

He's not wrong that he is better than them. But he's wrong to believe he gets to re-do his contract based on higher paid players every year. If that's what he wanted, he should just sign 1yr deals.

[Soda Popinski]

1 minute ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

Sorry bud, you go off track right from the start. His cap hit this season is $12.9M, not $4.8M. That $4.8M is what counts against their cap only if they were to cut him. So they could save $8M in cap space this year by cutting him. If they dont, he counts $12.9M against.

 

If it was just about guaranteed money, they could flip some of his $10.5M salary to guaranteed and keep the same cap hits. But he wants an extra $6-7M to put him above Sammy and Cooks.

 

Dead cap ramifications dont matter if you dont plan on cutting him. Which they dont.

 

He's not wrong that he is better than them. But he's wrong to believe he gets to re-do his contract based on higher paid players every year. If that's what he wanted, he should just sign 1yr deals.

THat's what I meant, he's not wrong he's better than guys making more money than him.   

 

Bruce used to pull something every offseason as I remember.  He had to be the highest paid defensive player every year or every other year or he'd have a fit.   

[Wayne Cubed]

12 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

Sorry bud, you go off track right from the start. His cap hit this season is $12.9M, not $4.8M. That $4.8M is what counts against their cap only if they were to cut him. So they could save $8M in cap space this year by cutting him. If they dont, he counts $12.9M against.

 

If it was just about guaranteed money, they could flip some of his $10.5M salary to guaranteed and keep the same cap hits. But he wants an extra $6-7M to put him above Sammy and Cooks.

 

Dead cap ramifications dont matter if you dont plan on cutting him. Which they dont.

 

Nope, wrong again, 'bud'. His salary does not count against the cap, as a vested veteran, until after Week 1. If they did cut him before Week 1 he would count $4.8(dead money) against the cap. I don't know how many different ways I can explain this to you but his money for 2018 IS NOT GUARANTEED. Meaning its not counting against the cap until after Week 1. He could get hurt in camp and the Falcons could cut him and owe him nothing. The $4.8m is only what is being counted against the cap in terms of dead money. This is true for the final remaining years of his contract as well. Why should he show up to camp without any money guaranteed?

 

You can't "just flip some money" to guaranteed and keep the same cap hits, because that money for next season... doesn't count against the cap yet. That's not how it works, at all. If they wanted to give him more money now, that requires converting the money to a signing bonus, which has dead cap ramifications past this season. Again, if the Falcons plan on extending other players and this cuts into their cap space for extending these players then they may not want to "just flip some money" to guaranteed.

Edited July 24, 2018 by Wayne Cubed