The Jets Just Made a Mistake

[Heitz]

Without reading this entire thread, I would say there’s a reason teams trade up during the draft is to ENSURE they guy they want is there.

 

This could work out great for the Jets - or not.  We shall see!

 

 

[Reed83HOF]

2 minutes ago, thunderingsquid said:

Whatever - get it done

[Beast]

2 hours ago, HappyDays said:

Whatever happens I don't think we'll know until draft day. That's what really surprises me about this trade, that it happened today. Why would the Jets show their hand like that?

 

I could see a scenario where we already have a deal in place to get Foles, and we like a QB that will be available at 22. That leaves pick 12 for a player that will immediately contribute. Not saying that's exactly what will happen but I am sure Beane already has a contingency plan in mind.

 

I think because the Jets are also desperate for a franchise QB and have been it talks with Cleveland and the Giants and have a good idea what those two teams are going to do. Indy has Luck......

 

It wouldn’t surprise me one bit if QB goes 1, 2, 3 in this draft. It would certainly be a first but so was UMBC as a 16 beating a 1 last night.

 

I really hope the Bills aren’t on the outside looking in at the end of April.

Edited March 17, 2018 by Binghamton Beast

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

7 minutes ago, Binghamton Beast said:

 

Yeah, because you don’t come off as a know it all. Save me with your cute little phrases, Oldie.

 

...IGNORE is a beautiful thing...use it.....I know I'll never be able to live up to your high horse in that rarified air.......see ya sonny...........no harm...no foul here.....

[Beast]

Just now, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...IGNORE is a beautiful thing...use it.....I know I'll never be able to live up to your high horse in that rarified air.......see ya sonny...........no harm...no foul here.....

 

None at all old friend.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

1 minute ago, Binghamton Beast said:

 

None at all old friend.

...thought you were.....apparently not and disappointedly so......

[Beast]

Just now, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

...thought you were.....apparently not and disappointedly so......

 

Let’s drop it and forget it, huh?

 

[T-Bomb]

Can you two please stop shitting all over the board?

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

Just now, Binghamton Beast said:

 

Let’s drop it and forget it, huh?

 

....we're good Jeff...ALWAYS held you in THE highest esteem......good guy...good poster.....and with a wealth of football knowledge...

[Bring it]

2 hours ago, BadLandsMeanie said:

Just a word if you will allow me.

 

The Jets just traded into the 3rd spot of the first round. I feel grim about that just like everyone because it makes it look like we might get shut out from having our choice.

 

I think the only person truly happy about it is AJ McCarron, who is probably still dancing as I speak.

 

But it was a mistake. This was never going to be easy and it is more like a gunfight than anything else. Somebody is going to live and somebody is going to die.

Beane will keep his cool, because Beane will know that the Jets just locked themselves in to taking whoever is left at 3.

 

So the Jets have played their cards too soon which leaves  Beane with a small advantage. Beane still has the option to trade up if the guy he wants is there at 2. 

 

The Jets just made it so we can get ahead of them. We don't have to worry about them any more if you look at it that way.

 

You get 15 minutes I think it is in round one to wheel and deal. If the Bills see somebody they want bad enough they can probably trade ahead of the Jets and get who they want. While the Jets are pretty much locked in.

 

The whole thing is dicey but we just got a small advantage here.

 

I don't believe they will, but if the Browns take Barkey #1, this Jets move could result in the Buffalo Bills getting first pick of all the quarterbacks. They can get whoever they want.

This is exactly my take on the situation as well. That first pick by Cleveland is what will determine if Beane even try’s to move up to 2 or not. They  probably have already had discussions since they know each other well! A J shouldn’t dance just yet.

[xRUSHx]

2 hours ago, Looper said:

No mistake at all ... Jets will get Mayfield @ #3. Darnold to CLE, Rosen to NYG and then Mayfield. Allen to the Broncos @ 5 and the Bills will take Jackson. 

Rosen wants to go to the Giants. 

 

https://www.bigblueview.com/2018/3/16/17128840/nfl-draft-josh-rosen-gives-giants-a-shout-out-after-his-pro-day-workout

If they end up with Jackson they should have just kept Tyrod, same QB.

Run Jackson Run

 

I hope they pass on the running QB and draft a pocket passer in Rudolph

[Golden*Wheels]

Boy i don't think it is a mistake, though I did at first....now they can just say to the Giants....if anyone calls you to get #2, call us, we'll give you something decent to move back only one spot AND guarantee they won't take whomever the Giants want.

 

Basically the Jets can rooster block us very easily from #3. Sure they have to give up even more but if they think anyone might leapfrog them to their guy, why wouldn't they?

 

(If Giants go QB I'm all wrong but I am banking on them taking Saquon in this scenario)

Edited March 17, 2018 by Golden*Wheels

[Beast]

2 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

....we're good Jeff...ALWAYS held you in THE highest esteem......good guy...good poster.....and with a wealth of football knowledge...

 

Thanks bud. I still do feel the same way about the QB position though. We need one. I am fearful we will be on the outside looking in at the end of April. The guys I really like, in order, are Mayfield, Rosen and Darnold. I’m not a sold on much else and I was sure Beane would be picking in the top 3.We still may but I now have my doubts.

 

I was on the QB in ‘18 train as soon as they made the deal at last years draft.

[Bring it]

2 minutes ago, Golden*Wheels said:

Boy i don't think it is a mistake, though I did at first....now they can just say to the Giants....if anyone calls you to get #2, call us, we'll give you something decent to move back only one spot AND guarantee they won't take whomever the Giants want.

 

Basically the Jets can rooster block us very easily from #3. Sure they have to give up even more but if they think anyone might leapfrog them to their guy, why wouldn't they?

 

(If Giants go QB I'm all wrong but I am banking on them taking Saquon in this scenario)

Good point. It wouldn’t even become a bidding war unless Beane gives up a boatload of picks. That’s all that might entice the Giants to give up that spot. Our only shot it seems is if the Browns take Saquon #1. Removing who imo the Giants really want.

[Rochesterfan]

2 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

I'm sure the Jets completely disagree with you and are fine with being third and would be completely fine with having any of those three. Why else would they have made the trade?

 

Because it was the only move they had left - they have to say well we like all 3 and now we will get one for sure, but I still think the safest play is day of the draft for the Giants pick - I think they want Barkley - I don’t think they want a QB - new HC and GM with a veteran QB - they want to make a run.

 

I think the Jets know/feel they are getting the 2nd QB off the board.  If Cleveland goes QB - Giants probably go Barkley without a trade and NYJs get number 2 QB.

 

The Only issue is if 2 QBs go - then they just gave up a bunch for the 3rd best QB and that is a much lower chance of working out.

 

I commend them for moving, but without the draft playing out yet - it was to early to risk it with the roster they have and the coaching staff on life support.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

4 minutes ago, Binghamton Beast said:

 

Thanks bud. I still do feel the same way about the QB position though. We need one. I am fearful we will be on the outside looking in at the end of April. The guys I really like, in order, are Mayfield, Rosen and Darnold. I’m not a sold on much else and I was sure Beane would be picking in the top 3.We still may but I now have my doubts.

 

I was on the QB in ‘18 train as soon as they made the deal at last years draft.

 

...my passion for the position is the same my good friend....OBD has woefully effed it up since Kelly with TE spot a close second,,,,,at te hsame time, the draft was, is and forever will remain a crapshhot...I'm thnking McBeane know his targets(s) and moves to the next one at 12 if the first intended is gone....

[DriveFor1Outta5]

32 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...my passion for the position is the same my good friend....OBD has woefully effed it up since Kelly with TE spot a close second,,,,,at te hsame time, the draft was, is and forever will remain a crapshhot...I'm thnking McBeane know his targets(s) and moves to the next one at 12 if the first intended is gone....

The kicker is the fact that I want to see Mayfield, Rosen, or Darnold in a Bills uni. Anything less is simply a disappointment. Allen or Jackson would feel more like the OBD you mentioned. 

[Roundybout]

Maybe this is the Guinness talking but I've been thinking and I seriously think that the Jets needed to leapfrog someone at 4. I wonder if they've learned that we were looking to move there. 

[John from Riverside]

4 hours ago, BillsFan17 said:

I'm telling you right now, anyone who thinks yesterday was lip service from Beane...

 

I think Beane saw an opportunity to shed salary and move up in the draft with Glenn.

 

There is a very strong possibility that move didn't entail him automatically moving up as was assumed.

 

Now the Jets moving up means the Giants can literally ask for anything and I sincerely doubt Beane gives up the cost.

To me that will depend on Beans conviction of Josh Rosen.....if he truly feels that he is a franchise guy he will pay the price

[billsfan89]

The Jets gave up a good amount to trade up to pick 3 but in the context of trading up for a QB they didn't give up much. The pick they got from Seattle was found money from the Richardson trade, their 2nd round (a high second rounder) and next years 2nd rounder is a steep cost but one you are more than willing to pay if it means landing your franchise QB. Compare that to the RGIII and Goff trades and it is a bargain. 

[Shaw66]

4 hours ago, BillsFan17 said:

I'm telling you right now, anyone who thinks yesterday was lip service from Beane...

 

I think Beane saw an opportunity to shed salary and move up in the draft with Glenn.

 

There is a very strong possibility that move didn't entail him automatically moving up as was assumed.

 

Now the Jets moving up means the Giants can literally ask for anything and I sincerely doubt Beane gives up the cost.

Right. Fans want a top pick so they believe it's Beane's plan to get one.  

 

Beane is just dealing when sees an opportunity.  When the Colts called and asked if he would outbid the offer they had, Beane rightly said no.  He Wil

 Wait and see what opportunities come to him that make sense.  

[BillsFan17]

9 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

Right. Fans want a top pick so they believe it's Beane's plan to get one.  

 

Beane is just dealing when sees an opportunity.  When the Colts called and asked if he would outbid the offer they had, Beane rightly said no.  He Wil

 Wait and see what opportunities come to him that make sense.  

My only issue is, you don't trade back last year and pass on Watson/Mahomes, trade starters for picks, trade Tyrod, move up to 12 while trading a good tackle all not to get a true blue chip spec.

[Manther]

3 hours ago, Looper said:

 

This is true, but I want someone who wants to play here. Rosen is giving shoutouts to the Giants, not the Bills. Mayfield is a big city Jets type personality (Broadway Baker) and Darnold has already stated he would love to lead the Browns. That leaves Allen and I see him with the Broncos backing up Case for a few years. 

Really!?

[DriveFor1Outta5]

6 minutes ago, BillsFan17 said:

My only issue is, you don't trade back last year and pass on Watson/Mahomes, trade starters for picks, trade Tyrod, move up to 12 while trading a good tackle all not to get a true blue chip spec.

Right, their backs are to the wall now. They have to get something done for a top QB. There is no way that they can’t do so without looking like idiots imo. You don’t trade away a garage full of cars for two Dodge Neons. That’s basically what they’d be doing. 

[BadLandsMeanie]

34 minutes ago, BillsEnthusiast said:

Maybe this is the Guinness talking but I've been thinking and I seriously think that the Jets needed to leapfrog someone at 4. I wonder if they've learned that we were looking to move there. 

I didn't think of that but it makes sense.

[Buddo]

13 minutes ago, BillsFan17 said:

My only issue is, you don't trade back last year and pass on Watson/Mahomes, trade starters for picks, trade Tyrod, move up to 12 while trading a good tackle all not to get a true blue chip spec.

 

Realistically, I think you have to hang the blame for that on McDermott.  I'd say that he wasn't prepared to trust anyone elses judgement on a QB, when he probably knew there was a new GM on the horizon, and that it probably would be someone he would trust (i.e. Beane).

 

Now, they might still roll the dice if they can find a partner, but it would seem, for the moment at least, that the Jest have got, and made, the jump on them.

 

One thing I would say, is that unlike player contracts, just because one team has overpaid (imho) to move up, doesn't automatically mean other teams will have to pay the same sort of premium. Maybe if there's a bidding war, but not necessarily otherwise.

[jkirchofer]

Meh. I am starting to think McCarron may be their guy. No way they can get to two without both firsts this year, a second this year, and next year's first. If McCarron was a franchise guy, someone would have tried him away from Cincinnati. Same mistake Rex made with Taylor. 

[Seventeen]

3 minutes ago, jkirchofer said:

Meh. I am starting to think McCarron may be their guy. No way they can get to two without both firsts this year, a second this year, and next year's first. If McCarron was a franchise guy, someone would have tried him away from Cincinnati. Same mistake Rex made with Taylor. 

 

Agreed ... that's potentially 4 starters for a "franchise QB".  I'd forget about moving up and fill the holes on the roster starting with #12. And I just can't see the Giants parting with #2 given Manning's age. 

[BillsFan4]

5 hours ago, BadLandsMeanie said:

Just a word if you will allow me.

 

The Jets just traded into the 3rd spot of the first round. I feel grim about that just like everyone because it makes it look like we might get shut out from having our choice.

 

I think the only person truly happy about it is AJ McCarron, who is probably still dancing as I speak.

 

But it was a mistake. This was never going to be easy and it is more like a gunfight than anything else. Somebody is going to live and somebody is going to die.

Beane will keep his cool, because Beane will know that the Jets just locked themselves in to taking whoever is left at 3.

 

So the Jets have played their cards too soon which leaves  Beane with a small advantage. Beane still has the option to trade up if the guy he wants is there at 2. 

 

The Jets just made it so we can get ahead of them. We don't have to worry about them any more if you look at it that way.

 

You get 15 minutes I think it is in round one to wheel and deal. If the Bills see somebody they want bad enough they can probably trade ahead of the Jets and get who they want. While the Jets are pretty much locked in.

 

The whole thing is dicey but we just got a small advantage here.

 

I don't believe they will, but if the Browns take Barkey #1, this Jets move could result in the Buffalo Bills getting first pick of all the quarterbacks. They can get whoever they want.

Yeah I just had a somewhat similar thought -

 

What if the Jets did all of this - gave up the #6 overall pick PLUS 3 more top 50 picks -for the 3rd best QB in this draft class (Mayfleid/Allen etc)?

 

The only thing they did with this move is guarantee that they get the 3rd QB off the board (with a possibility at the 2nd QB off the board). 

 

Is anyone totally convinced that the 3rd best QB in this draft is worth 4 top 50 picks?

 

I sure am not. 

 

What if the Bills sold the farm to get to #3, only to be left with both our top 2 QBs off the board at 1 and 2?

 

I am far from convinced that QB #3 in this draft is worth everything it would have taken for us to get to the 3rd overall pick (figure at least 2800 draft points, if not more since we were at 12, not 6 and the Colts still get a blue chip guy at 6). 

 

#2 or bust!  

 

[Reed83HOF]

7 minutes ago, Looper said:

 

Agreed ... that's potentially 4 starters for a "franchise QB".  I'd forget about moving up and fill the holes on the roster starting with #12. And I just can't see the Giants parting with #2 given Manning's age. 

we have $100 million next year, you can buy everything but a QB....this is the way we have built our rosters since JP...it's a terrible idea. Let's keep doing the same thing over and over again

[Seventeen]

3 minutes ago, Reed83HOF said:

we have $100 million next year, you can buy everything but a QB....this is the way we have built our rosters since JP...it's a terrible idea. Let's keep doing the same thing over and over again

 

Gotta have a trade partner and I don't think the Giants are going to deal away Rosen. 

[Reed83HOF]

Just now, Looper said:

 

Gotta have a trade partner and I don't think the Giants are going to deal away Rosen. 

I don't see them taking a QB...

[Seventeen]

Just now, Reed83HOF said:

I don't see them taking a QB...

 

Why wouldn't they and let the new guy learn from Eli for a couple ? I would think they value Rosen more than Davis Webb. 

[Reed83HOF]

Just now, Looper said:

 

Why wouldn't they and let the new guy learn from Eli for a couple ? I would think they value Rosen more than Davis Webb. 

They are trying to win now. I find it fairly obvious via their moves thus far. The need players to help them win now...

[jkirchofer]

10 minutes ago, Looper said:

 

Gotta have a trade partner and I don't think the Giants are going to deal away Rosen. 

Exactly. With next year's draft class weak at QB, three was our only chance to get in the top four.  I see the Browns taking Barkley at one since they would be guaranteed a QB at four. This sucks. 

[LABILLBACKER]

5 hours ago, BadLandsMeanie said:

Just a word if you will allow me.

 

The Jets just traded into the 3rd spot of the first round. I feel grim about that just like everyone because it makes it look like we might get shut out from having our choice.

 

I think the only person truly happy about it is AJ McCarron, who is probably still dancing as I speak.

 

But it was a mistake. This was never going to be easy and it is more like a gunfight than anything else. Somebody is going to live and somebody is going to die.

Beane will keep his cool, because Beane will know that the Jets just locked themselves in to taking whoever is left at 3.

 

So the Jets have played their cards too soon which leaves  Beane with a small advantage. Beane still has the option to trade up if the guy he wants is there at 2. 

 

The Jets just made it so we can get ahead of them. We don't have to worry about them any more if you look at it that way.

 

You get 15 minutes I think it is in round one to wheel and deal. If the Bills see somebody they want bad enough they can probably trade ahead of the Jets and get who they want. While the Jets are pretty much locked in.

 

The whole thing is dicey but we just got a small advantage here.

 

I don't believe they will, but if the Browns take Barkey #1, this Jets move could result in the Buffalo Bills getting first pick of all the quarterbacks. They can get whoever they want.

It will all depend on the Giants making a reasonable deal with us. I'd rather take Jackson or Rudolph than give up a kings ransom for risky QB's  like Rosen or Mayfield. It's got to be a fair price.

Edited March 17, 2018 by LABILLBACKER

[Seventeen]

1 minute ago, jkirchofer said:

Exactly. With next year's draft class weak at QB, three was our only chance to get in the top four.  I see the Browns taking Barkley at one since they would be guaranteed a QB at four. This sucks. 

 

Sucks is right ... all depends how the Browns feel about the 4 QBs. IMO, if they want Darnold, they'll take him @ 1. If not, Barkely @ 1 and possibly Baker Manziel @ #4.

[DriveFor1Outta5]

5 hours ago, Limeaid said:

They got other players they wanted and extra picks.     Fortunately I think our GM plays chess while you struggle at checkers.  Maybe you should try tic tac toe but take my advice and let other player go first.

This NFL draft should be more of a checkers game, so I’m fine playing checkers. We need a franchise QB, it’s as simple as that. Don’t over complicate that simple fact. If we don’t get a first tier QB this draft, the draft is a failure imo. Beane will eventually be playing chess with his pink slip, if he doesn’t get a QB this draft. 

Edited March 17, 2018 by DriveFor1Outta5

[Reed83HOF]

31 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

It will all depend on the Giants making a reasonable deal with us. I'd rather take Jackson or Rudolph than give up a kings ransom for risky QB's  like Rosen or Mayfield. It's got to be a fair price.

Those are actually the 2 who are the least riskiest...

[Wayne Arnold]

20 hours ago, baskingridgebillsfan said:

I don't think the Jets can get to two because the Giants are not going to trade them the pick

 

20 hours ago, Bangarang said:

Pretty sure the Jets tried getting to 2 first. The Giants probably don’t want to trade out or are asking for something unreasonable to make it happen. I don’t see how this is an advantage for us since the Giants can either stay put at 2 or bend us over the table since they know we need to jump the Jets.

 

20 hours ago, BadLandsMeanie said:

I think they were always going to bend us over for #2 overall. I don't think that has changed. But if we are sure this is the guy we want sitting there, paying a lot isn't wrong.

 

First of all, Gettleman is not going to "bend over" Beane and the Bills. Gettleman was Beane's mentor for years. They're very close. Not to mention Gettleman started his scouting career with the Buffalo Bills in the late 80's. So it's personal for Gettleman, fwiw. 

 

But not only is it personal, bending over another NFL team in a trade is simply bad for business. Otherwise, good luck ever making a deal with that team ever again.

 

Another thing to consider: Giants only have five draft picks in 2018. There's no question that they'd love to pick up some more. And there's no immediate need to draft a quarterback in the Top 2 because they have Eli for at least a couple more years, and there will likely be a good one to develop later in the first.

 

If Beane feels like he wants to (has to) trade up to #2, he will.

 

My guess/plan if Beane truly wants to get to #2:

 

Trade picks #12 and #53 (1570 points) to Bucs for pick #7 (1500 points). Maybe even have the Bucs throw in their 5th rounder (33.5 points) for good measure.

Trade picks #7, #22, #56, and #96 (2736 points) to Giants for pick #2 (2600 points).

 

This seems realistic to me. And since that is 136 points in favor of the Giants - if Gettleman is feeling extra nice he could swap 4th rounders (102 for 121). 

 

But even if he doesn't, that would leave the Bills with a healthy-enough number of draft picks (6) at the following spots:

 

1 (2)

3 (65)

4 (121)

*5 (144) - Bucs pick

5 (166)

6 (187)

 

Giants would go from having just five draft picks to having:

 

1 (7)

1 (22)

2 (34)

2 (56)

3 (66)

3 (96)

4 (102)

5 (139)

 

Seems to me like a great deal for the Giants.