If Taylor finishes season strong, do we build around him/Dennison?

[GoBills808]

12 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

No, I'm not entirely.  It is an overthrow, but it's also a ball Jones probably could have gotten to and caught with a little more effort.

 

But you're missing the context of the discussion.  I'm responding to Shady, who already seems to forget why the whole conversation started since he's responding to your comment here already forgetting about why we started talking about the pass in the first place.

 

He's using that throw in the context of his "uncatchable passes" argument.  And he directly reference a pass that I think was catchable, despite being an overthrow.

 

But it's Shady, so it's not unexpected.

If he’s throwing to Antonio Brown it might be catchable. If that’s Roethlisberger throwing the ball it might be a completion. Sadly, it’s Tyrod Taylor throwing to Zay Jones.

2 minutes ago, JerseyBills said:

I believe what he said.

With the right scheme I feel Taylor can flourish, his ability to turn something into nothing is largely overlooked.

Those 10 yard 3rd down runs for a 1st, versus a regular QB taking a sack is a huge margin.

His record this year is super impressive. Most on here and the national media had us as a 5-7 win team, he's 21-19 as a starter, under that BRUTAL Rex Ryan defense. what is Winston, Mariota and Carr's win loss record? While people on here obsess over 300 yards games, I'm looking at that W-L record, it's all that matters. He's been a winner with below average-average talent, surround him with better quality and he'll win more..

W/L is not a QB stat.

[BuffaloBill]

2 minutes ago, JerseyBills said:

I believe what he said.

With the right scheme I feel Taylor can flourish, his ability to turn something into nothing is largely overlooked.

Those 10 yard 3rd down runs for a 1st, versus a regular QB taking a sack is a huge margin.

His record this year is super impressive. Most on here and the national media had us as a 5-7 win team, he's 21-19 as a starter, under that BRUTAL Rex Ryan defense. what is Winston, Mariota and Carr's win loss record? While people on here obsess over 300 yards games, I'm looking at that W-L record, it's all that matters. He's been a winner with below average-average talent, surround him with better quality and he'll win more..

 

 

Yes, 21-19 is most impressive.  Just a shade above .500.  

 

But please continue to believe that the problem is the talent around him. 

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

19 minutes ago, JPP said:

Maybe im wrong but i think it kinda looked like Anthony Lynn's playbook in the first half and dennision dumped it and used his in the second half......our blocking on the oline was good in the first and shady ran like crazy....moreso outside blocking than the dennison crap.....

In Chargers land Anthony Lynn trashed his playbook and let Rivers play QB.  

ONCE that was done the Chargers started winning.   

 

\

 

I thought W/L was a team result?

So confusing.   /sarcasm 

 

[JPP]

8 minutes ago, ShadyBillsFan said:

In Chargers land Anthony Lynn trashed his playbook and let Rivers play QB.  

ONCE that was done the Chargers started winning.   

 

\

 

I thought W/L was a team result?

So confusing.   /sarcasm 

 

nope it looked completely dejavu for me at least....they pretty much shut down the offence in the second half (compared to the 1st).....thats the problem with this coaching...get a 1.5 or 2 possession lead and they completely play out the clock....this will not work this sunday...

[Playoffs?]

TT is 2-12 (I believe) when having to attempt 30 or more passes in a game. 

This record is scary, and doesn’t give me much confidence is his ability to win games when we need him to. I’m passing on him for next year.

Edited December 20, 2017 by Playoffs?

[Big Gun]

38 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

No, I'm not entirely.  It is an overthrow, but it's also a ball Jones probably could have gotten to and caught with a little more effort.

 

But you're missing the context of the discussion.  I'm responding to Shady, who already seems to forget why the whole conversation started since he's responding to your comment here already forgetting about why we started talking about the pass in the first place.

 

He's using that throw in the context of his "uncatchable passes" argument.  And he directly reference a pass that I think was catchable, despite being an overthrow.

 

But it's Shady, so it's not unexpected.

Yes you are, your track record says otherwise or you wouldn't even say this.

 

 

[Maine-iac]

1 hour ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

I don't know what you're trying to prove...

 

That Taylor doesn't spread the ball around?

 

He completed a pass to 8 different players in the game on Sunday.

 

 

As for what the play by play recap says... use your eyes... could Zay Jones have gotten to and caught that ball?

 

That thing in his hands is the ball ........ he just needed to hang on to it.  Anyone who calls it an overthrow clearly didn't watch the game.

Edited December 20, 2017 by Maine-iac

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

Why are you people using the non catch video and ignoring the other play where the ball was actually uncatchable???     

 

 

[transplantbillsfan]

25 minutes ago, PeterGriffin said:

Yes you are, your track record says otherwise or you wouldn't even say this.

 

 

 

Oh look, you and xRushx must be buddies.

 

Tell me more about what I think, please 

[GoBills808]

11 minutes ago, Maine-iac said:

That thing in his hands is the ball ........ he just needed to hang on to it.

Isn’t that a different play?

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

 

Just now, transplantbillsfan said:

 

Oh look, you and xRushx must be buddies.

 

Tell me more about what I think, please 

Speaking of buddies.  

 

Where is jm2009 and his aganda talk?   

1 minute ago, GoBills808 said:

Isn’t that a different play?

Shhh.  We don’t want to cloud their reality.  

[Maine-iac]

As for the adding my 2 cents to the post.  I'd definitely draft a QB if there's one there early.  Don't waste a first round pick on the 3rd or 4th best guy though.  Either make some moves and take a consensus good pick or build the team with play makers and defense.  I'm all for adding a good QB.   I'd rather play Taylor and Peterman with an explosive reciever and a better line next year than trade 2 firsts for a middle of the road prospect though.

[transplantbillsfan]

1 minute ago, ShadyBillsFan said:

Why are you people using the non catch video and ignoring the other play where the ball was actually uncatchable???     

 

 

 

Ummm... what?

 

The twitter clip I posted for you is one of Tyrod's targets to Jones.  The one Jones dropped is the other.

 

You said there are 2, right?

 

2 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

Isn’t that a different play?

 

Yes, it is... and it's a different play from the All-22 clip I posted that Shady doesn't even sound like he looked at, despite the fact that it's the one he's talking about

 

But again... it's Shady... I'm starting to just play a goofy sitcom-type little theme in my head every time I read a post from him, at this point.

[Maine-iac]

5 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

Isn’t that a different play?

You are right ......... my bad.  It's blocking the twitter in the forums on my browser so I had to go to Cover 1's page to find out I screwed that up.  Carry on nothing to see here :).

5 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

Ummm... what?

 

The twitter clip I posted for you is one of Tyrod's targets to Jones.  The one Jones dropped is the other.

 

You said there are 2, right?

 

 

Yes, it is... and it's a different play from the All-22 clip I posted that Shady doesn't even sound like he looked at, despite the fact that it's the one he's talking about

 

But again... it's Shady... I'm starting to just play a goofy sitcom-type little theme in my head every time I read a post from him, at this point.

The one I got wrong Taylor was essentially throwing away.  There wasn't anything else he could do on that.

[BillsFan4]

1 hour ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

It's close.  And I'm not saying it was an easy catch.  But better tracking and/or laying out a little I think Jones could have caught that.

 

Of course that would have just involved getting the ball to touch his hands... the next problem would be those stone hands of his... which we all know how to fix...

 

 

 

 

I don't see how Jones could have really tracked that ball much better. 

 

It looked to me that he was running full speed the entire route, and I thought he did lay out trying to catch it (watch him stretch and fall trying to catch the ball).

 

I really don't see much else Zay could have done on that one. 

 

I guess you could maaybbee say that he paused for like a millisecond when turning to look for the ball. But I have a hard time saying that was a catchable ball by Tyrod (and you know I'm not a Tyrod hater). 

[Maine-iac]

The one thing I will say if Zay knows he's covered in man coverage the DB basically ran the route for him and then they send the RB right into the same area.  There are only two WR's out and one RB and 5 guys covering.  The whole play looks doomed all over.

[BuffaloHokie13]

58 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

Isn’t that a different play?

Yes. And I think the point Transplant is attempting to make is that an overthrow isn't necessarily uncatchable (like 10 yards OoB or 15 yards downfield). It was overthrown, but potentially within reach (if we still had Sammy )

[wppete]

[ndirish1978]

7 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Hands down the worst receiving corps the Bills have fielded in a full season since they joined the NFL.

 

Deonte Thompson has probably been their best WR this season........a mid-season waiver wire add.........that's like Travaris Cadet being your leading rusher.

 

Zay Jones ineffectiveness is reaching historic proportions with each pass that he dro....I mean gets defensed..........and he's the most targeted receiver on the team.

 

As I said......like it or not, Taylor's numbers with Watkins and Woods healthy in Buffalo spoke for themselves.

 

I could argue with jackasses and fools like you all day on TSW but I just occasionally stop in to call out the bullsh*t when people like Kirby or Bandit aren't already there pointing it out. 

 

 

 

Thanks bro, it's a privilege having someone of your incredible humility and self-awareness interact with me on a faceless message board, you're a real cool guy and I'm happy you're such a positive influence on this community.

[Big Gun]

1 hour ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

Oh look, you and xRushx must be buddies.

 

Tell me more about what I think, please 

No need, you know you're full of yourself as does everyone else. 

[Thurman#1]

6 hours ago, Maine-iac said:

As for the adding my 2 cents to the post.  I'd definitely draft a QB if there's one there early.  Don't waste a first round pick on the 3rd or 4th best guy though.  Either make some moves and take a consensus good pick or build the team with play makers and defense.  I'm all for adding a good QB.   I'd rather play Taylor and Peterman with an explosive reciever and a better line next year than trade 2 firsts for a middle of the road prospect though.

 

 

I imagine the Steelers are pretty happy they took the third-best guy a few years ago in the first. Last year, Watson was the #3.

 

This is apparently a year where there may well be more than two guys with a pretty good shot at being a franchise guy. Being after the first two picked doesn't make you a middle of the road prospect, especially not this year.

[Thurman#1]

9 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

A big target and deep threat would be great for TT but Benjamin is only one of those things............I doubt he could break 5.0 flat on that torn meniscus that Peterman gave him with that blind heave into heavy traffic.........just like Rico drew it up baby!

 

There is a reason why most of the scoring throws from distance you see in the NFL are outside the hashes now........that's what kind of league it's become.......the west coast offense that Benjamin is better suited for is out of style now that secondaries and LB corps are faster and now that the hits are all directed at knees.

 

Now put a legit deep threat opposite or alongside him as an X or Z to keep the safeties back and perhaps it will be a lot safer work on the inside for ol' KB.   

 

 

The reason why most scoring throws from distance are outside the hashes now ... is that ... wait for it ... outside the hashes is most of the field.

 

Inside the hashes is 18.5 feet. The hash itself is two feet long. The field is 160 feet wide. So outside the hashes is 160 - 22.5 feet. Of course most of the long TD passes are outside the hashes. So are most of every kind of pass thrown, at any distance, TD or not.

 

But the idea that Benjamin's fit only for a west coast offense is ridiculous. He wasn't in a west coast scheme in Carolina. And plenty of tall but not super-fast WRs do very well in the NFL right now, in a variety of systems.

 

 

Edited December 20, 2017 by Thurman#1

[Thurman#1]

On 12/19/2017 at 1:14 PM, JerseyBills said:

If Taylor finishes season strong do we build around himDennison?

 

 

No. He's often had a good game or two in a row. Point is he's inconsistent and has major holes in his game that aren't going to change.

 

He's who he is, and who he is ... is not a franchise QB and certainly not a pocket QB.

 

I wish he was. But he's not. I can imagine a slight chance ... 5%? ... that they bring him back next year as a bridge but I doubt they even do that. My guess is that if they feel they need a bridge that they bring in one who fits the QB pre-requisite that McDermott laid out. They said before the season that a QB in their system must be good from the pocket. Given a chance to show he could be that, Tyrod didn't manage it.

Edited December 20, 2017 by Thurman#1

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

When was the last time our offense played well and scored points on the road with Tyrod? He seems to play pretty well at home more often, but man it seems like unless we run like crazy...we never score points on the road. We have 2 real good road wins this year, but barely scored on offense in either. Other then week 2 Miami last year and at Seattle (of all places), I can’t think of to many good road games for Tyrod. Even in the Seattle game, I’m pretty sure we scored on a blocked punt, or because of one. The sad part is though, I am so starved for playoffs abs so tired of the drought, if by some turn of fate we actually make it, I won’t care if he’s back. I will just be so happy that the drought is finally over, I’ll give them a pass for probably 2 years.

[GunnerBill]

11 hours ago, JerseyBills said:

He's been a winner with below average-average talent, surround him with better quality and he'll win more..

 

I'm not sure he will.  I see no evidence of that.  He is a do just enough, play conservative Quarterback.  You could give him AJ Green and Julio Jones on the outside and Tyrod would still not throw it until they were obviously wide open for fear of making a mistake.... and games would still consistently be within 7 points either way in the last 4 minutes of a game.  I think Tyrod could get you to 10 wins.... he might even have a Case Keenum type season in him where he goes off and gets you 12.... but Tyrod's seasons will normally be in that 7-9 range whatever and whoever you have around him.  

[mead107]

Peterman Can. Sign Tyrod as long term backup ?

[Teddy KGB]

9 hours ago, ndirish1978 said:

 

Thanks bro, it's a privilege having someone of your incredible humility and self-awareness interact with me on a faceless message board, you're a real cool guy and I'm happy you're such a positive influence on this community.

 

Agree.     At least his thoughts on McCoy and Taylor bring the laughs.  

[Billsfan1972]

12 hours ago, GoBills808 said:

Isn’t that a different play?

 

Could not be a better screen grab.  Perfect pass, in his hands, defender no where close to  getting his hands in and still dropped.  

 

But yep to those haters, it was somehow Taylor's fault.  

 

Still he is by far their best QB, fire Dennison and draft a QB high to be ready late 2018 or 2019.

 

And some WR's wouldn't hurt.

 

And please no competition with a 5th round draft choice who fits a dinosaurs idea of an offense.

Edited December 20, 2017 by Billsfan1972

[MAJBobby]

14 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

I think he could/would have on Sunday if we weren't up by 3 scores on Miami and the offensive play calling didn't, once again, go into a shell to try to protect a lead.

 

Taylor put up 177 yards (passing + rushing - sacks), 2 TDs and no turnovers in the 1st half alone.  And Dennison called over 20 passing plays in the 1st half.  Taylor was on track for 35+ passing attempts.

 

But then we went into the 2nd half up by 3 scores.

 

 

I think McDermott thinks "safe" quarterback play is "good" quarterback play based on what's unfolded with our game management when this team gets a lead.

 

Back to blaming theBOC againn i know the play calling went Conservative and use clock however that doesnt excuse TT from not executing the plays does it?

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

https://www.buffalorumblings.com/2016/11/23/13727758/scouting-tyrod-taylor-buffalo-bills-cincinnati-bengals

 

Buffalo’s 32nd-ranked passing offense turned in another ho-hum result on Sunday against the Cincinnati Bengals, with Tyrod Taylor turning in his sixth game of the season with fewer than 200 passing yards. 

seem familiar? 

Edited December 20, 2017 by ShadyBillsFan

[Billsfan1972]

26 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

 

Back to blaming theBOC againn i know the play calling went Conservative and use clock however that doesnt excuse TT from not executing the plays does it?

And how many "mistakes"  did TT make in the second half?  The OC put the Bills in bad situations on many second and third downs as usual in the second half.  

 

So yet again were the Bills out coached in the second half (which is the other excuse one can use).

[GunnerBill]

8 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

And how many "mistakes"  did TT make in the second half?  The OC put the Bills in bad situations on many second and third downs as usual in the second half.  

 

So yet again were the Bills out coached in the second half (which is the other excuse one can use).

 

It wasn't coaching.  It was lack of execution in the passing game.  Not on Tyrod for the most part though I think he should have hit Clay for the TD there was plenty of room to fit that ball. But there were some protection breakdowns, a bad drop by Zay and a bad route by Thompson when he should have been wide open for a big play.  It was execution 2nd half.... definitely, but it wasn't Tyrod.  

[MAJBobby]

18 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

And how many "mistakes"  did TT make in the second half?  The OC put the Bills in bad situations on many second and third downs as usual in the second half.  

 

So yet again were the Bills out coached in the second half (which is the other excuse one can use).

 

See above tweet. How about stay on the field. Convert some 3rd down passes etc etc etc 

Edited December 20, 2017 by MAJBobby

[xRUSHx]

15 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

Oh look, you and xRushx must be buddies.

 

Tell me more about what I think, please 

Why are you bringing my name into this Trans? I thought you moved past this type of garbage posts towards me after our last conversation? I said nothing to you, keep my name out of it.

 

Oh look some are talking about your man crush on Tyrod. I agree with them they must notice the same thing. 

 

 

 

Edited December 20, 2017 by xRUSHx

[Maine-iac]

3 hours ago, MAJBobby said:

 

Back to blaming theBOC againn i know the play calling went Conservative and use clock however that doesnt excuse TT from not executing the plays does it?

Like he didn't execute that beautiful pass that Jones dropped?

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

2 hours ago, Billsfan1972 said:

And how many "mistakes"  did TT make in the second half?  The OC put the Bills in bad situations on many second and third downs as usual in the second half.  

 

So yet again were the Bills out coached in the second half (which is the other excuse one can use).

2nd half - First drive 

1st and 10 at MIA 39
(12:18 - 3rd) T.Taylor pass incomplete deep right to Z.Jones [C.Harris]. Overthrown, receiver near sideline at MIA 14
3rd and 7 at MIA 36
(11:32 - 3rd) (Shotgun) T.Taylor pass incomplete deep right to D.Thompson. Thrown wide of receiver, 9 yds. into end zone.
4th and 7 at MIA 36
(11:23 - 3rd) (Shotgun) T.Taylor pass incomplete deep left to C.Clay. Overthrown, receiver near sideline at MIA 3.

 

Is this enough? 

[Maine-iac]

Taylor is what he is and the "Taylor sucks" crowd are just taking the simple easy route.  Taylor is as good or bad as the team around him for the most part.  If the team shows up, plays defense, doesn't take multiple negative running plays and penalties, catches passes, then Taylor will put up decent numbers and more often than not win.  If the teams doesn't show up, doesn't play defense, runs for -3 yards on first and second downs, drops easily caught passes, and gets a procedure penalty to start every drive Taylor is not going to fix all that.  Very few QB's will.  When we have a better QB on the roster by all means play him.

[Albwan]

Build around him? When is this madness going to end?

Really suggesting trying to build a team around a non passing qb?

[Mat68]

If Taylor leads us to into the playoffs I believe you pick up his options but still draft a Qb early.  If he is better than Taylor you trade Taylor or you play Taylor until the rookie is ready to lead the team.  

[Maine-iac]

2 minutes ago, ShadyBillsFan said:

2nd half - First drive 

1st and 10 at MIA 39
(12:18 - 3rd) T.Taylor pass incomplete deep right to Z.Jones [C.Harris]. Overthrown, receiver near sideline at MIA 14
3rd and 7 at MIA 36
(11:32 - 3rd) (Shotgun) T.Taylor pass incomplete deep right to D.Thompson. Thrown wide of receiver, 9 yds. into end zone.
4th and 7 at MIA 36
(11:23 - 3rd) (Shotgun) T.Taylor pass incomplete deep left to C.Clay. Overthrown, receiver near sideline at MIA 3.

 

Is this enough? 

Did you watch the damn game?  Really.   First off Taylor just got a first on 2nd and 13 after a crappy run.  Then got another first on 3rd and 8.  The first play you are listing they only sent two WR and a RB out and had five guys covering so yes he threw it away.  The last play to Clay wasn't even a bad throw.  My best guess is Clay didn't see it because he definately should have adjusted for it.