Who starts next week: Taylor or Peterman?

[grb]

Way back on 13Oct, this was my take on Petermania :

 

 

Not to be a sourpuss, but there are three problems with Petermania :

 

(1) Never has so many back-up dreams been based on so little. Usually the backup makes a splash in preseason with big-time plays and gaudy numbers - by (yes) facing third-stringers, future Sears salesmen, and vanilla defenses. But Peterman completed just 54% of his passes for 5.4 yards per attempt. His longest throw was only 28 yards. Petermanics thrill to the memory of a ten yard slant (it was soooooo perfect), forgetting the wildly inaccurate throws it was sandwiched between. Taylor's bad outtings playing meaningful games against some of the league's most brutal defenses are barely worse than Peterman's entire preseason record.

 

(2) Right now the Bills have no running attack, an offensive line which frequently implodes, a (temporary, we hope) head case for one receiver, several punt returners for other receivers, and the very definition of a journeyman pulled off the scrap heap topping the group off. Prior to Cincinnati, Taylor was in the top-quarter of the NFL making plus-twenty yard pass plays with pretty much a tight end and running back alone. Then, of course, he lost the tight end. Instead of dreamily believing Nathan can make more of this dung hill, why not ask how Taylor has been able to accomplish what he has? Setting aside raw attempts, who has made more with less? And here's a question : How exactly is poor NP going to stretch the field? If you found the 4.7 ypa Bengal's game ugly, what do you expect Peterman to produce? Ya ain't seen nutt'n yet, dink and dunk-wise.

 

(3) Taylor and Peterman were both late-round picks for a reason. In both cases there were / are problems with their game. Believe it or not, Taylor is at least an average quarterback today. Given decent NFL-grade talent to play with, he's looked pretty solid. But that has been an accomplishment of years of hard work on both his strengths and weaknesses. If Flacco had gone down Taylor's rookie year, I'd bet anything TT would have flamed-out years ago. Peterman has a chance to beat the odds too, but I don't think it will come from being dumped into the Bills' cesspool offense. The Petermanics' dreamy best wishes may kill their man with kindness.....

Edited October 13 by grb

 

 

I think my last point looks pretty strong today. Peterman can recover from this game, but sometimes entire careers burn out when young players are asked to do too much too soon. Also, prediction-wise : Peterman averaged 4.7 ypa, so my prediction he'd do worse was way off-base......

 

https://www.twobillsdrive.com/community/topic/197095-again-how-can-a-switch-to-peterman-be-any-worse/?page=28

 

Edited November 20, 2017 by grb

[starrymessenger]

Watched the Rams and Vikes earlier today.  Case Keenum, a scheme dependant journeyman QB continued his excellent play. Call me crazy but I'm pretty sure Peterman would have looked a lot better, and maybe even good, behind that line and with the Vikes weapons at his disposal. Last year Keenum was pretty aweful behind a bad line and with fewer weapons. 

I don't think coach was wrong to start Peterman because he is a fifth round raw rookie. It appears to me that he miscalculated by not taking into consideration just how bad the O-line was in pass pro especially going against a team that can get after the QB. Losing Benjamin and Matthews only made a bad situation much worse, in fact downright impossible to overcome.  When Ben and Brady came in as rooks/raw QBs they were surrounded with and supported by much better players than we have on our roster. The nightmare that is this defence probably on its own was enuf to seal our fate as far as competing for the win was concerned. 

I don't know who coach will or even should start in KC. There really are no good options and I'm not sure which of the two is worse. 

[Senth]

Sonja Henie is out so let's see I'm gonna go with Joe Webb.  

[grb]

3 minutes ago, starrymessenger said:

 Call me crazy but I'm pretty sure Peterman would have looked a lot better, and maybe even good, behind that line and with the Vikes weapons at his disposal. Last year Keenum was pretty awful behind a bad line and with fewer weapons.

 

Nah, I won't call you crazy. I will - however - suggest you consider how much better Taylor would look with average pass protection and decent-grade targets.

Better than Peterman, I'd bet

[stevestojan]

14 minutes ago, mannc said:

What’s that Quarterback Rating?

 

17.857

[Stank_Nasty]

I’m trying to put a silver lining on this thing. There really isn’t one. The defense is completely f**ked. The line has been awful. BUT.....

 

 

what if the benching lit some sort of fire under Taylor’s ass and from here on out he just lets his nuts hang all over the field and things start happening on offense? I’m not gonna hold my breath but maybe it was just what the Dr ordered. 

 

 

2 minutes ago, stevestojan said:

 

17.857

If there’s one thing I’ve learned from this board it’s that qb rating means nothing. Lol

[starrymessenger]

2 minutes ago, grb said:

 

Nah, I won't call you crazy. I will - however - suggest you consider how much better Taylor would look with average pass protection and decent-grade targets.

Better than Peterman, I'd bet

 

They would in that case probably both look better imo. As for the bet, to me its a 50/50 proposition at this point. Taylor has the assets we know about and he is experienced, but he really isn't very good at throwing a football. You clearly win the bet if you are of a mind to write Peterman off as a prospect. Speaking for myself I'm not there already, although I gather many are. 

[Marty McFly]

The rookie looked bad his 1st outing. I knew it was gonna be bad but no one could have predicted 5 picks in the 1st half. I hoped we would win and i was bein negative for no reason but dam, that was a big McFck up!

[Agent 91]

1 hour ago, The juice said:

Start peterman. Seasons gone 

 

Lockers been lost 

Season has already been gone. I dont know why the Jet game wasnt the telling factor. That was when I knew. Now, couple that with NE×2 and the Chiefs. We now will be lucky if we dont end up 5 and 8. Its a cycle. We arent going anywhere regardless. 

[DC Tom]

6 minutes ago, stevestojan said:

 

17.857

 

That's higher than I expected. 

[Agent 91]

1 hour ago, jmc12290 said:

This is actually worst case scenario.

 

If Petey showed something but still lost because he's a fifth round rookie, you could sell the locker room on him while keeping your pick high for 2018.  He was so bad you can't reasonably start him from here on out, even though that would virtually ensure a top 7 pick.  

 

Now we'll win a couple with TT and pick #10-16 and miss on QB's.  Red alert.

Who are we beating? Miami 2 times?

[Kirby Jackson]

Welcome back to common sense everyone 

[Agent 91]

1 hour ago, Scott7975 said:

He is better than Peterman that's all that matters. Can we not try to dog Taylor after Peterman had a worse showing than EJ in London. 

or Tyrod last week

[BringBackOrton]

6 minutes ago, Agent 91 said:

Who are we beating? Miami 2 times?

We'll steal a game from the Colts and Miami probably.

[HappyDays]

11 minutes ago, Stank_Nasty said:

I’m trying to put a silver lining on this thing. There really isn’t one. The defense is completely f**ked. The line has been awful. BUT.....

 

 

what if the benching lit some sort of fire under Taylor’s ass and from here on out he just lets his nuts hang all over the field and things start happening on offense? I’m not gonna hold my breath but maybe it was just what the Dr ordered. 

 

 

If there’s one thing I’ve learned from this board it’s that qb rating means nothing. Lol

 

I actually don’t want Tyrod being more aggressive. We don’t have receivers that can reward aggressiveness. If they aren’t open don’t throw them the ball. The scheme is what needs to go. We’re making the same mistake on offense that we made with Rex’s defense.

[Kirby Jackson]

So, Tyrod sent a text to a friend at halftime (he probably shouldn’t do that) saying that it was 100% Dennison’s decision to bench him. Apparently Dennison basically told McDermott that he wanted Nate.

[Scott7975]

1 minute ago, jmc12290 said:

We'll steal a game from the Colts and Miami probably.

Well... smoking jay might have had almost as bad of a game as Peterman did if he wouldn't have gotten concussed.  Then again Peterman could have also continued his passes to the other team if he stayed in.

[Manther]

1 hour ago, Adam said:

Maybe its time to take a look at Taylor as the future and get some talent around him. The offense improved dramatically when he went in

No thank you

[Scott7975]

Just now, Kirby Jackson said:

So, Tyrod sent a text to a friend at halftime (he probably shouldn’t do that) saying that it was 100% Dennison’s decision to bench him. Apparently Dennison basically told McDermott that he wanted Nate.

Guess trying to save his job backfired.  Then again, not sure McD will fire him.

[McNubbins]

Just now, Kirby Jackson said:

So, Tyrod sent a text to a friend at halftime (he probably shouldn’t do that) saying that it was 100% Dennison’s decision to bench him. Apparently Dennison basically told McDermott that he wanted Nate.

Can this be documented anywhere?

Also, Tyrod, if it's true that McDermott wants to win now.

[Stank_Nasty]

2 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

I actually don’t want Tyrod being more aggressive. We don’t have receivers that can reward aggressiveness. If they aren’t open don’t throw them the ball. The scheme is what needs to go. We’re making the same mistake on offense that we made with Rex’s defense.

I agree 100% schematically. But at this point with how bad everything else is and him maybe being in “f*** it” mode” maybe he walks a little closer to that edge and it opens things up a bit. Just wishful thinking really. I’m not expecting much from anyone the rest of the way out. 

[Fadingpain]

Depends on what their intentions are.

 

If they want to maximize our chances to lose this season, start Peterman.

 

If they want to maximize our chances to win this season, start Tyrod.

 

Both are valid approaches depending on your mindset. 

 

 

[Kirby Jackson]

Just now, McNubbins said:

Can this be documented anywhere?

Also, Tyrod, if it's true that McDermott wants to win now.

I mean, I don’t know what documentation you want to see but I read it. Boyst can probably vouch for me (or maybe Augie) because they met the recipient of the text in Atlanta. I didn’t know this to be the case but saw it late in the game from her brother.

[HappyDays]

2 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

So, Tyrod sent a text to a friend at halftime (he probably shouldn’t do that) saying that it was 100% Dennison’s decision to bench him. Apparently Dennison basically told McDermott that he wanted Nate.

 

I am sure this is true. Buffalo Fanatics has the same story on their Instagram yesterday. You think Dennison could be fired tomorrow? His call, his ass on the line I would think.

[Kirby Jackson]

1 minute ago, Fadingpain said:

Depends on what their intentions are.

 

If they want to maximize our chances to lose this season, start Peterman.

 

If they want to maximize our chances to win this season, start Tyrod.

 

Both are valid approaches depending on your mindset. 

 

 

This is one of the truest and most honest posts this board has ever seen. It’s an interesting dilemma.

Just now, HappyDays said:

 

I am sure this is true. Buffalo Fanatics has the same story on their Instagram yesterday. You think Dennison could be fired tomorrow? His call, his ass on the line I would think.

Don’t know what will happen with it but it can’t sit well with McDermott. He stuck his neck out and got completely embarrassed and destroyed over it. 

[BringBackOrton]

Just now, Kirby Jackson said:

This is one of the truest and most honest posts this board has ever seen. It’s an interesting dilemma.

I don't see McD regaining the respect of the lockeroom if they play Peterman.  Too much of an intentional tank move.

[Manther]

1 hour ago, PastaJoe said:

If DiMarco catches that first pass we may have had a completely different game. That may have rattled Peterman, and then the next 2 Ints were in the OL.

That and maybe a TE to help block Bosa on the right side against Ducasse and Mills.  That seemed like poor coaching and game plan.

 

I don't know if the coaches had a poor plan developed this week working through their process.

 

Don't get me wrong Peterman was not good

[Kirby Jackson]

Just now, jmc12290 said:

I don't see McD regaining the respect of the lockeroom if they play Peterman.  Too much of an intentional tank move.

That was Sullivan’s point in the press conference. It is probably true but it may end up being in their best interest. I just don’t think that they can straight face it.

[Stank_Nasty]

1 minute ago, jmc12290 said:

I don't see McD regaining the respect of the lockeroom if they play Peterman.  Too much of an intentional tank move.

I have a hard time seeing him get it back regardless. Although I must admit I have no clue how an nfl locker room works. 

 

And hiw how much of the roster is even gonna be around next year? This was just one offseason and it was a legit overhaul already. 

[HappyDays]

1 minute ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Don’t know what will happen with it but it can’t sit well with McDermott. He stuck his neck out and got completely embarrassed and destroyed over it. 

 

I’m actually okay with McDermott letting his coordinators make those kinds of decisions but the axe has to fall after such a miserable failure.

[Manther]

1 hour ago, Dr.Sack said:

White privilege would be throwing 5 first half picks and getting rewarded with a start next week at KC. 

Ridiculous and unnecessary 

[phypon]

Okay, I thought about this one.  You start Peterman.  Why?  Because...draft.  TT is not the long term answer, neither is NP.  I don't think the W/L column changes with either QB at the helm but you may as well start the rook, see what kind of backup he could be.  I know this will not be a popular point of view, but it's the most logical.

[Woodman19]

If I am McDermott, you stick with Peterman.  You already made the move and made your bed and you might as well see what you have.  Yes, Peterman had an awful day.  Rookie QB in his first NFL game that had a fluke Int in the first drive and then tried to keep forcing the ball from that point on.  Give him some more reps and see if you can work on his aggressiveness.   Take your extreme,  the QB who won't take risk or the QB who takes too much.

[Kirby Jackson]

On a side note was that the worst half quarterbacked in franchise history? I thought that I remember Brohm being bad but maybe not this horrible. 

[BringBackOrton]

4 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

That was Sullivan’s point in the press conference. It is probably true but it may end up being in their best interest. I just don’t think that they can straight face it.

Exactly.  He was so bad they can't get away with it.

2 minutes ago, Stank_Nasty said:

I have a hard time seeing him get it back regardless. Although I must admit I have no clue how an nfl locker room works. 

 

And hiw how much of the roster is even gonna be around next year? This was just one offseason and it was a legit overhaul already. 

A decent chunk, I think.

[Scott7975]

3 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

On a side note was that the worst half quarterbacked in franchise history? I thought that I remember Brohm being bad but maybe not this horrible. 

It was the worst half QBed of any NFL QB since the merger.

[Agent 91]

Just now, jmc12290 said:

We'll steal a game from the Colts and Miami probably.

i was thinking 1 v Miami.  Brissett is putting up real qb numbers. it's no gimme. unfortunately our pass defense wentfrom good togiving whatever you want

[Boatdrinks]

Nope. This move was made to win a football game... today. It made sense and when asked if it was long term earlier in the week McD said taking it day by day or something. Look, Lynn knows the book on Taylor and it would have been the last two weeks redux. It was worth a shot because there is no way you could throw the rook into a hornets nest stadium at Arrowhead. Or vs the hoodie. You have to try to make the playoffs , and therefore since the results were awful you play Taylor next week. He'll have a new fire under his bippy and the Chiefs are struggling in a major way. Keep the season alive until you are eliminated then play the other guy. This was the only game you could play NP while you're still in it. Had to try it. 

Edited November 20, 2017 by Boatdrinks

[100DollarBills]

Get ready to get upset, Peterman is here to start for the remainder of the season. Will be looking at a 1st round QB next year. 

[Scott7975]

5 minutes ago, phypon said:

Okay, I thought about this one.  You start Peterman.  Why?  Because...draft.  TT is not the long term answer, neither is NP.  I don't think the W/L column changes with either QB at the helm but you may as well start the rook, see what kind of backup he could be.  I know this will not be a popular point of view, but it's the most logical.

Players don't respect coaches that sabotage a team for better draft position.  If he hasn't lost the locker room already, he will if he continues with your thought process.